Foreskin amputation is a touch
hyperbolic. But relatively accurate. Are you cut CFC? Show me!!
Parents make choices for their children,
its what parents should do. This is really no different.
There are benefits and they outweigh the drawbacks.
I've never met anyone that experienced a negative from it. Noone posting in this thread has mentioned sexual issues.
In terms of medical intervention, this is overwhelmingly benign.
I'm fine with it and that's good because its permanent.
Amputation is how it's rightfully described in the literature and literally what it is. Genital multilation is another accurate term for circumcision. It's a term nobody contradicts when describing female genital mutilation. Perhaps if we adopted these accurate terms, people would stop and think a bit more rather than pretending the operation is just a trivial aesthetic or religious issue with non-relevant outcomes.
As for benefits - have you done any more reading on the subject since last week? The overwhelming weight of research continues to demonstrate how unnecessary and harmful circumcision can be. It also continues to demonstrate how ineffective circumcision is in HIV prevention (another canard that's often wheeled out).
I also see anecdotes being swung around as 'evidence' - ie that "I" don't know anyone who has had any trouble with circumcision and "I'm fine" etc. But do we
really think men are going to be completely honest about a matter which is as overwhelmingly bound up in their self-esteem as their cocks and sex lives? The bullshit lies we men tell each other about our sexual prowess are infamous and the subject of a million books, movies and pub tales. It's one reason I think so many men here are (perhaps subconsciously) being quite defensive, perhaps projecting their own anxieties.
Anyway, since we can all throw around anecdotes, let's instead look at what some actual research says. I thought we could start off with a short easy-to-read article covering some of the commonly documented psychological harms:
Circumcision’s Psychological Damage
Narvaez, D. (2015)
The circumcision of children has myriad negative psychological consequences that the CDC has failed to consider. Removing healthy tissue in the absence of any medical need harms the patient and is a breach of medical providers’ ethical duty to the child. We believe that all people have a right to bodily autonomy and self-determination and deeply respect this fundamental tenet of international human rights law (UNESCO 2005). As children cannot advocate for themselves, they need adults to understand the complexities of their emotional experiences and provide them special protection. We oppose the CDC’s circumcision recommendation and encourage all parents to do the same in order to protect their children from physical and psychological harm.
Full article >
>here<<
Next up, let's have an overview of some of the potential physical harms. This book is a good one (and one that I had to read when I was an advisor on the subject some years ago). Here's a couple snippets of the intro. You may be able to read the whole book following the link or possibly on Google books. I know some of the articles within have also become journal articles in their own right, so may be available:
To quote:
96.2% suspected or were confident that circumcision had resulted in a reduction of the normal male capacity for sexual response and pleasure.
(Stable link to book:
http://link.springer.com/chapter/10.1007/978-1-4757-2679-4_11 )
Next is a general collection of some of the vast library of literature covering physical harms, moral consequences and so forth:
Long-Term Consequences of Neonatal Injury
Beggs, Simon
The Canadian Journal of Psychiatry, 2015, Vol.60(4), pp.176-180
In this review, the impact of neonatal surgical incision on nociceptive circuitry is discussed in terms of the underlying developmental neurobiology. The changes are complex, occurring at multiple anatomical sites within the CNS, and including both neuronal and glial cell populations. The altered sensory input from neonatal injury selectively modulates neuronal excitability within the spinal cord, disrupts inhibitory control, and primes the immune system, all of which contribute to the adverse long-term consequences of early pain exposure.
Neonatal Circumcision Reconsidered
Rhinehart, John
Transactional Analysis Journal, 1999, Vol.29(3), pp.215-221
This article discusses the present status of neonatal circumcision in the United States and presents clinical findings regarding the long-term somatic, emotional, and psychological consequences of this procedure in adult men. These consequences are seen as typical of complex posttraumatic stress disorder. They emerged during psychotherapy focused on the resolution of prenatal, perinatal, and developmental trauma and shock experiences. Their relationship to phenomena such as trauma, shock, somatic decisions, discounting, and scripting is described
Male circumcision and sexual function in men and women: a survey-based, cross-sectional study in Denmark
Frisch, Morten ; Lindholm, Morten ; Grønbæk, Morten
International Journal of Epidemiology, 2011, Vol. 40(5), pp.1367-1381
Findings were stable in several robustness analyses, including one restricted to non-Jews and non-Moslems. Circumcision was associated with frequent orgasm difficulties in Danish men [...] notably orgasm difficulties, dyspareunia and a sense of incomplete sexual needs fulfilment.
After Cologne: male circumcision and the law. Parental right, religious liberty or criminal assault?
Merkel, Reinhard ; Putzke, Holm
Journal of Medical Ethics, 22 July 2013, Vol.39(7) pp.444-9
Non-therapeutic circumcision violates boys' right to bodily integrity as well as to self-determination. There is neither any verifiable medical advantage connected with the intervention nor is it painless nor without significant risks. Possible negative consequences for the psychosexual development of circumcised boys (due to substantial loss of highly erogenous tissue) have not yet been sufficiently explored, but appear to ensue in a significant number of cases. According to standard legal criteria, these considerations would normally entail that the operation be deemed an 'impermissible risk'-neither justifiable on grounds of parental rights nor of religious liberty: as with any other freedom right, these end where another person's body begins. Nevertheless, after a resounding decision by a Cologne district court that non-therapeutic circumcision constitutes bodily assault, the German legislature responded by enacting a new statute expressly designed to permit male circumcision even outside of medical settings. We first criticise the normative foundations upon which such a legal concession seems to rest, and then analyse two major flaws in the new German law which we consider emblematic of the difficulty that any legal attempt to protect medically irrelevant genital cutting is bound to face.
Adult Male Circumcision Does Not Reduce the Risk of Incident Neisseria gonorrhoeae, Chlamydia trachomatis, or Trichomonas vaginalis Infection: Results from a Randomized, Controlled Trial in Kenya
Supriya D. Mehta, Stephen Moses, Kawango Agot, Corette Parker, Jeckoniah O. Ndinya-Achola, Ian Maclean, Robert C. Bailey
J Infect Dis (2009) 200 (3): 370-378.
We examined the effect of male circumcision on the acquisition of 3 nonulcerative sexually transmitted infections (STIs). Circumcision of men in this population did not reduce their risk of acquiring these nonulcerative STIs. Improved STI control will require more-effective STI management, including partner treatment and behavioral risk reduction counseling.
Neonatal circumcision does not reduce HIV/AIDS infection rates
D Sidler, J Smith, H Rode
SOUTH AFRICAN MEDICAL JOURNAL, Volume 98, Number 10: Pages 762-766 (2008 ).
Male non-therapeutic infant circumcision is neither medically nor ethically justified as an HIV prevention tool. Circumcision is not equivalent to successful immunisation. There are far more effective prevention tools costing considerably less and offering better HIV reduction outcomes than circumcision.
Finally, the WHO and UNAIDS appear to be basing these multi-million-dollar prevention programmes on limited and in some instances biased information. In order to prevent confusion and parents making misguided decisions on behalf of their infants, and to offer effective help in alleviating the suffering that is being created by HIV/AIDS, a much broader review process would be called for. Such a process would involve more objective scientific opinion, and the involvement of a representative panel of African experts, such as paediatric surgeons and neonatologists.
Religious circumcision, invasive rites, neutrality and equality: bearing the burdens and consequences of belief
Johnson, Matthew Thomas
Journal of Medical Ethics, Jul 2013, Vol.39(7), p.450
The decision of the German regional court in Cologne on 26 June 2012 to prohibit the circumcision of minors is important insofar as it recognises the qualitative similarities between the practice and other prohibited invasive rites, such as female genital cutting. However, recognition of similarity poses serious questions with regard to liberal public policy, specifically with regard to the exceptionalist treatment demanded by certain circumcising groups. In this paper, I seek to advance egalitarian means of dealing with invasive rites which take seriously cultural diversity, minimise harm and place responsibility for the burdens and consequences of beliefs upon those who promote practices.
Male circumcision: pain, trauma and psychosexual sequelae
Boyle, Gregory J ; Goldman, Ronald ; Svoboda, J Steven ; Fernandez, Ephrem
Journal of health psychology, May 2002, Vol.7(3), pp.329-43
Infant male circumcision continues despite growing questions about its medical justification. As usually performed without analgesia or anaesthetic, circumcision is observably painful. It is likely that genital cutting has physical, sexual and psychological consequences too. Some studies link involuntary male circumcision with a range of negative emotions and even post-traumatic stress disorder (PTSD). Some circumcised men have described their current feelings in the language of violation, torture, mutilation and sexual assault. In view of the acute as well as long-term risks from circumcision and the legal liabilities that might arise, it is timely for health professionals and scientists to re-examine the evidence on this issue and participate in the debate about the advisability of this surgical procedure on unconsenting minors.
Do the Benefits of Male Circumcision Outweigh the Risks? A Critique of the Proposed CDC Guidelines
Earp, Brian D
Frontiers in pediatrics, 2015, Vol.3, pp.18
The Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) have announced a set of provisional guidelines concerning male circumcision, in which they suggest that the benefits of the surgery outweigh the risks. I offer a critique of the CDC position. Among other concerns, I suggest that the CDC relies more heavily than is warranted on studies from Sub-Saharan Africa that neither translate well to North American populations nor to circumcisions performed before an age of sexual debut; that it employs an inadequate conception of risk in its benefit vs. risk analysis; that it fails to consider the anatomy and functions of the penile prepuce (i.e., the part of the penis that is removed by circumcision); that it underestimates the adverse consequences associated with circumcision by focusing on short-term surgical complications rather than long-term harms; that it portrays both the risks and benefits of circumcision in a misleading manner, thereby undermining the possibility of obtaining informed consent; that it evinces a superficial and selective analysis of the literature on sexual outcomes associated with circumcision; and that it gives less attention than is desirable to ethical issues surrounding autonomy and bodily integrity. I conclude that circumcision before an age of consent is not an appropriate health-promotion strategy.
I realise this info won't likely change most intransigent minds. But bear in mind that your (potential) children might be fucked up by a decision that you casually make if you base all your knowledge and limit yourself to your own experience.