Going Off Atypical Antipsychotics (Abilify)

[It's a baby!]

I'm on 5mg/day to treat a psychedelic/K2-induced psychosis. I'm working with a psychiatrist and we're gonna start tapering in a couple of weeks. How did your taper work out if you've done that? What was the schedule like? I'm not worried about going crazy again, I'm pretty damn sane these days, but I am worried about rebound panic attacks and whatnot.

Though, as my psychiatrist said, the dose is low and I've withdrawn from worse before.

 

[JJJames]

I don't have full answer for you, but from my own experiences with anti physc drugs (seroquil) ((which for me made numbed out like I was on 100mgs of valium but without any of the good bits and made my depression much worse)) is to tell your doctor to give you as little as required to get healthy again and do everything else in you can to help general happiness, for me what works is exercise that I enjoy, getting out and doing fun things. Also ask you phychiatrist for anti anxitey drugs that are not addictive, considered 'safe' with the least side effects then read up on them for yourself on medical websites etc.. Hope this helps

 

[AlphaMethylPhenyl]

So I am currently tapering Risperdal. I was on .5mg. When school ended, I decided to taper to at least .25mg. I did this by carving off about 5mg at first for six days (waiting for the full amount of drug to completely leave my system), then, once I affirmed that I could handle this lowered dose, proceeded to lower the dose further in the same manner but by larger increments, which I was pleasantly surprised to find never felt as bad as the first tapered amount. I've been wanting to taper down to nothing, but after reducing my dosage to 12.5mg am finding some negative effects a little too close for comfort (being anti-altruistic, mood-swingy, mechanical, racing and reeeally damning thoughts). However, I expected the taper down from .25mg to be worse than that of .5mg-.25mg since I've been on .25mg a lot longer than on the full .5mg. I think I'll probably taper down further, but maybe not right now.

You're on a really low dose, dude. If you still want to taper I would definitely make sure you taper very slowly, always watching for negative symptoms returning. If they do (expect some, since it is withdrawal after all) then evaluate the risk to your human livelihood and that of others; if you decide to continue the taper then that's where good habits come in.

I was once on three different meds at a high dose. After taking a psychedelic, I became rabidly anti-pharmaceutical, and got of these meds almost immediately. The shock of doing this without attending to my brain definitely caused some horrible upset. I remember telling myself before I got off them that I was perfectly fine--a misguided statement, as the drugs were keeping me fine. What I'm saying is that its right on to want to get off medications and be able to use you know-how as a crutch instead of a corporation's money maker, but please don't be afraid to stay on it if you really need to, even if its just a tiny dose.

If you're worried about the questionable safety of the medication you're on, or even the way it changes your personality, there are natural alternatives that will substantially reduce these risks.

Abilify is a really interesting medication. I was on it for a couple days a few years ago--don't really remember it. It didn't seem to really be an anti-psychotic. Its hard to imagine trying to class a chemical that treats bi-polar, depression, anxiety, adhd, schizophrenia, and drug dependency among illnesses, though.

The best advice I can offer you is use what energy or whatnot the drug withdrawal gives you constructively. Exercise and cognitive tasks should be easier--a great and fulfilling venue. Please don't experiment with any other drugs whatsoever at least until you are and have been finished with tapering the substance for a long time to ensure that you won't have to visit the psychiatrist again, and its truly advisable to not use the drugs that got you into this mess ever again, but if you do, then the utmost caution is a must.

I think you should also be mindful, going along with using the drug withdrawal to your benefit (in the greatest way possible), of what habits you are using to fill this void. If you find yourself smoking a lot more than usual, for instance, then maybe consciously try to mitigate this with a less harmful habit, or if you absolutely can't, then perhaps way the benefits and risks of this versus abilify. Interestingly enough, nicotine is supposed to be effective in treating schizophrenia and associated psychotic maladies. The patch might be useful as an alternative.

quite the lineup:
D2 partial Agonist
D4 receptors
5-HT1A partial agonist
5-HT2A antagonism
5-HT2C partial agonist
5-HT7 antagonism
Histamine (moderate affinity)
α-adrenergic

I imagine that 5-HT2A being up-regulated will make you a tad bit loopy, as it has me, while less agonistic activity at 5-HT1A and D2 might make you somewhat depressed and anxious (though they're only partial agonists). But who knows.

One last thing. If you keep having panic attacks and need something long-term, then abilify is a lot better of a medication to be on than the addictive, proven-to-be neurologically damaging and cognitively-dulling (not to mention obscenely addictive) gabaergics, and probably serotonin re-uptake inhibitors too, since they cause mania (associated with psychosis) more so than abilify, have been shown to be hardly better than placebo in many studies, blunt the mood in a hardly desirable way (even compared to anti-psychotics, and especially compared to abilify), and generally only work for a short period of time. But I'll be the first to say natural medicines are the best, and developing good habits is even better.

Anyways, hope this was of some help. I know I go off on a tangent here or there.

Peace

 

[It's a baby!]

No thanks so much for writing all that!

Yeah I'm definitely going off of them and I'll see how I do. I've withdrawn from alcohol before and I don't think anything can be worse than that. I'm prepared for a little loopiness, I used to love tripping after all. My psychiatrist is basically like "if you DO need medication it's not an antipsychotic" after having talked to him a lot. I don't have bipolar disorder, I'm really impulsive and like to abuse a lot of substances (which I have not done since may 18), it was the substance abuse (tons of psychedelics and synthetic cannabinoids) that turned "moody person" into "raving lunatic", haha. Or so I hope.

And there's no way I can stay on this med long-term, it's simply not affordable even for my parents. It's not covered by our insurance.

 

[Missykins]

And there's no way I can stay on this med long-term, it's simply not affordable even for my parents. It's not covered by our insurance.

Four yourself and others, the makers of Abilify have a patient-assistance program for individuals who cannot afford the medication. For the insured, there are free trials and reduced copays.

www.abilify.com

And if your insurance company denies coverage, ALWAYS appeal the decision. It might be something as simple as requiring prior authorization.

 

[JJJames]

so Messed up that the USA is the only developed nation on earth not to have healthcare free at the point of use.. Just can't understand it..

 

[It's a baby!]

Four yourself and others, the makers of Abilify have a patient-assistance program for individuals who cannot afford the medication. For the insured, there are free trials and reduced copays.

www.abilify.com

And if your insurance company denies coverage, ALWAYS appeal the decision. It might be something as simple as requiring prior authorization.

Thanks but yeah with our insurance you have to try Resperdal and Seroquel first and have both of them proven ineffective. But no worries I'll be off the damn stuff soon. It made me feel strange for a long time and now I feel perfectly normal on it, which is disturbing and just means my brain has adapted. It was only two or three days ago that the akathisia really started to go away.

Thanks a lot for the link though if worst comes to worst and I do need this med, that will be helpful. My psychiatrist is like "yeah these pills are expensive but it'd be stupid as hell to switch you to an older antipsychotic in the middle of treatment" and I agree with him on that for sure.

 

[mrflowers00]

i've never tapered anti-psychotics just jumped right off with no ill effects

 

[AlphaMethylPhenyl]

Glad to help. I just have to say I read what you said about drug use creating sociopaths and basically came to a positive epiphany about some of my past actions, which has in turn allowed me to forgive myself in some ways and re-formulate ideas of morality in relation to drug use. Thanks.

Do you mean you tried Risperdal and Seroquel and they don't work?

Risperdal was the first anti-psychotic that my psychiatrist put me on. He's a very highly regarded professional, and I was not surprised to find with research that risperidone has the least anti-chollinergism of any anti-psychotic with comparably negligible sedation and extra-pyramidal side effects. Its also indicated for extreme anxiety (go figure: major tranquilizer), which seems to have the effect (at least on me) of being a more serene but less socially acceptable (read: on the outside--risperdal may make me look mentally impaired when I am first around people but it allows me to care for others and build genuine trust not inhibited by Realpolitik, unlike the outgoing dis-ingenuousness of benzodiazepines) and in some ways less "potent" (but certainly less addictive) gabaergic. It kind of makes sense to use anti-psychotics for anxiety instead of benzos in that they directly inhibit areas where anxiety stems from instead of dis-inhibiting a nuerotransmitter that in turns inhibits said regions.

It sounds like you went through a lot of heavy duty drug use to achieve this psychotic state. I mean I experimented with a psychedelic over about three months, taking a decent amount every week, but even that slammed my mind into psychotic concrete from five hundred feet, though I always came pretty much down after my trips and only used cannabis sparingly at that time (granted, I was also taking Welbutrin). That you were also smoking a lot of synthetic cannabinoids makes it sort of amazing to me that you're not on a higher dose of Abilify.

 

[It's a baby!]

Glad to help. I just have to say I read what you said about drug use creating sociopaths and basically came to a positive epiphany about some of my past actions, which has in turn allowed me to forgive myself in some ways and re-formulate ideas of morality in relation to drug use. Thanks.

Do you mean you tried Risperdal and Seroquel and they don't work?

Nah just that I have to try them and have them not-work for my insurance to pay for the abilify. I'm glad you like my writing! I really love writing, sometimes I can be a blabber-mouth but I'm glad something I said had a positive impact on somebody! Drug use can just warp our value-systems, even something as benign as marijuana I'd hang out with people I didn't care for just because I knew we'd get to smoke (kind of hard to admit that but it's the truth), etc.

Risperdal was the first anti-psychotic that my psychiatrist put me on. He's a very highly regarded professional, and I was not surprised to find with research that risperidone has the least anti-chollinergism of any anti-psychotic with comparably negligible sedation and extra-pyramidal side effects. Its also indicated for extreme anxiety (go figure: major tranquilizer), which seems to have the effect (at least on me) of being a more serene but less socially acceptable (read: on the outside--risperdal may make me look mentally impaired when I am first around people but it allows me to care for others and build genuine trust not inhibited by Realpolitik, unlike the outgoing dis-ingenuousness of benzodiazepines) and in some ways less "potent" (but certainly less addictive) gabaergic. It kind of makes sense to use anti-psychotics for anxiety instead of benzos in that they directly inhibit areas where anxiety stems from instead of dis-inhibiting a nuerotransmitter that in turns inhibits said regions.

Interesting, I think if I were gonna need these long term I might actually prefer Resperdal, I've found abilify somewhat stimulating if anything and this messes with sleep etc. Or it used to, I've gotten very used to it over the past few days.

It sounds like you went through a lot of heavy duty drug use to achieve this psychotic state. I mean I experimented with a psychedelic over about three months, taking a decent amount every week, but even that slammed my mind into psychotic concrete from five hundred feet, though I always came pretty much down after my trips and only used cannabis sparingly at that time (granted, I was also taking Welbutrin). That you were also smoking a lot of synthetic cannabinoids makes it sort of amazing to me that you're not on a higher dose of Abilify.

Yeah I'm very lucky. When I was in the psych ward they thought I needed 20mg/day because my behavior was so odd to them (I'd walk around practicing my Greek by reading outloud from a Loeb and they thought I was talking nonsense to myself, etc., every behavior was pathologized). And on 5mg/day I was still experiencing some psychotic thought processes up until around mid-June. So all in all the worst of the psychosis lasted about a month and a half. These days I'm just dealing with generalized anxiety, which may be being increased by the abilify, so I just can't wait to get off it and experience truly sober living for the first time in a lonnnng time!

 

[It's a baby!]

Well I saw my doctor yesterday and we're going down to 2.5mg/day for the next couple of weeks, then down to zero.

Honestly I'm a bit annoyed with my psychiatrist. He just seems eager to diagnose me with something. I talked to him for all of 20 minutes and he's already thinking I'll need antidepressants, suggested I may have Bipolar Disorder, all that. I do definitely have an unstable mood and I can look over the course of my whole life and see that even as a child I had a tendency to fall into deep depressions. But I've never been Seriously Suicidal. And I might have anxiety problems but they don't prevent me from doing things, if anything I take joy in testing myself and doing things that scare me.

Robert Burton:

[F]rom these Melancholy Dispositions no man living is free, no Stoicke, none so wise, none so happy, so patient, so generous, so godly, so divine, that can vindicate himselfe, so well composed, but more or lesse, somtime or other, he feels the smart of it. "Man that is borne of a woman is of short continuance, and full of troble," (Job 1.14). Zeno, Cato, Socrates himself, whom Aelian so highly commends, for a moderate temper, that "nothing could disturbe him, but going out, and comming in, still Socrates kept the same countenance, what misery soever befell him," if wee may beleeve Plato his Disciple, was much tormented with it. etc. etc. etc.

Feelings of loneliness and sadness and boredom are part of the human condition. I no longer have any interest in taking drugs, legal or otherwise, to blot out a part of my soul. If I ever find myself awake for days or suicidal, sure I'll try medication. But the fact that this guy's barely spoken to me and is already thinking of diagnosing me with something or other is very disturbing.

I think the only way to avoid a diagnosis with a doctor like this is to say "I'm fine! No anxiety, no sadness, I'm cool as a cucumber!" (though not too quickly or with too much enthusiasm, that's "hypomania" you see).

Eh once again I am ranting and raving. I'm just glad to be getting off this shit, it made me feel unwell.