Fucked up on heroin big time. Need urgent help. Please

[F.U.B.A.R.]

Actually, Loperamide can be very effective at alleviating stomach problems in withdrawal. As far as im aware, It doesn't need to cross the bbb to be effective as there are opiate receptors in the gut. As a recreational drug its useless due to the bbb thing, but it can help to stop you throwing up and shitting yourself every 5 minutes.

 

[Shambles]

A strong mind and a will to succeed help more than any drug IMHO

I would suggest it is generally more to do with the context than the strength of mind or willpower when it comes to addiction. As noted above, pain management patients don't tend to associate their symptoms with withdrawal and addiction in the same way that "street junkies" do. It's a whole other ballgame when you are used to just dialing a few numbers to make the pain go away as opposed to the pathologised mindset of simply following doctor's orders.

 

[BigG]

As an aside, the above doen't necessarily only apply to "trusted professionals". Somewhere around the height of my addiction myself and an even more deeply addicted friend were tasked with delivering pharmacueticals to hospitals (he was employed as the driver/deliveryman whilst I was along for the ride - we also took the opportunity to hit every pharmacy along the route for bottles of opioid-based cough syrups (Gee's Linctus ftmfw ) as back-up supplies but that is by the bye). This one day my companion was in such severe w/d he shat himself whilst driving (I had to nip into a charity shop to acquire clean kecks for him) yet we still did not touch the fukkin shitload of benzos in the back nor the stack of red CD packages we had in the front. Everybody has their redlines and that was one neither of us wished to cross. Plus, Gee's Linctus awaited so...

Your dead right shambles.... I've often thought that when I've seen pharmaceutical supplier delivery drivers dropping off boxes of CDs..

They would probably be caught easier as the potential for any diversion being noticed is huge but they could still do it...your right.

The thing with personal issue morphine. (that I'm given anyway) is it comes in 10mg/1ml aims which is then diluted with saline to 10mg/10ml to make it easier to titrated. Lots of times you don't need to give it all so your wandering around with a half full syringe of morphine in your pocket until you can find the appropriate time and place to dispose of it. The potential for diversion then is very high but still I think someone would notice when your eprf report didn't match the disposal bin and tye batches didn't add up but I'm always super careful.

That Gee's Linctus must have tasted pretty rank though mate

 

[BigG]

I would suggest it is generally more to do with the context than the strength of mind or willpower when it comes to addiction. As noted above, pain management patients don't tend to associate their symptoms with withdrawal and addiction in the same way that "street junkies" do. It's a whole other ballgame when you are used to just dialing a few numbers to make the pain go away as opposed to the pathologised mindset of simply following doctor's orders.

Again this is true...pain management opiate dependence (pathological pain) and opioid dependence due to addiction without underlying pathological symptoms are different. Withdraw is withdrawl at the end of the day but I imagine it's harder if relief is only a phone call to a dealer away. Once a pain patients doctor has stopped their meds then (usually) their source has disappeared so the psychological element is different.

Edit...FUBAR...you right about lope (I'm sure we talked about this the other day)... I was meaning more useless as a recreational substute. Obviously it will help with Gi problems associated with WDs but is unlikely to help with many of the other symptoms due to its limited receptor affinity (basically just the gut but i is more complicated as you know due to the BBB issue)

 

[pjd555]

To play Devil's advocate, they would say you were never an 'addict' in the first place, not by their definition anyway. I'm aware that there is a significant element of ad hominem reasoning in there but at the same time I understand that point of view.

I met the diagnostic criteria of an alcoholic and my first lonesome attempt at stopping was met with all of the withdrawal syndrome symptoms one would expect. If some untrained religiously driven mystic who plays the ringmaster in one of those vile circuses wants to say I was never addicted I can do nothing to stop him saying what I know to be moronic psychobabble.

 

[BigG]

I met the diagnostic criteria of an alcoholic and my first lonesome attempt at stopping was met with all of the withdrawal syndrome symptoms one would expect. If some untrained religiously driven mystic who plays the ringmaster in one of those vile circuses wants to say I was never addicted I can do nothing to stop him saying what I know to be moronic psychobabble.

If you don't mind me asking... What was your reason for joining this fine forum?

I initially joined for tye pain management forum but got sixk of yanks whingeing about the makers of oxy changing the formula (Jesus they go on and on ). But Imoved over th o EADD because I like the people here.

 

[pjd555]

^



Which, miraculously, coincided with widespread prescribing of pregabalin and such. Which is definitely, definitely non-recreational nor addictive. FACT!

Pregabalin is a shitty little drug, horrifyingly expensive, next to useless as an anticonvulsant in cost/benefit terms in comparison to other drugs and, yes, it certainly does have abuse potential. Thankfully, it is a third line option and it is up to the consultant to prescribe it for GAD. I don't see the world as a better place because of its existence.

 

[BigG]

Pregabalin is a shitty little drug, horrifyingly expensive, next to useless as an anticonvulsant in cost/benefit terms in comparison to other drugs and, yes, it certainly does have abuse potential. Thankfully, it is a third line option and it is up to the consultant to prescribe it for GAD. I don't see the world as a better place because of its existence.

I was prescribed it as part of my pain management for the neuropathic component of my symptoms. I found it next to useless and the size effects so severe I couldn't take it.
However it did help considerably with withdrawl. Especially those horrible noradrenaline surges that make you want to crawl out of your skin. That and clonidine were what got me through.

It definitely has uses...Just not necessarily the uses its prescribed for

I never found it even slightly recreational though as I found its effects quite unpleasant

 

[pjd555]

If you don't mind me asking... What was your reason for joining this fine forum?

I initially joined for tye pain management forum but got sixk of yanks whingeing about the makers of oxy changing the formula (Jesus they go on and on ). But Imoved over th o EADD because I like the people here.

I want to understand my patients. My own, very narrow, personal experience of addiction has never sufficiently informed me in understanding other types of addicts and I have chosen to specialise in addiction and allocate much of my time to dealing with addicts in the practice and outside. In recent years the wide availability of RC benzo type drugs has created a situation where there are addicts of a type I hardly ever get to see because they never run out of supply. Visiting places like this is one of the few ways I hear their voice. I'm terrified of some ill-informed or ideologically driven government rushing in an analogue law but I have to prepare for the horror that would ensue in such circumstances. I can cope with the dribble of patients who come in with a sprained ankle and then burst into tears and tell me they have been addicted to xyz for five years but I'm utterly terrified of the mayhem of patient after patient presenting with disastrous withdrawal symptoms because someone in Whitehall thought June 1st is a good day to die.

 

[F.U.B.A.R.]

Edit...FUBAR...you right about lope (I'm sure we talked about this the other day)... I was meaning more useless as a recreational substute. Obviously it will help with Gi problems associated with WDs but is unlikely to help with many of the other symptoms due to its limited receptor affinity (basically just the gut but i is more complicated as you know due to the BBB issue)

Yes I think we did. Oh well, I just wanted to point out that anything which provides some relief from withdrawal is worthwhile, even if it's 'Dr. Murphy's snake tonic'. However, i feel that loperamide is a valid remedy because when in acute withdrawal the GI discomfort is significant. The worst thing for me though is the feeling that something is pressing hard on my chest and I'm suffocating or drowning. I hate that feeling and it has caused me to relapse countless times.

 

[BigG]

I want to understand my patients. My own, very narrow, personal experience of addiction has never sufficiently informed me in understanding other types of addicts and I have chosen to specialise in addiction and allocate much of my time to dealing with addicts in the practice and outside. In recent years the wide availability of RC benzo type drugs has created a situation where there are addicts of a type I hardly ever get to see because they never run out of supply. Visiting places like this is one of the few ways I hear their voice. I'm terrified of some ill-informed or ideologically driven government rushing in an analogue law but I have to prepare for the horror that would ensue in such circumstances. I can cope with the dribble of patients who come in with a sprained ankle and then burst into tears and tell me they have been addicted to xyz for five years but I'm utterly terrified of the mayhem of patient after patient presenting with disastrous withdrawal symptoms because someone in Whitehall thought June 1st is a good day to die.

You've come to the right place then!!!

Trying to understand the myriad of ABCD123-XYZ. research chemicals that I now come across on the road was one of my reasons for sticking around too. When your front line and someone had hurt themselves by taking some drug you've never heard of this education can save lives.

I have discussed many times with folk on here the utter meltdown that will ensue (and has already started to Ensue) with people buying benzos (or nor-benzos) online in gram quantities....Some of these drugs are active at sub milligram doses so it's just mind boggling. Before this people's benzo consumption was limited due to supply but now supply is virtually unlimited. An analogue law would be utter, utter carnage.

I'm sick of trying to defib some young kids heart after he's taken some unknown combo of whatever and telling his parents hes gone. Overdoses seems to have increased exponentially in recent years to the point that a colleague of mine was tellingly yesterday that when they come across an unconscious patient on the street in Manchester they bang 300 of narcan IM as a FIRST line treatment....Just in case before they even start baseline obs or ECG... That's how bad it's become.

Breaks my heart it really does. The sorrow that comes from dealing with families that have lost their loved ones to some random cocktail of whatever is something that affects me profoundly and the day it no longer does is the day I'll leave this job.

Please take care out there folks