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My Opioid Problem

I really liked DMT when I tried it last year, I had a morning ritual for a while where I would smoke it, write about my experience, and then practice yoga during the afterglow. During one of my experiences I felt blood pouring out of my nose, ears, and eyes, and I could feel it pooling underneath my head all wet. It was weird, and felt so real, and I never knew how to interpret that. Whether it was a vision from a past life, a suicide premonition, an expression of my wounded soul, or the drug abuse. Never happened again though. I have never broke through though. I think it might be time to kick my ass with a breakthrough dose (I'd definitely want a sober sitter for that though).

Ibogaine seems incredibly interesting for rebooting the nervous system, and I know it is used for opiate addictions. Do you remember what doses you were taking tpd? I am really interested in the idea of sub-flood doses... possibly taken daily for a week or so. I don't have the root bark. I have pure ibogaine and I was thinking something like 50mg daily for a week. That seems safe to me, having never used it before. I would be looking for really subtle effects from it.

I wouldn't do K ever again, the one time I tried it I found it to be habit forming. Last thing I need is a ketamine habit, haha.

My withdrawal symptoms are pretty crappy today, I feel hungover for the second day in a row. Learned my lesson, I hope. This hasn't been fun ever since I dosed that stuff. I have been using the muscle relaxer baclofen at fairly high doses and it's time to get off it completely since it's been nearly a couple weeks - that is probably contributing to why I feel sort of crummy today. Really helped with the RLS though and muscle aches.
 
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not to sidetrack this discussion, but since we're on the subject of psychedelics during recovery from opiates... this is something i've been considering. however, i am very naive when it comes to these drugs. if i were to go this route, my good (and very experienced) friend has offered to babysit me.

of course, i feel like i'm making progress in recovery without using entheogens so maybe i should leave well enough alone. any thoughts on possible benefits or pitfalls for trying this route? for context, i'm past acute wd's (on day 26, i think).

thanks!
 
Wow. I was feeling the lowest of lows since I slipped and took dilaudid 3 days ago. I felt like I was at day 1 emotionally, but day 14 physically.

I took 30mg Ibogaine out of desperation (never having tried it) and it seems to have completely reverted my mental state back to the way it was before I slipped up - hopeful and positive. I was feeling very depressed. It's remarkable how this substance could take away my withdrawal symptoms and mentally have me feeling just great. At only 30mg!

Wtf does this do at higher doses haha. I kind of want to find out some day. I was thinking of hanging myself from the rafters earlier today... that's how bad the darkness has been since I relapsed. I felt completely hopeless and I was ready to die. I already feel like this is changing everything for me.

I think it's a really useful recovery tool. I don't even really want to take my maintenance oxy dose at noon anymore. Whaaaat, as if I just said that. Now I see why this was recommended to me. I bought a gram of it many years ago, because I knew that when the time came when I wanted to quit, I'd probably need it. Wow!

I swear I feel a connection to that African bush... I just had a vision of it, and took the time to thank it for helping me out. This stuff is just remarkable.

This is so fucked up!!! I think I found my new therapist. A spirit from a bush in africa that transmits physical healing through some complicated molecule it somehow creates that somehow, being naturally made and not produced by man, but does THIS to me. Wow!!! I cannot even believe this is happening. I was considering hanging myself earlier and I feel like a shining spirit now. I can feel the spirit of that beautiful plant working inside me right now. I feel such a connection to it. I'm listening to music with heavy tribal drum beats and flutes... I feel like an african tribesman. This is my kinda therapy : )

I'm considering cold turkey now, and perhaps dosing more ibogaine at noon instead of my maintenance oxy dose. I feel like this, if there is anything in the universe, has the potential to reset my whole entire nervous system.
 
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Really glad you're feeling better.

How hard did that 30mg hit? i.e. Was it an intense psychedelic experience, or was the dose low enough that the effect was subtle?

As for going cold turkey now, that's a tough call. When to do that is very personal. But my understanding of your situation (you've tapered a pretty big multi-opioid habit down to a relatively small oral oxy habit) suggests that it wouldn't be reckless to jump off now, unless I'm wrong about the situation.

Let us know what you decide. We're with you regardless.
 
Why would you do that? It would be very, very counter productive if your goal is to get off the opioid. Do you have some kind of Health condition that you to rely on exogenous opioids for their analgesic effects? Otherwise I strongly suggest you give you body a break from being bombarded with exogenous opioids for a while to let it heal up a but. You can always get back into your opioid habit later in life. They aren't going anywhere ;)
 
I have chronic pain and I've been tapering off opioids. I am still taking 20mg oxy 12 hours apart, sorry to clarify that. I'm not fully clean yet. A month ago it was 120mg daily, and before that it was pretty much heroin all day every day. I've come a long way. I am tapering with percocet.

I've stabilized at 40mg now and I will be dropping my dose very soon. I want to learn how to deal with the cravings better, before entering the final stage of my withdrawals.

I guess you thought I was taking zero right? I've really come a long way, but cold turkey is extremely harsh due to my chronic pain condition. Tapering is what is working for me... I already feel like my good old self at this lower dose and not a zombie anymore. I'm never high from it, just stable. I am fully committed to getting down to zero by the end of the year.

I would go cold turkey if I was sure that I could, but I might end up fucking everything up and winding up back on heroin. I'm taking it slow. It has been absolute hell to get down to this dose level.
 
No worries, pushing yourself too hard isn't the best idea. Try taking a lower dose than normal when you're on the ibogaine, as it should potentiate the analgesic effects of your opioid(s). If you need to take them to manage your condition, the opioids opinions that is, I think that is your best option at this point. You can continue to taper once you find a lower dose that works well on the ibogaine.
 
I am using those OxyNeo ones... the tamper proof extended release. I'm not getting high off them at all, or my taper wouldn't be successful. I got high three days ago and it completely fucked me for it. It is the drugs or meds that are in more abusable forms that I will go overboard with - I fiend dilaudid like crack, I like heroin way too much, and high dose oxycontin pills I will abuse the hell out of too (we still have 6 types of generics up in Canada).

Percocet and tamper-proof 10mg pills I simply use for pain relief. And before I go any lower... I really need to learn how to manage the excruciating pain in my spine. I could barely walk for two years before getting into pain management. Obviously I abused my meds and it needs to stop forever (I would never get back into my opiate habit ever again later on in life, unless I had like cancer or something, consider the absolute nightmare this has been). Once I am out, I will be out. this has been an absolute nightmare.

By the way, my Ibogaine experience has only gotten more powerful since my last message. It got a little overwhelming at one point. Man... this is really powerful stuff and seems very different than traditional tryptamines and phenethylamines. For my present purposes, I think I'll keep the dose a little lower next time ago, and not take it on a daily basis like I was planning. I just took 30mg orally, but a little bit spilled off my milligram scale and I think I should have taken that in account. Really need to be careful with this stuff! It's very powerful in ways. I think if I have another bad day like I did this morning, I will dose a little less next time.

Thanks for understanding, and not being critical that I am still using my doses to taper off. I need to quit fully, but that involves a lot more effort than simply going cold turkey. I need to find alternative treatments for my chronic pain that hopefully will not be pharmaceuticals. Otherwise, the pain is so extreme that I might relapse or keep on a low dose - and I don't want that. I'm here because I want to be sober as a judge, and I'm damn close to getting there. Just a couple more taper drops when I feel ready. Thanks again for not being like... oh he's still using again, not serious. It's totally not like that man. I have a lot of issues that need to be addressed - both physically and mentally.

And yeah... I need to figure out the best way to approach Ibogaine. It's really serious stuff, and even for a pretty low dose I was taken aback by it's obvious power. I'm going to experiment with some different dose levels... some lower, and some perhaps higher to figure out how it can help me best. Not on a daily basis, at least not yet. I hadn't heard of it potentiating my oxy. I feel like it could help me taper... like while doing a relatively quick taper to zero from 40mg, I could use Ibogaine at the right dose to help mitigate withdrawal symptoms.
 
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Just go easy on the ibogaine. Do not ingest more until you have felt the effects of your previous dose taper off and you are at baseline again. It is very, very powerful medicine. Redosimg before you are are really ready to is a recipe for disaster. So go easy on yourself with this my friend. A little, as you have know found for yourself, goes a long way.
 
Thanks for the advice. I'm thinking of holding off on smoking DMT until the ibogaine experience has passed for a few days. It really is serious stuff, even at low doses. It is very powerful medicine, and I am surprised as I took a pretty low dose of it. Although, I really want to smoke some DMT right now. That's definitely next up on my to-do list, and I should be able to start tapering from my 40mg daily dose in the near future. I'm going to take it slow.

Sooo this strange looking root bark molecule has at least convinced me to try 35mg instead of 40mg today.
I have to start moving down again. I feel like my progress has stagnated a bit as I've been taking 40mg for almost 2 weeks now, despite the slip. So yeah... I'm starting to move my dose down again, and that's exciting to me. I should be at 20mg daily pretty soon... I'm basically just dropping half a perc every couple of days until I'm there. If I get too depressed, I'll dose ibogaine again. I don't feel the need to, for the time being. It served its purpose more than I could have ever expected.

If I hadn't taken Ibogaine today, I would have laid in bed feeling severely depressed all day for the third day in a row. Instead - I had a morning of very intense self reflection, followed by an afternoon in which I am reading some literature for the first time since I began to withdraw - and not only that, but taking notes for new vocabulary. I had the idea that I could potentially be a writer, as that is well within the limits of my chronic pain. I've been thinking about career options. It's really powerful stuff if it can stimulate me in these ways in which I am struggling to deal with in withdrawal. Again - I realize I have to be cautious more than ever with Ibogaine. I'd probably take a slightly lower dose next time, or the same, and not go any higher until I am more familiar with the effects. I feel like it is very long lasting in it's action as well.

I'm excited to try the total alkaloid extract as well. Next time, I will use that one for contrast - as it contains ibogaine, ibogamine, and ibogaline at 40% purity. Probably at the same dose or a little higher. It should be interesting to experience the contrast, as this should be more akin to consuming the actual root bark, but with less physical disturbance. I'm really damn impressed that I was in for another day of depression, but I'm ending up powering through a book while taking notes on new vocab. I feel like I'm over the slip-up, since I have my positive energy and initiative going strong.

I'm also considering a sublingual 5-meo-dmt experience in the near future. This isn't all about opiate withdrawal and cravings... there is a lot on my plate right now. I've wanted to try it for ages, but I don't want to vape the HCl. I don't want to sniff it either, so I was thinking trying it sublingually. I'll have to refer to the 5-meo-dmt thread for more info.
 
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You have the rest of your life to benefit from this kind of sacred medicine. I'm glad to hear you don't feel you have to rush yourself with any of it, because that us not how one benefits from its therapeutic use. Take your time, savor and enjoy your present moment day to day experiences. That is what life is all about my friend. I know you know this :D
 
I had a great day today. I am under my prescribed dose now, at 30mg daily. Hung out and jammed guitar with my brother for a few hours. Made it to the health food store. Enjoyed the little things and the relatively nice weather... I'm still in withdrawal, but I'm almost there.

I'm beginning to wonder about how I am going to manage my spine pain without these things. It's going to be tough, especially since I have unlimited access to these low doses for pain management. It just never ends up being enough though. I seem to be an all-or-nothing type of person with this family of drugs. It's something I am struggling with though... that I could probably keep on a low dose like 5mg max 3x daily for pain and benefit from it. I just need to see what I'm like with the drugs completely out of the picture - and if the pain is really way too much for me down the road, after months of being clean, then that option will still be there if I feel that I have no quality of life.

I don't think I'll smoke dmt until I feel like I am in a more recovered state, and at that point I will aim for my first breakthrough dose. I took a small amount of iboga total alkaloid extract today, and I haven't had any withdrawal symptoms apart from mental fog. Hanging out and catching up with my brother really helped.

Thanks for all the encouragement tpd, really has helped.
 
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No prob. The best thing you can do for yourself is give yourself some time away from opioids and entheogens of all kinds, so that you can reset and get a chance to (re)evaluate what is really going on in your life.

A chance for your mind to reach a new equilibrium and stabilize without any distractions or inputs from entheogenic substances or exogenous opioids.

That way you will get a glimpse of what is real for at least a few days or whatever, if you know what I mean. A vacation from mind altering substances, you know?

Everyone needs a retreat from the rigamarole and the shit storm of real life every once in a while. . . 8) %) =D
 
Thanks for that - and I agree, although I am staying on my low, prescribed dose of oxycodone for the time being as I'm too unstable to go lower yet. This borderline dude can really freak the fuck out sometimes. And, only if my stupid self would have taken those words to heart...

So I abused cocaine the other day, I only did one line but it triggered a panic attack that lasted 24 hours, I believe due to a meth cut. I thought I was going to die, and had to stay up all night with a loved one to make sure I didn't have to go to the hospital. Big mistake... my brain is seeking alternatives it seems. I hadn't done stimulants in 5 years because with my borderline issues and panic disorder this tends to happen. It was miserable, I despise coke.

I took 2mg klonopin, 2mg xanax, 20mg valium, and 10mg etizolam to calm down. Even still, all of that wasn't enough to knock me out. Took at least a couple days to feel normal again. I still felt overstimulated that whole time and like I was having a heart attack. Anyways, I'm over it now and back on track. I just gotta stop doing stupid shit like this! I am smarter than that!

Also, today is the first day I am capable of experiencing happiness again after abusing dilaudid that one day. It seems that the slip-up created an extreme high that blew away all progress I had made emotionally, but kept my physical wd's at two weeks. I was experiencing the anhedonia without the associated complaints that normally go with it. I just felt very depressed, and it fucked with me emotionally for a while. All good now! Just need to make better choices in the future.
 
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^ it's crazy how our brains turn to substitution. i've come so close to scoring coke several times recently... and i really don't even like blow.

it's good to take note of how your brain is responding to things, though. as you said, that's how you'll make better choices down the line.
 
What I'm really struggling with now are panic attacks. I have been at this same low dose for 3 weeks... so it could be PAWS? I already have a panic disorder... but not like this. Having my second hardcore panic attack of the day and I feel like I'm dying of a heart attack. Just trying to breathe through it but I'd take any of the physical wd's over these nasty, horrible experiences. A thousand times over.

My panic symptoms are usually under control and hardly even surface with a low dose benzo, but it's like panic attack after panic attack after panic attack after fucking panic attack I honestly feel like I'm dying man.Dying of a fucking heart attack every time.

I don't know why this is happening to me? Is it a post-acute opioid withdrawal symptom that is common to have? Could it be that I was taking the muscle relaxer baclofen for 2 weeks during acute wd's and now I stopped? I always do that though and it's chill. I wasn't getting these the first few weeks and I'm struggling with the benzos now. They are not even working to calm me down the panic is so extreme.

Just want to somehow figure out this isn't short term baclofen-withdrawal related. I don't want to fuck with any more benzos as I have made enough stupid decisions lately and I'm already on them, I am not going to keep taking higher doses for this that's stupid. But it's extreme, I cannot even think straight. Full body sweating, pounding heart, chest tension, dizzy, extreme fear, body tremors... not even a couple valium will touch it. I need something as I am seriously doubled over from it, almost collapsing.

Baclofen chills me out and would synergize with the benzo I'm on without fucking more with my Gaba A and benzodiazepine receptors than I already have since it works on Gaba B. So I could start frying those receptors instead. I just hate baclofen and I want off it as it makes me drowsy. I try to close my eyes, breathe, think of my safe haven up at the family cottage but it's just too extreme to ignore. I tried a little yoga earlier, but could barely be still in my usual asanas. I have no idea if this is related to the stupid coke I did a few days ago that I don't even enjoy, but it seems to have been a problem since that night. I personally think it is a post-acute opioid withdrawal symptom possibly exacerbated by some other things, like quitting high doses of daily hash oil at the same time, and now baclofen, and the coke triggering attacks - but I just don't know. I feel like I am going to drop dead from it.

Anyone else get this? Hardcore, extreme panic attacks fucking 3 weeks in? After the physical wd's subside... like very soon after? It's killing me. It makes me want to go back to the heroin like not even think twice about it. Just get the dope and make this go away...
 
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ShroomySatori said:
What I'm really struggling with now are panic attacks. I have been at this same low dose for 3 weeks... so it could be PAWS? I already have a panic disorder... but not like this. Having my second hardcore panic attack of the day and I feel like I'm dying of a heart attack. Just trying to breathe through it but I'd take any of the physical wd's over these nasty, horrible experiences. A thousand times over.

My panic symptoms are usually under control and hardly even surface with a low dose benzo, but it's like panic attack after panic attack after panic attack after fucking panic attack I honestly feel like I'm dying man.Dying of a fucking heart attack every time.

I don't know why this is happening to me? Is it a post-acute opioid withdrawal symptom that is common to have? Could it be that I was taking the muscle relaxer baclofen for 2 weeks during acute wd's and now I stopped? I always do that though and it's chill. I wasn't getting these the first few weeks and I'm struggling with the benzos now. They are not even working to calm me down the panic is so extreme.

Just want to somehow figure out this isn't short term baclofen-withdrawal related. I don't want to fuck with any more benzos as I have made enough stupid decisions lately and I'm already on them, I am not going to keep taking higher doses for this that's stupid. But it's extreme, I cannot even think straight. Full body sweating, pounding heart, chest tension, dizzy, extreme fear, body tremors... not even a couple valium will touch it. I need something as I am seriously doubled over from it, almost collapsing.

Baclofen chills me out and would synergize with the benzo I'm on without fucking more with my Gaba A and benzodiazepine receptors than I already have since it works on Gaba B. So I could start frying those receptors instead. I just hate baclofen and I want off it as it makes me drowsy. I try to close my eyes, breathe, think of my safe haven up at the family cottage but it's just too extreme to ignore. I tried a little yoga earlier, but could barely be still in my usual asanas. I have no idea if this is related to the stupid coke I did a few days ago that I don't even enjoy, but it seems to have been a problem since that night. I personally think it is a post-acute opioid withdrawal symptom possibly exacerbated by some other things, like quitting high doses of daily hash oil at the same time, and now baclofen, and the coke triggering attacks - but I just don't know. I feel like I am going to drop dead from it.

Anyone else get this? Hardcore, extreme panic attacks fucking 3 weeks in? After the physical wd's subside... like very soon after? It's killing me. It makes me want to go back to the heroin like not even think twice about it. Just get the dope and make this go away...
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As you have recently had a bit of a lapse I would say that it sounds more like a little bit of acute withdrawal. If you can stay away from using substances for a week or two, even just a few days to start, you will start to feel better.

The panic attacks, anxiety, depression, insomnia and general malaise are one of the biggest struggles in making it through early recovery. The stress that kind of stuff causes is a huge reason why relapse is so common at that early stage in recovery.

Try and work on not beating yourself up or being too hard on yourself. It isn't easy. Relearning, or learning for the first time, how to be kinder and gentler with yourself and giving yourself some credit for all the hard work you are doing is the biggest and most rewarding opportunity of early recovery. It isn't just a challenge for people in recovery, but for people of all sorts struggling to overcome the challenges life tends to throw our way, regardless of whether you are a current substance user, a former substance user or someone who has never struggled with harmful patterns of substance use.

Keep trying, keep up the hard work you're doing to get healthy and you will make it sooner than you might think.

Good luck my friend. Know SL and BL are always here for you when the times get tough <3
 
Definitely stress related. Absolutely. Thanks for helping me realize that because I won't think I am dying from a drug complication when I continue to have these attacks. I don't have physical wd's anymore. I am full of vitality, positive energy, and I am actually cheerful and social again. I feel wonderful most of the time. I am filling my days with constructive activities like guitar playing, reading, healthy eating, and yoga. I am talking to my family again, especially my little bro. I feel very creative, and I have a healthy attraction to the opposite sex again (great sign IMO). I am sleeping great too. The only real symptom I'd say I still have, apart from the very real threat of relapse, is getting hit by these panic attacks at least twice daily. Since I have a pre-existing panic disorder that was triggered during a time of my life when I wasn't even using any drugs, but which was extremely stressful, I think that it is safe to say that this is stress related. I am summarizing what I wrote below when I was in more of a panic state... but I'll leave everything I wrote so that I can look back. May as well.

So I took that dilaudid one time over a week ago, I've recovered from that and I no longer have any physical wd's at all from opiates and I no longer have cravings either. I am also quite cheerful most days presently, sleeping great, and full of energy, I feel like I am 80% better from the opiate abuse. I just want this panic to go away and I am unsure where it's coming from or why it has gotten so much worse. Sure I might have the odd craving but it's easy to ignore because I don't have access.

I am essentially just entering the post-acute withdrawal phase now... the time when I no longer have physical symptoms to worry about at all. I don't have any cognitive symptoms at the moment either, apart from these panic attacks. Wondering if panic attacks are a common symptom during this time, very shortly after physical wd's end? I just wouldn't consider myself in early recovery anymore as I am feeling infinitely better (but in the grand scheme of things, I suppose that I am). I'm not too worried about a relapse from it. Just anxiety and I'm used to it, had it for years, but it's at its worst right now.

\Ohhhh I think I see what you are saying. I thought by early recovery, you meant that I was still experiencing all the dope sickness. I'm not really at all anymore. No RLS, no muscles aches, not much nausea, nothing like that anymore. I feel completely, 100% like my good old self apart from getting hit at least twice daily by these attacks. It has still been just a few weeks since the abuse ended. This has nothing to do with any substances other than opiates as my use of those as comfort meds was negligible in comparison, and a single line of coke that was just a mistake would not cause this.

I think it is just my panic disorder being exacerbated by the recent stress. If I keep chilling out (I really did learn my lesson) then I think it will subside, probably within a week or two at most. I still have waves of depression and very mild wd's but that isn't a big deal - it is when I am feeling like I am dying that I can't handle it. And yeah... I know what you mean. My panic disorder was triggered during a stressful time of my life when I wasn't abusing any drugs. I think it is stress related for sure, thanks for helping me realize that. Now, when I have panic attacks, it will be easier to convince myself that I am not going to die since it isn't so much drug related as I previously thought.
 
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Shroomy -

I just wanted to stop by and say I'm thinking of you. I hope all is well and I'm sending you my good vibes.

Keep pushing, Shroomy, you have so much to live for!

- VE
 
Thanks VE, that is very kind of you. I am struggling a lot - no longer with cravings or withdrawal symptoms at all, no more thinking about the high. No more opioid-related slip-ups, but slip-ups with other drugs. I did enough xanax for a period of time, that it started to make me feel really stupid, and intelligence is one of the few things I have left. I just want to escape the reality of my life. I woke up to a lot of problems that had been buried deep, and I'm not doing well with that. I was thinking a little cannabis might help keep me sane but I can't really afford it right now (yeah...)
 
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