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Can you do Methylone between MDMA rolls occasionally?

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Hirokotzu

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Joined
Dec 20, 2012
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I've been talking to my friend recently about MDMA and Methylone, and he said he did some research and found that Methylone doesn't work off the serotonin system like MDMA does. I did brief google research and found other people saying the same thing. First of all, I know methylone has been around for far less time than MDMA has, so there isn't much evidence of what it will do to you long term or whatnot. What I want to know is if it's possible to use Methylone in between MDMA rolls every once and a while without ruining the MDMA effects. If anyone could provide me evidence/sources that would be awesome. I know ultimately it would be best to just not do it and stick with the spaced out rolls, but I'm curious for the truth about this. Thanks guys.
 
Hirokotzu said:
he said he did some research and found that Methylone doesn't work off the serotonin system like MDMA does. I did brief google research and found other people saying the same thing
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Where did you find this? Because that's not true. Methylone releases serotonin JUST like MDMA does. It just does it at 1/3 the amount. It's release for norepinephrine and dopamine is the same though, so the tolerance will cross over highly there.


The drugs work in almost the same way, it's just that MDMA is 100 times better lol



If you want another drug to do in the time period you can't roll in, you'll need to find one that doesn't cause any serotonin or dopamine release. That would be really anything that is not a stimulant
 
I've had the same thoughts man. Unfortunately, nothing can substitute for the great feelings of MDMA. You just gotta wait the month+ between rolls sadly.
 
Folley said:
Where did you find this? Because that's not true. Methylone releases serotonin JUST like MDMA does. It just does it at 1/3 the amount. It's release for norepinephrine and dopamine is the same though, so the tolerance will cross over highly there.


The drugs work in almost the same way, it's just that MDMA is 100 times better lol



If you want another drug to do in the time period you can't roll in, you'll need to find one that doesn't cause any serotonin or dopamine release. That would be really anything that is not a stimulant
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Your right that it releases serotonin at 1/3rd of the amount that mdma does, but I'm pretty sure that it releases quite a bit more dopamine and norepinephrine. Methylone would cause some sort of cross-tolerance but not that much. I personally never got hangovers from methylone, I actually felt better the next day unless I went to a stupid high dose.
 
Hirokotzu said:
What I want to know is if it's possible to use Methylone in between MDMA rolls every once and a while without ruining the MDMA effects.
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No. Serotonin sensitivity takes weeks to recover back to normal after a dose of a releaser. Methylone may be less potent on serotonin, but it's similar enough that I would follow the general rule of thumb (once a month max).
 
Folley said:
^ It just feels like the two are higher compared to it's serotonin release, I believe.

MDMA releases DA and NE too you know, in quite high amounts as well
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I know that. I just remember reading something that had a pie chart divying up the percentage of all three methylone and mdma released in what amounts. I just found it so I posted it on the bottom. Not sure the credibility but I remember reading that.



http://www.bluelight.ru/vb/threads/299732-The-Big-amp-Dandy-bk-MDMA-(Methylone)-Thread/page29
 
^ Can I ask why you think it would be less cross tolerant if it releases more DA and NE?

MDMA releases those chemicals as well (as well as prolactin, oxytocin, GABA and many other neurochemicals)... so it would be cross tolerant at AT LEAST 3 receptor sites with methylone.
 
electrodevo said:
No. Serotonin sensitivity takes weeks to recover back to normal after a dose of a releaser. Methylone may be less potent on serotonin, but it's similar enough that I would follow the general rule of thumb (once a month max).
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Is that a general rule of thumb?

We must have different thumbs.
 
StoneHappyMonday said:
Is that a general rule of thumb?
We must have different thumbs.
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There is no specific study on serotonin receptor density with methylone that I can Google.
If there were, I could give a better answer.

With MDMA, we can say that receptor density is back to reasonable control within 21 days after a very heavy dosing schedule. (With rats, of course, which are different than humans... hence the once the month and occasional extended break rule that plays out in practice with humans. Not a hard, fast, rule of thumb... but one that seems okay enough.)

With methylone, we don't even have that data point. At least that I can see.

Methylone *feels* less neurotoxic and more repeatable than MDMA, in part due to the less potent SERT release. (And, SERT *seems* to be slower to recover than DA or NE. Insert depressing factoid about humans being more adept at fight-or-flight NE or primitive rewards DA vs more seemingly complex emotive state transport systems like SERT, a tangent for another day).

However, I will make no conclusion personally based on "feels". If you want to be the human guinea pig to prove there is no cross tolerance, feel free. All I can say is that in lieu of the science we have a few things in Erowid and elsewhere that does demonstrate some cross tolerance between methylone and MDMA, at least anecdotally. The degree, I cannot say definitively, but it's better to be cautious.

Feel free to experiment if you want to expand the safety definition. There is not a lot of hard data and a lot of this is playing it safe in lieu of it.
 
electrodevo said:
Methylone *feels* less neurotoxic and more repeatable than MDMA, in part due to the less potent SERT release. (And, SERT *seems* to be slower to recover than DA or NE. Insert depressing factoid about humans being more adept at fight-or-flight NE or primitive rewards DA vs more seemingly complex emotive state transport systems like SERT, a tangent for another day).
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I believe methylone is non-neurotoxic btw.
 
electrodevo said:
With MDMA, we can say that receptor density is back to reasonable control within 21 days after a very heavy dosing schedule. (With rats, of course, which are different than humans... hence the once the month and occasional extended break rule that plays out in practice with humans. Not a hard, fast, rule of thumb... but one that seems okay enough.)
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there once was a study on humans from an university in the netherlands iirc (i can't find it now). they had an average recovery time of 6 weeks there (but it was quite variable, for two weeks to a few months i think).

SERT is the serotonin transporter btw. . serotonin itself is usually called 5-HT in the literature.
 
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