Just finished in patent detox - questiions

[LotusExige]

All,

I hope I'm in the right place - if not my apologies. I've been a chronic pain suffer for about 5 years now and wound up taking 6 8mg dilaudid a day for about the past year or so. A few months ago things got so bad pain wise I made the stupid mistake of IVing them which became my method of admin for about 2 months now. Visiting family I started to run out so I decided its time to stop and did a 5 day in patient detox. I'm home from it now, feeling better (save for the extreme exhaution - how do you sleep in those shitty hospital beds!)

Anyway my questions are:

- My RLS is just awful. I did just take 60mg of lopermide (Immodium) so I'm hoping that'll help in a bit. What OTC should I be trying? As I work with a pain doc for all my meds I can get whatever I need so if that's something better I want to know.

- What do I do when my pain comes back. God I don't want to go through this again (the first 48 hours were just hell) but my pain is already returning. I'm trying to cowboy up but still - the pain is intense (hence the dose). So the question is can I use this stuff sparingly (like 30 a month vs. 180) or will one send me back to physical dependence?

- Did I mention the RLS??

- I did get some kratom online and am making some tea from it now - good or bad idea?

- I'm also a fan of the chronic but that seems to almost make it worse, make any sense?

The good thing is it's 2 weeks before I can see my doc so I have time to get clean before I have the option of these things again. I'm just terrified I'll *need* them again as the reason I was on them was the intense chronic back pain I have. 15 specialists in 5 years can't figure out what's wrong with me.

While I'm glad I flushed the rest of my pills before going in god damn a big part of me would kill for one to stop this pain in my legs. Feels like I was 10 with the awful growing pains (I had them horribly as a kid).

Thanks all - god I hope I can get this monkey off my back!

 

[Trying2Iso]

KRATOM IS AWESOME make yourself a big cup
anyway good luck with that, im more of an uppers person like coke/adderall/mdma so i dont really know much about

if the weed isn't working, don't smoke it.
Try getting a pdoc to prescribe you a benzodiazepine to take the edge off, it'll help with the irritability and aggravation

 

[Trying2Iso]

try Diphenhydramine for RLS

 

[Prescottdave]

A number of medications can make RLS worse. In particular, anti-nausea drugs and sedating antihistamines (like Benadryl AKA Diephenhydramine) can cause an increase in RLS symptoms. Antidepressants that increase serotonin and antipsychotic medications can also aggravate the condition. Let your doctor know if your restless legs symptoms worsen after you take a new medication. A change in dosage or to a different medication may do the trick.

 

[Trying2Iso]

A number of medications can make RLS worse. In particular, anti-nausea drugs and sedating antihistamines (like Benadryl AKA Diephenhydramine) block the brain’s dopamine receptors, causing restless legs symptoms. Antidepressants that increase serotonin and antipsychotic medications can also aggravate the condition. Let your doctor know if your restless legs symptoms worsen after you take a new medication. A change in dosage or to a different medication may do the trick.

Diphenhydramine is a dopamine reuptake inhibitor, it doesn't block dopamine, it keeps it flowing and stops it from leaving...

 

[Prescottdave]

Per medscape and dozens of other sources including studies on pub med and web MD they say something similar to the following," Discontinuation, when possible, of medications that cause or exacerbate RLS, such as selective serotonin reuptake inhibitors (SSRIs), serotonin-norepinepherine reuptake inhibitors (SNRIs), diphenhydramine, and dopamine antagonists

 

[Prescottdave]

Per wikipedia Diphenhydramine has also been shown to inhibit the reuptake of serantonin. I see nothing in regards to it being a "dopamine reuptake inhibitor" but you could be correct. It is well known that Diphenhydramine increase RLS. You can search blue light and find dozens of reports explaining the fact that this medication is known to increase the symptoms. http://www.bluelight.org/vb/archive/index.php/t-366986.html
Actually I am not an expert on how this medication affects dopamine but it is well known to exacerbate RLS. This is well documented and I have experienced this first hand while going through WD symptoms from opiate pain medications.

 

[Prescottdave]

http://www.bluelight.org/vb/archive/index.php/t-439713.html
I would stick with a cal mag supplement. This has been proven to reduce RLS is some individuals. You can also speak with your doctor about medications that would help. I can tell you discontinuing opiates and taking Diphenhydramine is not going to help much besides make you more drowsy.
http://www.rls.org/Document.Doc?id=2074

 

[LotusExige]

First thanks so much to all of you who've taken the time to reply and help me in this journey. As you surely can relate it's really hard to get good information when you're going through something like this basically alone as none of my family or friends really understand.

The good news is other than exhaustion I'm doing much better. No RLS for 6+ hours now, hoping it won't return tonight. I did make a pot of kratom tea and just had about a 1/4 cup of it (brewed down to 1 cup from an ounce of cut leaves). Seems to be making me a little more awake (in a good way) but could be a placebo. Going to try some in the morning to see if it helps wake me up.

My main issue now is sleep - in the last 7 days I've maybe gotten 2 hours constant sleep - I'll get about an hour, wake up for a few hours then maybe get 2 hours. A family friend gave me 10 1mg xanax (which, other than at the hospital during detox I've never had). I believe they have me .5mg doses.

Question: I'm considering taking 2mg of the Xanax tonight before I hit the sack to help me sleep - good or bad idea? I've laid off the weed for the day as I'm worried it was making my RLS worse. So thoughts on taking the 2mg Xanax?

Again thanks - your support really means a lot to me right now...

 

[endotropic]

In your opinion what was the purpose of going through the in-patient detox?

Were you trying to free yourself of opiates completely? Free yourself from all drugs? Reduce your dilaudid dosage while still using as prescribed for pain?

I think you'll get a lot more meaningful advice if you can answer that question first.

 

[LotusExige]

In your opinion what was the purpose of going through the in-patient detox?

Were you trying to free yourself of opiates completely? Free yourself from all drugs? Reduce your dilaudid dosage while still using as prescribed for pain?

I think you'll get a lot more meaningful advice if you can answer that question first.

In short to break my physical dependence. I have no moral issues with drug use and fortunately my drug of choice is simply weed (and as I live in Colorado it's fully legal now). I've never done anything illicit, save for LSD twice in college. What I couldn't deal with any longer was the physical dependence - the constant fear of not having meds and getting sick, the constant doctors visits, etc. And the reality is they never made me feel "good". I told my doc I feel like I'm going through what a heroin addict would but I never got the fun of heroin!

It was 100% my choice to go into the program and as I finally slept last night (taking nothing, not even weed) I slept 3 hours then 4 hours. I feel the best I've felt in weeks right now. The only thing I've "taken" is some of the kratom tea I made but honestly I don't think it's doing shit as I both didn't drink much and am not sure I made it correctly.

In the future it's the physical dependence that I don't want to happen again. If that means I can't ever touch opiates (unless I get hit by a bus and must) I won't ever touch them again...

 

[mareseatoats]

Diphenhydramine is a dopamine reuptake inhibitor, it doesn't block dopamine, it keeps it flowing and stops it from leaving...

Diphenhydramine ALWAYS increased my RLS every time. It also helped keep me more crazy wide awake-just with an odd feeling, sluggish type heart-beat; while my head raced, and my limbs flailed.

 

[Prescottdave]

Lotus i think it is great that you are trying to reduce the amount of medications or opiate related drugs you ingest. Going through detox for opiate dependency and then using Kratom is an easy way to get hooked on that plant. Kratom can be intoxicating and addictive physically and psychologically. If you do not like being addicted physically to opiate related chemicals then i would suggest lowering your dosage of all related substances and then stopping. I would highly suggest you look into finding some help through support groups and possible out patient treatment. Depending on substances like xanax and kratom are only short term solutions to a bigger problem.

 

[LotusExige]

Lotus i think it is great that you are trying to reduce the amount of medications or opiate related drugs you ingest. Going through detox for opiate dependency and then using Kratom is an easy way to get hooked on that plant. Kratom can be intoxicating and addictive physically and psychologically. If you do not like being addicted physically to opiate related chemicals then i would suggest lowering your dosage of all related substances and then stopping. I would highly suggest you look into finding some help through support groups and possible out patient treatment. Depending on substances like xanax and kratom are only short term solutions to a bigger problem.

Once again thanks - I think that's also great advice. The Kratom didn't really do anything anyway so I just chucked the rest. I never tried the Xanax as I agree - I just want off everything. Right now it's been 1 week since I've had any opiate, the longest I've been in 5+ years. I will *NOT* start these things again now that I'm free.

 

[Mariposa]

I would not rule out Xanax if I were to be in your position. I am prescribed .5 mg twice daily. I split them in half and take one-half before bed about 3 times per week. I use no other drugs other than occasional cannabis, which is legal for me, alcohol in extreme moderation (that's my issue), and about 1 cup of coffee in the morning. Kratom and opiates/opioids make me vomit violently.

I do commend you on your effort to stay clean. Please be sure to drink a lot of water and attend to your nutrition. It's easy to forget to eat when you're beating a polydrug addiction. Even if it's just something small, eat healthy food and drink clean water. Bananas are a quick and easy fix for potassium, which is very helpful with RLS. Calcium/magnesium supplements, as someone above mentioned, also work. It is best to get this through diet rather than pills, according to my nutritionist.

I believe with a healthy diet and proper hydration, you'll be able to stay off drugs. Don't give up! Best to you. I hope you feel better soon.

 

[LotusExige]

I would not rule out Xanax if I were to be in your position. I am prescribed .5 mg twice daily. I split them in half and take one-half before bed about 3 times per week. I use no other drugs other than occasional cannabis, which is legal for me, alcohol in extreme moderation (that's my issue), and about 1 cup of coffee in the morning. Kratom and opiates/opioids make me vomit violently.

I do commend you on your effort to stay clean. Please be sure to drink a lot of water and attend to your nutrition. It's easy to forget to eat when you're beating a polydrug addiction. Even if it's just something small, eat healthy food and drink clean water. Bananas are a quick and easy fix for potassium, which is very helpful with RLS. Calcium/magnesium supplements, as someone above mentioned, also work. It is best to get this through diet rather than pills, according to my nutritionist.

I believe with a healthy diet and proper hydration, you'll be able to stay off drugs. Don't give up! Best to you. I hope you feel better soon.

Once again thanks for the time and encouraging words. I haven't tried the Xanax yet but sleep pretty rough last night (I'm just a bad sleeper - RLS is gone now) so I may take 1-2mg of it tonight just so I can get constant sleep. Right now I've been 7 days with no opiates - which is the longest I've been in 5+ years. While I'm still really tired (from sleeping like crap) I can't believe how much better I feel. It's also amazing how much my sex drive has come back - last two mornings I've woken up with wood which is very rare for me. I've had zero sex drive for a very long time but all of a sudden I'm tempted to call my prior fuck-buddy as, well, I finally want to. That's a good thing in my book!