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What's the deal with N-ethyl-Norketamine (NEK)?

C

cannibalsnail

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Sep 18, 2011
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Here is a report from Adder which I would have guessed is the first to be done:

Ethylketamine, 2-(2-chlorophenyl)-2-(ethylamino)cyclohexanone

Route/dose: 100mg intramuscularly of HCl salt
Report:
The name is obviously wrong but it’s easy to know what hides there. This is just ketamine with ethyl on amine (just like in case of PCE). This obviously had an impact on drug potency. It’s not stronger by a factor of 2 or 3 but 100mg i.m. knocked me out totally and I was EthylK-holing for about an hour. So it didn’t really alter duration of experience. It’s got already a broken piperidine ring, ethyl is known to be the best when it comes to potency so here it is, get an S-enantiomer and you’ve got a winner.
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Now Adder has written reports for essentially every Arylcyclohexamine ever devised so I would trust his judgement.

However now that NEK has been released it seems to have a very different effect profile. People are reporting that even 200mg insufflated isn't sufficient to hole and one user actually IM'ed just under 100mg and did not hole: http://www.bluelight.ru/vb/threads/635994-N-ethyl-norketamine?p=10893844&viewfull=1#post10893844

So what is the likely explanation? I am awaiting high resolution NMR results of the current batch being circulated and will post them here.

My hypothesis is that the synthesis was impure and the possible impurity is Norketamine. Many users are reporting nose discomfort/pain which would fit with a primary amine being present (highly basic).
 
My verdict: It's fake.

Vendors are not known for their accuracy in chemical sales.

Until a relaible third party analysis is done, avoid.
 
Other verdict (although I agree with sekios first one as well) : Adders report is based more on speculated SAR and information available in the literature, rather than actual trials. There are some other glaring inconsistencies that have led many others to reach this same conclusion.
 
^:(, well damn! I hate to hear that, makes me sad... I really thought we had a nice compilation of useful info from actual trials.
 
I would be more inclined to trust Adder over random companies selling what is likely impure material. But don't quote me on that, until someone with half a brain who's not an employee of a legal highs company does some testing
 
I just thank you for referring to it as N-Ethyl-norketamine instead of simply N-ethyl-ketamine
 
The only NMR results I've seen are supposedly independent ones from a vendor website, but they're unreadable. I guess that's why cannibalsnail is waiting for HD copies.

The acidity of primary and secondary amines isn't *that* different, but it does look like there's something that makes some chems much more painful.

However, doesn't seem to be consistent with nasal damage. I don't know if it is still the case but certainly when I tried it it was incredibly painful and there was blood in my mucus occasionally for a few days. It's a secondary amine. I don't think we can draw conclusions based on the the substitution of the amine.

It's odd because the main vendor has a great reputation and I imagine that's something they want to keep. Something is certainly off.
 
Why is it that whenever vendors provide GC/MS or whatever results they're always unreadable? Do they actually have anyone who can read the things or are they just saying, oh well, they provided this, it must be right?

fwiw, amp was just fine in my nose. bupropion is apparently terrible. So are the 25x's from what I've read.

Ham
 
oh well, they provided this, it must be right?
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I think this is the case - I have seen vendors send "lab reports" that are LC / NMR results for what *should* be a single compound, which clearly is not what it was sold as. Just because you can print off a report doesn't mean it actually corresponds to your material. Or yoyu get goofballs like the guy who just pulls MS / IR scans off the DEA site and changes the colors. ("100% 2cb-fly maaan!")

Given that most people are confused as fuck by MS scans, I don't expect people to be able to reliably read a LC or NMR report. Especially if your Chinese vendor sends it to you. You don't even know they have a working GC.
 
Transform said:
The acidity of primary and secondary amines isn't *that* different, but it does look like there's something that makes some chems much more painful.

However, doesn't seem to be consistent with nasal damage. I don't know if it is still the case but certainly when I tried it it was incredibly painful and there was blood in my mucus occasionally for a few days. It's a secondary amine. I don't think we can draw conclusions based on the the substitution of the amine.
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You've possibly already seen this post http://www.bluelight.ru/vb/threads/635994-N-ethyl-norketamine?p=10928611&viewfull=1#post10928611 where ungelesene_bettlek reports absence of pain and damage with finely ground chemical, and my post http://www.bluelight.ru/vb/threads/635994-N-ethyl-norketamine?p=10924257&viewfull=1#post10924257 - I get no pain, nor damage, from spraying a fairly concentrated solution of this substance up my nose, or up my rear end, and this has been confirmed: http://www.bluelight.ru/vb/threads/...K-Volume-5?p=10924746&viewfull=1#post10924746 . Therefore I believe any pain or damage other guinea pigs are experiencing has a mechanical, not chemical, cause. It feels very much like ketamine, in fact.

It's odd because the main vendor has a great reputation and I imagine that's something they want to keep. Something is certainly off.
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I think the "main vendor" (if I am reading your mind correctly ;) ) has stated that they did not commission the synth.
 
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knockando said:
You've possibly already seen this post http://www.bluelight.ru/vb/threads/635994-N-ethyl-norketamine?p=10928611&viewfull=1#post10928611 where ungelesene_bettlek reports absence of pain and damage with finely ground chemical, and my post http://www.bluelight.ru/vb/threads/635994-N-ethyl-norketamine?p=10924257&viewfull=1#post10924257 - I get no pain, nor damage, from spraying a fairly concentrated solution of this substance up my nose, or up my rear end, and this has been confirmed: http://www.bluelight.ru/vb/threads/...K-Volume-5?p=10924746&viewfull=1#post10924746 . Therefore I believe any pain or damage other guinea pigs are experiencing has a mechanical, not chemical, cause. It feels very much like ketamine, in fact.



I think the "main vendor" (if I am reading your mind correctly ;) ) has stated that they did not commission the synth.
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There is an image on one vendors site which can be read by someone who understands the results. This is the same vendor that is pushin 2-meo-ketamine pretty hard and has many many sites of n-ethyl-norketamine all pointing to it. Please, someone verify the images.
 
Any images of "lab reports" et cetera direct from the vendor are not to be trusted. Vendors have faked NMR/IR/MS data before and you fucking bet they will do it again
 
I thought there was an insufflation pain thread but I cant find it now and I'm wondering if I imagined it.

I tried insufflating 2C-B dissolved in water and it still burnt a lot. Maybe not quite as bad as powder but it's definitely inherent to the 2Cs, even if that isn't the case for NENK
 
[NMR removed by request, available on request by PM]

NMR courtesy of another member. This is for a respected non-UK vendor.
 
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i wouldnt mess with that kind of stuff until i personally collected HNMR and mass spec data personally. trust no one! well,definitely not a damn vendor internet site.
 
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