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Yahweh and Allah. Are they moral and ethical Gods?

Gnostic Bishop

Gnostic Bishop

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Yahweh and Allah. Are they moral and ethical Gods?

Some say we cannot say or know, because it is all myth.

http://bigthink.com/videos/what-is-god-2-2

I think they are wrong as men can judge actions.

I think we can atleast know if Yahweh and Allah, and the religions they spawned, are good orevil.

Since God is a Man interpreting God’s words, believers allfollowing a Man.

We invent our Gods and put them above us. But ultimately getall we know of God, and his morality from others around us. Priests and imamsinterpret and are the spokes in the religious communication network. Those priestsand imams are teaching violence against their neighbor instead of love. I donot see that as ethical behavior for any moral religion.

From what you know of Yahweh and Allah, and the religionsthey have spawned, would you say that those two War loving Gods, as we alsolove it in their image, good Gods, or would you say they are something else?

Regards
DL
 
Not in my opinion. If they were the perfect set of moral principals, we wouldn't have felt the need to come up with a different system of ethics like secular humanism.

Killing in the name of any speculative deity is already a big nono.
 
From what you know of Yahweh and Allah, and the religionsthey have spawned, would you say that those two War loving Gods, as we alsolove it in their image, good Gods, or would you say they are something else?
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Yahweh and Allah are poor excuses for a god assuming their respective texts represent them with any fidelity. I'm not in a position to comment really cause I haven't read the Old Testament or Koran, but from what I've seen quoted these gods have lousy personalities. I am happy to call them the demiurge, as a concept it suits me just fine and reconciles my own perspective on God with those of more fundamentalist types.

I came across this account of Robert Morning Sky today from the Hopi and Apache traditions. These traditions describe a race of beings who knew no limitations, who existed far outside this physical universe.

"One day one of them declared his intention to visit Earth and take on a body just for the adventure of it, for the experience. His friends cautioned him, as this universe had a reputation as amnesia-producing, a place of no return.

But the entity laughed that off and promised to come back after one lifetime.

Centuries passed, and the entity never came home. One of his comrades decided to enter the physical world to go look for his friend. He promised not to get lost in matter and to return with the other individual. More centuries passed, and neither being returned.

So another immortal entered physical mass, and he also never came back.

In time many members of these unlimited beings incarnated in human form, and the story goes, none of them yet has gone home."

Anyways, it's interesting to see these that traditions developed narratives consistent with the demiurge. There are certain realities about Earth, like our finiteness, our need to devour each other to survive, and having the odds stacked against us in terms of doing justice to the gift of life that are inconsistent with the potential inherent in consciousness. So yeah, those gods aren't going to get my praise.
 
Nixiam said:
Not in my opinion. If they were the perfect set of moral principals, we wouldn't have felt the need to come up with a different system of ethics like secular humanism.

Killing in the name of any speculative deity is already a big nono.
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I wrote this to another on how religions are basically forcing you and I to fund their wars.

==========

Secular law has bested Yahweh and Allah and all the oldGods, --- in terms of law and morality, --- and the honorable thing for Yahwehand Allah to do, --- is accept defeat gracefully. Instead, Christians andMuslims murder each other for their imaginary Gods, while secular tax payerspay in lives and support.

If Christians and Muslims cannot accept that their creedsare basically worthless, --- in terms of law and morality, then peace willnever be had between East and West. Christians and Muslims must recognize where their creeds have becomecorrupted and purge themselves of those theological flaws.

Secular people are not happy about all the religiousconflicts that are costing so many lives and other valuable resources thatcould be better used for peace instead of war. Religions are forcing secularstates into wars and that is not what religions were invented to do.
========

You and I, as tax payers, are funding the fighting and killing for religions with out tax dollars.

Regards
DL
 
levelsBeyond said:
Yahweh and Allah are poor excuses for a god assuming their respective texts represent them with any fidelity. I'm not in a position to comment really cause I haven't read the Old Testament or Koran, but from what I've seen quoted these gods have lousy personalities. I am happy to call them the demiurge, as a concept it suits me just fine and reconciles my own perspective on God with those of more fundamentalist types.

I came across this account of Robert Morning Sky today from the Hopi and Apache traditions. These traditions describe a race of beings who knew no limitations, who existed far outside this physical universe.

"One day one of them declared his intention to visit Earth and take on a body just for the adventure of it, for the experience. His friends cautioned him, as this universe had a reputation as amnesia-producing, a place of no return.

But the entity laughed that off and promised to come back after one lifetime.

Centuries passed, and the entity never came home. One of his comrades decided to enter the physical world to go look for his friend. He promised not to get lost in matter and to return with the other individual. More centuries passed, and neither being returned.

So another immortal entered physical mass, and he also never came back.

In time many members of these unlimited beings incarnated in human form, and the story goes, none of them yet has gone home."

Anyways, it's interesting to see these that traditions developed narratives consistent with the demiurge. There are certain realities about Earth, like our finiteness, our need to devour each other to survive, and having the odds stacked against us in terms of doing justice to the gift of life that are inconsistent with the potential inherent in consciousness. So yeah, those gods aren't going to get my praise.
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Well put. Thanks.

Regards
DL
 
Well, I don't pay taxes quite yet, but I get the point.

Nice declaration that we are funding resource draining wars though, I completely agree.
 
A fuck of a lot of evil have been done in the name of these two religions. One would be very suspect intelligence and rationality wise to make a case that these gods are about love.
 
Yahweh is a pretty capricious god and most of the other gods don't like him.

Besides, there are nicer ones. Worshiping yahweh has too many rules, not to mention the routine flogging.
 
I think this passage from Numbers 31:7-18, regarding Yahweh's seeming endorsement of the wholesale slaughter of women and little boys -- and sexual enslavement of little girls -- is telling. This is how you attracted men interested in maximizing copies of their genes to your army in the ancient world:

7 They warred against Midian, as the Lord commanded Moses, and killed every male. 8 They killed the kings of Midian with the rest of their slain, Evi, Rekem, Zur, Hur, and Reba, the five kings of Midian. And they also killed Balaam the son of Beor with the sword. 9 And the people of Israel took captive the women of Midian and their little ones, and they took as plunder all their cattle, their flocks, and all their goods. 10 All their cities in the places where they lived, and all their encampments, they burned with fire, 11 and took all the spoil and all the plunder, both of man and of beast. 12 Then they brought the captives and the plunder and the spoil to Moses, and to Eleazar the priest, and to the congregation of the people of Israel, at the camp on the plains of Moab by the Jordan at Jericho.

13 Moses and Eleazar the priest and all the chiefs of the congregation went to meet them outside the camp. 14 And Moses was angry with the officers of the army, the commanders of thousands and the commanders of hundreds, who had come from service in the war. 15 Moses said to them, “Have you let all the women live? 16 Behold, these, on Balaam’s advice, caused the people of Israel to act treacherously against the Lord in the incident of Peor, and so the plague came among the congregation of the Lord. 17 Now therefore, kill every male among the little ones, and kill every woman who has known man by lying with him. 18 But all the young girls who have not known man by lying with him keep alive for yourselves.
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It's too bad us western and european folk got saddled with middle eastern religion. You'd a think we'd have come up with something original. It's just so lame IMO.
 
I think this passage from Numbers 31:7-18, regarding Yahweh's seeming endorsement of the wholesale slaughter of women and little boys -- and sexual enslavement of little girls -- is telling. This is how you attracted men interested in maximizing copies of their genes to your army in the ancient world
Click to expand...

Yeah, that's messed up, pretty sure that ain't moral. I found the following quote, where Yahweh is all like stream of consciousness about fuckin up some sinners. By the time he's done with em they're eating their own kids.


“And if ye walk contrary unto me, and will not hearken unto me; I will bring seven times more plagues upon you according to your sins. I will also send wild beasts among you, which shall rob you of your children, and destroy your cattle, and make you few in number; and your highways shall be desolate. …And when I have broken the staff of your bread, ten women shall bake your bread in one oven, and they shall deliver you your bread again by weight: and ye shall eat, and not be satisfied. And if ye will not for all this hearken unto me, but walk contrary unto me; Then I will walk contrary unto you also in fury; and I, even I, will chastise you seven times for your sins. And ye shall eat the flesh of your sons, and the flesh of your daughters shall ye eat.”
(Lev 26:21-29)
 
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if you can discuss about how "god" is, then what does that really say to you about the concept of "god"?
 
Bagseed said:
if you can discuss about how "god" is, then what does that really say to you about the concept of "god"?
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It's a rhetorical question, but it says the concept of god is limited. I suppose it suits some people to define god in such a way, and then we get into semantics if we argue with them, but defining god as a subset of the totality of existence makes no sense to me. A mere mortal such as myself could than take that definition of god, add something to it and come up with god 2.0 which is bigger than the original and makes your god embarrassingly inadequate. God as I chose to understand it is transcendent. It's certainly isn't encapsulated in a concept that is reducible.
 
First of all, Yahweh and Allah both refer to the same God, because both religions believe in one God and because prophet Muhammed (pbuh) declared himself the last and final messanger, without dismissing the other messengers!

Second of all, the concept of God, or, "creator", is idiotic. Only an idiotic mind can come up with something like this, that "God" created the world. If God created the world, then who created God, IF! We are to talk about CREATION, who created creation? Creation. Creation created creation!

And instead of noticing that fact, we wonder off making up some bullshit story about a policeman in the sky, who created the sky and who watched you...every time you get a blowjob...if you enjoy it too much, or if you slide it too deep...God gets mad.

Also, sūrat l-shūrā (42:11) takes care of your question about Allah's mortality, saying no attributes of this world apply to Allah, except their "list" like the most merciful, etc. lol and you have to say "the most" because if you just say merciful it's blasphemy to the Muslim community. LOL!

:)
 
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Allah being what muslims call God. We are only permitted to act in violence if someone goes against us first or intends to harm us. We are not even permitted to try to force islam on people who do not listen. Was catholic 21 years and converted and have read the Quaran three times almost now threw. It has multiple scientific facts listed that were delivered to Muhammed 2000 years ago that only our top scientists are learning in this generation. He created the jews, they were repeatedly disobedient, then the gospel, Christians were disobedient. His final word was the Quaran and he will send no more messages until jesus second coming against the anti christ. Proud muslim .
 
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