☮ Social ☮ [PD Social Tripping Thread] NEW! Gather here for swirly talk

[Solipsis]

Hey guys,

had a really glowing amazing trip on 2 hits of AL-LAD (were they 125 ug or 150 don't remember?), and thinking of previous trips I would say it has not degraded at all (just sitting in my bagpack taken along to many places, but in a zip pocket enclosed in a blacked-out baggie so relatively well sealed. So just want to say once again there isn't much to worry about.

(Also in the morning I'd had a alternative medicine / yogic physical therapy of sorts that really centered me and primed me well)

Trip confronted me with myself, some difficult truth and reality, but in a really guiding way allowing very fair evaluation of the good and the bad... allowing for transformation, reinforced convictions etc.
And the hallucinations! Good god! I am probably really fully sensitized again after not tripping much or at all for such long periods! Redropping 1 1/2 hit WELL after the peak or even plateau did cause a considerable though milder mini-trip, CEVs and everything - very nice! Redropping is not pointless, although with preexisting tolerance it might be. And timing perhaps / and dosing idk?

At one point I was seeing so much cartooning of everything that it meshed entirely with when I decided to put on a Rick & Morty episode. Just absolute unleashed artistic / technical creativity in the minds eye when just meditating on the CEVs.

An excellent private housewarming while I am settling in, finishing decorating..

wow!!!

I don't want to start up with narcotic drugs again - something I'm slightly dabbling in again, I'm now more motivated to work out and do something about my physique etc.. but frequent trips a la AL-LAD is something I now plan instead for glows swirls and spiritual / personal-'moral' guidance (wanting to be a good and healthy person, to be better for myself and others).

I wonder which lysergamides are suited for this (otherwise I might go looking for some 4-HO-MET)... ETH-LAD is stronger and more serious than LSD rather than lighter?
Cause I think for frequent tripping in my condition I don't like to risk really letting the ego and mind slip so deep that it gets counterproductive. AL-LAD has proven to be quite capable of being a forceful guide to confront, but didn't have to leave me feel jarred. With say mushrooms of course there is great potential but at this point I am just not looking for a chance to get soul-raped, it's just too big of a mindfuck. Dont need that.

 

[xammy]

Would it be dangerous to combine 5-MeO-MIPT and 3-MeO-PCP?

 

[Solipsis]

I think so yeah:

Both are serotonin reuptake inhibitors and not insignificantly. If one is much stronger than the other on SERT, it mostly 'overrules', but when both act on SERT (think tramadol with DXM) aselectively you get synergistic effect. You want to avoid promoting synergistic serotonergic effects like that.

And when some people intentionally go for that combining two drugs for synergy carefully dosing two drugs appropriately / titrating, in some cases like when one of the drugs is notorious for adverse reactions like SS or seizure, and imo all things 3-MeO-PCP, it really seems a bad choice to fuck with.

 

[kidklmx]

Are you sure synergistic SRI effects are all that dangerous? Psychiatrists have been combining TCAs and SSRIs (and even SSRIs and SSRIs) since like forever. You mention aselectivity, so I might be missing something, way over my head here in this discussion! Anyway, wouldn't that just be less dangerous? If the transmitter is already inhibited, the molecule would just try to bind to the next available site right? Surely there could be a tipping point where SS could become a danger, but I have combined 5-MeO-MiPT and 3-MeO-PCE in lower doses and I have felt fine (more than fine actually ).

p.s I've noticed AL-LADs lack of tolerance as well. I like to drop huge doses of it and then dose a little bit of 4-AcO-DMT during the comedown, to find a more spiritual context in my experience, but overall I think AL-LAD would for your purposes be the best suited lysergamine.

 

[Xorkoth]

Would it be dangerous to combine 5-MeO-MIPT and 3-MeO-PCP?

I actually have done that twice, I experienced no issues at all, it was quite nice in fact.

But be careful with it, dose low I'd say.

 

[perpetualdawn]

Hey guys,

had a really glowing amazing trip on 2 hits of AL-LAD (were they 125 ug or 150 don't remember?), and thinking of previous trips I would say it has not degraded at all (just sitting in my bagpack taken along to many places, but in a zip pocket enclosed in a blacked-out baggie so relatively well sealed. So just want to say once again there isn't much to worry about.

..

I wonder which lysergamides are suited for this (otherwise I might go looking for some 4-HO-MET)... ETH-LAD is stronger and more serious than LSD rather than lighter?
Cause I think for frequent tripping in my condition I don't like to risk really letting the ego and mind slip so deep that it gets counterproductive. AL-LAD has proven to be quite capable of being a forceful guide to confront, but didn't have to leave me feel jarred. With say mushrooms of course there is great potential but at this point I am just not looking for a chance to get soul-raped, it's just too big of a mindfuck. Dont need that.

Good to hear your AL-LAD is holding up well! I have a healthy stash that I hope will survive with me over the years.

I wouldn't call ETH-LAD stronger than LSD in the sense you're talking about. It's probably stronger if you compare dosage vs. magnitude of effects, but I wouldn't say it's necessarily more serious than LSD. I'd probably call it less serious than LSD. It's kind of paradoxical because it's simultaneously deeper into the world of psychedelia, but less manipulation of the ego.. maybe. I'm kind of extrapolating because I've still only had 2 full blown ETH-LAD trips, so it's still hard to generalize. I do think ETH-LAD is more heart-centred than LSD, which is more head-centred than ETH-LAD. AL-LAD is just giggles and rainbows I love them all so much.

I definitely recommend checking ETH-LAD out after you've had a break, and try it at small doses first if you want to be cautious with your mind, because it's a whopper. I found 150µg of ETH-LAD to be stronger than 150µg AL-LAD by miles. Probably the new 100µg tabs are the right dose for a first try.

 

[Xorkoth]

Hey guys,

had a really glowing amazing trip on 2 hits of AL-LAD (were they 125 ug or 150 don't remember?), and thinking of previous trips I would say it has not degraded at all (just sitting in my bagpack taken along to many places, but in a zip pocket enclosed in a blacked-out baggie so relatively well sealed. So just want to say once again there isn't much to worry about.

(Also in the morning I'd had a alternative medicine / yogic physical therapy of sorts that really centered me and primed me well)

Trip confronted me with myself, some difficult truth and reality, but in a really guiding way allowing very fair evaluation of the good and the bad... allowing for transformation, reinforced convictions etc.
And the hallucinations! Good god! I am probably really fully sensitized again after not tripping much or at all for such long periods! Redropping 1 1/2 hit WELL after the peak or even plateau did cause a considerable though milder mini-trip, CEVs and everything - very nice! Redropping is not pointless, although with preexisting tolerance it might be. And timing perhaps / and dosing idk?

At one point I was seeing so much cartooning of everything that it meshed entirely with when I decided to put on a Rick & Morty episode. Just absolute unleashed artistic / technical creativity in the minds eye when just meditating on the CEVs.

An excellent private housewarming while I am settling in, finishing decorating..

wow!!!

I don't want to start up with narcotic drugs again - something I'm slightly dabbling in again, I'm now more motivated to work out and do something about my physique etc.. but frequent trips a la AL-LAD is something I now plan instead for glows swirls and spiritual / personal-'moral' guidance (wanting to be a good and healthy person, to be better for myself and others).

I wonder which lysergamides are suited for this (otherwise I might go looking for some 4-HO-MET)... ETH-LAD is stronger and more serious than LSD rather than lighter?
Cause I think for frequent tripping in my condition I don't like to risk really letting the ego and mind slip so deep that it gets counterproductive. AL-LAD has proven to be quite capable of being a forceful guide to confront, but didn't have to leave me feel jarred. With say mushrooms of course there is great potential but at this point I am just not looking for a chance to get soul-raped, it's just too big of a mindfuck. Dont need that.

Nice man! I'm glad you had a good mental cleansing. That's why I use psychedelics regularly, I find they really help me to stay on the path I want to be on, by helping me to keep current on being objective about and understanding of myself and my life situation. It's a time to confront yourself honestly and from a loving and more in-touch and honest place. When I see that place regularly, it's easier for me to stay there consistently. I think it's important to always be as self-aware as possible, to be aware of your physical/animal/chemical reactions so you can act with the proper level of oversight. Psychedelics can be a good tool for facilitating that.

I find ETH-LAD stronger physically/somatically than LSD, but LSD is more intense in the mind (at least from my one trip at 300ug of ETH-LAD). I find it easygoing but some people find it to have a very intense come-up. For me it was quite zen, less ups and downs than LSD, sort of like mescaline in a way. Contrast that with AL-LAD, which I found to be more outright euphoric than either, with a very positive and humorous direction.

 

[perpetualdawn]

For me it was quite zen, less ups and downs than LSD, sort of like mescaline in a way.

Yeah I agree about the comparison to mescaline. Never thought about it that way.

 

[Crashing]

My girl and I take psychedelics in series now. So, i'll dose one day while she sits, and she doses the next day while I sit. And this way, we have far better trips. AL-LAD to me is 'better' than LSD. I just find it to be more real, I would call it zen, similar to the way 4-aco-dmt is zen. The way you guys talk about ETH-LAD though... sounds awesome.

 

[Img_9999]

I do think ETH-LAD is more heart-centred than LSD, which is more head-centred than ETH-LAD.

I've only ever had one go with ETH-LAD, but I can really relate to that.

 

[Solipsis]

Are you sure synergistic SRI effects are all that dangerous? Psychiatrists have been combining TCAs and SSRIs (and even SSRIs and SSRIs) since like forever. You mention aselectivity, so I might be missing something, way over my head here in this discussion! Anyway, wouldn't that just be less dangerous? If the transmitter is already inhibited, the molecule would just try to bind to the next available site right? Surely there could be a tipping point where SS could become a danger, but I have combined 5-MeO-MiPT and 3-MeO-PCE in lower doses and I have felt fine (more than fine actually ).

p.s I've noticed AL-LADs lack of tolerance as well. I like to drop huge doses of it and then dose a little bit of 4-AcO-DMT during the comedown, to find a more spiritual context in my experience, but overall I think AL-LAD would for your purposes be the best suited lysergamine.

Yeah SSRI's have restricted effect and are not really that comparable to begin with, compared to straight aselective SRI's they seem to do curious things.
With anti-depressants or other psychiatric drugs the dosage is also quite controlled, in addition, while people experimenting with drugs don't usually benefit from such guidelines and supervision.

Really what the SRI interaction predicts is one of the major things that will probably cause adverse effects at some point or even quite dangerous... but not at what dosage, so not that it is a certainty at any dosage (when is it ever?)

Synergistic effects compared to other very simply additive interactions can proliferate and run out of control... more exponentially than linearly I guess. I think that when considering a therapeutic index and its narrowness, you are typically considering that dosage range where certain effects start 'running wild'. This can be an interaction but also just the way a drug may shift in binding preference a la GHB.

You mean the transporter 'inhibited' / blocked instead of transmitter? Well if one of the drugs is overruling I think the milder drug just won't really be that relevant since it can't bind so well - but when two drugs both act well to occupy SERT the intrasynaptic serotonin levels may at some point become a problem. And yeah when SS actually does become a danger it might get tricky very suddenly. I'm sure that at low enough doses it's 'more than fine', but that is probably true for many combinations that may at some dose lead to SS.

So again: one may get away with it but just ask yourself if you want to risk an interaction with drugs that you are particularly screwed with if something happens. It is I think better to think of it as narrowing your therapeutic index, and I have experience with 3-MeO-PCE and 3-MeO-PCP and while perhaps not physically unsafe at higher dosage, mentally people can get into a problem area (where you're just GONE) really fast.. and under that serious mania. Just doesn't seem wise to make the therapeutic index narrower (although granted serotonin problems are likely pharmacologically separate from dissociative blackout effects)
I'd definitely opt for combo alternatives that don't have those issues.

__

I have AMT and 2C-E and 2C-C here but no scale within reach - I got that stored elsewhere - of the AMT, I don't know how much it is exactly and I don't wanna dose that volumetrically anyway (not okay in solution).. Volumetric for 2C-E is a possibility though of course it can be pretty hardcore..

 

[Snufkin]

Yeah nothing wrong with enhancing your day or anything. I just don't like if a friend of mine does it or I do it, it feels fake to be "high secretly" you know. I feel like I'm not being honest or real me if I'm under the influence, even if I were a "better", "funnier" or "more outgoing" version of myself. I'm talking about myself, close friends or even family members, I don't really care how altered someone's state is.

I know what you're saying, I used to think exactly the same when I or a friend of mine would act a bit out of the norm. Is he on medication, do I come out drunk, does she have a terrible hangover etc. What is fake? What's real? What's just brain chemistry? Ever since I've done any substances besides alcohol I've more of less come to terms with my mood swings which can be quite drastic imo. People closest to me have much easier time to take me as I am, but for +30 years I've been a puzzle to myself. Within less than 6 months of infrequent psychedelics use I've learned more about myself than years with psychiatrists' sessions.

A friend of mine suffers from schizophrenia and it can be quite difficult to interact with her. Now that she got the medication right more or less, things have improved a lot. Once I asked her if she thinks herself a new person now under the influence. No, this is me now, finally, she repied.

I know what she's talking about.

 

[DragonFly31]

I have this LSD stored in my fridge for nearly a year, and as it is a bank holiday tomorrow I've decided to take a quarter of this acid which I wasn't sure was going to be good.

Well I have to say I am in love with low-dose LSD trips. It's like I can feel everything times a 100, but it isn't overwhelming at all. I don't feel restless or uncomfortable, nor do I feel the urge to go outside and explore or "do something".

It's quite pleasant just sitting here, reading or surfing on the internet and I could almost eat something, but actually thinking about it that doesn't seem likely.

I feel firmly connected to the world, at peace with myself and others, although that paradoxically makes me feel like a hypocrite because what do I know about the suffering and horrors of this world?

 

[Solipsis]

Yeah it can be a real enhancer like that, bring out the best in people...

Feeling connected or united is actually very well explained by recent unique findings in brain studies using LSD where people were found to have chatter between many brain regions. How connected or not connected we "are" is in fact irrelevant and when you think about it ridiculous to try and make objective, and quite impossible to become aware of considering like you suggest we know only a small portion of the world, a sample size and a selected one at that... nevertheless it can feel like an inner revolution if we become sensitive to the world and inner 'unionized', and that personal development is still an important and beautiful feat. The fact that it's only a symbolic notion to feel connected to others, without it being an effect of meeting people, is overestimated when considered vague like a spiritual effect .. but underestimated when not valued whether its artificial or not.

It's experiential, and in that sense for a big part unimportant where it's physical... just like the brain can benefit from imagined simulated sports practice like it can benefit from physical practice.

People can be hypocrites lots of times, but let us not make ourselves feel guilty for things that are unreasonable to ask of ourselves to take into account into all of our feelings.

Also, the brain chatter I mentioned also explains a lot of the psychedelic effects like the sensory effects: mental activity gets interpreted very freely, making visuals and the feeling like we can sense an entity, aura or many more things, and all of the while it feels like magical phenomenon happening since we can't properly explain our own brain acting in what is normally inappropriate for function, and what we are aware of we feel as a loss of boundary.

In my experience, the loss of boundaries is a great adjunct in letting us empathize more than usual even, and imagining all about what you know of horrors and suffering can shape our feelings and convictions, when actual encounters are lacking.

As the adagium says: change the world start with yourself.

 

[DragonFly31]

Yes very nice post. Indeed the feeling of connectedness may be overestimated, I think this is in part related to whether it is the Ego that is feeling, or something deeper whithin us that transcends and really connects us all?

In my experience with drugs, you really do have to be careful about the validity of any experience by itself. The doors of perception they seem to open, as with all things, they have to be placed in perspective: that there is no truth in this world, only shades of grey.

This is of course my own truth and I will mention here that it is intimately linked to what I am finding in my search for the Light; I might say it here, I am a freemason and being a freemason has done more to advance my understanding of the world and my own place in it than all the drugs I have every taken ever did... Although the two actually meet up because both in a way lead to a challenge of what we are and what we know.

And I will reveal here the greatest knowledge freemasonry has yet provided me with; the realisation that opposites do indeed come together to form a third, greater power. Two opposing truths, and they exist in this world - take quantum mechanics and classical mechanics for instance - actually build together to form a greater undertanding yet, and in this way we must tolerate and encourage those who do not think like us because we are all in the shit together!

What got me started with this rant is the idea that in order to change the world we first have to know ourselves, as the entrance to the ancient Greek temple in Delphi said.

One thing is for sure; that when we look at the stars at night and wonder at their beauty and their origin, we might as well be gazing into our own hearts and souls; I find that there is the same depth, wonder and mystery in ourselves as there is out there, wherever there is.

 

[Solipsis]

I never said anything about truth, just experience.

What the brain activity measured suggests is not merely the ego being stroked, although novelty insight and transformation can naturally produce feelings of achievement or significance.... but what stands out IMO is that not only senses meld together but apparently also thought or evaluation. (With 2C-E it is also more commonly reported that the mind and senses become one major synaesthetic soup).
It should be no surprise that there is some 'unity' within the brain (or loss of differentiation and compartmentalization), and while our personal experience of consciousness does stay limited to our person I would say that this inner unity is symbolic for our view of the world.

The world objectively speaking is neither united nor separate, or rather both - condensing with observation (all starting with quantum waveform collapse as you suggest ^ ). The trip changes nothing about that, but teaches us to look differently, rather than just the differentiated view we normally have. The interconnectedness in the brain allows creativity by greater and unusual jumps between nerve branching which is normally reserved for people with quite special mentalities.

Our minds are like a hall of mirrors, with softened boundaries we can gaze much further and deeper within ourselves, looking inside can become more truthful and comprehensive... although if there is chaos rather than harmony is it any wonder that we can get lost in ways that boundaries normally guard for...

Not stating fact here, we all adapt our ideas as we go - but thats what I think and what its like for me.

Going for a nice walk in nature with someone tomorrow and hopefully tuesday I can trip again ^_^

 

[DragonFly31]

Our minds are like a hall of mirrors, with softened boundaries we can gaze much further and deeper within ourselves, looking inside can become more truthful and comprehensive... although if there is chaos rather than harmony is it any wonder that we can get lost in ways that boundaries normally guard for...

As Nietzche put it, 'take care when you gaze into the abyss, that it does not gaze into you'

It would be foolish to think that we humans are nothing but pure light inside... We all have a dark companion and whoever is reading this on this forum is probably more aware of this dark side of ourselves than many others. We must embrace, understand ourselves and everything that we are in order to begin the quest for our restoration. Indeed in many religions man suffers from a fall from the heavens and must work to regain his divine place.

All this being said, I try to remember that it is not the goal that matters but the journey itself... Let's enjoy our little time in this incomprehensible existence...

Happy tripping!

 

[TheAppleCore]

Yo PD. Just came here to gush real quick about how much fun it is to play instruments while swirlin' a little on my favorite tryptamines. I'm trying to learn a little guitar - owned one for years but never bothered to pick the thing up, and I'm really glad I finally did!! Can't wait to record the song I'm learning and share with you guys.

One thing is for sure; that when we look at the stars at night and wonder at their beauty and their origin, we might as well be gazing into our own hearts and souls; I find that there is the same depth, wonder and mystery in ourselves as there is out there, wherever there is.

Well, the Zen folks would argue that when you look at the stars at night, you ARE gazing into your soul. The boundary between self and other is arbitrary / illusory. It's still a concept that I'm grappling with; I find it difficult to accept that there isn't some distinction between the subjective and the objective. I'm reading a kickass book right now on Zen, and I would highly recommend it to anyone interested in the subject -- Zen Buddhism: Selected Writings by D. T. Suzuki.

Anyway, I feel that there is an infinite depth of beauty in any aspect of the natural world, whether that's the human mind, the cosmos, flora and fauna, chemistry, physics, etc. I find that this magic is starkly lacking in almost anything man-made, which I why I *detest* urban environments, and love being in rugged natural landscapes.

I mean, even the beauty of a brick wall is the stippled texture of the brick, which is totally serendipitous; a natural quality of the brick's material. The man-made aspect of the wall, which is its basic shape, and the pattern in which the bricks are stacked, is absolutely boring as all hell; it's just a rectangle made of a bunch of rectangles. Nothing magical about that.

 

[Img_9999]

What about music, TAC ?
Music is completely man made, and is one of the most magical things there are
Also, literature, paintings, poetry... The concept of beauty itself, and all the concepts we as a specie churn out of our minds and embed to the world to enchant it with the illusion of structure, giving shape to our experiencing of the natural world.

We, humans, are also part of nature, and everything we do is also soaked with that kind of magic that is present in everything under the sun. Existence is a riddle, and a mystery, so no wonder everything is so exciting and also sometimes overwhelming !!

 

[DragonFly31]

^Completely agree!!

It's true that the urban environment leaves much to be desired, in general terms - I mean, who likes pollution, overpopulation, and the break with nature that is mentioned?

But what about the architectural beauty found in the Greek temple in Parthenon, in the middle of the horrid city of Athens, where the Golden ratio already found by the ancient Greeks within nature is included in the design and build of the temple? Humans have this incredible ability/duality inherent within themselves to create much beauty but also to destroy. It is a fundamental feature of our existence and I don't think we can escape it - it's part of the experience of being a human, stuck in this world between the heavens and hell.

We can, however, take care to create just a little more than we destroy - I think that each of us that has this awareness of our impact on this world and our contemporaries has a duty to themselves and to others to try and contribute something to this world, no matter how small it is.

It's this idea that keeps me going. The idea that I don't want to just take from this world anymore, but I want to give. I'm now on my own path to do just that in my own way, and this idea is also at the center of the humanist school of thought - the notion of a human progress towards an ideal, a goal.

The butterfly effect is very real for human action, too. What we do in this day, will constitute what tomorrow is made of... In this very real way there is an invisible link between all of us, a link that cannot be broken...

Well, the Zen folks would argue that when you look at the stars at night, you ARE gazing into your soul. The boundary between self and other is arbitrary / illusory. It's still a concept that I'm grappling with; I find it difficult to accept that there isn't some distinction between the subjective and the objective. I'm reading a kickass book right now on Zen, and I would highly recommend it to anyone interested in the subject -- Zen Buddhism: Selected Writings by D. T. Suzuki.

That's a very interesting point of view... difficult indeed to grasp with but wonderful in its implications...