ndergrounder
Greenlighter
- Joined
- Jul 13, 2014
- Messages
- 9
this post is part educational report for those less familiar with the coca plant, and part questions for those that know a little more about the chemistry of it than i do.
i recently discovered that acquiring coca leaf powder (or powder in tea bags) from peru or bolivia online is as easy as a web search, despite it's schedule II status in the states (don't spread the word too much, i feel like it's only available because it's under the radar). I got my first package about a week ago, and have been experimenting with different methods of taking it. for those that are not familiar, coca leaf is a whole different animal than refined cocaine (cocaine HCI, which i'll refer to as HCI), and is an entirely different experience. it does contain cocaine, but it also contains some 15 different alkaloids (of which cocaine is the most prominent) that work in a synergy to create a much 'rounder', natural feeling mellow buzz. if want to, you can catch a serious buzz, but it's not the pure stimulus speedy buzz like from HCI, because some of the other alkaloids work more as depressants that counteract the cocaine. depending on how you consume it, it lasts much longer and has a smoother come up and come down than HCI, and overall more wholesome feeling. there is no crash like you would experience from HCI or caffeine, and even though i have used it fairly liberally over the past several days there seems to be absolutely no craving or withdrawals like you would experience with HCI. many posts i have read state things like 'coca has nothing to do with cocaine' and that the cocaine consumed from chewing leaves is so nominal that it's hard to get a high from it. that has not been my experience at all, and if it is your goal you can catch quite a euphoric high from it. it is a sacred plant that has been used for thousands of years by many South American cultures, and is to be treated with much respect. after getting to know this plant, i feel it's a disgrace that people have turned cocaine into such an ugly industry. the reasons to not buy street cocaine are numerous; you're supporting violent cartels in SA, violent (or at least greedy/shady) gangsters up here, and it's always made in clandestine jungle labs that use gasoline and whatever dirty shit they can get away with to make a buck, and then up here it's cut down to half with god knows what, and the people that take it always seem to be shady gross people to be around, not to mention it's way over priced and the come down is basically not worth the high.. honestly i prefer the experience of the whole plant much more. i feel like there is some potential for abuse, but nothing compared with HCI, more on par with cannabis; habitual but not addictive. i'll most likely use it daily untill i run out, and when i'm out i won't be in a hurry to get more, which is usually my relationship with cannabis. anyway, there's a few ways to consume this wholesome and sacred plant:
when you make a simple tea with a gram or two of the leaf powder, it acts as a light pick-me-up akin to a cup of coffee, but not quite the same. less jittery, smoother and more natural feeling. it enhances your mood, gives you a general sense of well being, and at higher doses it seems to heighten the visual and tactile senses. it's great for work and physical activity.
so drinking tea gives you a mild, clean energy boost, but if you want to catch a real buzz you need to 'chew' it. it comes in a very fine powder (harina de coca- coca flour), so it's kind of a strange thing to suck on. i mix a small amount of sodium bicarbonate (baking soda) with the powder and stuff a small amount in my cheek. the amount of bicarb i'm still playing with but something like a 1-10 ratio, you don't need much. one method is to put some in an empty tea bag and stuff that in your cheek and suck on that. it is cleaner (no bits of green all over your mouth), but is also slower acting and not as strong untill you break the bag open with your teeth, and then why even bother with the teabag. chewing is not the most social thing because you will have a wad in your cheek and you cant talk for a good 20+ minutes, because the idea is that you want to hold the saliva in your mouth for as long as possible, without swallowing much. swallowing the coca is fine, but too much bicarb can give you the runs. you want to swish your saliva around and hold it under your tongue. at a certian point, that wad in your cheek will dissolve and you'll end up with a numb mouth FULL of green saliva, and after 5-10 mins you'll notice the buzz coming on. i found that getting the blood flowing helps a lot (it's great while going on a hike, or if at the house do some push ups or something. you'll want to!). this seems to be the strongest way to take it, the most 'bang for your buck', a gram in the cheek is way stronger than a gram in tea.
another way that i tried is making coca wine, an old school method that was popular in the late 1800's. do a search for Vin Marianni if you are interested in the history of it. i cant find an accurate recipe, but from what i could gather it's simply red wine infused with coca. from another forum post's suggestion, i used 2 grams of coca per liquid ounce of red wine. which is quite a lot, 32 grams for 16 ozs of wine. i let it sit for 24 hours at room temp, strained it through a strainer than then through a cloth and squeezed every last drop from the leaf material. i've read that coca mixed with alcohol creates a different compound called cocaethylene, which is more potent than cocaine itself, and creates a more euphoric high (but also has greater liver toxicity, so it's not to be used daily). my wine was certainly active, but for the amount of coca i used i felt it should have been stronger. after consuming a third of my 16 ozs over a couple hours, and realizing that amounted to about 10 grams of coca, i felt that i was not feeling it near as much as if i had chewed or even brewed that amount. i actually ended up taking my spent coca matter (or most of it), and mixing it with just enough water to liquify it, and simmering it for about 10 minutes, then straining that and reducing it further before adding it back into the wine. upon tasting it before adding to the wine there was a strong numbing tingle, so was sure that there was a pretty good amount of alkaloids that i recovered, and now i'm curious as to how i can improve this formula. i'd like to try another batch, and this time i plan to heat the wine coca mixture, as it seems that heat helps to extract the alkaloids.
this is where my question phase comes in. i know that PH plays a big role in extraction of the alkaloids, and usually a base is used to convert the cocaine into a freebase form. but red wine is quite acidic, apparently averaging between 2.9 and 3.9. so i'm curious as to whether it would be a good idea to basify the wine with bicarb or cooking lime, and then after straining re-acidify it with citric acid to make it easier on the belly. there must be something to the red wine mixture, because it was wildly popular back in the day; everyone from the queen of England to the pope publicly endorsed the stuff, and apparently it was quite cocafied. who knows what chemestry they used, and it's possible it was a mixture of coca leaf and cocaine HCI. but i'd like to hear from some people that have a better understanding of the chemistry as to whether my basifying idea makes sense.
if you end up googlin Vin Marianni, you'll come accross Mr. Pemberton, the creator of coca-cola. when they banned alcohol in Atlanta in the 1890's he famously had to re-formulate his vin mirianni knock off, pemberton's french wine coca, without the booze. his wine version contained kola nut and damianna along with coca, and in his temperance version he took out the damiana, and added some essential oils and a shit ton of cane sugar, and made it into a syrup to be sold at pharmacy soda fountains. i dont think the cocanized version was ever sold in glass bottles, only available to be consumed at the soda fountain.. anyway, i thought it would be fun to try and re-create a faximily of cocanized coca cola, with lots of coca and kola nut. i would like to make a concentrated syrup that i could mix into soda water. any advice on using PH to help extract the alkaloids would be greatly appreciated. the method i have in my head would be to mix coca and kola powders with just enough water and enough bicarb to reach ph 9ish, and simmer it for a while, then strain the plant matter out, and then re boil the liquid with some citric acid to PH 5 or 6, lots of sugar, and maybe some other spices such as cinnamon, vanilla, cloves, nutmeg, etc., and reducing that to a good syrup consistency. there's a supposed coca-cola formula from the 70's floating around on the web to get an idea of what flavors he used, but my goal isn't an accurate clone, it's a tasty and potent coca elixir.
any advice or experiences with similar experiments would be appriciated!
nder.
i recently discovered that acquiring coca leaf powder (or powder in tea bags) from peru or bolivia online is as easy as a web search, despite it's schedule II status in the states (don't spread the word too much, i feel like it's only available because it's under the radar). I got my first package about a week ago, and have been experimenting with different methods of taking it. for those that are not familiar, coca leaf is a whole different animal than refined cocaine (cocaine HCI, which i'll refer to as HCI), and is an entirely different experience. it does contain cocaine, but it also contains some 15 different alkaloids (of which cocaine is the most prominent) that work in a synergy to create a much 'rounder', natural feeling mellow buzz. if want to, you can catch a serious buzz, but it's not the pure stimulus speedy buzz like from HCI, because some of the other alkaloids work more as depressants that counteract the cocaine. depending on how you consume it, it lasts much longer and has a smoother come up and come down than HCI, and overall more wholesome feeling. there is no crash like you would experience from HCI or caffeine, and even though i have used it fairly liberally over the past several days there seems to be absolutely no craving or withdrawals like you would experience with HCI. many posts i have read state things like 'coca has nothing to do with cocaine' and that the cocaine consumed from chewing leaves is so nominal that it's hard to get a high from it. that has not been my experience at all, and if it is your goal you can catch quite a euphoric high from it. it is a sacred plant that has been used for thousands of years by many South American cultures, and is to be treated with much respect. after getting to know this plant, i feel it's a disgrace that people have turned cocaine into such an ugly industry. the reasons to not buy street cocaine are numerous; you're supporting violent cartels in SA, violent (or at least greedy/shady) gangsters up here, and it's always made in clandestine jungle labs that use gasoline and whatever dirty shit they can get away with to make a buck, and then up here it's cut down to half with god knows what, and the people that take it always seem to be shady gross people to be around, not to mention it's way over priced and the come down is basically not worth the high.. honestly i prefer the experience of the whole plant much more. i feel like there is some potential for abuse, but nothing compared with HCI, more on par with cannabis; habitual but not addictive. i'll most likely use it daily untill i run out, and when i'm out i won't be in a hurry to get more, which is usually my relationship with cannabis. anyway, there's a few ways to consume this wholesome and sacred plant:
when you make a simple tea with a gram or two of the leaf powder, it acts as a light pick-me-up akin to a cup of coffee, but not quite the same. less jittery, smoother and more natural feeling. it enhances your mood, gives you a general sense of well being, and at higher doses it seems to heighten the visual and tactile senses. it's great for work and physical activity.
so drinking tea gives you a mild, clean energy boost, but if you want to catch a real buzz you need to 'chew' it. it comes in a very fine powder (harina de coca- coca flour), so it's kind of a strange thing to suck on. i mix a small amount of sodium bicarbonate (baking soda) with the powder and stuff a small amount in my cheek. the amount of bicarb i'm still playing with but something like a 1-10 ratio, you don't need much. one method is to put some in an empty tea bag and stuff that in your cheek and suck on that. it is cleaner (no bits of green all over your mouth), but is also slower acting and not as strong untill you break the bag open with your teeth, and then why even bother with the teabag. chewing is not the most social thing because you will have a wad in your cheek and you cant talk for a good 20+ minutes, because the idea is that you want to hold the saliva in your mouth for as long as possible, without swallowing much. swallowing the coca is fine, but too much bicarb can give you the runs. you want to swish your saliva around and hold it under your tongue. at a certian point, that wad in your cheek will dissolve and you'll end up with a numb mouth FULL of green saliva, and after 5-10 mins you'll notice the buzz coming on. i found that getting the blood flowing helps a lot (it's great while going on a hike, or if at the house do some push ups or something. you'll want to!). this seems to be the strongest way to take it, the most 'bang for your buck', a gram in the cheek is way stronger than a gram in tea.
another way that i tried is making coca wine, an old school method that was popular in the late 1800's. do a search for Vin Marianni if you are interested in the history of it. i cant find an accurate recipe, but from what i could gather it's simply red wine infused with coca. from another forum post's suggestion, i used 2 grams of coca per liquid ounce of red wine. which is quite a lot, 32 grams for 16 ozs of wine. i let it sit for 24 hours at room temp, strained it through a strainer than then through a cloth and squeezed every last drop from the leaf material. i've read that coca mixed with alcohol creates a different compound called cocaethylene, which is more potent than cocaine itself, and creates a more euphoric high (but also has greater liver toxicity, so it's not to be used daily). my wine was certainly active, but for the amount of coca i used i felt it should have been stronger. after consuming a third of my 16 ozs over a couple hours, and realizing that amounted to about 10 grams of coca, i felt that i was not feeling it near as much as if i had chewed or even brewed that amount. i actually ended up taking my spent coca matter (or most of it), and mixing it with just enough water to liquify it, and simmering it for about 10 minutes, then straining that and reducing it further before adding it back into the wine. upon tasting it before adding to the wine there was a strong numbing tingle, so was sure that there was a pretty good amount of alkaloids that i recovered, and now i'm curious as to how i can improve this formula. i'd like to try another batch, and this time i plan to heat the wine coca mixture, as it seems that heat helps to extract the alkaloids.
this is where my question phase comes in. i know that PH plays a big role in extraction of the alkaloids, and usually a base is used to convert the cocaine into a freebase form. but red wine is quite acidic, apparently averaging between 2.9 and 3.9. so i'm curious as to whether it would be a good idea to basify the wine with bicarb or cooking lime, and then after straining re-acidify it with citric acid to make it easier on the belly. there must be something to the red wine mixture, because it was wildly popular back in the day; everyone from the queen of England to the pope publicly endorsed the stuff, and apparently it was quite cocafied. who knows what chemestry they used, and it's possible it was a mixture of coca leaf and cocaine HCI. but i'd like to hear from some people that have a better understanding of the chemistry as to whether my basifying idea makes sense.
if you end up googlin Vin Marianni, you'll come accross Mr. Pemberton, the creator of coca-cola. when they banned alcohol in Atlanta in the 1890's he famously had to re-formulate his vin mirianni knock off, pemberton's french wine coca, without the booze. his wine version contained kola nut and damianna along with coca, and in his temperance version he took out the damiana, and added some essential oils and a shit ton of cane sugar, and made it into a syrup to be sold at pharmacy soda fountains. i dont think the cocanized version was ever sold in glass bottles, only available to be consumed at the soda fountain.. anyway, i thought it would be fun to try and re-create a faximily of cocanized coca cola, with lots of coca and kola nut. i would like to make a concentrated syrup that i could mix into soda water. any advice on using PH to help extract the alkaloids would be greatly appreciated. the method i have in my head would be to mix coca and kola powders with just enough water and enough bicarb to reach ph 9ish, and simmer it for a while, then strain the plant matter out, and then re boil the liquid with some citric acid to PH 5 or 6, lots of sugar, and maybe some other spices such as cinnamon, vanilla, cloves, nutmeg, etc., and reducing that to a good syrup consistency. there's a supposed coca-cola formula from the 70's floating around on the web to get an idea of what flavors he used, but my goal isn't an accurate clone, it's a tasty and potent coca elixir.
any advice or experiences with similar experiments would be appriciated!
nder.
Last edited:
