how and when to tell a girl u have hep c

[Wobblier]

I do, but I would think that one would need to disclose such a serious thing when such an insanely life-changing possibility exists, condom or no condom.

I'm sure. I know the HIV Laws and you don't need to disclose (except in some countries) (if you wear a condom) and rightly so it’s no one else business. Wearing a condom and being on anti-retro-viral drugs means you will NOT spread the infection.

Having a draconian law like they have in Canada (and comments like in this thread), criminalizing HIV, HCV, only pushes it underground where it explodes. If you don't have a HIV test and don't know the result then you can not be prosecuted. So laws like this mean people don't get tested (which is obviously bad). Regular testing is the key to ending this virus. Forced disclose does more harm than good.

Read up on the facts here:

http://www.bluelight.ru/vb/threads/6...HIV-Megathread

http://www.tht.org.uk/myhiv/Telling-people/Law/Thinking-on-prosecutions

http://www.icaso.org/resources/10reasons_20081201.pdf

I would wear a condom and apply all the safety measures. Tell her when you feel right to do so. Its your call.

If you have safe sex and especially if you are on medication you are not being irresponsible and you do not have to disclose (check the laws in your country). OP don't listen to all these negative posts. I'm not 100% on Hep C laws but I know the HIV laws. Do what you feel is right.

 

[NerdOnDrugs]

I've always told my partner I'm clean

How many times do u have to tell him? I thought programming wuz ur day job??

I'm sure. I know the HIV Laws and you don't need to disclose (except in some countries) (if you wear a condom) and rightly so it’s no one else business. Wearing a condom and being on anti-retro-viral drugs means you will NOT spread the infection.

Having a draconian law like they have in Canada (and comments like in this thread), criminalizing HIV, HCV, only pushes it underground where it explodes. If you don't have a HIV test and don't know the result then you can not be prosecuted. So laws like this mean people don't get tested (which is obviously bad). Regular testing is the key to ending this virus. Forced disclose does more harm than good.

Read up on the facts here:

http://www.bluelight.ru/vb/threads/6...HIV-Megathread

http://www.tht.org.uk/myhiv/Telling-people/Law/Thinking-on-prosecutions

http://www.icaso.org/resources/10reasons_20081201.pdf

I would wear a condom and apply all the safety measures. Tell her when you feel right to do so. Its your call.

If you have safe sex and especially if you are on medication you are not being irresponsible and you do not have to disclose (check the laws in your country). OP don't listen to all these negative posts. I'm not 100% on Hep C laws but I know the HIV laws. Do what you feel is right.

There's a difference between what's legal and what's the "right" thing to do. Wouldn't you want to be told asap, before u start catching feelings or a condom busts or one drunk night u just say fuck it?

 

[Wobblier]

How many times do u have to tell him? I thought programming wuz ur day job??

There's a difference between what's legal and what's the "right" thing to do. Wouldn't you want to be told asap, before u start catching feelings or a condom busts or one drunk night u just say fuck it?

If we are safe then I wont not mind if I was not told. I would be happier if the person was honest and open about everything, but this is the real world and I know it must be a difficult situation, so I would understand if the person felt like they were scared to loose me and didn't tell me for some time... as long as we are safe

If the condom burst and the person was HIV+ then they need to disclose and get some PEP drugs to stop the spread of infection in its track, though if that person is on anti-retro-virals and the VL in none detectable then the risk is practically none existent anyway.

What's 'right' is subjective.

'To be told before I start getting feelings' - exactly so you could stop the feelings and run a mile? Doesn't he deserve a little happiness? Be it a one night stand or to have sex and build a stronger relationship before disclosing? As long as he is safe there is NOTHING he should feel bad about. Shame on the people who have posted derogative comments, though this was done in ignorance, an emotional knee jerk reaction, with little or no facts.

Or should he disclose as soon as he shakes their hands hello I'm Mr OP and I have HCV. Or maybe get it tattooed on his head? - Like ever he is going to find a decent relationship like that. Choosing the right time is the tricky part, but having all the correct information at hand can help. Good luck OP

With HIV the transmittion rate is not all that high compared to other viruses and Hep C it is even lower. Also If you are on medication the risk is next to nothing in catching it. Also if you wear a condom the risk is EVEN less. Also if you use lubrication it reduces the risk even less. We are now getting to levels of risk that are so low there are practically non-existent even the law doesn't recognize it.

It is up to the OP if he wants to disclose and if he is safe then he is not being irresponsible and he is doing the right thing.

Medical studies and trails have shown that anti-retro-viral drugs can work better than condoms in reducing transmission.

My HIV viral load is 'none detectable' now due to anti-retro-viral drugs. This means I can have sex with my partner and she can become pregnant and have a child and she and the child will NOT be HIV positive. We don't want a child yet and I wear a condom just to be super careful (I have O.C.D), though there is no* risk.

So if the OP is on meds and uses a condoms then he is being safe and not irresponsible, why should he disclose?

As long as he is keeping safe, I feel and so does the Law, that he is doing nothing morally or illegally wrong.

All due respects please educate yourself a little

OP you chose the wrong place to ask this question, normally the drug community is generally open minded, but you will find with HIV and HVC etc it is still the last predigest / ignorance topic.

*disclaimer there is never 'no' (or zero)risk in anything, including crossing the road.
http://www.bluelight.ru/vb/threads/690158-The-HIV-Megathread

 

[NerdOnDrugs]

If we are safe then I wont not mind if I was not told.

I guess it's all about the standards we set for ourselves..


a.k.a. i bust outta every magnum, double strapped...


edit: I mean, there is some pre-screening (not literal testing) you can sometimes do to end up with a DD free person (btw the way, i hate how with DD, drugs are lumped in with fuckin diseases.. even if a good share are mostly talking about hard drugs.. raging alcoholics get to slide in while still being somewhat honest)

edit 2: also, if ur someone who would consider being with someone with an STD (using protection) one-night/short/long term... if u get someone to say it off that bat. Just think of how awesome they have to be in every other aspect to make up for it right then as they humble themselves and then u know a really relevant aspect if ur considering sex; a must-know if ur considering more than a one-night stand.

 

[Wobblier]

I guess it's all about the standards we set for ourselves..

Exactly and my standards are high. Safety first.

Cool 'fuck buttons' profile pic

Didn't understand the rest of your post

 

[NerdOnDrugs]

Exactly and my standards are high. Safety first.

Oh, I wuz kinda saying my standards are higher but in a nice-ish way...

Safety comes first and second for me... 1. std free? (sure they can just lie, but intuition and all that..) 2. condom, unless we're dating

 

[mrflowers00]

don't lead with it but before you bang you gotta tell em they might get scared a not wanna bang but the other option is being a malicious dick and risking giving her it w/o her knowing what she's getting her self into

 

[verso]

I'm sure. I know the HIV Laws and you don't need to disclose (except in some countries) (if you wear a condom) and rightly so it’s no one else business. Wearing a condom and being on anti-retro-viral drugs means you will NOT spread the infection.

ah, OK. Well, you certainly do seem to know your shit, and I hope that I didn't come off as being snotty because it wasn't my intention, but it just didn't make sense to me and still doesn't.

My understanding is that the risk of transmission is low, and made even more unlikely when a condom is used, but still not 100% and so I would imagine that if the possibility exists at all, even if only a small, minute chance, then one would need to disclose their having hepatitis c regardless of whether or not a condom is used. (shrugs)

EDIT: I mean, even if the risk were reduced to 1 in 100,000 by using a condom ... well, if you or your partner happens to be that 1 in 100,000, I would hate to be in that position. Wouldn't you? Imagine if you contracted hepatitis c from your partner, and all he had to say about it after-the-fact was, "well, I'm sorry, but we used a condom and the condom should have prevented this; it greatly reduces the risk, y'know..." It wouldn't make a bit of difference at that point, and I'd imagine that you would be pissed, and rightfully so... because it could have been prevented entirely, like, 100% if only this person had told you that they have hepatitis c and you chose not to engage in sexual activity with them.

ANOTHER EDIT: And hell, I'm a gambling man, so if someone told me that they had hep c but we could greatly reduce the risk of transmission by using a condom, I might still go for it, but then it's on me if the condom fails to prevent transmission and I come down with hep c. Do you understand what I'm saying? I don't know... for me, "greatly reducing the risk" is just not the same as reducing the risk entirely which could only come through full exposure and then making the decision not to engage in sex.

 

[pofacedhoe]

Yeah bro a lot of ignorant responses but whaddya expect on a public forum. Hep c Is a chronic condition people. It doesn't affect u for generally 20 years. Herpes is going to quickly give u sores within a year. Hep c less than 5% chance contracting sexually. Not advocating silence, but the passion for hr in some of u zealots is mildly irritating. And yes, I'm just mad cuz I have hepc. You guys probably do too I youre an IDU.

herpes doesn't require a liver transplant so its a bit different.

there are no easy answers in this. if you tell soon it could put them off. if you tell after a while i could seem like some lie by omission. rock/hard place...

 

[Lysis]

How many times do u have to tell him? I thought programming wuz ur day job??

lol I'm a little loopy but I assume you're kidding.

But seriously, I think that topic is important before you have sex. Obviously it's not always so easy but for me I've always had several conversations before having sex with someone, so it's easy to bring up. It's probably easy for me, because I'm clean but it's an easy way for the other person to bring up if something is wrong!

Even though I've only had sex with one person in the last 9 months, I'd still get tested if I thought I was having sex with someone I met.

 

[NerdOnDrugs]

lol I'm a little loopy but I assume you're kidding.

But seriously, I think that topic is important before you have sex. Obviously it's not always so easy but for me I've always had several conversations before having sex with someone, so it's easy to bring up. It's probably easy for me, because I'm clean but it's an easy way for the other person to bring up if something is wrong!

Even though I've only had sex with one person in the last 9 months, I'd still get tested if I thought I was having sex with someone I met.

I had to get tested once before a girl would let me have sex w/ her... man the 80s really fucked things up forever..

I feel most of the "I don't mind if I'm not told" and the "tell them about the STD when your ready" is biased and comes from the STD-having/sympathetic crowd... just look at the %'s of active people who have at least one.

 

[llama112]

ALWA&S after the first date !!!!

 

[Wobblier]

ah, OK. Well, you certainly do seem to know your shit, and I hope that I didn't come off as being snotty because it wasn't my intention, but it just didn't make sense to me and still doesn't.

My understanding is that the risk of transmission is low, and made even more unlikely when a condom is used, but still not 100% and so I would imagine that if the possibility exists at all, even if only a small, minute chance, then one would need to disclose their having hepatitis c regardless of whether or not a condom is used. (shrugs)

EDIT: I mean, even if the risk were reduced to 1 in 100,000 by using a condom ... well, if you or your partner happens to be that 1 in 100,000, I would hate to be in that position. Wouldn't you? Imagine if you contracted hepatitis c from your partner, and all he had to say about it after-the-fact was, "well, I'm sorry, but we used a condom and the condom should have prevented this; it greatly reduces the risk, y'know..." It wouldn't make a bit of difference at that point, and I'd imagine that you would be pissed, and rightfully so... because it could have been prevented entirely, like, 100% if only this person had told you that they have hepatitis c and you chose not to engage in sexual activity with them.

ANOTHER EDIT: And hell, I'm a gambling man, so if someone told me that they had hep c but we could greatly reduce the risk of transmission by using a condom, I might still go for it, but then it's on me if the condom fails to prevent transmission and I come down with hep c. Do you understand what I'm saying? I don't know... for me, "greatly reducing the risk" is just not the same as reducing the risk entirely which could only come through full exposure and then making the decision not to engage in sex.

The risk is so small it might as well not be there. How about traveling in planes, there's a risk there. How about stepping outside, there's a risk you might be struck by lightning. We are probably looking at similar odds. I'll did out the stats when I get a moment.

Its simple wear a condom and be on meds. The laws see it as the case, doctors see it this way too. How come a HIV+ man myself be told by more than one doctor your VL is low you could have sex with your partner without a condom and have a child and not pass on the virus, period.

I think a lot of people forget this is the real world

I think a lot of this shock and knee jerk reactions come from people with only a little amoung of knowledge on the subject.

The 80s really did screw us up, look at the adverts they put out when they had no HIV meds, they really stuck in the collective consciousness...though we have moved on

(safety first all the rest is over kill)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WT-RH_2gfog

 

[pofacedhoe]

The risk is so small it might as well not be there. How about traveling in planes, there's a risk there. How about stepping outside, there's a risk you might be struck by lightning. We are probably looking at similar odds. I'll did out the stats when I get a moment.

Its simple wear a condom and be on meds. The laws see it as the case, doctors see it this way too. How come a HIV+ man myself be told by more than one doctor your VL is low you could have sex with your partner without a condom and have a child and not pass on the virus, period.

I think a lot of people forget this is the real world

I think a lot of this shock and knee jerk reactions come from people with only a little amoung of knowledge on the subject.

The 80s really did screw us up, look at the adverts they put out when they had no HIV meds, they really stuck in the collective consciousness...though we have moved on

(safety first all the rest is over kill)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WT-RH_2gfog

yeah either way weather you have a high viral load or not its responsible to tell someone BEFORE you have sex with them that you have HIV. its simple. condoms break/fall off sometimes and if i was having sex with someone and the condom slipped inside and they went "oh shit i have HIV" i would not be happy. tell me before and i can make up my own mind

 

[Wobblier]

^ The world doesn't always work that way there are lots of other factors when considering relationships between people. She probably wont sleep with him and 'just want to be friends' if he discloses. What if he just wants a one night stand, just to name a few, the mind boggles at the variety of situations and relationships between people. The world is not always that black and white. There isn't apple pie cooling on every windowsill.

condoms break/fall off sometimes and if i was having sex with someone and the condom slipped inside and they went

Also (in my case) if the condom broke it would make no difference, it's simple, my VL is none detectable due to medication. Please do some research.


So if the OP is on meds and uses a condom the risk is so low it isn't even reconsigned by law and even the medical world will state it as negligible, which is a strong thing as doctors are never 100% about anything. So the conversation whether he should disclose because she might get it is a non-conversation.

What else should he disclose straight away? Some people are disgusted at drug users, should he disclose his history of drug use too. What serious grim conversations he is going to have at the very start of a relationship, when relationships aren't strong. No one is going to hang around. Should he die alone?

Whether he should disclose just to be open about everything and lay the cards on the table from the very start is up to him. Personally if someone stopped me before the first time and said "wait wait wait I have to tell you something!...I have this is have that, but I am on medication and I have condoms." I would think my God you have totally killed the mood and why are you being so serious?! Next you will be talking about marriage, I thought we were just going to have safe sex...and I'd run a mile (but then I know the facts). Its reminds me of the girls who want you to meet with their parents on the second date. Total over kill. Then that's just me, again I know the facts.

I don't know the OP and I don't know the girl and I don't know the relationship so there is no way I could answer the OP's question about disclosure. It is completely up to him as long as he is being safe then there is no risk, or it's negligible. - talk to doctors about this (like I have) they will say the same.

OP, I am a little disappointed with how you have phrased your question with no background information. What do you expect on a public forum anything other than knee jerk responses? This actually feels like a troll question. Come on OP this is not 'fighting the good fight' sort it out my friend.

Here is the transmission rate of HIV, being that the person is not on meds and is no condom is used, also bare in mind that HCV is much much lower. As you can see it is still very low (none safe sex is not advised of course) and this is with out and safety measures and medication.



http://www.bluelight.ru/vb/threads/690158-The-HIV-Megathread

 

[verso]

^ The world doesn't always work that way there are lots of other factors when considering relationships between people. She probably wont sleep with him and 'just want to be friends' if he discloses. What if he just wants a one night stand, just to name a few, the mind boggles at the variety of situations and relationships between people. The world is not always that black and white. There isn't apple pie cooling on every windowsill.

It's funny you should say that, because there's apple pie cooling here... two of them, in fact... and I cannot wait to have some!

yeah either way weather you have a high viral load or not its responsible to tell someone BEFORE you have sex with them that you have HIV. its simple. condoms break/fall off sometimes and if i was having sex with someone and the condom slipped inside and they went "oh shit i have HIV" i would not be happy. tell me before and i can make up my own mind

Right? That's the way that I feel about it... yeah it's unlikely for unlikely things to happen, but unlikely does not mean impossible. All the things that Wobblier mentioned do happen, and they are things that I consider before getting on a plane, stepping outside when it's storming, etc. because, well, planes do go down and people do get struck by lightening.

I'll let someone with Hep C explain themselves to me, explain what a minute chance it is to transmit Hep C, and then I'll go ahead and make an educated decision much in the same way that I would before getting onto a plane.

Not disclosing is like if every time a plane went down, they hide the wreck and tell you that "well it's so unlikely to happen it might as well not have happened at all and there's just no reason for you to even know about it." Yeah, but uh.. it did happen, sooo...

EDIT: And Wobblier, all that I am asking is for you to do what you just did... explain yourself. After hearing what you have to say and learning about how low the risk for transmission is, hell, I'd sleep with you. (I'm not gay, but you get the point...) So what's so hard about that? I'm sure that there are a lot more perfectly reasonable people out there who would hear you out and then romp around with you. But by not telling a person even if there is only a 1 in 1,000,000 chance or whatever, well, I think that's kind of shitty.

 

[NerdOnDrugs]

It is completely up to him as long as he is being safe then there is no risk, or it's negligible.

You had everyone at negligible, I think. I think it's like 2 out of 100 times with perfect condom use, it will fail. Then you factor in how many people aren't using them right, or bought the Magnums and they come off, then factor in how many times we realize condoms suck, and the guy just rams her full of stds before she knew he had any.

Lots of ppl with STDs will naturally want to tell the person at the last possible second, for fear of rejection; so we all know why there are weak rationalizations for having the longest possible amount of time before telling, if at all. Not fair to clean guys and girls of this world though.

 

[BlueHues]

Hep C is not an STD in the traditional sense. It doesn't cause oozing sores, discharge of pus or painful urination. The chances of transmission through sexual contact are very remote. There's many people who contracted it in the '70s through IV drug use, went on to have families and didn't find out for 25-30 years or still don't know. Their spouses don't have it and their children weren't born with it despite them having unprotected sex thousands of times.

The bottom line is: Under normal circumstances, it's virtually impossible to contract Hep C through normal sexual contact. This would basically include pretty much all forms of oral and vaginal sex. Unless both parties have open cuts you will not contract this disease. Of course, if you have anal sex it changes everything risk-wise because there often is blood involved.

I agree that even if there's a remote chance of you giving someone a disease you should tell them before you have any sexual contact with them, but the thing that really bothers me about this thread is that you have people who seem to have no idea of the actual risks of hep c or even what the disease does, holding people who may have it to a higher standard than people that have other, more easily contractable diseases. You're being prejudicial out of fear and ignorance.

If I'm reading this right, there's some people on this thread that think it's perfectly fine for someone with ANY other disease or illness to engage in kissing and fooling around a little bit, but when it comes to Hep C you should disclose this before the first kiss?! Because Hep C is easier to get from kissing and touching than Herpes, HIV and everything else under out there?!

Just an astounding amount of ignorance, misinformation and guess-work going on in this thread!

If you hold people with Hep C to the standard that they can't do anything with anyone without disclosure, you should hold anyone with any disease to the same standard, which might be slightly more inconvenient because 70-80% of the world population has one form or another of "Herpes", a virus that actually CAN be transmitted through saliva!

I've been an IV drug user on and off for over 15 years, and it does seem that at least half of everyone who shoots up has it. And when there are needles involved, it becomes a very easy virus to contract even without sharing needles.

It can be a very mild disease that pretty much does nothing for long periods of time. On the other hand, it can aggressively attack your liver and kill you. In 90% of cases it takes decades, not years...decades to manifest as anything with symptoms, but you don't wanna be in the unlucky 10% who get really sick from it.

It's hard to say when to tell someone if you have it. I'd say before actual penetration. Wrrying about blood on blood during oral is laughable to me. Of course if we were talking about a REAL STD that was transmitted through skin contact and fluids it would be different.

 

[Wobblier]

If I'm reading this right, there's some people on this thread that think it's perfectly fine for someone with ANY other disease or illness to engage in kissing and fooling around a little bit, but when it comes to Hep C you should disclose this before the first kiss?! Because Hep C is easier to get from kissing and touching than Herpes, HIV and everything else under out there?!

Just an astounding amount of ignorance, misinformation and guess-work going on in this thread!

If you hold people with Hep C to the standard that they can't do anything with anyone without disclosure, you should hold anyone with any disease to the same standard, which might be slightly more inconvenient because 70-80% of the world population has one form or another of "Herpes", a virus that actually CAN be transmitted through saliva!

^ Someones talking more sense.

You had everyone at negligible, I think. I think it's like 2 out of 100 times with perfect condom use, it will fail. Then you factor in how many people aren't using them right, or bought the Magnums and they come off, then factor in how many times we realize condoms suck, and the guy just rams her full of stds before she knew he had any.

'I think..' Show me some facts from some reliable sources please. Due to my medication, in my situation I don't need to use a condom if I don't want to and I will not pass HIV on to my girlfriend. I can have children. So the condom argument can be void in some situations. The world isn't always black and white. Do some research.

..'rams her full of STDS..' ~ oh dear. You must live in a scary world.

I sometimes feel the way HIV and HCV etc, are viewed today with all the misinformation and hysteria, it is similar (analogy) to the 1920s anti cannabis propaganda. "Know your dope fiend!" One day the common denominator will catch up with the facts and modern science, we just have to give them time and not judge their ignorance. Lets just hope that not too many people get hurt in the process.

Remember, throwing fear and criminalization around just stops people getting tested which just increases HIV and HCV infection rate

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RYDkFJkNVeQ&list=PLA7C910023BB8A62C

http://www.the-peoples-forum.com/images/tinfoil_hat_shazam.png

The bottom line is: Under normal circumstances, it's virtually impossible to contract Hep C through normal sexual contact. This would basically include pretty much all forms of oral and vaginal sex. Unless both parties have open cuts you will not contract this disease.

^ more sense. This guy has seems to have more of a mature knowledgeable world view.

Wrrying about blood on blood during oral is laughable to me. Of course if we were talking about a REAL STD that was transmitted through skin contact and fluids it would be different.

^ He knows his stuff

Disclosures is up to him the OP if he is being safe. I am not saying 'yes' or 'no'. Who am I to tell someone what to do or not do (I'm not that immature and arrogant) when it's all subjective anyway. I can only quote the Law and what doctors have told me and some facts.

I can all completely understand all your view points "I think this...I think that.." and I am not fundamentally agreeing or disagreeing with what you think is right or wrong. Your view point is yours. I'm just stating some facts. I am just letting you know about a different situation, my own and the facts involved. This is only my situation / view point. Think what you like, though it would be wise to learn the Law, talk to doctors and professionals, do the research

Suppose it's how you view the world:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=llLY9VUKpRM

Verso well done with the apple pies (two! ), lucky you, not every ones the same.

 

[verso]

Huh... well, I'd like to think that I live in a reasonable world; I might still sleep with someone who has Hep C if they explained themselves to me in the same way that Wobblier has, as now it makes sense to me and I'm much less afraid of transmission. But you'd better still tell me, because even if it's a 1 in quadrillion chance, well, some lucky winner hits the lotto every now and then, right? And don't get me wrong, I'd like to be the guy winning the actual lotto... not so much Hep C.

And that's all I've got left to say about that. And now for the apple pie... risk of transmission? 100% ... ahhhhhyeah!