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Bupe This New Year is "Going to be a nightmare." Says my sub doc.

dhopeless

dhopeless

Bluelighter
Joined
Mar 12, 2010
Messages
154
Location
East Coast, United States
Over the past 6 months, it seems every month when I go to my sub appointment to get my subutex there is a new notice on the wall of some new rule. No more early refills under circumstances (even if stolen&I have a police report), everyone with certain insurance providers must switch to film strips, pill counts at every appointment, maximum of 2 tablets per day...it goes on and on. My doctor almost made me switch to suboxone but I freaked out at him and reminded him that I can't take that crap and luckily he agreed to give it to me, provided I cut down from 3 to 2 tablets a day. My doctor has always been very lax and never did anything like pill counts before. He had to attend a conference where they informed doctors of the evils of subutex and then was visited by a representative of Reckitt who told him that they're company is trying to completely do a way with subutex. My doctor's secretary told us that this new year is "Going to be a nightmare for us." Has anyone else been affected by these regulations? I'm in the US but I'd be interested to hear if this is happening in other countries as well.

I think that this is not happening because of abuse or diversion, but because of money. Follow the money...Reckit has STOPPED MAKING subutex...and it is now only made by other companies as a generic, so of course they don't want to see it prescribed, as they loose money. Also the patent for suboxone expired in '09 but I hear that there will be no generic available anyway? I'm not sure why..

Please share your recent experiences with tightening regulations and thoughts on the subject as well as what you think will happen as a result.
 
that's insane, but i've been hearing things like this for a while. My doctor once said she was worried that they would stop making suboxone a take home prescription... I dont know though, there should be some kind of action to put R&B down. If I got subutex i would save so much fucking money.
 
I would if it wasn't my mother who's been paying for my appointments and believes everything out of a doctors mouth, especially in regard to subutex
 
laCster said:
find a new doctor
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^ This. Sometimes you will have to see a few doctors before one that understands recreational drug use and its after effects and is sympathetic. If a doctor wants to get you a drug, even if a certain pharmaceutical company has stopped making it, there will be a ways they can get round this. Doctors are not held hostage by Pharma as much as people make out.
 
Damn OP "New Year is gonna be hell" what kind of unproffesional bullshit is that? I agree with the other posters its a free market system find a new doctor cause as far as I know the DEA hasnt changed the regulations on suboxone prescribing.
 
R&B is in a unique position. They literally have market control with Suboxone because the 4:1 bupe to naloxone delivery system is proving difficult to make generically. Not only that, but the demand for bupe maintenance is astronomical. R&B is going to try to milk this for everything they can, and forcing doctor's hands to Suboxone is clearly beneficial to their interests.
 
I wonder if this will lead to Docs handing out scripts for Butrans patches instead to avoid some of the red tape. They're not as potent, but using the pain management type bupe Rx has gotten me around having to see a Sub doc and go through the whole program.

First time I tried to get on subs, the doc wanted me to commit to group therapy, meeting with him every week, and a bunch of other stuff that I wasn't going to do/couldn't afford. So I saw another doc and talked to him about bupe for chronic pain, which I do have. The patches did nothing for pain, but did keep me off other opiates.

I'm not encouraging anybody to lie to their docs or telling anyone how to score, but maybe just ask your doc if a taking the pain management type bupe drugs would be easier for all parties involved.
 
obscure said:
I wonder if this will lead to Docs handing out scripts for Butrans patches instead to avoid some of the red tape. They're not as potent, but using the pain management type bupe Rx has gotten me around having to see a Sub doc and go through the whole program.

First time I tried to get on subs, the doc wanted me to commit to group therapy, meeting with him every week, and a bunch of other stuff that I wasn't going to do/couldn't afford. So I saw another doc and talked to him about bupe for chronic pain, which I do have. The patches did nothing for pain, but did keep me off other opiates.

I'm not encouraging anybody to lie to their docs or telling anyone how to score, but maybe just ask your doc if a taking the pain management type bupe drugs would be easier for all parties involved.
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Yes, I take my Subutex for chronic back pain and my doctor did hand me a pamphlet for butrans. The dose is simply too low though. I really don't think that R&B will be able to get rid of Subutex entirely, and so far my doctor has not said he has a problem continuing prescribing it to me, but he did say something like 'in the event you couldn't get Subutex there is Butrans...' I've been with this doctor for years now and really don't want to find a new doctor. i'm pretty confident that he will keep giving it to me, but this month when I filled it was hard to find a pharmacy that had it in stock. The pharmacist told me that Teva is currently not producing their subutex and it was on backorder, luckily my friend and I got the last Teva's around....I much prefer those. I don't know what's going on with Roxane but I really hope Teva doesn't stop making them because I like the Teva's much better.
 
So I recently went back to the sub doc(relapse) and while at his office nothing was different except he was only willing to script the sub strips b/c they are less "abusable". When I went to get it filled, however, the pharmacy told me that my insurance doesn't cover suboxone anymore. Its like wtf. i dont know what I am going to do b/c without insurance sub is hella expensive. Fucking eh ill have to see if the doc will script generic subutex if the doc allows it hopefully my insurance will cover it. if not wtf will i do fucking get clodiodne (sp) and ambien and rough it out.
 
thebay420 said:
So I recently went back to the sub doc(relapse) and while at his office nothing was different except he was only willing to script the sub strips b/c they are less "abusable". When I went to get it filled, however, the pharmacy told me that my insurance doesn't cover suboxone anymore. Its like wtf. i dont know what I am going to do b/c without insurance sub is hella expensive. Fucking eh ill have to see if the doc will script generic subutex if the doc allows it hopefully my insurance will cover it. if not wtf will i do fucking get clodiodne (sp) and ambien and rough it out.
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A friend of mine recently got prescribed tex because he couldn't afford the strips. His mother was paying for it and he told the doctor that his mom was angry that she had to pay more for the strips which make him feel like shit when she could pay less for subutex which makes him feel better, and it worked. Give it a try.
 
If taken as prescribed under the tongue there is no difference between the subutex and suboxone as the naloxone is not absorbed that way. It's done that for a reason so people won't iv it.
 
Tekloc said:
If taken as prescribed under the tongue there is no difference between the subutex and suboxone as the naloxone is not absorbed that way. It's done that for a reason so people won't iv it.
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Naloxone and bupe, suboxone, can be injected just as easily as just bupe.
Bupe us stronger than naloxone and so N had no practical purpose whatsoever, though it may delay the onset of bupes effects by a few minutes.

Suboxone is just a scam by the drug company, because it's harder to make as a generic.

Here in Australia subs are NOT prescription, they are just like methadone, you must attend the pharmacy or clinic everyday to dose in front of the retarded fucks who I want to punch their heads in.
Except the weekends, where the shop is closed, so on Friday they give out two extra doses to take home.

They drive a guy back to heroin with their retarded behaviors and by making the drug program difficult and inconvenient.
 
Hate to hear that "supposed" medical professionals still try to pull this. I run a State Licensed Alcohol Drug Outpatient treatment center and have put many programs together over the years, and I really get pissed at the physicians that pay more attention to the pharmaceutical reps than they do the needs of their patients. Being an intractable pain patient myself I can tell you there are few viable options. BUT.....in California when Physicians started to pull things like this it took some cancer patients to call their bluff. I often make the call and the physicians are none too happy.
I ask for their malpractice carrier, and policy number. Yeah, we all have to carry this in the USA and it is not cheap. They all know that just filing a claim, even if it does not get followed through, will usually up their malpractice insurance by an average of $34K per year. Sure I burn bridges, but there is not much I won't do if it helps my clients.

Try to call around and I would start with the pharmacists as they are usually up on what physicians are there to help!

This is why India and China have seen their pharmaceutical industries grow 1,000 % per year... not that I promote buying overseas...
 
My pharmacist people are far worse than my doctor.

My doctor is just an uninformed backwater type, but he try's to help.

The pharmacist who dose me treat me ignorantly, let me wait for up to an hour for my dose instead of treating me like a customer (I pay them) examine my mouth to make sure there's no film left when I leave, and talk to me like I'm a piece of dog shit.

What's really funny is that it was easier to purchase 2 packets of codeine off them a day, back when I was starting out on opiates, than it is for them to treat me for the addiction they gave me.
 
Tekloc said:
If taken as prescribed under the tongue there is no difference between the subutex and suboxone as the naloxone is not absorbed that way. It's done that for a reason so people won't iv it.
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Which is quite ironic seeing as I zero problem IV'ing either one. When Suboxone is is IV'ed, the buprenorphine beats out the naloxone in competition for the opiate receptor sites as the bupe has a higher binding affinity. Rekitt's move to add naloxone to buprenorphine years ago was political/business move that allowed the company to repackage it under the name Suboxone and renew their patent. This was strictly a business move, and serves no real medical purpose.

I have IV'ed all forms of Suboxone and Subutex, and other than that nasty orange taste they all work relatively equally as well. I will say that it seems that the film doesn't carry all the fillers and binders of the pill forms however, some people report getting headaches from the added naloxone.

WP
 
Yep - when I went back to my Suboxone doc, he said DEA's been cracking down on Sub docs big time. He said he had to urine test me at every appointment (to make sure I've taken Sub & no other drugs) which I'd never had to before... in addition to other stricter regulations. This is ridiculous... if anything, they should make it EASIER for people to access Sub, not harder. So, so fucking stupid.
 
Wesley_pipes_27 said:
Which is quite ironic seeing as I zero problem IV'ing either one. When Suboxone is is IV'ed, the buprenorphine beats out the naloxone in competition for the opiate receptor sites as the bupe has a higher binding affinity. Rekitt's move to add naloxone to buprenorphine years ago was political/business move that allowed the company to repackage it under the name Suboxone and renew their patent. This was strictly a business move, and serves no real medical purpose.

I have IV'ed all forms of Suboxone and Subutex, and other than that nasty orange taste they all work relatively equally as well. I will say that it seems that the film doesn't carry all the fillers and binders of the pill forms however, some people report getting headaches from the added naloxone.

WP
Click to expand...

Couldn't have said this better myself.
 
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