WARNING about NBOME blotters

[annoonnnamous]

We laid a sheet of 25C-NBOME, and the results were a bit disturbing.

Here was the process. We made sure our drying dish was leveled. Inside a small shot glass, we mixed 50 mg 25C-NBOME hcl in 1ml of 91% rubbing alcohol (+2% polysorbate 80). We also put a drop of red food coloring in the solution. We agitated this with a cheap vibrating toothbrush for about 5 minutes. Then we transferred the solution to our pyrex dish. Then we rinsed the shot glass out with about 0.5ml of the solvent, and added that to the dish also. At this point we dropped the the 9x9 sheet of blotter (dish wouldn't hold 10x10) into the tray and poked it a bit so it was flat in the dish. The paper appeared to easily soak up all the liquid. We let this dry for ~12 hours.

Now we had the printed side facing up, and it looked great. All hits were equally red. But when I flipped it over, I saw that the edges were MUCH more red than the inside of the paper. The corner hits were completely red, but the hit in the center was just pink. We thought maybe this was just the food coloring doing this, but no it wasn't. These should have about 600ug on each hit, but they definitely do not. The center hit was completely inactive. A hit taken from the layer in between the center and edge hits produced threshold effects. The ones on the edges, and especially the corners, are very strong. I'm not sure how strong, but no matter what the exact number is, it's not good at all that this happened. If we had tried for say 1.5mg per hit instead of 600ug, we could have ended up with potentially lethal doses on the edges of the paper.

I'm pretty sure the mistake we made was using too much of a fast evaporating solvent. The edges dried first, and when doing this, they pulled more of the solution toward them. Maybe distilled water, or a smaller amount of alcohol would have given better results.

Anyways, in the interest of harm reduction, I'd recommend that anyone laying NBOME compounds on blotters put food coloring in the solution. And lay a few sheets without any drugs on them, just for practice. This process is not nearly as simple as it seems. This kind of mistake is ok with LSD, since it has such a high safety margin, but these chemicals are not safe like LSD is.

PS some of these captchas look like they`re in latin or something.

 

[marsmellow]

You'll probably be ok. Even if all the drug landed on the outside edges of the blotter paper, which seems impossible to me, you would have maybe 1.2mg on each hit on the outside. That should be an alright dose.

But that is a bit concerning. Maybe your dish wasn't all the way flat on the bottom? There may have been space under the edges (think of a moat around a castle), so the outside was holding more liquid, and there was more space for air to flow under it.

 

[TDOOMX]

the past three days i have heard nothing but bad things about nbome's

 

[RobotRipping]

^that's because there's too much access to them. Most people who have been using psychedelics for years and have worked with high potency psychs in the past have absolutely no issues with them.

 

[cannakickit]

I was gonna give it a go but I don't want an insane dose to start with. I like safety too so maybe I'll pass.

 

[IamMe90]

Here's a better idea: lay the blotters individually using a micropipette or insulin syringe. Don't attempt to lay a whole sheet at once; obviously there's plenty of room for error in such a lazy technique.

 

[crOOk]

FFS when will people realize these NBOMEs are neither meant for oral use nor for distribution on blotters?!?!? Imho, the only reason anyone would lay these onto blotters is for distribution to friends or customers. A nasal solution will allow for quite accurate dosing in the form of a pipette or nasal spray. Ofc this wouldn't sell too well, eh?

Nonetheless thanks for the headsup. I've warned people not to do this numerous times. From what I've heard, the market is currently flooded with NBOME blotters. Please just STOP doing this! The compounds aren't really suitable for oral or sublingual use at all, much too unreliable ime.

Now let's not let this turn into a "how to lay blotter" thread. Close this bitch for god's sake.

 

[JonL]

FFS when will people realize these NBOMEs are neither meant for oral use nor for distribution on blotters?!?!? Imho, the only reason anyone would lay these onto blotters is for distribution to friends or customers. A nasal solution will allow for quite accurate dosing in the form of a pipette or nasal spray. Ofc this wouldn't sell too well, eh?

Nonetheless thanks for the headsup. I've warned people not to do this numerous times. From what I've heard, the market is currently flooded with NBOME blotters. Please just STOP doing this! The compounds aren't really suitable for oral or sublingual use at all, much too unreliable ime.

Now let's not let this turn into a "how to lay blotter" thread. Close this bitch for god's sake.

I would argue that the availability of accurately dosed, professionally laid blotter may actually be harm reducing; these compounds are available and their dangers known, but young people want to experiment with them anyway. I would rather the majority of people were not attempting liquid measurement of such doses without guidance; time and time again we are seeing reports of them getting it wrong and the consequences are unpleasant.

LSD blotters are laid by people who put a lot of effort and care into ensuring their product is uniform and consistent. I would hope that the same can be said for those who are distributing the NBOMes.

Nasal sprays/liquid storage of these compounds can be dangerous as the alcohol based solutions tend to evaporate over time, leaving a liquid of unknown (and often much stronger) concentration - which with the NBOMe compounds can lead to very dangerous outcomes.

 

[Skelington]

Hey, I've been searching EVERYWHERE for an answer to this, could you guys please help me?

I ordered a G of 25c-NBOME and I have been dong TONS of research on the risks, doses, ROA's and solubility of both the freebase and HCL form.

I still haven't gotten a clear answer.

Why do people say to add alcohol?
Is it strictly for preservation? Does it increase bioavailability for sublingual and buccal hits?

From what I understand, polysorbate is only useful for the freebase and does not increase bioavailability in the HCL form, which is what I am getting.

Please, I've read SO much on this stuff and am getting a huge headache. Every thread (including both big and dandy's) are full of ADHD like replies where they will touch on the topic then just move to something not even related to 25c.

I plan to possibly make blotter, or simply use altoids.

I have measured the drops per mL out of a visine bottle over 20 times. I get an average range of 15-17 drops per mL.

I plan to mix 50mg's of 25c with UP TO 7mL's of liquid. I say UP to because I will probably use less, like 6.7, to help compensate for the range in drops.

I was just going to use water, but I see people saying to use vodka (40 %) or just everclear (90 %).

Can someone please help me T_T. I've seriously read over 100 pages on this shit and still don't have a definitive answer to feel good about.

thanks in advance guys.

 

[slo mo]

the past three days i have heard nothing but bad things about nbome's

I never got into the NBOME blotter fad. If they are to be used , it should be with a consistent , controlled and accurate dose and ROA. Sheets of Blotters, inaccurate scales, inconsistent absorption all can lead to issues. I think the NBOME series are problematic if all the requirements aren't met for HR. I hope to not see anymore bad reports, but have a feeling they will continue I don't think people should make blotters with these unless it is an individual blotter strip. Want to try NBOMES? Time to get a scale and handle them safely, relying on someone else to do so can be a serious mistake.

 

[slo mo]

I would argue that the availability of accurately dosed, professionally laid blotter may actually be harm reducing; these compounds are available and their dangers known, but young people want to experiment with them anyway. I would rather the majority of people were not attempting liquid measurement of such doses without guidance; time and time again we are seeing reports of them getting it wrong and the consequences are unpleasant.

LSD blotters are laid by people who put a lot of effort and care into ensuring their product is uniform and consistent. I would hope that the same can be said for those who are distributing the NBOMes.

Nasal sprays/liquid storage of these compounds can be dangerous as the alcohol based solutions tend to evaporate over time, leaving a liquid of unknown (and often much stronger) concentration - which with the NBOMe compounds can lead to very dangerous outcomes.

Good points about evaporation and guidance. There are ways to handle this, too bad it isn't known by every user and user to be.

 

[Incunabula]

Skellington. I think people are using alcohol because if you have the freebase it's not dissolving very easy in water. That is, the solubility is better in alcohol, also it will evaporate faster.

If you want to lay the blotter yourself, and be really safe about it, I suggest you buy a micropipette and lay one blotter at the time.

 

[zn13bt]

^ Though putting freebase on blotter is not a good idea, because it will be absorbed very poorly by the mucous membranes in the mouth, leading to inconsistent dosing. Better to convert it to HCl or some other salt before laying it, in which case you can then use water as the solvent.

 

[Skelington]

I ordered the HCL, sorry if I didn't specify.

Let me post what I posted on another topic (the big and dandy)

Please understand that I have nothing but cautious respect for this substance. I do not intend to sell it as LSD.

I would like to precede what you're about to read with a personal trait. I am INCREDIBLY OCD, and I would literally STARE at EVERY SINGLE DOSE I dropped onto an altoid, blotter, etc. If I saw a dose not absorb correctly, I would toss it or add it to a personal stash.

I understand that you guys are worried about the uneven doses, but I hope my research here will shed a little light on how intently I am trying to do this right. I want to do this with the same care and consideration that a good acid dealer would put into his dosing.

So you are saying that I don't need to use polysorbate OR alcohol?

I am going to simply dose it onto whatever I can, honestly.

Blotter, altoids, gum, a drop under the tongue.
i AM NOT trying to pass this as LSD. (Just an fyi)

I did some research that I believe others may appreciate.
I discovered that the different viscosity between water and alcohol (Everclear) is EXTRAVAGANT.

Let me post my results. I used a visine bottle and I SHOOK THE BOTTLE EMPTY in between every trial to make sure that it was COMPLETELY empty,
I even tested the difference between CONSECUTIVE drops, and dropping, depressing, then dropping again. There was no variance.
Experiment #1 - 50/50 water/everclear mixture - mL
1. 32 drops
2. 30
3. 31
4. 33
5. 31

PURE EVERCLEAR - 1 mL
1 . 36
2. 34
3. 34
4.34

WATER - 1 mL
1. 20
2. 17
3. 17
4. 17
5. 18

These are all consecutive drops, until the bottle is empty.
I used an IV needleless syringe that my wife had from her last MS relapse, marked up to 10 mL.
I think i've REALLY gotten good at my measurement technique, hence the fairly stable results.

Regarding these results, these are the numbers as far as mL i will use in my vials with 50mg's per vial.

water - 100 doses per 5.9 mL
everclear 100 doses per 3mL
everclear/water - 100 doses per 3mL


I hope i added to this big and dandy thread =P

EDIT: I do worry that the addition of the 25c-nbome will effect the viscosity the way that adding alcohol will, but I can't see it doing much; Opinions?

edit : Using THESE measurements, I feel that I can easily dose the compound for vials. You simply multiply the amount used in a vial (of 25c) and multiply it by 20. So if I was to use the alc/water method, I would use 3mL x 20, so 60 mL, then dose to 20 bottles with my syringe.

 

[Skelington]

the past three days i have heard nothing but bad things about nbome's

I just enjoy the ol' way of taking it by mouth. When i took 3 Buccal spray shots from a pre-made spray (from a friend), I would say that i touched the +4 area honestly.

I'm extremely hard on my reviews of substances but this stuff truly blew me away. The visuals were the best I've ever had since the 1 of 2 times I ever had real LSD.

Spoiler: Trip Report

The body load WAS pretty gnarly, I cannot deny that. I had a hacking cough from the week before and when I coughed, it was very deep. I didn't feel actual nausea, but when I had these hacking coughs, it's almost like the cough simply followed through into vomiting. I had an empty stomach from not eating until that point, so all that really came up was some white foamy shit. I can tell you that I DID NOT hold those 3 sprays in my mouth very long, though, if at all. It was a simple spray, then wait.

I did stagger the sprays. 1 spray unfront, 2 after 5 minutes.

I am 6'1 - 190 lbs (about)

The reason people are getting varied results is simple, this stuff follows the same rules as the fake bake that's been going around.
RC's are just varied in results dependent on the user.

I was a big fan of the scentsi-star brand fake bake, but when my friend smoked it he felt NOTHING.
My friend who had the buccal spray said that there was a single girl who said she felt nothing.

As for my trip report, that I have failed to write, I will make it short and sweet.

0.00 - took a spray
t- 5 mins - took two more

t- 15 minutes - start to feel a DEFINITE come up, almost overwhelming

t- 25 Minutes - My hacking cough kicks in. I believe that this stuff makes you a bit mucusy too. I'm sweating BALLS, moreso than on MDMA. I am starting to get MINOR CEV's and I can tell that my vision is trying to merge the real world with the tripping world. I decide to get in the pool. OMG does the pool feel AMAZING. I feel like i'm at peace. THe mild tremors I felt coming on are a little more solidified, but the water REALLY helps me relax.

t- 35 mins - I'm starting to get tripped out by the ripples im making in the water. It's not full out tripping. More like things are moving in slow motion, and like there is a mild oil discoloration to the water. p.s - my friend and wife are sitting by the pool watching me.

t-50 mins - still in the pool, and GOOD GOD, the visuals are just full blown. I see what I call the "vines of life". I see FULLY in focus 3D visuals materializing before my eyes.

(Fun fact - a lot of use usually try to see things in two ways CEV's (closed eyed visuals) and OEV's (open eyed visuals). To those of us who have a horrible visual prescription, upwards of -5.50, i find a SIGNIFICANT different between having my glasses on and off. I actually prefer to have my glasses off. It allows me to see the amorphous blobs that are my friend and wife, but the trip is COMPLETELY taking up my field of vision. I honestly usually prefer my glasses off. It's like you are getting the creative freedom that CEV's permit you to have, like a blank canvas, but at the same time not being unaware of your surroundings, thus feeling much more in control. Just a little thing I've gathered from my ample tripping times. )

t- 1:30 - My friend leaves and I go to sit on the porch, i'm very content and just enjoying the visuals that are still unfolding before my eyes.

t- 3:30 - like hitting a wall, my trip just kinda cuts down. VIsuals are mild, I'm feeling a bit cracked out.

t- 5:00 - I'm done tripping. I feel VERY worn out.

t- 7:00 same as 5:00, but I know that sleep will not come. I'm mildly agitated that I'm so strung out, yet tired, but I don't let it really get to me. I expected this to happen.

t- 10:00 - I fall asleep,


next day I was pretty damn worn out, and had no want to take another hit. I felt... satisfied with the experience, enough so to go and do ALLLLL this research on it and order myself a gram.

I did have a bit of a headache, but nothing that a lil aleve couldn't help, seemed to be an obvious vaso-constricion side effect.

 

[my3rdeye]

"A nasal solution will allow for quite accurate dosing in the form of a pipette or nasal spray."

So why does the 25i page on wikipedia say: "Snorting 25I appears to be a particularly dangerous method of consumption"


"I would argue that the availability of accurately dosed, professionally laid blotter may actually be harm reducing"

Its not possible to put a chemical on paper with accuracy with any method i have ever heard off. If there is some mass production machinary or something for laying blotters okay. If these people are laying it hit by hit with a dropper your doses will be all over the place.


"LSD blotters are laid by people who put a lot of effort and care into ensuring their product is uniform and consistent. "


Really? Says who? Send two different corners of same sheet to netherlands and see. It is impossible to lay LSD blotters with accuracy.
I told people a few years ago before the prelaid nbome blotters craze that laying a sheet is much harder to do than people think and i was laughed at. That doesnt fit with the "any kid can buy nbomes and pump out mimics because its so easy" mentality i see spread online.
Anyone who says laying a sheet is easy has never done it.

 

[Skelington]

"A nasal solution will allow for quite accurate dosing in the form of a pipette or nasal spray."

So why does the 25i page on wikipedia say: "Snorting 25I appears to be a particularly dangerous method of consumption"


"I would argue that the availability of accurately dosed, professionally laid blotter may actually be harm reducing"

Its not possible to put a chemical on paper with accuracy with any method i have ever heard off. If there is some mass production machinary or something for laying blotters okay. If these people are laying it hit by hit with a dropper your doses will be all over the place.


"LSD blotters are laid by people who put a lot of effort and care into ensuring their product is uniform and consistent. "


Really? Says who? Send two different corners of same sheet to netherlands and see. It is impossible to lay LSD blotters with accuracy.
I told people a few years ago before the prelaid nbome blotters craze that laying a sheet is much harder to do than people think and i was laughed at. That doesnt fit with the "any kid can buy nbomes and pump out mimics because its so easy" mentality i see spread online.
Anyone who says laying a sheet is easy has never done it.

I understand that there is no guarantee that drops are equal, but I did research via how many drops per mL a visine bottle lets out.

My results showed 3 times in a ROW that pure water will drop out 17 drops per mL.

3 results were 17 in a row, 1 was 16, 1 was 18.

The last 3 were 17 and i believe it's because I got my measuring technique down.

This being said, could i not assume that the size of each drop is within a very marginal range of the others?

Edit: (update) I've been told that hits of 500ug is too much to start out with so i guess i will probably make hits of 400.