Health Why do I feel full-body unease/restlessness with mushrooms but not with LSD?

[ninjapirateroberts]

I mean technically all psychedelics are toxic.
The way I see it is that all psychedelics have the potential to be toxic, but I wouldn't consider them toxins at recreational dosages.

But I think with mushrooms, we are not ingesting the active substance psilocybin, but rather a fungus. Maybe the symptoms would not occur if we ingest the active drug psilocybin in form of a capsule that is isolated from Psilocybe cubensis, instead of ingesting the Psilocybe cubensis itself (which is a fungus and thus is a "poison" to the system). But since LSD is taken sublingually and doesn't go through the GI tract, it wasn't considered "poison" by the system therefore, the effects are more directed towards target receptors in the brain.

I think this is what @Foreigner meant by "toxic".

 

[swilow]

'The dose makes the poison'.

 

[Phobos]

But I think with mushrooms, we are not ingesting the active substance psilocybin, but rather a fungus. Maybe the symptoms would not occur if we ingest the active drug psilocybin in form a capsule that is isolated from Psilocybe cubensis, instead of ingesting the Psilocybe cubensis itself (which is a fungus and thus is a "poison" to the system). But since LSD is taken sublingually and doesn't go through the GI tract, it wasn't considered "poison" by the system therefore, the effects are directed towards target receptors in the brain.

I think this is what @Foreigner meant by "toxic".

I have taken 4 Aco DMT, which I find to be basically undistinguishable from shrooms in effects, and there is almost literally no body load for me, but then again also Mushroom tea has very minimal stomach issues for me.
Chewing dried shrooms gives me a bit of stomach tension and a hint of nausea but it quickly goes away.

But yes as I said before I think (personal experience and many reports) a significant amount of stomach discomfort can be caused by the mushrooms rather than coming from the psychoactive, but I think that the psychoactive greatly potentiates the nausea once you get it.

 

[Cheshire_Kat]

But I think with mushrooms, we are not ingesting the active substance psilocybin, but rather a fungus. Maybe the symptoms would not occur if we ingest the active drug psilocybin in form a capsule that is isolated from Psilocybe cubensis, instead of ingesting the Psilocybe cubensis itself (which is a fungus and thus is a "poison" to the system). But since LSD is taken sublingually and doesn't go through the GI tract, it wasn't considered "poison" by the system therefore, the effects are directed towards target receptors in the brain.

I think this is what @Foreigner meant by "toxic".

I've been taking LSD for decades and always swallowed it as did everyone I know so I think you making quite an assumption saying it is taken sublingually.
It can be taken that way but it not taken that way exclusively.

That being said I have always noticed more of a full body load with mushroom the way you described.

 

[swilow]

But I think with mushrooms, we are not ingesting the active substance psilocybin, but rather a fungus. Maybe the symptoms would not occur if we ingest the active drug psilocybin in form of a capsule that is isolated from Psilocybe cubensis, instead of ingesting the Psilocybe cubensis itself (which is a fungus and thus is a "poison" to the system). But since LSD is taken sublingually and doesn't go through the GI tract, it wasn't considered "poison" by the system therefore, the effects are more directed towards target receptors in the brain.

I think this is what @Foreigner meant by "toxic".

Serotonin receptors are found throughout the body. Body load on psyches isn't really a function of ROA ime, or not entirely at least. But certainly, nausea seems in part to be related to consumption of indigestible plant/fungus material. Try eating cactus for a real gastric nightmare

 

[ninjapirateroberts]

I've been taking LSD for decades and always swallowed it as did everyone I know so I think you making quite an assumption saying it is taken sublingually.
It can be taken that way but it not taken that way exclusively.

That being said I have always noticed more of a full body load with mushroom the way you described.

Interesting. I used to believe that since LSD is such a fragile molecule, stomach HCL would destroy it. But I guess it seems like oral and sublingual have the same bioavailability (at least I can only find this post from a Reddit user). So it's just the difference in onset.

I always thought I was destroying LSD by swallowing tabs prematurely within 10 minutes lol.

 

[ninjapirateroberts]

but I think that the psychoactive greatly potentiates the nausea once you get it.

Yeah, I think it's like adding fuel to the fire. With psilocin, we already are in a messed up state mentally, and if you add nausea and restlessness that comes with the fungus to the mix, it's guaranteed that I'd regret taking the mushroom in the first place.

 

[Foreigner]

But I think with mushrooms, we are not ingesting the active substance psilocybin, but rather a fungus. Maybe the symptoms would not occur if we ingest the active drug psilocybin in form of a capsule that is isolated from Psilocybe cubensis, instead of ingesting the Psilocybe cubensis itself (which is a fungus and thus is a "poison" to the system). But since LSD is taken sublingually and doesn't go through the GI tract, it wasn't considered "poison" by the system therefore, the effects are more directed towards target receptors in the brain.

I think this is what @Foreigner meant by "toxic".

A poison and a toxin are two different things.

A poison can only harm/kill, with a toxin it varies.

I'm saying that mushrooms are a toxin.

I mean... magic mushrooms aren't nutritious food.

 

[Mjäll]

My first thought is about the mushrooms themselves, which are a bit hard to digest. Making a tea is the best option.

Then we can look at receptor binding affinities to try and understand something about pharmacology. According to whatever sources i can find, LSD as compared to psilocin has more activity at 5HT2A (which seems strongly linked to visual activity) and 5HT1A (which seems linked to a unity feeling) relative to 5HT2C (which seems linked to depressive symptoms). Also LSD has affinity at dopamine receptors (which could mediate some of the beneficial cognitive effects).

 

[ninjapirateroberts]

My first thought is about the mushrooms themselves, which are a bit hard to digest. Making a tea is the best option.

Then we can look at receptor binding affinities to try and understand something about pharmacology. According to whatever sources i can find, LSD as compared to psilocin has more activity at 5HT2A (which seems strongly linked to visual activity) and 5HT1A (which seems linked to a unity feeling) relative to 5HT2C (which seems linked to depressive symptoms). Also LSD has affinity at dopamine receptors (which could mediate some of the beneficial cognitive effects).

I think the affinity at dopamine receptors could be the reason why I could feel effects like conceptual thinking, creative thinking, and increased music appreciation with LSD than with other psychedelics like mushroom and DMT. It's definitely more "stimulating" (which is something I go for).

 

[swilow]

Yeah, I think it's like adding fuel to the fire. With psilocin, we already are in a messed up state mentally, and if you add nausea and restlessness that comes with the fungus to the mix, it's guaranteed that I'd regret taking the mushroom in the first place.

For me nausea is one of the more difficult things to try and ride out when tripping. Can deal with most other intense sensations, anxiety, dysphoria, restlessness, but nausea can often colour a trip pretty badly. Hence, I tend to avoid substances that cause it, mushrooms and cactus being the worst culprits.

 

[Phobos]

Serotonin receptors are found throughout the body. Body load on psyches isn't really a function of ROA ime, or not entirely at least. But certainly, nausea seems in part to be related to consumption of indigestible plant/fungus material. Try eating cactus for a real gastric nightmare

Different types of receptors have different densities in different tissues.
We have a lot of 5HT3 receptors in the digestive tract, so serotonin agonists with enough activity at that receptor will cause some nausea.

Alcohol also has some activity at 5HT3.

 

[F.U.B.A.R.]

Mushrooms are famed for their increased body load and nausea compared to LSD.

However, if you pick and dry your mushrooms properly, this body load can be minimised.

I personally would never trust any mushrooms that I haven't picked myself.

Strangely, I find the body load from acid to be worse than mushrooms - I feel like some cunt is sat on my chest making it hard to breath.

That's why I've always preferred the little pointy headed bastards over that synthetic stuff.

 

[MuertaMan]

As the title says, I took 2.5 grams of mushrooms yesterday (in chocolate form), but at about T+0:45, I started feeling full-body restlessness, so I decided to lay on the bed. At T+1:20, the effects began to kick in, but at the same time, I felt restlessness throughout my body; I felt uneasy lying down, sitting up (loss of coordination), nausea. I barely felt "visual effects." It made me very drowsy, and I was "slipping" into a sleep-like state, but I forced myself to stay awake.

I never felt whole-body restlessness, unease, or drowsiness with LSD. I didn't find the need to keep myself awake when I'm on LSD, but it's totally the opposite with mushrooms. At T+2:30, I felt like I needed to scream like crazy (thankfully, I didn't), but I was doing all sorts of weird stretches to relieve my restlessness. Finally, at T+3:40, I figured I'd rather take alprazolam 1mg to free myself from the mental and physical restlessness (at this point, I also had a headache); at T+4:10, alprazolam kicked in, and I could finally lay down in peace.

I regret taking the mushrooms. I found LSD to be more "stimulating" (in terms of conceptual thinking, introspection, music appreciation, and visual effects) and definitely no nausea, and wanting to make myself awake (I never felt drowsy with LSD).

At T+6:00, the mental and physical restlessness was finally gone, and I was back to the sober state. I took another alprazolam 1mg with melatonin 10mg and slept for like 13-14 hours, and woke up like a newborn (I took my 40mg Vyvanse, and I feel so much fresh when writing this).

I figured I liked LSD a lot more than mushrooms. The whole time I was thinking I should have taken LSD.

Has anyone ever felt physical and mental restlessness, drowsiness and decreased "stimulation," and other effects I described above with mushrooms? Do you "like" LSD more than mushrooms for these reasons? (or vice versa?).

You arent eating enough and "breaking through", when peaking on a nice dose I have limitless energy and can dance to psytrance all night without being tired. I can also in the same breath sit down in a comfortable chair close my eyes and melt into the couch feeling very relaxed. Mushrooms are versatile like that IME and its all in the mind. The restlessness is also sometimes just not being able to find your groove and go with the flow. I don't have a set dose with shrooms anymore, Ive learned you can't just weigh it out an exact amount and expect it to always be enough, many times Ive had to eat more than my initial weighed out dose to get where I need to be, my mind knows "that feeling" and I don't stop eating them until I get there, you can still eat them up to about 90 minutes in and they will still work fine.

 

[cosmosmariner]

I get intense body load discomfort/agitation from both LSD and shrooms. If you have the opportunity, the best way for me to get rid of it is to fuck it away with a partner.