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  • TDS Moderators: AlphaMethylPhenyl | Eligiu | deficiT | paranoid android

Zanex help question

So I'm at the ER. I'm being treated very well . I got an IV and they gave me fluids and Ativan and something for nausea.
Gonna get Librium to take home.
Apparently, because I was drinking while coming off of the benzos, something called kindling came to effect and now basically I ruined drinking for myself. A fellow bluelighter told me this. He says that now if I drink one night , I will go into WD . He says it lessons with time but doesn't go away.
This has all been a shit storm.
I drank to curb benzo WD . Now I ruined drinking for the rest of my life. Wow.
It has to be this kindling thing because I only drank for two weeks while coming off the zanex and I got dependant on it in that short time. That is crazy . Unreal.
But at Least now I have a chance for a clean slate .
I can't go on drinking like this....
 
How are things going, yompf?

I would think that proper nutrition might really benefit you and help you recover. I would think that you are experiencing low levels of neurotransmitters related to your drug use. The body turns amino acids into neurotransmitters, so if your diet is lacking then your body will not be able to recover as fast.

Here is a link that briefly explains how the process of converting amino acids into neurotransmitters.
http://www.neurogenesis-inc.com/science_resources.aspx

Aerobic exercise is also linked to neurogenesis, but I would think you should be careful if you are going through alcohol/benzo WDs. Light exercise like walking would probably be beneficial, just be sure to stay hydrated.
 
Ok wait. I got 10 1 mg ativans.
Am I supposed to taper these or can I eat two a day for 5 days and be cured?
 
According to Dr. Phyllis Grable's Alcohol Withdrawal Protocol using Ativan:

http://www.divisiononaddiction.org/html/handouts/wartemberg_web.pdf

Day 3: Begin slow taper of Ativan dose, usually
no more than 15-20% per day. If frequent prn
doses needed, consider stopping taper, raising
dose, achieving stability, resuming at slower rate
Click to expand...

He recommends to start tapering on day 3 by 15-20% per day. Since you have 10 1mg pills you could take 2 pills a day for the first 3 days then start cutting the pills to lower the dosage. It's going to be tricky to reduce the dosage by 15-20% and get the exact taper he recommends with what you got. Doesn't have to be an exact science though. You can cut the pills in half and in quarters. The following taper is a close approximation to what Dr. Phyllis Grable recommends that can be accomplished with what you got.

Day 1-3: take 1 mg x 2 (2 mg per day)
Day 4 take 0.5 mg x 3 (1.5 mg total)
Day 5 take 0.5 mg x 2 (1 mg total)
Day 6 take 0.25 mg x 3 (0.75 mg total)
Day 7 take 0.25 mg x 2 (0.5 mg total)
Day 8 take 0.25 mg x 1 (0.25 mg total)
 
levels said:
According to Dr. Phyllis Grable's Alcohol Withdrawal Protocol using Ativan:

http://www.divisiononaddiction.org/html/handouts/wartemberg_web.pdf



Doesn't have to be an exact science though. You can cut the pills in half and in quarters. The following taper is a close approximation to what Dr. Phyllis Grable recommends that can be accomplished with what you got.

Day 1-3: take 1 mg x 2 (2 mg per day)
Day 4 take 0.5 mg x 3 (1.5 mg total)
Day 5 take 0.5 mg x 2 (1 mg total)
Day 6 take 0.25 mg x 3 (0.75 mg total)
Day 7 take 0.25 mg x 2 (0.5 mg total)
Day 8 take 0.25 mg x 1 (0.25 mg total)
Click to expand...
^^^ THIS!!! Write it down on places you can see and remember what day you're on. Your mirror or wherever you get your meds. Maybe divide/cut them and use a medicine case with the day to organize them. You CAN DO THIS!! Please keep in touch here and let us know how you are doing.
 
Thanks guys... Well I'm on day 4. It's wed. Sun I went in to the ER. I didn't drink that day. They gave me Ativan there. So the next day I started with my take home. I took 1 mg every 6 hours . Mon and Tues. I hoped I'd be ok with just 2 a day but when the 2nd dose wore off I started freaking out getting nausea and sleep wasn't exactly on the menu.
So i ended up eating a 3 quarters both nights...
Today I am at work. I wasn't exactly sober last night... I did some whippits and.... I shot up H. It was cut with fentanyl.
I was just in one of those moods...
Anyway... I'm pretty tired and probably deppressed because of that.
So anyway...I feel like crap. I just ate a half mg... I hope this is enough...
I'm counting this as day 4 because I have not drank anything in 4 days. But this is day 3 with the take home...
Is this right? Or should I eat 1 mg instead of a half??
 
It sounds like you are experiencing poly drug WDs, I don't think your problem is just one substance. You will never really level out if you don't give yourself time with no drug use. Certain drugs like benzos can help with things like alcohol WD, but if you are using other drugs then you are creating bigger problems for yourself.

The smart thing to do would be to start to taper off of the Ativan, you don't want to set off benzo WDs on top of everything else.
 
It's not poly drug withdrawls.
Not anymore. First was opiates and benzos. I got those that over with .
I was drinking to ease the benzo withdrawal,and I accidentally got dependant on it. @Levels , you explained that happened so fast because of something called "kindling "?
So either way , whatever reason ,when I stopped , I experienced alcohol withdrawals.
I went to the ER, They gave me a benzo to get through that.
Back and forth. Wtf.
I haven't drank for 5 days. Been on Ativan for 4 days. Tapering yes. Today I ate .5 but there was no way I could do 2 mg a day the first few days. So anyway I'm ok on .5 right now.
It's not poly WD. It's ONLY Alcohol withdrawl at this point.
I did the Heroine at night when the Ativan wore off and I started freaking out and wasn't thinking straight. I should of ate more ativan sooner .idk. Oh well. I did it . But I'm NOT gonna relapse into THAT.
If I end up having trouble with the Ativan I'm going to bang my head against something really freaking hard. They gave me ten. They are almost gone.
I better be ok because they told me to take .5-1mg every 6 hours... They said nothing about a taper.
Thank you levels for the taper plan , I messed it up but I'm gonna try to follow out.
 
Here's the wikipedia page on kindling

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kindling_(sedative%E2%80%93hypnotic_withdrawal)

Kindling due to substance withdrawal refers to the neurological condition which results from repeated withdrawal episodes from sedative–hypnotic drugs such as alcohol and benzodiazepines. Each withdrawal leads to more severe withdrawal symptoms than the previous withdrawal syndrome. Individuals who have had more withdrawal episodes are at an increased risk of very severe withdrawal symptoms, up to and including seizures, and death.
Click to expand...

I have a history of abusing alcohol. Mostly binge drinking when I was younger. Then later in my mid twenties I started drinking daily, like a six pack a day and occasionally much more on weekends when I partied. My drink slowly progressed and finally, when I fell into a deep depression, I started drinking with abandon. Worked my way up to 24-30 light beers a day toward the end. I kept this up for about 3 years. I quit a few times cold turkey during this time without significant withdrawal symptoms. Finally, I started to develop a light tremor and hightened pyscho-emotional discomfort when I attempted quitting. Eventually I had to start treating the withdrawal symptoms with a benzo taper to get sober more comfortably and to interrupt the progression of kindling that was changing my neurochemistry. I wish I had learned this sooner. The stress I put my body through those several times I attempted to quit alcohol without a taper set me up to experience withdrawal symptoms later in life. Now if I drink (I haven't drank in years) I rather quickly go into withdrawal. That's my own experience with kindling. Honestly, I don't give a fuck about the kindling anymore. I have no intention of ever drinking again. The kindling gives me a reason not to drink. There was a time however when I lacked the willpower to quit drinking and that's when the withdrawals really sucked and I wish I had taken care to avoid triggering it by being gentle on myself.

In my case it took many years of abusing alcohol (starting at 15 and ending in my early 30's) with many attempts to quit along the way, stretches of sobriety and relapses to begin to develop withdrawal symptoms. Reading what I have about your situation it is surprising that you developed withdrawal symptoms so quickly. It's not unheard of from what I gather though. I guess people should heed that as a warning against mixing benzos and alcohol, as it can precipitate kindling more rapidly.

So anyways, you definitely want to taper the benzo's so glad the schedule was helpful. I'm surprised the doctors didn't tell you that. Maybe they assumed you knew already or that the pharmacist would give you instructions. You really want to get this over with and not mess around too much. Don't get hooked on benzos cause alcohol withdrawals are relatively easy compared to benzo withdrawals. That's a special kind of hell. Maybe get some valerian tea of take a sleeping aid at night. Stay hydrated and take a multi-vitamin but brave through it. Withdrawal is never fun so don't expect this to be easy, but you can get through this. If your heart rate is elevated and you develop tremors you might not have been given enough medication. Get serious about this and don't mess around with heroin. Look forward to seeing you on the other side of this situation. Cheers
 
yea so kickin a 3 week h binge, esp. iv, is a motherfucker. take lots of xanex and ketamine (if u can afford it), for 5 days. taper if you want or just suck it up and stop xanax all together on day 6 after last h shot. day 7 suck it up no xanax, and drink a sixpack when you get home. do that for a few more days, and ur good. also, make sure you dont run out of weed through this process. the harder the h habit, the higher the xanax dosage. also, ive heard pcp makes you forget your kicking (ketamine gets you part way there), so maybe try that i have not.
 
Thank you levels. Ya I'm not messing with the H anymore. You are right I should get more serious about this .. thank you.
So I'm doing fine , a little behind on the taper but I'm going down to .25 3x today. We will see how it pans out. Haven't drank in 6 days . The worst should be over I think. I hope . Yesterday I ate less ativan , 1 mg total that day , and just had some dry heaves. Mentally I was OK. I wasn't freaking out like was or would of been if it had been a couple days before and I tried that dose.
Ya the doctor said to eat .5 -1mg every 6 hours. She gave me ten.
@ evilbrain. Thank you for trying to help.
I wasn't on a 3 week h binge though. I was on a two week zanex and Norco binge. Then I got dependant on alcohol kicking the zanex , now I'm dealing with that. For the Norco WD I just ate tramadol and drank water. That's all over now.
 
Good job on the taper, definitely stay away from the alcohol while tapering benzos.

You should be off of the ativans soon or ask if you can get a longer acting benzo like 0.5mg klonopin to help you jump off.

Best of luck
 
Yompf, you are doin it!!! 6 days is awesome...the first steps out of hell are the worst. So proud of ya and keep moving forward. Kickass!!
 
thank you everyone :) yes I think Im about done. Taking my last dose today. Don't think I need it but to counter the kindling effect I think I better.
That was a real shit storm I just went through. I could of lost my job , drinking like that. Well... Here's to a good day and a clean slate ...
 
Good work yompf! It takes some fortitude to get through something like that. I hope you feel somewhat better, and please try to remember, it's never worth the short-term escapism that you get from a period of drug abuse to have to deal with the repercussions of that binge.
 
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