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What is wrong with the MDMA available today?

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ThreePointCircle said:
Do you think there's any chance of talking someone from the research community into looking into this or is getting the testing organisations to up their game about the only option for a decent analysis to be done?
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Thats not such a bad idea. The more people we had behind the request the more weight it would carry. Im happy to both individually back it and also endorse www.pillreports.net full support if that would help I dont know.
 
For whatever it is worth, from communicating with earth from Drugs Data for a long time now, I do not think there is any ulterior motive at play. I think they are underfunded, understaffed, and ultimately more concerned with immediate needs like testing the incoming samples than digging into a hypothesis about "loss of magic" being rooted in drug purity (from their perspective). The idea of loss of magic is embedded into MDMA culture and widely accepted. Why consider another explanation at all? Drugs Data has been slowly pursuing the concept, and they bought the standards associated with several of the regioisomers. I am still hoping that they will, at some point, be willing to share the raw data with me for my samples and @G_Chem's sample, but they are tied up with another project right now.

Also, I think our question will eventually be answered by MAPS. One of their recent chemistry announcements talked about how specific the synthesis process is for MDMA, and how even ambient temperature can change the outcome. They claim they will be releasing their standards for MDMA production, and at that point, any chemist that cares will be able to follow those guidelines. They may even identify some of the undesirable outcomes when production is botched. It is just a matter of time before MDMA is FDA approved in the USA, and the whole game changes.
 
ThreePointCircle said:
Got a horrid feeling that if the mdma producers did care then we wouldn't be in this mess :(
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They’re out there, it’s just the product often sells for more than most are willing to pay (I pay a bit more than most despite who I know but it seems very worth it) and once someone like me finds some we buy up what we can (or what I can afford, 3.5-7g typically) and then share it amongst friends.

This is actually the only drug I won’t guve out to strangers cuz it’s too rare to do so. You can see me walking around handing out LSD, DMT, K, what have you... But only my friends do I share MDMA.

Plus it’s worth it to me to see my close family, friends and loved ones rolling hard, and in essence that’s what this drug is all about. Sharing moments with loved ones, Id rather burn a gram getting 6 people rolling than save it all for me.

Maybe this is part of why I roll so good... I love doing things which release oxytocin. Giving gifts to others releases oxytocin, which in turn boosts the empathogenic side of the experience. I imagine giving MDMA is like the ultimate in “gift giving oxytocin release” lol.

Speaking of I might roll again this weekend, 50/50 with the sample recently analyzed mixed with some very pure standard clear shard. Expect it to be a good weekend!

-GC
 
G_Chem said:
They’re out there, it’s just the product often sells for more than most are willing to pay (I pay a bit more than most despite who I know but it seems very worth it) and once someone like me finds some we buy up what we can (or what I can afford, 3.5-7g typically) and then share it amongst friends.

This is actually the only drug I won’t guve out to strangers cuz it’s too rare to do so. You can see me walking around handing out LSD, DMT, K, what have you... But only my friends do I share MDMA.

Plus it’s worth it to me to see my close family, friends and loved ones rolling hard, and in essence that’s what this drug is all about. Sharing moments with loved ones, Id rather burn a gram getting 6 people rolling than save it all for me.

Maybe this is part of why I roll so good... I love doing things which release oxytocin. Giving gifts to others releases oxytocin, which in turn boosts the empathogenic side of the experience. I imagine giving MDMA is like the ultimate in “gift giving oxytocin release” lol.

Speaking of I might roll again this weekend, 50/50 with the sample recently analyzed mixed with some very pure standard clear shard. Expect it to be a good weekend!

-GC
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I feel you man. Over a decade ago I started buying bulk pills and selling (because i was geting personal use awesome pills and wished my clubing mates were rolling like I was)

That spread fast to friends of friends. Maybe 3 months in i would get 100 before each weekend and I realized i was making no profit. Just breaking even, but didnt even once cant or care about profit. I would give half away because it was insane being at a rave with 20 mates all in magic land ect..

I totally get your rolling by yourself vs with others even if its your stuff.
 
andyturbo said:
I feel you man. Over a decade ago I started buying bulk pills and selling (because i was geting personal use awesome pills and wished my clubing mates were rolling like I was)

That spread fast to friends of friends. Maybe 3 months in i would get 100 before each weekend and I realized i was making no profit. Just breaking even, but didnt even once cant or care about profit. I would give half away because it was insane being at a rave with 20 mates all in magic land ect..

I totally get your rolling by yourself vs with others even if its your stuff.
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Man and I feel like that way of MDMA culture is dying, if I remember correct your a bit old school yourself right? 90’s raver? I feel the very fact this behavior is fading away along with other loving/giving behaviors which show an overall change in product for the mass of users. That’s the reason I still hang in this thread, I remember a time when things were very different. I refuse to put it down cultural changes or whatever.

You telling me that story reminds me of a time when people would very often share pills, even if they could barely afford it or weren’t making money, just so everyone was having a good time.

I remember folks giving away all their pills rolling only to wake up the next day with that kinda bummed but still happy they at least made everyone’s night lol.

Idk maybe it’s all the K people be sniffing these days too.. Don’t get me wrong I like it, but it’s definitely ruined things a bit. Let’s put it this way, in my area we could probably do with 1/10th or less the total amount of K circulating to keep things at a level that’s not “excessive.”

I then wonder, is K big now because MDMA has changed? It was right when our local producer shut down of the very magic pills that K began to grow in popularity. Probably coincidence but worth thinking about.. Thankfully my connections stayed good but I can see a lot less overall love and connection than before when these pills were everywhere .

-GC
 
G_Chem said:
Man and I feel like that way of MDMA culture is dying...
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So I talked again to my cousin, who is current gen, and asked him did they ever call mdma xtc nowadays? They don't, although they are aware of the term. Apparently they call it dizz is something like that. But its this thing about lack of euphoria which strikes me so much. They're not getting it, and to me xtc was the guaranteed euphoria pill (with the pro love nature and dancing being the other two features). Found out they tend to snort lines of the stuff like it was coke, just to try and get a meaningful hit off it. Crazy! Sad for us, sad for them.

G_Chem said:
They’re out there, it’s just the product often sells for more than most are willing to pay
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As an experiment I tried going for a couple of listings on the DMs that were quite a bit more expensive. Still meh unfortunately.
 
G_Chem said:
Man and I feel like that way of MDMA culture is dying, if I remember correct your a bit old school yourself right? 90’s raver? I feel the very fact this behavior is fading away along with other loving/giving behaviors which show an overall change in product for the mass of users. That’s the reason I still hang in this thread, I remember a time when things were very different. I refuse to put it down cultural changes or whatever.

You telling me that story reminds me of a time when people would very often share pills, even if they could barely afford it or weren’t making money, just so everyone was having a good time.

I remember folks giving away all their pills rolling only to wake up the next day with that kinda bummed but still happy they at least made everyone’s night lol.

Idk maybe it’s all the K people be sniffing these days too.. Don’t get me wrong I like it, but it’s definitely ruined things a bit. Let’s put it this way, in my area we could probably do with 1/10th or less the total amount of K circulating to keep things at a level that’s not “excessive.”

I then wonder, is K big now because MDMA has changed? It was right when our local producer shut down of the very magic pills that K began to grow in popularity. Probably coincidence but worth thinking about.. Thankfully my connections stayed good but I can see a lot less overall love and connection than before when these pills were everywhere .

-GC
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Don't forget that this has happened before. The 80s ravers became disillusioned with the whole scene because the pills were becoming shit.

Then the Mitsubishis hit.


We need another renaissance...
 
G_Chem said:
Man and I feel like that way of MDMA culture is dying, if I remember correct your a bit old school yourself right? 90’s raver? I feel the very fact this behavior is fading away along with other loving/giving behaviors which show an overall change in product for the mass of users. That’s the reason I still hang in this thread, I remember a time when things were very different. I refuse to put it down cultural changes or whatever.

You telling me that story reminds me of a time when people would very often share pills, even if they could barely afford it or weren’t making money, just so everyone was having a good time.

I remember folks giving away all their pills rolling only to wake up the next day with that kinda bummed but still happy they at least made everyone’s night lol.

Idk maybe it’s all the K people be sniffing these days too.. Don’t get me wrong I like it, but it’s definitely ruined things a bit. Let’s put it this way, in my area we could probably do with 1/10th or less the total amount of K circulating to keep things at a level that’s not “excessive.”

I then wonder, is K big now because MDMA has changed? It was right when our local producer shut down of the very magic pills that K began to grow in popularity. Probably coincidence but worth thinking about.. Thankfully my connections stayed good but I can see a lot less overall love and connection than before when these pills were everywhere .

-GC
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The change in the drug (mdma) resulted in the loss of that culture. Even the music is soulless now. I really hope the answer to this issue is found. I miss being in complete and utter peace with myself.
 
ThreePointCircle said:
That's great. I'm not sure the best approach to take but hopefully we can come up with something.
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I totally get you on the music. I loved house starting in the 90s and I don't listen to 4 on the floor anymore because there's no innovation, at least from what I've been hearing. I think sound design came back with nuerofunk, but I don't want to change the subject.

I just kills me that someone knows what's going on with the meh and magic, but we don't. I that gets fixed, the scene will get fixed. Someone knows though.
 
HerpDerpMcDerp said:
I totally get you on the music. I loved house starting in the 90s and I don't listen to 4 on the floor anymore because there's no innovation, at least from what I've been hearing. I think sound design came back with nuerofunk, but I don't want to change the subject.

I just kills me that someone knows what's going on with the meh and magic, but we don't. I that gets fixed, the scene will get fixed. Someone knows though.
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You know, I don't even know if I believe people know what is going on. I almost think that there is some oddity with a dirty precursor, or some shortcut in the production process, and the end result looks right, and fucks you up, and makes you money so...who cares? The people making it may have no clue. Unless you want to take it in a more "conspiracy theory" direction and think that the government or someone decided it was not good for business to have so much love in the world, and they deliberately flooded the market with similar but not so similar product... I mean, what could have shut down the rave scene faster?
 
indigoaura said:
You know, I don't even know if I believe people know what is going on. I almost think that there is some oddity with a dirty precursor, or some shortcut in the production process, and the end result looks right, and fucks you up, and makes you money so...who cares? The people making it may have no clue. Unless you want to take it in a more "conspiracy theory" direction and think that the government or someone decided it was not good for business to have so much love in the world, and they deliberately flooded the market with similar but not so similar product... I mean, what could have shut down the rave scene faster?
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Honestly, that thought came to my mind, no joke. I'm sure they know what's going on and would rather have people checking out instead of sharing loving vibes. Where is Sasha when you need him?

Do you think his wife would know? Ann might want to get the word out...maybe.
 
G_Chem said:
Man and I feel like that way of MDMA culture is dying, if I remember correct your a bit old school yourself right? 90’s raver? I feel the very fact this behavior is fading away along with other loving/giving behaviors which show an overall change in product for the mass of users. That’s the reason I still hang in this thread, I remember a time when things were very different. I refuse to put it down cultural changes or whatever.

You telling me that story reminds me of a time when people would very often share pills, even if they could barely afford it or weren’t making money, just so everyone was having a good time.

I remember folks giving away all their pills rolling only to wake up the next day with that kinda bummed but still happy they at least made everyone’s night lol.

Idk maybe it’s all the K people be sniffing these days too.. Don’t get me wrong I like it, but it’s definitely ruined things a bit. Let’s put it this way, in my area we could probably do with 1/10th or less the total amount of K circulating to keep things at a level that’s not “excessive.”

I then wonder, is K big now because MDMA has changed? It was right when our local producer shut down of the very magic pills that K began to grow in popularity. Probably coincidence but worth thinking about.. Thankfully my connections stayed good but I can see a lot less overall love and connection than before when these pills were everywhere .

-GC
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Ketamine hasn't been available in Australia since 2006.
 
as for events, I often went to them on purpose without anything, when the party started I looked for the most made people in the crowd and asked if they would sell me something ... they would never refuse and this is how I often gained good mdma☺️
 
tired of crap said:
What if we’re looking at this backwards and there was an impurity in the old s synth that synergized or potentiated the experience
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Then the MAPS project would be using the MehMDMA.

There is a way for us to find out, without their help, though.
Namely, one of us has to chromatographically purify a known MehMDMA sample and test it on multiple users, whether the objective and subjective pharmacological effects improve significantly.
The sample, column, silica gel, solvents, stains or lights/filters would cost several thousands of USD. (or below a thousand if you are willing to cut-corners).
 
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indigoaura said:
I mean, what could have shut down the rave scene faster?
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Poisoning the well is more effective than putting suppliers and users in jail.

However, the government (or powers that be) do not have the power to corrupt most clandestine manufacturers directly. The only way the manufacturing scene can be influenced on a mass scale is indirectly through precursors. e.g.:
1) Flooding the market with a cheap contaminated precursor
2) Turning a blind eye to a clean precursor, which is known to yield a Meh product naturally in cheap/sloppy/corner-cutting synths.

Since the obvious suspect here is the MD-P2P Glycidate, which has been banned in recent years, we can expect a shift in manufacturing methods as its stashes are being slowly exhausted.

What "new" precursor will be used next ? ...maybe Piperonal or Helional, or something novel entirely.
Will the MDMA made out of these "new" precursors be different ? There is no theoretical reason for it to be, but for practical cheap/sloppy synths - it might be.

Anyway, we might be seeing a shift in the quality of MDMA being released today already, which will complicate the answer to the subject of this thread even further.
 
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From what I’ve heard it’s going to be another similar ketone-substituted compound that skirts the laws still... Pretty sure it’s already in the works too.

-GC
 
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