Am I doing the right thing here? (boy/girl friendship in early recovery)

[RedLeader]

Hey everyone, thanks in advance for taking any time out of your day to read and to perhaps respond to this thread. It means a ton to me, as I know that many of you will be able to give me good advice at a time when I don't have confidence in myself to do the right thing at all.

About seven months ago I met a girl, who will me referred to from here-on as "A," at an AA meeting. A and I were acquaintances who ran into one another every so often up until about ten weeks ago when we actually swapped phone numbers, began going to meetings together regularly, grabbing the occasional coffee and so on. We had develop a friendship, one of those friendships within the recovery community, if you will. Then some ten weeks ago, A and I were headed to a Friday night meeting when during our trip there we both agreed that our days had been horrible and that we really didn't feel like going to the meeting. As you can probably guess, it was only a matter of time before we were on our phones with our respective dealers. The heroin was up our noses within an hour. And so it began. Recovery buddies became drug buddies that Friday night, and A and I hit the ground running.

I detoxed from the habit that followed over this past weekend. So did A; we had basically been using together nearly everyday during that time period. And sure, we had our fun. We had many deep and meaningful conversations, getting to know one another rather well. We kissed a few times quite briefly on the lips, slow-danced in her bedroom one night, we cooked together, shopped together, hung with her friends, then with mine. Though definitely platonic, A and I became very close during our relapse on heroin (this being the drug that did both of us in over the previous year). I found out that A is an absolutely amazing person - intelligent, beautiful, compassionate, charismatic and full of integrity. I hope that she saw some good in me too. But of course it had its dark side, as do most ten-week ambitious heroin relapses do. Money was blown, her family grew suspicious (she's back at home with her parents and "on her last straw."), we lied together, schemed together; she was my partner in crime and she definitely did it all lookin' good. We reverted to our old addict behaviours and traits together like it was nothing. Like we went way back, it was that comfortable.

What made me end it at ten weeks was an important drug test I had to take and could not at all risk a fail. Being her only source for heroin, A also quit with me. We supported each other during the detox, and though not doing it together physically, her spirit being with me throughout definitely helped me get through it. Neither of us knew what would happen after I took that test, but I kind of felt like in the back of my head, I was going to go at it for just one more night.

So last night, which was the night before the test, A gets in contact with me and tells me how badly she wants to stay sober. She talks about going to more meetings, reconnecting with her sponsor and doing anything and everything she can do to stay off of heroin. And she asks that I don't come around her or even speak with her if I am high or in the "I want to get high" mindset. I agree and entertain with her the idea of trying to stay clean for a longer time as well. Though I will say that I'm not one to get too excited during the early part of recovery. Simply not using is hard enough for me, and I'm not so much into the 12 steps. So I typically just transition back to living a normal adult life as I get clean - work, exercise, hobbies, etc. A gets really into the whole spiritual component of it too and the power of positive thinking. I think that this is awesome for her if it works, and promise to her that I will respect her wishes and never put her in a situation any more triggering than my person alone just being around her.

And so it starts. All of my feelings start coming back and I realise that despite having a lot of fun with her and getting to know an amazing girl, I was, at the same time, rather rude to A as far as being a friend within the recovery community goes. I enabled her a lot, gave her a lot of my drugs for free and did very little at all to suggest that we bring our relapse to a close at any point before the latest necessarily possible weekend. The more that A talks about the consequences and collateral damage of those ten weeks, the more guilt and shame I begin to feel for being a strong force in the damage that was done. I am that guy who meets a girl at an AA meeting and then relapses hardcore with her, does a lot of silly and questionable things with her during the relapse and even screwed up her relationship with her sponsor really badly. And yet due to her caring and loving nature, A remains by my side as a loyal friend here some 6 days into our new chapter, despite it being pretty obvious that it's hard for her to be around me and not crave heroin. The more my emotions come back the more guilt I feel.

I will say it once more - A is a very sweet girl who wants to help everyone she can, which obviously includes me. But I'm struggling with my very real addiction to heroin and am not in a place right now where I am free from cravings and thoughts about it every other second. If A really does want to stay clean, she needs to spend little time with me, and that's the cold/hard truth. I have so much love and respect for A that I actually am ready to put my connection with and innocent crush on (we're only going to be just friends, but she and I joke all the time about my attraction to her) her aside and distance myself as far as is needed. Now it's hard for me to read her mind, so when she tells me that wants to continue to hang out with me, to go to meetings with me and to be my close friend, I don't exactly know her reasoning for doing so. How much of it is a genuine friendship? How much is it that I am her connection to her drug-of-choice, so it's wise to keep me around? How much is her wanting to be there for me from the aspect of the recovery community? I don't know, neither do I know how difficult it is for her to stand up and tell me exactly how much distance she needs, and for how long.

I really want to see A stay clean. She's been taken to some nasty places during her addiction and with the zeal and enthusiasm that she's displaying a week in, I want to see her go the distance. I also want to get clean, but, and as I spoke about earlier, my strategy for doing so is way different than hers would be. And despite all of the praise I have for our friendship, I would be a lair if I said that it's not tearing me up inside how I enabled her and how I was codependent with her for those couple of months. I feel so horrible for being there as she continued to deceive her family and friends. I watched her make decisions she now regrets and didn't attempt to stop her. I kissed her while we were on drugs, and we'd frequently end up half-naked massaging each other half-hour into a nod, when we'd agreed beforehand to not do anything like that again "because we are just friends and anything more serious is a bad idea in early recovery." My addiction affected the way I saw/handled our friendship as it grew over those ten weeks, and now that I am getting back to my normal self, I feel so bad for a lot of stuff.

It would be extremely risky and unhealthy to A if she remains close to me right now. I sincerely believe that she wants to be my friend and sees great potential in me as a life-long friend. Again, though, she's not going to come out and directly tell me that she cannot be around me right now (other than, of course, if I am visibly high). So I feel like I need to take the initiative here. I need to tell A that because I do care about her and love her so much, and desire to see her begin the rest of an amazing life, that I am going to distance myself from her for a while for both of our benefits. I'm leaning toward an email or a Facebook message to the extent of:

Dear A,

... Because I care about you and love you, and want to see you take this with you as far as you can, it's necessary that you and I stay away from each other until we learn how to live responsibly on our owns again. And ya this means everything. No hanging out, no meetings, no calls, no texts. We need to do this for at least some period of time before perhaps we can test the waters and go grab a coffee and a bagel. Let me apologise to you for my rougish behaviour over the past ten months, and hope that I did make ya have at least one genuine laugh in there. If you're this beautiful of a person at your chemical worst, you're going to shine brighter than the sun with some clean time under your belt. I also am going to do my best to remain clean, and I do hope that down the road we are able to rediscover our friendship through a more crisp lens. Please take care of yourself, and my God help you if your computer breaks and I'm not there to fix it...

When I have 90 days under my belt, be it 84 days from now or a while longer, I'll be saying hello. But until then, I love you, you better love you and don't stop looking for that better day.

RL


Here I've kind of set the rule that I'd contact her once I make it 90 days.

Okay, so what I could use some advice on would be things like:

* Am I right to take charge of a situation like this when I know that she wouldn't?
* Is my way of doing this, by way of a brief Facebook message, appropriate?
* Does this seem fair for both of us, if we do see the potential for a great clean/sober friendship down the road, but both know that it's really dangerous right now?
* Will I actually be able to be friends with her, if I am going to feel so much guilt for the cavalier way I handed those ten weeks? Is the best thing to do to wave good-bye and we both go our won ways?
* Should I think/go about this in a completely different way? And if so, how?
* Should I offer to her an idea such as infrequent coffee dates or meetings so that it's not actually me totally distancing myself from her?
* Why is this soooooo hard? (rhetoric, but I'm sure many of you know the feeling....)


The goal here is the preservation of a friendship started in difficult, if not taboo, territory. A secondary goal would be my acceptance of leaving the friendship after having understood it as simply too risky for the both of us. As well, I need to know, perhaps from a female's perspective, if I should be apologising to her for things like kissing her while we were on the nod (and she had previously asked me to try not to), enabling her when she met me in a 12-step meeting while trying to get clean, not making her already risky living situation and general life direction any better at all, and so on. The last goal could be helping me stop thinking about her and how beautiful she is inside and out as I focus on getting my own self clean and to a better place in life.

Thank all of you still here with me. I have a love for A that goes way behind friends vs. lovers; we're two dancers in the performance of life, and I cannot wait for our next (sober) slow dance. But ultimately it's whatever is in the cards for us, and I can only hope for the best. Has anyone else ever gone through a similar situation and has a complete story to share? I'm so nervous about this, as she's so important to me.

Be good guys,
RL

 

[RobotRipping]

as you describe it the friendship seems too risky for her especially. Don't feel too bad about binging with her, it was her choice ultimately, whether AA believes so or not. Something inside the both of you that day said fuck it and started the binge. Your message is fine but could be seen as an attempt to have a drug buddy back to go get high with. I'd just let things be and see what happens. If you make it 90 days then a simple fb message would suffice, start slowly and see where it goes. If you know for sure that you are just going to relapse then this friendship will probably not work out.

i really don't see why you are to blame for enabling her, maybe you felt more dominate in the situation but that could easily be your perspective and not objective. I think the biggest issue with a possible life long friendship is whether you will remain sober or not during her early recovery and even in her later recovery. Some people just can't have that memory of a 10 week binge erased from their minds. If you're thinking about a relationship then this is all different, a friendship though, sounds just too risky.

if you just want to part ways at that 90 day mark then sending a message doesn't really make a difference IMO; after 90 days if she hasn't contacted you then she's moved on in life and i'd just let her go, as shitty as that may be.

 

[DooMMooD]

Dude you are 6 days back into sobriety after your last relapse which was with this girl.

I think that hanging out with her again, at all, is a bad idea and is a recipe for failure on both of your parts. You know that deep down too, which is why you feel guilty when you think about hanging around with her again. I think thats less that you feel guilty for enabling her specifically, and more that you feel guilty about the whole scenario in general. You know you didnt force her.

But yes, it is clearly a really bad idea as you have already seen.

Sending a message at all is questionable IMHO. It almost would appear that the message is to illicit her response and attention, more than to apologize. Apologies can wait till you're all in a good place (and by then you'll know if you really need to give one). But if you do want to get that off your chest don't do it on FB man: thats tacky as hell.

 

[nervousone]

I think you handled it in exactly the right way. For the reasons you eloquently articulated the two of you need to stay away from each other until you both have some clean time. I think taking the initiative and sending her a message was is the thing to do, because even if a small part of her thinks you being around you make make her more susceptible to relapse, she wouldn't tell you this because she wants to help you as well. The only way you two will have any type of real relationship in the future is if you are both stable and sober. To get stable and sober you need to be apart, for the moment at least.

I wouldn't dwell on the past and fret all the enabling. It sucks it happened that way, but you are doing the best you can to fix the situation. You are handling this like a stand up guy. Don't beat yourself up because it accomplishes nothing. Even if you gave her free dope she was with you on her own volition. You can't change the past no matter how much you would like to, beating yourself up is counterproductive. Focus on the future.

I hope you get manage to get a good bit of sober time sooner rather than later. Good luck to the both of you.

 

[motherofearth]

Firstly, all of this may hinder your efforts to keep sober. I'm not saying don't think about it (b/c that may not be possible), but your priority should be keeping yourself off heroin at all times.

I recently went through something of a similar situation. However, I decided to lay down the distance between us, and it was a sexual relationship. If my perspective can shed any light at all, basically I've told her I don't want to see her outside of meetings, but really, I don't want to see her at all. She is weak-willed, always has money, and needs my connections. Admittedly, I didn't have the connection w/ this person you had w/ your A, so A probably doesn't feel this way about you.

I think you are right to take charge of the situation as you did, b/c it was obviously not sustainable and wreaking havoc upon her life, if not yours as well. But are you sure she was unwilling to take charge of the situation? She did call you before your drug test and lay down some serious boundaries.
I would leave the facebook message, and if you are truly open to it, tell her she is welcome to call you if she wants a protracted explanation on the matter. I wouldn't bother w/ the apologies over kissing; the time for that has come and gone. Just demonstrate however you can that you're interested in a platonic relationship, as she is.
I can't really answer the the third and fourth questions, which seem to be the really bearing and nagging ones for you. That will depend on her capacity for forgiveness, but moreover how he evaluates your role in the situation.

I think you are right to distance yourself, and also in setting a boundary. It will be important you hold to the boundary, even if she tries to circumvent it. If staying off heroin is important for you both, then you each demonstrated it isn't something you can certainly do together. Distance isn't a good idea; it seems to be necessary.

Are you sure you want a platonic relationship w/ A? Not something more? The way you talk about her suggests you could have a go at a relationship if it were up to you. Which would be a bad idea, which would make it very hard for you, emotionally.

Sorry Red, this is a lot to keep on your mind while trying to avoid heroin, but I think it is severely important you keep to at least the 90 day boundary.

Best of luck.

 

[pastelcircus]

Dude, what happened between you and A is not your fault, as mentioned before. What is your fault is trying to extend this friendship further/ putting it on hiatus and giving it a time frame for revival, even when she has mentioned something along the lines of not wanting to be in contact. she might not know what she wants, and even if she does, she probably doesn't know how to communicate it well as fresh as she is into sobriety.

However, it is really easy for newcomers to be all gung-ho until they realize that yes, this hard work. i've noticed a pattern along the lines of- the more cocky and ambitious the person, the quicker and harder they relapse. this is especially true of a guy that i thirteen stepped myself. it sucks to see but it happens, it's one of those bittersweet parts of a sustained recovery.

I think it's easy for a person to want to either use or stay clean depending on who they're hanging out with, and you might just be more of a using influence. That also might not ever change.

If i were you i wouldn't send the message, i would just let it go, for her sake if not for yours. considering the series of bad choices that she continued to make during her relapse (which you took a minor role in but didn't make any of the finals calls in,) cutting all contact and is her (and, again, probably your) best chance of survival at this point. Female and Male addicts are both equally known for being highly influential during early sobriety, and if you feel bad about what already happened now, how would you feel if you and A ended up relapsing (again?) I would try to let everything go of the relationship, only making it a point to cut off contact with her if she contacts you. She deserves a chance at sobriety and i hate to break it to you, but that chance is highly fractioned when you enter the picture.

so.

it's your call, but for her sake and yours, try to let it go, the good, the bad, and the ugly. this might not be a bad time for you to get back on the new-year wagon either, bud, as you deserve your chance to live a clean life as well.

anyways, sorry for the rant, hopefully it helps

 

[RedLeader]

Sending a message at all is questionable IMHO. It almost would appear that the message is to illicit her response and attention, more than to apologize. Apologies can wait till you're all in a good place (and by then you'll know if you really need to give one). But if you do want to get that off your chest don't do it on FB man: thats tacky as hell.

Facebook is tacky, not disagreeing there. The reason for doing it electronically was to avoid face-to-face conversation, which would likely be way more triggering. But I see that you really mean that I shouldn't do it at all. And perhaps that is best, but my reasoning again for doing it my way was to avoid her being triggered by a possible Her: "hey so have you used recently?" Me: "Umm ya" - types of triggers completely.

Dude, what happened between you and A is not your fault, as mentioned before. What is your fault is trying to extend this friendship further/ putting it on hiatus and giving it a time frame for revival, even when she has mentioned something along the lines of not wanting to be in contact. she might not know what she wants, and even if she does, she probably doesn't know how to communicate it well as fresh as she is into sobriety.

She said that she only didn't want to be around me if I continued using. I don't know if I properly conveyed this in the first post, probably not. At the time she said that, she also said that if I was remaining clean, then it wasn't an issue and she wanted my friendship (this was the night before my test, after I had gotten clean). Just that she wouldn't want to be around me if I started using again. In the message I drafted above, I thought I was pretty clear about only getting back in contact with her after a genuine X days clean.


I guess I am just being selfish. I've been really struggling to have any friends at all these days. My sober/"normal" friends who know about my struggles want nothing to do with me when I am using drugs or talking about my drug-related problems. They all tell me to turn to recovery communities for friends. So I have a bit, but then this kind of thing happens. I'm just a fuckup who can't pull off friendships anywhere I suppose. I should just assume that she's lying to me when she says that she does want to be my friend if I do get clean too. I just need friends, young people my age, when I'm struggling like I am. I just have no clue where to find them. BL's like the only happy medium, but I just wish it existed around me in my real day-to-day life.

 

[motherofearth]

I guess I am just being selfish. I've been really struggling to have any friends at all these days. My sober/"normal" friends who know about my struggles want nothing to do with me when I am using drugs or talking about my drug-related problems. They all tell me to turn to recovery communities for friends. So I have a bit, but then this kind of thing happens. I'm just a fuckup who can't pull off friendships anywhere I suppose. I should just assume that she's lying to me when she says that she does want to be my friend if I do get clean too. I just need friends, young people my age, when I'm struggling like I am. I just have no clue where to find them. BL's like the only happy medium, but I just wish it existed around me in my real day-to-day life.

It sucks that your friends don't want to at least hear you out, and just push your problems off by way of recovery communities.

I wouldn't assume she doesn't want to be friends, but you two have each earned a hiatus in your friendship. You'd do well to put her out of your mind for now as best you can - as if you weren't going to see her again.

 

[Mariposa]

I will respectfully disagree regarding relationships in early sobriety.

It is not a good idea for the two of you to use, separately or together. You describe this woman as being your 'partner in crime' and that is not a good thing whether you are using presently or in the past. In 12-step speak, that's enabling. In real talk, it's continuing to use for both of you. If you truly do vibe with this woman, then you both deserve a relationship that is based on truth.

I don't know anyone who was a problematic snuggler. I don't view all addicts unilaterally as deficient. I think that addicts who continue to use, myself included (alcohol) as being perpetual problem children. I also don't view myself as unable to get to know another person. How is it justifiable for addicts to have friends, but not lovers? How is it healthier for a person to shut down emotionally when they wish to be sweet and happy with another sweetheart?

My best advice would be to view your new lover with an open mind, being conscious of both of your needs.

 

[herbavore]

^but she is not his new lover. She emphatically stated that she wanted to be friends.

RL, it does seem to me that you are completely in love with this person. I know that you say that you want a friendship for now because you just don't want to lose the connection that feels so deep and friendship is what she is offering. But it feels to me like your feelings for her are more than a platonic friendship could encompass--especially right now.

It also feels like it is all tangled up. Your feelings for her and your feelings for heroin are both bending you out of shape. And they are feeding each other. From that alone I would say tread very, very carefully. I don't know specifically what you should do but I think you know somewhere inside. When you are most conflicted is when you can really learn something. You want to feel good and you want love. You want physical and emotional love and you want ease in your feelings and interactions. That is natural, normal and makes perfect sense. The only problem is in deciding the source of all those good feelings. I try to ask myself these: Is it healthy? Is it sustainable? Does it align with my integrity and my sense of what is right? If the answer is no, you have to turn away no matter how tantalizingly close it feels to satisfying your needs. Look elsewhere for the same needs. Good luck, man. It doesn't sound easy.