Using benzos for Sub w/ds?

[Ghost-Man]

1st off is there anyone out there been through sub withdrawal that can offer any advice on any other supplements, herbs/extacts or meds (etc.) I should procure for my detox kit? Ok so I am about to jump off the sub train as I have been on it for at least 3-4 years (never more then 2mgs a day at most through those 4yrs). Anyways I've gotten my sub dose down to as low as I can, around 0.5mgs for awhile now. And now sense I got a good amount of alpraz0lam, klonopin 2mgs, and some 30mg Restoril.. Along with some Super Magnesium supplement and also some Potassium Gluconate as I hear the Magnesium and Potassium supplements can help RLS during the sub detox... Will this be easy with just using a bunch of benzos while I suffer for a week or two through these sub w/d's... I just hate sub w/ds cuz they aren't harsh like full opiate w/ds but they last forever and even know they are a bit milder the fact that they last so long drives me insane usually and i end up back on sub... so I am hoping this time sense i got a detox kit that my g/f has and will be administering them to me as needed, like for sleep and the kpins for the day time... I also got like 90 Tramadols (50mgs), those will probably help for the first couple weeks after the withdrawals set in..

Any other supplements I should get or anything else to help me finally beat this damn sub?? Please let me know if you have gone through sub w/d b4 and if you think the detox kit i have been stashing away for past couple months will work good? Any advice will be appreciated for those of you who have went through Suboxone w/d's and go through them and what I can expect.

(And don't worry I've never had a problem with benzo's so I don't have to worry about getting addicted to those, plus I won't be taking em except for when in the worst of suboxone withdrawals.)

 

[Gordon]

Sub detox is way too long for any supplements and benzos to work unless you take them for the whole duration of sub withdrawals. I was planning to go the short acting opiate route for half a year to rid the sub withdrawals.

0.5 is still a big dose to jump from, many take 3-5 months to go from 0.5 to 0 unless your a short term user.

In my experience benzos or any other meds do not really help but if anything potentiate sub withdrawals even more.

Sub withdrawals can last anywhere between 1 year to 3 or 4 years, this includes PAWS, this is why benzos or other meds just aren't worth it.

 

[Ghost-Man]

Sub detox is way too long for any supplements and benzos to work unless you take them for the whole duration of sub withdrawals. I was planning to go the short acting opiate route for half a year to rid the sub withdrawals.

0.5 is still a big dose to jump from, many take 3-5 months to go from 0.5 to 0 unless your a short term user.

In my experience benzos or any other meds do not really help but if anything potentiate sub withdrawals even more.

Sub withdrawals can last anywhere between 1 year to 3 or 4 years, this includes PAWS, this is why benzos or other meds just aren't worth it.

What are you talking about? Benzos don't make the withdrawals worse. I know its gonna be a good 6months-1year b4 I am totally back to normal and my brain has repaired itself.. But I am just talking about the first week or 2 after jumping ship.. Also I have been on 0.25mg-0.5mgs and I even skip days sometimes getting ready to jump ship.. I don't understand why you would say benzos during opiate/sub withdrawals would make you feel worse b/c i know for a fact thats not true. Everyone that detoxs from opies/subs use sub for the first week or 2 during the physical w/ds... I'll deal with the mental w/ds after i get through the physical when that time comes. And I am pretty sure its a good idea to take supplements during w/ds sense I probably won't be eating too much...

Anyways anyone out there that has got off suboxone and what you did to get off and any advice? I am just scared, cuz i know sub w/ds last forever, especially sense i've been on em for about 3 yrs... arghh i hope i can make it through this but I gotta do it, for myself.

 

[opium]

stay strong man, to be real..sub withdrawl is worse than opiate withdrawl.

And idk what the dude is saying that benzos make it worse.... they can be used the same way as you would use them for a normal opiate W/D, just for the physical portion of it..the mental part will be up to willpower.
you have a great kit together, and you obviously looked into things that help with the W/d

all i have to say, is try and stick it out. It will feel like forever, but this is the last leap you have to make in order to be totally substance free.
Just be careful with how long and often you take the benzos, not that you'll get addicted, but if the benzo use is prolonged, they have their own set of physical withdraws that can be life threatening.

good luck brother, keep us updated

 

[AdmiralPharmaGhost]

I am still sub maintenance so my experience is not exactly the same but I have gone through sub withdrawals a few years ago, (story behind this is too long) I was forced to cut my dose to 1/8 of normal for 7 days and then I had to go without for another 7 days. I had Tempazepam and Clonazepam. The benzos helped a lot with the muscular aches, headaches, anxiety and insomnia. The pain was there, but it helped to the point that that I was able to go about my day, no one could tell I was w/d. As opium mentioned, be careful how often you take the benzos, you may not become addicted but you can become physically dependent if you're not cautious and w/d from sedative/hypnotics are worse than opioid w/d. I would add vitamin D supplement to your daily regiment, it won't make any immediate difference but in the long term it will keep your body and immune system strong. I know that this may not be the exact experience you're looking for but it was enough to know that what you have to help you through w/d is as good as it can get.

I wish you the best of luck!

 

[Ghost-Man]

Alright so I know I have said this about 20 times now in the past year but now I am truly ready to take that step out of the sub-plane and hope to god my "parachute" of detox meds work to bring me safely back down to earth substance free..... I usually don't say stuff like this but I am so fucking scared to take that step out of the sub-plane and free fall back down to earth as a normal substance free person. Of course my parachute metaphor will consist of some alprazolam (for night), Temazepam (for night), Clonazepam (for daytime), and I just got a bottle of 90 Tramadol (50mgs) which i think will help a lot the first several weeks of sub withdrawal... And no worries about benzo addiction or anything I have never even been close to a benzo addiction and don't even find benzo's euphoric, they are just serving the purpose of making me relax while in the first 2-3 weeks of sub w/d's.. I am literally more scared of jumping off my sub-plane then anything in my entire life, even with my parachute (detox kit)...

Is there ANYONE out there that has been on Suboxone/Subutex and got off it any stayed off it? If so can you please tell me something, anything, some advice? or what I should do while going through detox? How long the physical last? what to do for the "PAWS"? any advice would be greatly appreciated by someone that has been on subs and got off and stayed off.... Thanks guys, I am so fucking scared to jump out of this sub-plane, i feel like my parachute is going to bust and ill have to repair it with a dose of suboxone .... lol sorry for all the metaphors but that's just how I talk about this stuff.

Anyone out there been through sub withdrawal that can offer any advice on any other supplements, herbs/extacts or meds (etc.) I should procure for my detox kit? I am basically just using this 'detox kit' to ease the physical w/d's in the first 2 weeks (which from what I hear is about how long the physical w/d's last on average)... Do you guys think I should use the Tramadol in the first 2 weeks of w/d's or should I save them for after the physical w/d's are over and use them for the PAWS that you get after stopping subs?

B/c the last time I got off subs I used Tramadol for about 1 month during the w/d's are they really helped ease the transition back to normal and also relieved some of the depression/lethargy/apathy I get when detoxing from subs.

PS - Do you think i'll need to use imodium (Loperamide) while going through the w/ds? B/c I got a big bottle of those too in my detox kit just in case..

 

[Tommyboy]

I got off of suboxone and stayed off of it. I was on an average of 16mg/day and basically went cold turkey off of it (went from 16mg to nothing in about 2 weeks so I can hardly call that a taper) and I was a lot better by the 2 week mark, but the first week was pretty horrible due to insomnia. You should be fine since you are on a lot lower of a dose.

I wouldn't use the tramadol since you are already on a low enough dose of suboxone where the tramadol will just prolong the withdrawals since 100mg of tramadol is equal to about 0.25mg of suboxone, so if you do take it make sure to stay below 100mg, and use it very sparingly.

As for the loperamide, I would use one or the other (loperamide or tramadol) so it's up to you. That may also prolong withdrawals so use that very sparingly as well.

When I am ready to quit I just want to get it over with as soon as possible, which is why I go cold turkey (although I would never jump off of suboxone like I did the first time, with the 2 week taper from 16mg to nothing) whenever I choose to stop.

I actually recommend getting rid of the tramadol. Out of site out of mind is how I got over the suboxone withdrawals. If you know you have an opioid on hand your mind will play tricks with you making you feel like you are withdrawing badly so that you can take the tramadol. If you know that there is nothing you can take (in terms of opioids) then your mind will accept the fact that it has to get through this on its own, and it will do so faster than if you know you have an opioid laying around.

 

[bronson]

Moving this BDD --> OD

 

[Mr.Scagnattie]

Id stay away from any kind of opiate as all it's going to do is prolong the withdrawals. But, the sparing use of benzos can be really beneficial especially in getting the acute phase. Really for me during any kind of withdrawal, the insomnia is what just drives me up the wall. If I can sleep, at least a few hours a night, I can much better handle the withdrawal symptoms during the day. So I'd advise finding something to help with that symptom especially, and certain benzos do help a lot of people with that.

 

[brutus]

We had about the same withdrawal kit back when I stopped taking bupe over a year ago. I think you should be fine in a good two weeks, just stay active and keep your mind busy. Best of luck man. PM me if you or anyone else needs any help.

 

[DickTate]

I agree with not using the Tramadol. It will not only prolong the WD but cause nasty Serotonine depletion which is very contraproductive in your situation.

I jumped of 0,4mg Bupe after a short time being on only 1mg/day and would suggest to get some Gabapentin or Pregabalin (Lyrica). These medications help much better with opioid WD than Benzodiazepines in my experience and have not that big addiction potential although it differs between individuals.

Physical exercise and being occupied are two important factors. Good luck!

 

[Ghost-Man]

Thanks for all the replies guys, I am just so fucking scared jumping out of my sub-plane and worried about when I hit the ground (withdrawals)...

I have one question for you guys. What benzo do you think would be better for the day-time part of my suboxone withdrawals: Valium 10mg (diazepam) or 2mg Klonopin (Clonazepam)? I already got the Xanax (alprazolam) for night time.

 

[Mr.Scagnattie]

Thanks for all the replies guys, I am just so fucking scared jumping out of my sub-plane and worried about when I hit the ground (withdrawals)...

I have one question for you guys. What benzo do you think would be better for the day-time part of my suboxone withdrawals: Valium 10mg (diazepam) or 2mg Klonopin (Clonazepam)? I already got the Xanax (alprazolam) for night time.

I've had good luck with both.

 

[Gordon]

I was meaning to say that sub withdrawals are too long drawn out to use benzos for the short term, you have to use them for several months to make any difference to sub withdrawals. No point using them for 1 week or 2 weeks as sub WDs still tend to be there, so by the time you get off benzos after short term you will still feel the affects of benzos, of course this is all my input in this.

Apparently low doses of bup are much harder to get off then high doses, I have read all around forums about this, it seems low doses affect our bodies and mental state more then high does of bup.. I understand now why peeps claim LESS IS MORE with bup, you get a high or feel better with low doses, thats why it seems more harder to get off at those doses..Bear in mind I have spoken to bup users personally and 2 of them were on 0.25 (after tapering down) and stayed there for like a month or 2 yet had horrible withdrawals and PAWS, so what am saying is there is no guarantee tapering or jumping from a tiny dose will be any better then jumping from a higher dose. It has a long half life and the half life is the same for any dose, so thats why when many taper down they still struggle..The half life seems equally long for even the lower doses as they would with higher doses.

I plan is to take short acting opiates for a time and then maybe Naltrexone, or just take the Naltrexone a week after I jump from bup, apparently it knocks the bup off the receptors and you feel mentally clearer, which can take several months when people quit bup without any thing to knock it off the receptors, you might get some precipitated withdrawals but you can use benzos for that, after when its over you apparently feel clearer and better, so am looking at that route for real.

 

[TimKT9]

Ambien may also be beneficial for insomnia during withdrawal and is also less addicting than benzos as far as i know

 

[ASteele86]

Suboxone is not supposed to be mixed with benzo's, so be careful not to take them either together or too close together. I found that marijuana helps with the w/d bc it helps with the insomnia, not eating, pain and just overall not feeling good.

 

[ChemicalSmiles]

I jumped off subutex about 20 days ago.. pretty damn close to it.

I used subutex daily for about 1.5 years. (1.25-2 mgs a day). The subutex withdrawal started about 36 hours after my last dose.. I tapered over 3 weeks .. but still was averaging .75 mgs when I kicked id say..

The withdrawal was worst the 5th, 6th, and 7th days... (I used 7.5 mgs of oxy the first two days off... and 2.5 mgs the 3rd, 4th, and 5th day. Then stopped completely).

I take 2 mgs of xanax a day.. but was using 8-12 mgs a day the first week of withdrawl. I switched back to my normal dose after a week, but every 3 days or so.. would take a large dose at night so I could get sleep. (10 mgs... and I have used benzos for years and have a high tolerance.. really high, I wouldnt recommend that dose to just anybody by ANY means...) The 10th day or so I started using Kratom. I'll be honest, I have used it everyday since.. and I dont use enough to get high, but it definitely keeps my sick away, and I sleep fairly good at night. I know I will have to stop this soon, but I know it will be much easier to stop the kratom than the sub.. and I think my body has purged all of it by now.. if not.. most of it, or damn near all...)

Staying positive and keeping good influences around you is very important during the withdrawal.. especially since its so long, and its easy to get depressed, hopeless.. etc..

You CAN do this. Im slowly removing all the harmful shit from my daily life. .first was cigs, now subutex, next benzos.. Im too old to be fucking around like I do.