I believe being possessed by an inner Reptilian Deamon

[PORB]

from a psychological prospective in the case of a another personality in a person, its usually best to treat the maladaptive personality the same you would the other(s) with respect, and you would bring the two together and slowly "feed" the other personality into a cohabited fusion, to bring wholeness back in the person, and from there typically therapeutic change occur after.

 

[Xorkoth]

Not everything you experience on psychedelics is real, many times you're just tripping. Sometimes your mind just makes stuff up, as we have powerful imaginations, and sometimes it's aspects of your subconsciousness coming through symbolically. Consider that some of the deepest parts of our brain are reptilian, due to our deep shared evolutionary history with reptiles (the first mammal evolved from a reptile, many millions of years ago). It's dangerous to take everything you experience with psychedelics literally. Our minds are powerful and suggestible and if you start thinking that everything alien or negative that you experience as an invading entity, it opens yourself up to some entirely self-imposed aberrant thought patterns. If you believe hard enough that you're possessed, you may start to suffer for it, but someone could have the same experience, interpret it as simply a random tripping thought, and never experience anything further from it. You have to take your psychedelic experiences with a grain of salt... I believe there are real experience one can have that are not hallucination, but I also believe that the majority of experiences on psychedelics are simply due to your own brain.

EDIT: Also, no need to call the guy names, that's not helpful.

 

[greengummybear]

Not everything you experience on psychedelics is real, many times you're just tripping. Sometimes your mind just makes stuff up, as we have powerful imaginations, and sometimes it's aspects of your subconsciousness coming through symbolically. Consider that some of the deepest parts of our brain are reptilian, due to our deep shared evolutionary history with reptiles (the first mammal evolved from a reptile, many millions of years ago). It's dangerous to take everything you experience with psychedelics literally. Our minds are powerful and suggestible and if you start thinking that everything alien or negative that you experience as an invading entity, it opens yourself up to some entirely self-imposed aberrant thought patterns. If you believe hard enough that you're possessed, you may start to suffer for it, but someone could have the same experience, interpret it as simply a random tripping thought, and never experience anything further from it. You have to take your psychedelic experiences with a grain of salt... I believe there are real experience one can have that are not hallucination, but I also believe that the majority of experiences on psychedelics are simply due to your own brain.

EDIT: Also, no need to call the guy names, that's not helpful.

i am totally in line with your opinion Xorkoth, the visions that we have on psychedelics are hallucinations sometimes representing our conscious/unconscious mind. also personally i don't believe in intangible gods, deamons, ect at all. but i have known many very spiritual people that have become better people because of their spirituality. i accept the possibility i am wrong about mysticism and respect the spirituality of those whose beliefs have made them better people. regardless of a persons ideas on spirituality i recommend separating drugs, god, and government as much as possible. i have learned combining any two or all three of those things is often destructive.

 

[beforethebeginning]

i would not recommend to do ayahuasca or any other drug to either "get rid of demons" or "gain more enlightenment",
because i believe that they dont work.

it was fun to read your experience, thread starter. i have had many similar experiences.
i think the demons make us believe something is wrong with us, and thus need to use psychedelics to improve ourselves;
it part of their way to gain more control over us.

i dont care if people think this is delusional talk, they can believe what they want to believe, and i will believe what i want to.
i think the world is under an evil spell,

and every person is under this evil spell himself to some degree.
some being extremely evil, like pedophiles or warmongers...

and others just trying to be good people,
but they are being helt back by fears, addictions or delusional beliefs (like religious dogmas; or "psychedelic experiences"),
whatever it may be that prevents u to be the most supportive, productive and balanced person u could be.

 

[atara]

hey peeps,

(not 100% sure if this belongs into dark side, if not, maybe a friendly admin could move it, thank you )

I once had a really good psychedelic mushrooms trip (I've eaten 5 g cubensis I believe) - the trip was fabulous, but I spotted a reptilian deamon inside of me once during the trip. the other entity / ghost inside me was a monkey (I got the whole methamorphosis), the mokey was strong and good.

the lizard seemed to be a relatively weak (maybe this is a deception) deamon, but truely evil in its nature and represented all the negative parts of me, like getting into depression, nurishing sadness and lonelyness rather than going out and making change happen or just being happy like a good person feels (or like I felt as a child).

two days ago I had a really good Ketamin trip (without facing deomons, I only saw christ I believe). but, and here's the point, I watched an Ayahuasca documentary yesterday and I saw people getting rid of deamons (intense, harsh procedure, people screaming, vomiting in pain and agony) and now I believe IF the deamon still is inside of me (I'm pretty sure it is the case) than I must get rid of it. but how? the only way would be truly go to the rainforest and take part in all the ayahuasca ceremonies for a period of time.

would anyone of you like to add some thoughts on this matter? ever encountered deamons / evil beings inside of you? how does a deamon get inside oneself? Is it through contact with evil people? I have lot of questions arising and if someone knows a very well written site on this topic I'd be glad if you posted a link.

thankyaw :D

This is a not-uncommon delusion. Consider e.g.

http://philosophyofbrains.com/2013/...r-disorders-of-self-consciousness-part-2.aspx

A lot of people conclude that something is taking over their mind when they don't seem to get the results they would like, thinking. Fortunately, those people are wrong; as the philosopher states, this isn't really a meaningful concept.

There's a sort of "gap in the language" where we don't have a useful way to describe where "thoughts"/"perceptions"/"qualia" originate: we have our thoughts, we can only react to them. We can't speak of where thoughts come from, because we can't show it to anyone. Things which can be concretely described are things which can be mutually experienced, even in some limited way -- Mission Control watches a video of Dr. Armstrong and Dr. Aldin on the Moon.

Different cultures have different traditions of trying to feel comfortable with this concept; in the West they consider it natural that all of your thoughts and perceptions are your thoughts, your perceptions, et cetera. Buddhist philosophy takes the opposite tack and will say that no thoughts or perceptions are yours, because there is no "you" to have them.

In either case the situation is like this: you have some problems that you need to deal with. Your mind doesn't always seem to work the way you want it to. You can address real problems while tripping and learn to view them in a different way; you can address real problems while sober and learn to view them in a different way.

There are no demons to be slain; it is more like a large pile of rubbish you have forgotten to clean up and which continues to accumulate.

all the negative parts of me, like getting into depression, nurishing sadness and lonelyness rather than going out and making change happen

One step at a time.

 

[Xorkoth]

i would not recommend to do ayahuasca or any other drug to either "get rid of demons" or "gain more enlightenment",
because i believe that they dont work.

it was fun to read your experience, thread starter. i have had many similar experiences.
i think the demons make us believe something is wrong with us, and thus need to use psychedelics to improve ourselves;
it part of their way to gain more control over us.

i dont care if people think this is delusional talk, they can believe what they want to believe, and i will believe what i want to.
i think the world is under an evil spell,

and every person is under this evil spell himself to some degree.
some being extremely evil, like pedophiles or warmongers...

and others just trying to be good people,
but they are being helt back by fears, addictions or delusional beliefs (like religious dogmas; or "psychedelic experiences"),
whatever it may be that prevents u to be the most supportive, productive and balanced person u could be.

I think this is just human nature, not that it's due to demons or evil forces. We struggle with our light and dark sides. Some people, due to trauma or whatever, succumb to the darkness. Some people, perhaps, are born dark (though I'm not at all sure this is the case).

Also, a psychedelic experience is the opposite of religious dogma. It's an experience directly experienced, an intensely personal thing, whereas religious dogma is not personal at all, but an enforced belief that is not at all based in personal experience.

 

[neversickanymore]

@moneyboy

Could you describe what the demon looked like and esp if it was dressed in anything.

Also was it a monkey or was it an Ape?

 

[Doldrugs]

i think the world is under an evil spell,

...

delusional beliefs (like religious dogmas; or "psychedelic experiences")

I don't think you have a very good grasp on what is or isn't delusional. Who put this evil spell on the world? What is an evil spell, in your mind?

 

[beforethebeginning]

well yeah, maybe its all not really "evil" and not really "demons",
but symbolic i think its real, and thats real enough to take it serious

the psychedelic realm is there sober as well, its just less Obvious.
maybe in case of normal people you can call it "darkness", but some people seem downright evil.


when i see people studying to become drs for example, i'm jealous in a way;
but i'm way too caught up by my own demons that prefer to waste time than be productive like that.

i also eat less healthy than i'd want to,
addictions and compulsions are like being possessed.

 

[moneyboy]

@moneyboy

Could you describe what the demon looked like and esp if it was dressed in anything.

Also was it a monkey or was it an Ape?

it was not really about the look, but more of my feeling when I watched inside a mirror. It was some being that attracts negative emotions and wants to make others suffer. I also had a transformation on acid once I walked a long time in the woods I felt like becoming some kind of reptilian animal.

monkey or ape, isn't it meant to be the same? I mean something like a chimp maybe.

 

[jason7]

YES THEY ARE!
A demon is going to fill the void while you are having an OBE?!
The Catholic Church still does exorcisms!?
Come the fuck on people, dude was TRIPPING and saw some shit...no BFD IMO.

Wow, are you green. While a malevolent non-physical entity may not be able to get into your body while your soul is out, it also may. Now if you don't believe that such entities exist then how do you explain all of the cases of houses being haunted by them or people possessed by them, causing them to act weird and do evil stuff? Were all those people just lying, and for what conceivable reason? People who have had NDEs have also encountered such entities. I doubt the Catholic church has any power over them, but they definitely exist. This person who saw the lizard was 99% likely to just have been tripping but you never can tell. It appears to be a mental representation of parts of his own personality, especially since the lizard and monkey both had animal forms. You don't often see monkey or lizard shaped entities so I doubt he has much to worry about possessionwise.

 

[AA357]

Dude. Someone like you has no business messing around with psychedelics.

My advice:

- Give yourself a good hard slap in the face
- Stay away from all drugs in future.

 

[Vurtual]

As pointed out above, the word demon was originally a general term for a lesser deity (or something - like jinn) - it only come to mean a malevolent spirit after early christians would refer to all pagan gods/spirits as malevolent (before they were established enough as a religion to just say they didn't actually exist). So the people who actually invented the term meant nothing like what christians do now - the greeks referred to demon as something like genius eg eudaimonia meaning happiness, literally means the demon of happiness has possessed you.

Ascribing one's negative qualites (like addiction, laziness) to some outside entity possessing you is a total cop out i'm afraid - you could just as easily say the good bits of you weren't you but were some angel possessing you. Also, ascribing a general negative quality to the entire planet/humanity is just projection - i tend to project niceness, joy and that sort of stuff - neither projection is 'right' (but i think i'm righter ) - i don't know where all this negativity about the world comes from (is it judeo-christian (or just watching the news too much)) but in my experience, the vast majority of people are lovely (they just don't get on the news as much).

I've no doubt that seemingly independent entities can appear to your consciousness when on psychedelic drugs (or not), and i'd guess there are probably subconscious 'entities' living inside your brain (as in a society of mind), but we don't need a supernatural dimension of nasties to explain this, just a bit of psychology.

 

[Doldrugs]

how do you explain all of the cases of houses being haunted by them or possessed by them, causing them to act weird and do evil stuff?

Science has no problem explaining any of that. None of it has ever been proven when subjected to legitimate research.

Were all those people just lying, and for what conceivable reason?

Hoaxes that provided economic gain (book sales, tourist visits, etc), mental illness, displaced blame for criminal actions, etc...

People who have had NDEs have also encountered such entities.

"Entities" easily explained by psychology and chemistry, which science hasn't affirmed as real despite thousands of years worth of people's subjective experiences.

 

[AA357]

I've no doubt that seemingly independent entities can appear to your consciousness when on psychedelic drugs (or not), and i'd guess there are probably subconscious 'entities' living inside your brain (as in a society of mind), but we don't need a supernatural dimension of nasties to explain this, just a bit of psychology.

Couldn't have put it better myself. This subforum is full of weirdos who think everything they see or think while tripping has some kind of divine significance and I'm sick of it - it gives psychedelic users a bad name.

Another thing: excessive spirituality and delusional/superstitious beliefs are a symptom of schizophrenia. If you already have schizophrenia, you have absolutely no business taking psychedelics. One trip is all it takes... I tripped with a schizo early last year and he ended up in a psych ward (AFAIK he's still there now).

 

[neversickanymore]

It may have just been a visual representation of the reptilian part of brain which we all have, it is mostly concerned with survival so may carry with it selfish traits we may interpret as dark or evil

if your into this subject matter you may enjoy this thread

The Brain and Addiction

it was not really about the look, but more of my feeling when I watched inside a mirror. It was some being that attracts negative emotions and wants to make others suffer. I also had a transformation on acid once I walked a long time in the woods I felt like becoming some kind of reptilian animal.

evokes negative emotions instead.. possibly?

Im not sure this is relevant at all , but you might find it interesting

Who are the shadow people?

monkey or ape, isn't it meant to be the same? I mean something like a chimp maybe.

Though ape and monkey are often used interchangeably in the English language, they are not the same from a scientific point of view.
Apes and monkeys are primates that have evolved different physical and mental characteristics throughout time to respond to different needs and environments. For example, most monkeys have an easily visible tail, but no apes do, and while monkeys are physically built for a life in the trees, apes tend to be built for a life lived in the trees and on the ground.

Comparison chart

 

[The Chronic]

Thanks for the link

 

[Xorkoth]

i also eat less healthy than i'd want to,
addictions and compulsions are like being possessed.

It seems to me that this may be a way in which you are passing off responsibility for your own actions. Addictions and compulsions may be "like" being possessed in a sense, but they're ultimately under your own control; they are products of your own mind and body system. I can say this with confidence given that I have struggled with addiction my entire life, and strong compulsions as a child bordering on OCD. While I was powerfully controlled by my addiction to opiates, I alone allowed it to develop and fester, and it was ultimately my own willpower that got me past it. Some people are predisposed to self-defeating behavior patterns, but anyone who is can also overcome them. By claiming them to be the result of outside forces, we remove the responsibility for these states from ourselves, and we also remove our own power to vanquish them.

 

[iodo]

Okay, I'm still really bothered by this thread, and heres why.

If I went over to OD, and claimed that I had been using MDPV for days, and I was currently chilling with shadow people, a RESPONSIBLE BL user would use harm-reduction by saying "go to sleep, if these delusions continue talk to a doctor, try to get on anti-psychotics"

Could a moderator explain why this hasn't been moved to Philosophy and Spirituality, why it remains in the psychedelic drug forums where we're supposed to be expressing HR?



I really don't like being that guy, I don't get any joy from bashing religion/spirituality, but this really doesn't seem to be fit for Focus Forums, it should be in community or support. Furthermore, I don't think users in Focus Forums should use their non-scientific speculations in the form of facts.

Evil entities do enter our bodies through doing drugs, the lack of faith, promiscuity, ouija boards, etc. because these things weaken our souls and open the door to a world of darkness. You make yourself vulnerable to be taken advantage of by the Devil. I don't know if you're baptized, you should get it done soon if not.
Pray. Pray every day.

If you're standing outside your body because you took some shrooms, for instance, an entity could fill the vacancy and then you're stuck with it until you can cast it out.

These examples (I'm not meaning to call anyone out) express no facts, but still could be interpreted as true by a less-informed user, which is specifically against HR and voids the User Agreement. It's on par with saying "If you snort oxycodone, you'll be higher than if you ate it"



Again, I'm not trying to be an asshole, but I really don't like seeing these threads with users actively participating in pure speculation and no facts or HR used.

 

[Xorkoth]

Well I understand your points, and I don't like the pseudoscience that gets spouted in here sometimes either. But people are free to say what they're going to say in here. We can't stop people from making nonscientific claims, and it's inevitable that many such claims will be made in the psychedelics forum. We can only hope that posts by other people will be made to counteract said claims, and they are in almost every case including this thread. Some people are seeking pseudoscientific opinions and these people are going to ignore evidence to the contrary and latch onto the kinds of posts they want to see, and nothing we do here is going to stop that. And this will happen in the opposite direction as well. But others will read everything and come to the conclusion that seems most plausible to them.

It's reasonable to move this thread to the spirituality forum, but this topic does relate to psychedelics, and PD has long been a place where spirituality/philosophy discussion and technical psychedelic discussion cross over. It's due to the nature of the psychedelic experience. The main reason I thought to leave it here is that the OP is specifically asking for help, and over there he is most likely to just get insulted or for the responses to relate not specifically to him but to the general topic. At least over here people generally want to be helpful. The OP was not, I don't think, looking to have a philosophical discussion but to receive support for a situation that has frightened him.

Also: promiscuity leads to possession by evil entities? Wow...