• MDMA &
    Empathogenic
    Drugs

    Welcome Guest!
  • MDMA Moderators: Esperighanto

Do doctors have any clue?

HarrytheHead

HarrytheHead

Bluelighter
Joined
Mar 14, 2013
Messages
194
Location
East Coast USA
I took mdma once, it was way too high for a first timer, like .250g. Had a bad reaction and broke out into 5 intense panic attacks. Had panic disorder for a month or two, doc put me on 10mg of paxil.

Two months later the anxiety is subsiding and the doc wants to put me up to 20mg. What the fu*k is this guys problem?! Who ups a dose of AD when someone is feeling better? Reading bluelight, I know that people in my case (one time use) tend to recover fully over a period of 3 months to a year. But if I listen to this pill pusher I might be looking at whole different problem. Any experiences on this?
 
If you are feeling better then personally I would probably refuse to have the dose increased.

You can get withdrawel from ADs and the higher the dose you are taking the worse the potential for withdrawel.

To be fair to the doc it is quite common to have the dose of AD increased over time.
 
its capitalism. its business. he wants to sell you his product. money makes the world go round, apparently
 
I think doctors have quite a few clues... not all of them will be right, however. If you do not feel the need for more ADs, don't take them. Simple as that.



futura2012 said:
To be fair to the doc it is quite common to have the dose of AD increased over time.
Click to expand...

Is that not because they down-regulate serotonin receptors? SSRIs are awful, ESPECIALLY for people recovering from MDMA abuse.
 
Yea I agree folley. I am not totally knocking the guy and his knowledge. But I just think more emphasis needs to be placed on how the patient feels and other steps being taken like cognitive therapy and lifestyle changes. Instead of prescribing high doses of ADs like they're candy.
 
how the fuck are the pharmaceutical companies going to continue with the capitalistic endeavours of forever increasing sales?

money is god. i bet you $10 the doctor became a doctor because of the pay check just as much if not more than because they wanted to help people..

If you do not feel the need for more ADs, don't take them. Simple as that.
Click to expand...
fuck. i just assumed that to be obvious, it wasn't?
 
Yea but prior to reading this site, I saw my panic symptoms and said "fuck I'm screwed.. I need ADs". Now reading about other people's similar stories I am changing my mind. Seems like so many people burned their brains and came back strong anyway without medicine.
 
HarrytheHead said:
Yea but prior to reading this site, I saw my panic symptoms and said "fuck I'm screwed.. I need ADs". Now reading about other people's similar stories I am changing my mind. Seems like so many people burned their brains and came back strong anyway without medicine.
Click to expand...

Yes, mate. Its all about how you are feeling. Thing is - now you know you might feel "sick or different", but "refresh" back to reality, and see how you deal with everything...everyday. Its SIMPLE!
 
Apologies if this slightly off topic, but I keep seeing this question raised and have been pondering: HOW do people end up with panic disorder/anxiety after MDMA? In my mind, all that happens when you take a 200mg+ dose of pure MDMA, you come-up like an absolute train, and then your face melts off with euphoria. Considering the come-up stage of MDMA is never concerning or dangerous enough to actually kill you (it may be intense), I don't understand this. If I'm having an anxious come-up, it gets to the point where I just dont give a shit, and I roll with it.
 
SilentRoller said:
Apologies if this slightly off topic, but I keep seeing this question raised and have been pondering: HOW do people end up with panic disorder/anxiety after MDMA? In my mind, all that happens when you take a 200mg+ dose of pure MDMA, you come-up like an absolute train, and then your face melts off with euphoria. Considering the come-up stage of MDMA is never concerning or dangerous enough to actually kill you (it may be intense), I don't understand this. If I'm having an anxious come-up, it gets to the point where I just dont give a shit, and I roll with it.
Click to expand...

It happens some times with first timers on high dose.. and or people who already have a predis. to have anxiety issues to start with.. it acts as a trigger.. I have seen it first hand with a few people, mostly ones that have some sort of "control" issues to start with who can't just "roll" with it.. it brings on panic attacks as they can't control how they are feeling and once it starts its a like and snow ball tossed down a hill and cant stop.
 
For me - salvia and shrooms both gave me panic attacks before (I am not built for tripping). Going into mdma like a complete noob, I though it was just an upper like coke, which is why I did so much when I wasn't feeling anything. Then 20 minutes later it all hit me like a ton of bricks. Combine that with a bad setting and I had 5 intense panic attacks - despite trying to stay calm.

Since then I've had panic disorder - these days my complaints are face/head pressure, a quick heartbeat occasionally, unsatisfying sleep and lightheadedness. Don't know if this is all in my head but there are hundreds of others with these exact symptoms after too much mdma. Most of whom recover fine.. especially those who got burned from a one time use.
 
Absinthekitty - yes you are right. I am naturally an anxious person (though I never felt it physically until now). There was definitely a snowball effect that got me to this point which I am slowly reversing through time, mindfulness, exercise and nutrition.
 
I know this goes against HR, but my advice to this would be to face your fear again at some point (but with a controlled dose). I had something similar to this with Methylone a few years back, where I took far too much at once, and when it all kicked in, a was shitting bricks (so much so, I nearly called 999). 3 months later, I decide to face my demons, and took a measured dose of Methylone, and because I knew I had been through worse, I was okay and my anxiety completely dissappeared!
 
Haha I considered that. I'd rather be sober. It's like telling a war vet with PTSD to go back to an Afghan war zone for a bit to get over it.
 
I hate to ask, but I assume you tested your MDMA right (Marquis)? Caths/amp cuts are notorious for causing come-up anxiety. If this happens again, do what I do: Just tell yourself "Its alright, I've taken pure MDMA so there is no need to worry. Sure, the come-up is kicking my arse and I may not be able to feel my legs due to rushes, but its all good". I personally LOVE the come-up phase of any drug now, I find it exciting!
 
It was brownish tinted crystal which I assumed was pure. It's irrelevant to me at this point. Some ppl are built for tripping, some are not.
 
To be fair to the doc it is quite common to have the dose of AD increased over time.

Is that not because they down-regulate serotonin receptors? SSRIs are awful, ESPECIALLY for people recovering from MDMA abuse.
Click to expand...

Most Ads have a programme to increase the dose over time. I dont think its because of down regulation.

Probably to get the body used to the AD before the dose is increased.

Yes many people do report SSRIs being ineffective for MDMA abuse issues.

Although some report SSRIs being of some benefit. I guess different strokes for different folks.
 
I'd be extremely surprised if it WASN'T down regulation that caused it.. even opiates will naturally deregulate their receptors, causing the patient to become more susceptible to pain over time. In the same way, SSRIs deregulate the serotonin receptors and will cause depression to worsen over time.

futura2012 said:
Probably to get the body used to the AD before the dose is increased.
Click to expand...

hmm.. you mean like this?

SSRIs inhibit the reuptake of the neurotransmitter serotonin (5-hydroxytryptamine or 5-HT) into the presynaptic cell, increasing levels of 5-HT within the synaptic cleft.
However, there is one counteracting effect: high serotonin levels will not only activate the postsynaptic receptors, but also flood presynaptic autoreceptors, which serve as a feedback sensor for the cell. Activation of the autoreceptors (by agonists like serotonin) triggers a throttling back of serotonin production. The resulting serotonin deficiency persists for some time, as the transporter inhibition occurs downstream to the cause of the deficiency and therefore, is not able to counterbalance the serotonin deficiency. The body adapts gradually to this situation by lowering (downregulating) the sensitivity of the autoreceptors.[98]

Another adaptive process provoked by SSRIs is the downregulation of postsynaptic serotonin 5-HT2A receptors. After the use of an SSRI, since there is more serotonin available, the response is to decrease the number of postsynaptic receptors over time and in the long run, this modifies the serotonin/receptor ratio. This downregulation of 5-HT2A occurs when the antidepressant effects of SSRIs become apparent. Also, deceased suicidal and otherwise depressed patients have had more 5-HT2A receptors than normal patients. These considerations suggest that 5-HT2A overactivity is involved in the pathogenesis of depression.[99]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Selective_serotonin_reuptake_inhibitor
Click to expand...

That means they will naturally down regulate at at least two serotonin receptor sites.. and take a look at that last sentence. 5-HT2A OVER activity is what causes depression. Well, MDMA induced depression is caused by some MAJOR over activity.. but that's only once a week or so and when you stop it drops down to much, much lower levels. That's perhaps why SSRIs have neuroprotective effects on the direct comedown of MDMA, but using them even the day after is probably just going to give your brain more things to do before it can focus on getting back to normal and being able to live without the drugs.
 
It was brownish tinted crystal which I assumed was pure
Click to expand...

NEVER assume. I think it should be BL law that everyone use a test kit, and anyone who is found doing otherwise shall be made Folley's bitch! There is no exscuse, test kits cost £5 or so....(sorry all, had a few beers...)
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top