My Physiatrist told me previously that the max daily dosage typically prescribed for klonopin is 4mg. She recently started me on 5mg twice daily on diazepam, and said that it has much more leeway in the daily dosage amount (I realize 1mg of Valium equates to a .5 to 1mg of Klonopin). Does anyone know the dosage range of Valium? (I know the dosage range for benzos used for seizures are much higher, but can't find anything on anxiety dosages)
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BDD Moderators: Keif’ Richards
Therapeutic doses of klonopin and diazepam
- Thread starter JonVander
- Start date
NeighborhoodThreat
Bluelight Crew
Anxiety dosages for Klonopin (clonazepam) range anywhere from 0.5mg a day (I've even heard of 0.25mg a day) upwards of 4mg a day, usually spaced into twice daily dosing. 4mg clonazepam is a lot. Most conversion charts (like ours) will tell you that 0.5mg clonazepam is about equal to 10mg diazepam (Valium). There's a bit of variation from person to person though. However, if you go by that conversion, 4mg clonazepam = 80mg diazepam...or thereabouts. For some people, the conversion is closer to 1mg clonaz = 10mg diaz. I've heard of people being prescribed more diazepam (upwards of 100mg a day).
As far as anxiety doses of diazepam goes, it could be anywhere from 2.5mg to 10mg a day to start out with. Since you were at 4mg clonazepam, it's safe to say you're going to need upwards of 30-40mg diazepam. I'm not sure if a "ceiling dose" exists for prescriptions. As you mention, prescribed anti-seizure doses for diazepam and clonazepam will be higher. This is the norm for other benzos (such as lorazepam).
What prescription did he write you for diazepam? Are you planning on tapering down off clonazepam using diazepam or just maintaining on the diazepam? How long have you been on benzo therapy?
As far as anxiety doses of diazepam goes, it could be anywhere from 2.5mg to 10mg a day to start out with. Since you were at 4mg clonazepam, it's safe to say you're going to need upwards of 30-40mg diazepam. I'm not sure if a "ceiling dose" exists for prescriptions. As you mention, prescribed anti-seizure doses for diazepam and clonazepam will be higher. This is the norm for other benzos (such as lorazepam).
What prescription did he write you for diazepam? Are you planning on tapering down off clonazepam using diazepam or just maintaining on the diazepam? How long have you been on benzo therapy?
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NeuralFrequency
Greenlighter
Rule of thumb:
diazapam / (clonazepam or alprazolam) => 10 / 1
The usual UL for diazapam is ~20mg/day, for clonazepam and alprazolam it's ~2mg/day. Of coarse some find that they are more sensitive to some benzos than others.
diazapam / (clonazepam or alprazolam) => 10 / 1
The usual UL for diazapam is ~20mg/day, for clonazepam and alprazolam it's ~2mg/day. Of coarse some find that they are more sensitive to some benzos than others.
I've been on benzo treatment for about a month and a half. I'm not entirely sure why she switched me to the 5mg diazapam (twice daily as needed). I had expressed to her that while the klonopin was fine for my everyday anxiety issues, it wasn't really helping during an acute panic attack because by the time it kicked it my mind would already be so wound up that the klonopin would have minimal effect. I was hoping to supplement the klonopin with something fasting acting for these acute attacks, but she wants to try diazapam, because Xanax has too much potential for abuse. I mean Xanax isn't the only fast attacking benzo is it? And I believe all benzos have a high potential for abuse...
NeuralFrequency
Greenlighter
IME Lorazepam (Ativan) has the quickest onset. I take my clonazepam sublingualy to cut down on reaction time; however, they are still slower. Love the 40hr HL though. Diazepam is similar to clonazepam in that it's slower acting, but longer lasting. Seems silly to me not prescribe alprazelam, but prescribe diazepam, clonazepam, lorazepam etc.
^ Diazepam has a quicker onset than alprazolam due to it being lipophilic. Temazepam is the most rapidly absorbed benzo, according to several research papers though. Lorazepam is intermediate acting and generally takes quite sometime to peak.
NeighborhoodThreat
Bluelight Crew
I'd say lorazepam and diazepam (yes, yes, also alprazolam) are the most effective for panic issues, whereas clonazepam is better for more constant anxiety.
If I'm having a panic attack I would much rather have an Ativan or Valium at hand. YMMV, however. Best to find the benzo that works best for you.
If I'm having a panic attack I would much rather have an Ativan or Valium at hand. YMMV, however. Best to find the benzo that works best for you.
^ Bromazepam is another one that is superb for panic states. I'd say its better than lorazepam because it kicks in quicker than lorazepam does. Bromazepam is on par with diazepam for panic states and I think they are both slightly better than alprazolam.
Etizolam is a better for panic attacks than all of them. It is reported to be 6x more powerful as an anxiolytic than diazepam is.
Etizolam is a better for panic attacks than all of them. It is reported to be 6x more powerful as an anxiolytic than diazepam is.
NeighborhoodThreat
Bluelight Crew
^I agree. Etizolam is a wonderful middle ground between lorazepam and alprazolam (IMO), fast onset and powerful anxiolytic properties. The amnesia-inducing properties of etizolam seem to be stronger than alprazolam (again, in my experience).
Sadly it probably won't be FDA approved for prescription in the United States.
Sadly it probably won't be FDA approved for prescription in the United States.
Yes, etizolam is unmatched as an anxiolytic by any benzo on the US market. Lorazepam and alprazolam I'd rank equally effective for general anxiety, with diazepam slightly better than both. Bromazepam is as good as lorazepam and alprazolam for general anxiety but it's a bit better for a panic attack. Clonazepam is great for general anxiety (IMO better than lorazepam and alprazolam), but not so much for panic attacks. Diazepam is overall the best one of the bunch, IMO.
Agreed on diazepam being the best overall option out of what's written for in the US. It doesn't seem to leave the mental fog other benzos do either. Not sure how the foggy effects (sedative and hypnotic) are generally assessed compared to other benzos? I do know it makes a damn fine anxiolytic used as intended.
Maybe you have some insight on this kokaino?
Maybe you have some insight on this kokaino?
Well the group of hypnotic benzodiazepines (temazepam, triazolam, midazolam, lormetazepam, flunitrazepam, etc) have much higher activity at the alpha 1 subunit of the GABA(A) receptor. Modulation of this subunit produces sedation, motor-impairment, amnesia, ataxia, physical dependence, reinforcing behavior and other side effects. Most hypnotics are compared against each other in research studies to find out which ones are more sedative, toxic, more likely to cause amnesia, etc. For example, go here to read "Temazepam or midazolam for night sedation. A double-blind study."
I got more studies comparing hypnotics I can send you.
For sure, I'd love to read them when I have the time. A very interesting subject and great knowledge to have.
Tried to PM this to you but you were out of room for msgs. Just PM me back when you get the chance.
Okay I'll PM you some studies comparing various benzos.
NeuralFrequency
Greenlighter
Agreed, one reason I like clonazepam is that it seems to have more PNS sedataion to go along with benzos general CNS effects IME. Again, I'm only speaking anicdotaly here, but I would say if you like heady Sativas go with Lorazepam, if you prefer a heavy Indica try Clonazepam. My experience with diazapam is hard to rate as it was just pure powder, not pills.
See just personally I have to say I find benzos to be nothing at all like pot. Marijuana of any type seems only to worsen my anxiety. I do know a couple friends though who are anxious and seem to think it helps a good deal.
Perhaps it just comes down to an issue of brain chemistry, I'm not sure?
Perhaps it just comes down to an issue of brain chemistry, I'm not sure?