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Drug tests for People trying to get the dole

Well, this is a discussion board.
If i wanted apathy I'd go someplace else. All the political sections of Bluelight are very US-centric, and the topic of this thread is something that could have hugely detrimental effects on our community (ie bluelighters, drug users) if the idea ever took off in Australia. So yeah, an issue that can get divide people.
You don't have to be convinced by an argument, but it's more constructive to counter it with your own thoughts, don't you think?
 
bunnymunro you are barking up the wrong tree champ...why tax people with no money why not tax those that can afford to pay just a little more? how much tax in the dollar was packer paying...not too fucking much hey old example sorry...

What do we all think of gina trying to black male us into working for peanuts? pay aussies fair wages you fat slut! im sure there is plenty of aussies to do the work if she was willing to cough up some fair coin...whats the current national unemployment and homeless figures...surely australians could do the work without needing to bring across basically slave labour from os?

it amazes me how difficult it is for people to view things from a different perspective...put your self in the shoes of those that you are putting shit on before putting shit on them.

[snip]

i just read a book about malcolm x...was a real interesting book...we are a pretty sick form of life in so many ways its disturbing...we still treat our aboriginals like animals...disgusting
 
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spacejunk said:
^ there are still goods and services taxes and all kinds of duty taxes and so fourth. income tax? maybe not - i can't remember if you have to pay (much? any?) tax with the income you earn on the dole (i was stoned off my pickle at the time). but i'm pretty sure prostitutes pay tax like any other profession? not street workers, but those employed in brothels?
you're assuming that all drug dealers make enough profit to live off - pay the rent on time, buy food and the goods they trade in as well....there are lots of different types of dealers. sometimes they have gear/money, sometimes they don't. not all dealers are handling massive commercial quantities, not all are high-rollers.
of course, there are the other kinds of dealers that earn millions of dollars a year and still feed from the public trough, but i think these people often become quite conspicuous to law enforcement when they have flashy lifestyles, expensive cars and luxury homes but claim unemployment benefits. unexplained income...which is what you are suggesting should be an option?
i'm confused!
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If you earn less then 25k you pay no tax due to the low income rebate.

You don'tpay GST on everything only goods and services. The tax actually replaced about 26 taxes
 
Guys, some of the comments being made towards female users on this board are really inappropriate. You have to understand that those sort of comments can make people uncomfortable and should not be used in public forums toward people you barely know. Please show some common decency and keep your fantasies in your head.

If it continues we will be infracting, consider this an open warning.
 
laugh said:
What do we all think of gina trying to black male us into working for peanuts? pay aussies fair wages you fat slut! im sure there is plenty of aussies to do the work if she was willing to cough up some fair coin...whats the current national unemployment and homeless figures...surely australians could do the work without needing to bring across basically slave labour from os?
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Seriously, Gina fucking reinhart. What earning 12 BILLION dollars of personal wealth in 1 year wasn't enough? The fact that you're estimated to be the richest person in the world within 10 years (most likely after 5). And you'd rather pay someone less then cough up some of that money to hard work Australians. If it was upto me we'd raise the tax for people who have an annual profit of a million+ by 10%. It's a big increase, but it would be fantastic for our economy thats an extra 1.2billion off that bitch alone.
 
Divine Moments said:
Guys, some of the comments being made towards female users on this board are really inappropriate. You have to understand that those sort of comments can make people uncomfortable and should not be used in public forums toward people you barely know. Please show some common decency and keep your fantasies in your head.

If it continues we will be infracting, consider this an open warning.
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Seriously? I haven't seen anything to support people being more offensive to women rather then men on this forum. I'm a boy so maybe I missed some of it, I'm just a bit surprised, I've seen some flirting but nothing worse then that, or maybe those comments have been removed
 
thestudent14 said:
Seriously, Gina fucking reinhart. What earning 12 BILLION dollars of personal wealth in 1 year wasn't enough? The fact that you're estimated to be the richest person in the world within 10 years (most likely after 5). And you'd rather pay someone less then cough up some of that money to hard work Australians. If it was upto me we'd raise the tax for people who have an annual profit of a million+ by 10%. It's a big increase, but it would be fantastic for our economy thats an extra 1.2billion off that bitch alone.
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Haha, while we're on the topic of Gina... www.howrichareyou.com.au
 
fuck thats pretty insane/depressing dm

that shit on tv today was just for shits and giggles i reckon, just to stir all us cretins in the pubs up give em something to winge about.

i wouldnt be surprised if gina was pretty lonely atm though
 
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IMO, anyone who gets refused welfare in this nation is going to be a much bigger burden to taxpayers then even the worst dole abusers, i get a wholesome 10k a year on welfare now just say i had to commit crimes to even just eat its gonna cost the tax payers 7 times the amount to have me fed 3 times daily and stored in a correctional facillity and still have the option to use illicit drugs whilst imprisoned, and as for the testing it in itself is a flawed scenario because even the straightest shooter could be refused a vital lifeline because he or she consumed a poppy seed roll, cake or salad dressing with seeds and test positive, i might be seeing it totally wrong but the real burden in this whole picture is the thing that apparently keeps us from anarchy in the first place which is the monetary system, i only wish we had tried the thing known as the barter system but then where would our politicians and all the fat cats go? they would actually have to really work for a living, the biggest thing that keeps getting missed here is money or no money we are all still human and this is still the planet earth we are just the sick game, btw how do u get a job with no experience or means to gain experience,

also just picture a gang the media has shown u then times it by hundreds and then picture that crowd of people then imagine ur house in front of them, and there only objective is to remove all ur possesions in order to survive, this may not seem realistic, but in australian we are naturally rebellious so u add life and death to the mix and it will be chaos that i believe could easily out number the australian police force, to summarise, it wont work and all it will do is divide the population further :P
excuse my rant
 
Didn't know where to put this, so pls move to the right place if need be -

Workplace drug alert

WORKPLACE drug testers are reporting an increase in positive tests for methamphetamines among workers.

Cannabis and alcohol still lead the list of substances most likely to be found in Tasmanian workers.

However, the drug testers say that they are finding a growing number of local workers testing positive for methamphetamines.

Integrity Sampling Tasmania managing director Colin Thomas said that, despite popular opinion, cannabis was the most difficult drug to pick up due to a move towards saliva testing as opposed to urine testing.

"Cannabis is the most difficult to pick up with saliva testing," Mr Thomas said.

"It was the easiest to pick up with urine testing.

"Approximately 2 per cent of random tests confirm positive results for alcohol, cannabis or other drugs."

Mr Thomas, whose company does drug testing for some of the state's largest private and public employers, said it was not just industries such as mining being tested.

"We all need to manage the risk," he said.

Integrity Sampling has about 50 offices around the country and, in Tasmania, implements drug and alcohol testing for a wide range of companies including government business enterprises.

Mr Thomas said companies used a number of different testing regimes including random testing, testing after accidents and causal testing if a manager or supervisor believed a staff member was under the influence of drugs or alcohol.

Unions Tasmania secretary Kevin Harkins yesterday said there were some concerns around drug testing.

"We don't oppose drug testing if it is in a positive way in the best interests of the employees first and foremost," he said. "But we don't agree with some workplace testing.

"We don't support urine testing. Saliva testing is more appropriate."

Mr Harkins said causal testing could present problems, with some bosses targeting particular workers.

http://www.themercury.com.au/article/2012/10/03/363058_tasmania-news.html
 
I see this as obvious pandering to the conservative and bigoted voters in Australia that sadly make up a significant proportion of the population. Luckily I think just on the basis of a financial costs/benefits analysis this is unlikely to come about. Unless of course the tests were random or restricted to those with criminal convictions. either way I am against it.

fortunately I have not been on the dole but I have been on Aus study before. that was hard enough to live off. I can't imagine how someone on the dole manages to get by and live in a city such as Melbourne unless they live in the commission homes. but even then it would incredibly difficult.

Cutting back on already meagre payments is just going to make people who either don't have the skills, have a disability or an addiction to get work, resort to desperate measures to get money. And these measures are going to come through crime. Whether it be prostitution, burglary, drug dealing or roberry. If people have addictions to feed, or even don't have enough money to eat and to support a family and pay rent, they will do what it takes to get money. One only has to look at developing countries where there is little to no social welfare. the crime rates are alot higher. There is a strong link between poverty and crime. People will do what they have to do to put food in their belly or to pay for whatever they need. and for people addicted to drugs, it is a need.

And yeah it is even bigger injustice to have people who might just smoke a joint now and then but are otherwise looking for work to have their payments taken away due to being drug tested.

just on a side note, it is not all that easy to get a job, let alone one that suits your qualifications or skills. I have a post grad degree and would consider myself to be very skilled and intelligent. but at the moment I have had to settle for a job that whilst it is in the field I want to work in is poorly paid - well below what meets my qualifications and skills. I have been applying for other jobs next year but it has been slow and my phone has not been ringing off the hook. If you are unskilled, have a disability or are uneducated what hope do you have? Maybe get a job as a waiter/dish pig, work in a supermarket or maybe work in telemarketing. thats if you're lucky. jobs aren't exactly growing on trees at the moment.
 
Just in regards to poledrivers post I can see why there would an increase in meth for work placed drug testing for two main reasons. 1- for the last few years its popularity has surged. 2 - it makes people work more productively and makes work seem more interesting. Whilst a student I used speed to get a huge amount of work done before the deadline. Many american students used dexies, adderal and ritalin routinely to complete their work. My ex is American, herself and her brothers all used it to cope with heavy school work loads. It wouldn't surprise me if it is regualrly used as work drug within Australia, particularly for white collar jobs that require the completion of huge workloads in a limited amount of time.
 
spacejunk said:
^so troll someplace else.
this is a harm reduction forum, not a "let's become america" website. the aims of this forum have a lot to do with being a voice of compassion in a world of bullshit propaganda. we're talking about explicitly discriminating about drug users in a forum for/about/of drug users.
in australian society the safety net of welfare is harm reduction at its finest/most simple.
food stamps? this ain't the depression. don't believe the hype - aussies have it unbelievably good right now.

but you never know what's around the corner, so all you tony abbott / gina rhinehart / alan joneses can just stay in your troll cave, please. not all of us are corporate mouthpiece whores that can afford to take a cheap shot at welfare recipients.

some australians passionately believe in "a fair go" whatever the fuck that means nowadays. to me it means helping the vulnerable when they're doing it tough.

can you dig that?
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AMEN!!!!!! sick of this shit about tax payer food stamp mentality lately it seems , Everyone's entitled to X amount what they do is their bizz. I like Australia because of how it is laid back , not like USA, Sometimes to survive living on welfare you need to get a little bit escaped from the everyday doldrums. Plus we should always look after our vulnerable in society, not ditch them to kerbs.


nin015 said:
I never said I was against welfare I said I was against welfare being used to purchase drugs and I don't care if it's 0.0000001% of tax payers money it's still a waste that could be spent elsewhere.

I also said earlier that there are more wasteful uses of tax payer money out there but we are only talking of one topic here and I don't care what it is if it's wasteful then it should be stopped (if possible).

If being called ignorant, stupid and having personal digs at me because I said I was a professional are calm rebuttal then I'm glad it was only calm rebuttal (don't know how personal digs are rebuttal though).

Also I thought everyone knew public funds weren't for drug use since it's against the law but I guess that's because I'm stupid so please tell me what I don't know about it.
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Yeah but soon as we start dictating who can do what when where, it's like dictatorship! Ok when kids involved that's fine, but no kids do as you please, ID soon throw myself of a bridge if i just ate cookies n tea everyday. Im not saying abuse welfare, but if i want to buy a bag, whatever now n again to break the insanity it helps me is all. The Gubment put up prices ciggies, booze, is a cheap shot! im tired to of the Gov going after the smaller people, if your basics are met, Rent/Food/ bill/ well i believe in freedom of choice what to do with the rest "IF any is left that is which mostly it isnt., so when ppl say this stuff its a real dig like ok your last $30 i will tell you to go buy tim tams!!!!!!!!. Oh yeah and i am against raising crime , so anything that makes it worse, well you know isn't good, the system isn't broken so why fix it?. There' always seems this fight between tax payers and welfare. Honestly do the politicians sit on there leather Chesterfields at night thinking this shit up????


Read
http://melbournephilosopher.blogspot.com.au/2005/09/downwards-envy.html
 
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Meth use is rampand throughout victoria in factory/warehouse and Hospitality.

Hospitality has huge amounts of meth use, not just in the couple of restaurants I've worked at, Chefs have said at other work restaurants it's often extremely common. This isn't new though, this has been happening for years. I have a friend who works at one of the biggest hospitality work places in Australia, he says the workers that aren't on meth are the minority. The VAST majority he believes use meth regularly because they often go from night shits to day shifts to arvo shifts and get shuffled regularly. And as psytaco covered working on Meth is not difficult and is more interesting.

It would be completely acceptable for me to use meth at work, as much of the staff does/has. I have never done this though, I guess I feel that it's still irresponsible. I've always tried to keep my uni and work life seperate from my drug use. I think if I start crossing them over, then I would be much more likely to get addicted and cause myself problems later down the track.

I don't judge people who work on meth (except for people where others safety may be at risk), but if you're considerring using for work. It's a slippery slope and I've seen more then one friend go down the wrong track from doing this. I would advise people take great caution if doing this, and make sure it doesn't become the norm. I had a mate who used to start every day with a "super coffee" 2 teaspoons coffee, 2 sugar, 1/2 meth. Needless to say eventually the habit became too much and consequently some nights when he would crash he would oversleep the next day and eventually lost his job. I'm glad my friend got fired, because he didn't realise how addicted he was until he had no money and was forced to give up. He is grateful he lost his job when he did, it could've gotten much worse and he might have done more substantial damage which I've seen in other regular meth users/addicts.
 
I had a friend in canberra a few years ago who was a professor, he was commissioned by the federal gov (then john howards mob) to do a study into the centerlink system, His recommendation was that they scrap the whole welfare system and replace it with a radically different approach.

Everyone on under 40k a year would get 250 bucks a week regardless if they were working or not, it just automatically hit your account every week, then if you were unemployed there was no stigma attached to it and it gave you agreat incentive to find some work and top up this amount, if you left the country for any reason it stopped, but the moment you returned then it just automatically started again.

how would we pay for this ? by sacking the 17000 centerlink staff and saving all they money spent on their wages, super etc.. not to mention the money saved in the cost of running the offices (electricity, cleaning blah blah...), he worked out they would actually SAVE money by adopting this idea.

needless to say it went down with the gov like a lead balloon and the whole thing was shelved and never heard of again.
 
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