Thiaminorex RC stim.. be careful!

[paracelsius]

this compound

a thiazoline the sulfur homolog of aminorex, an oxazoline:

was discussed here on BL some time ago..apparently sold online by some stupid a..holes having no fckng idea WTF they doing. THIS IS NOT SAME AS AMINOREX or related stimulants like cyclazodone. we tried that one back in BC. It is highly potent triple releaser, somewhere between mdma and meth..more like meth actually but least 5x as potent as d-meth. It is EXTREMELY COMPULSIVE on par with d-methamphetamine! or crack.. Be careful ! There is nothing in the literature about that compound psychoactivity profile afaik.. but correct me if I am wrong. the closest would be thiadrine (priatan), drug developed in germany for asthma in 60s

incidentally some of the thiadrine side-effects including psychiatric intoxication and sympatomimetic typical of stimulants startin at 25 mg PO(will post ref later..

do not assume because chemical structure is very similar to aminorex or even cyclazodone type stimulants, it would have same pharmacology profile!!!. so please be extremely careful if yo u happen come across it! Stay Safe Out There

 

[broncoseamonkey]

Doubt I will ever come across it but good to know

 

[someguyontheinternet]

Sounds fun

I wonder if you can vape it

 

[paracelsius]

^ havent try that.. only oral and snorted .. I guess you can vape but I wont go there. lest you ended up 5 days straight doing absolutely nothing but hittin pipe with a totally unknown compound. Dont do it I repeat again: That compound is extremely compulsive starting at 10 mg even insuflatted!.. as compulsive as pyros. GF had to flush 100s $ worth when she start havin tinnitus (ear ring!!) Just stick to meth if that is your doc..

I post that on BL for harm reduction sake because I've seen that in the wild claiming it as 4-MAR analog. And some other sites (not sure polish??) discussing synthesis. It is not same as AR it is way more potent I guess because it is more lipoliphilic so it gets straight to the brain better than AR or 4-MAR...kind like amph v meth! STAY SAFE OUT THERE
On another note: If you reading that: miss you "muffn"!. One of the most brilliant talented chemist I've ever met!

 

[Rectify]

I want some!

 

[deficiT]

Lol tell me why someone comes on here to warn ppl about something and ppls first instinct is to be like "hey I want to try!"

 

[SpiralusSancti]

Lol tell me why someone comes on here to warn ppl about something and ppls first instinct is to be like "hey I want to try!"

Cuz orange juice is rarely very compulsive while rum can be lol

 

[logos_rising]

this compound

a thiazoline the sulfur homolog of aminorex, an oxazoline:

was discussed here on BL some time ago..apparently sold online by some stupid a..holes having no fckng idea WTF they doing. THIS IS NOT SAME AS AMINOREX or related stimulants like cyclazodone. we tried that one back in BC. It is highly potent triple releaser, somewhere between mdma and meth..more like meth actually but least 5x as potent as d-meth. It is EXTREMELY COMPULSIVE on par with d-methamphetamine! or crack.. Be careful ! There is nothing in the literature about that compound psychoactivity profile afaik.. but correct me if I am wrong. the closest would be thiadrine (priatan), drug developed in germany for asthma in 60s

incidentally some of the thiadrine side-effects including psychiatric intoxication and sympatomimetic typical of stimulants startin at 25 mg PO(will post ref later..

do not assume because chemical structure is very similar to aminorex or even cyclazodone type stimulants, it would have same pharmacology profile!!!. so please be extremely careful if yo u happen come across it! Stay Safe Out There

Im very curious where you received this information. Please post the ref. I have tried the Thiazole (extra double bond), but it appears to be inactive @ 20mg PO. It was obtained from a reliable source, so I don't question its structure.

I found a chem company allegedly based in Canada that allegedly sells the thiazoline you mention on their website. However, the company seems suspect since the individual affiliated with this company on linktn has a nonexistent last name. It seems like a honeypot set up offering likely psychoactive derivatives just outside current legislation.

 

[someguyontheinternet]

Im very curious where you received this information. Please post the ref. I have tried the Thiazole (extra double bond), but it appears to be inactive @ 20mg PO. It was obtained from a reliable source, so I don't question its structure.

I found a chem company allegedly based in Canada that allegedly sells the thiazoline you mention on their website. However, the company seems suspect since the individual affiliated with this company on linktn has a nonexistent last name. It seems like a honeypot set up offering likely psychoactive derivatives just outside current legislation.

Why would that be a honeypot? Offering legal compounds seems like an odd choice for a honeypot

 

[paracelsius]

Im very curious where you received this information. Please post the ref. I have tried the Thiazole (extra double bond), but it appears to be inactive @ 20mg PO. It was obtained from a reliable source, so I don't question its structure.

Where i received that info? from myself and my GF... joke asides, we actually made it and tried it that's how I got the info..it is quite straightforward synth if one knows whats he doing, a bit simpler than making hard boil eggs..

am afraid you wont find any ref on that compound afaik. I mean in terms of psychoactivity/pharmacology..etc..Would love to hear from anybody who find any ref. As I said the closer is an old drug thiadrine (the 3,4-dimethyl thiazolidine) here ..No the thiazole wont work...pretty much sure of that!

It is again rules mentioning vendors/sources..etc on BL. but I dont know, could be scam could be legit..who knows.?

 

[logos_rising]

Where i received that info? from myself and my GF... joke asides, we actually made it and tried it that's how I got the info..it is quite straightforward synth if one knows whats he doing, a bit simpler than making hard boil eggs..

am afraid you wont find any ref on that compound afaik. I mean in terms of psychoactivity/pharmacology..etc..Would love to hear from anybody who find any ref. As I said the closer is an old drug thiadrine (the 3,4-dimethyl thiazolidine) here ..No the thiazole wont work...pretty much sure of that!

It is again rules mentioning vendors/sources..etc on BL. but I dont know, could be scam could be legit..who knows. I dont buy drugs I dont sell then. I design, make and test them..

Interesting. Thanks for the feedback. Were you able to confirm its chiral structure? I'm curious if 2-Amino-4-Propyl-5-Phenyl-1,3-Oxazoline would be more manageable.

 

[paracelsius]

Interesting. Thanks for the feedback. Were you able to confirm its chiral structure?

Do you mean if we did the optically pure compound? No. Yea sure it has one chiral carbon so yeah the R and S enantiomers possible. but no the method used gives the RS racemate. But of course, can be adapted using chiral precursors or just separate the enantiomers. just extra steps mean extra $, right? It helps a lot make separation easier since that compound (free base) crystallize nicely Mp 112-113oC. The HCl salt also crystallize..beautiful shiny crystals and the weirdest thing I came across: It (2-amino-5-phenylthiazoline HCl) has the same Mp as d-methamphetamine HCl I mean exactly the same!: 172-173oC v d-methHCl 172-174oC... WEIRD concidence!! go figure

I'm curious if 2-Amino-4-Propyl-5-Phenyl-1,3-Oxazoline would be more manageable.

That is good idea. How did you come up with that one? Very interesting compound. Actually It was mentioned in the original McNeil Co patent of active oxazolines. (2-amino-4-propyl-5-phenyloxazoline and also similar like the 4-isobutyl..etc. Sure easier to manage as far as prep is concerned shouldnt be problem but keep in mind depend on where you live, could still be illegal as analog of Schedule I (or 2??) aminorex since it is still an oxazoline right?.. then again that law is so stupid and confusing, you can jail ppl for drinking water as "analog" of heroin they both have hydrogen and oxygen, right?

 

[logos_rising]

the method used gives the RS racemate.

i'm no chemist & maybe my memory is off, but if its the method I'm thinking of, I seem to recall that unlike with oxazoline, the thio cycling reagent attacks the amine instead of the OH group leaving you with the rexamino derivative instead. Some say that these derivatives are inactive, but others disagree. For example, some of these derivatives have stimulant-like & precognitive effects preclinically (in rodents) that aren't directly mediated via monoamine release & reuptake inhibition, but appear to act indirectly via TAAR, and perhaps mu opiate receptors. I also came across an old (2010?) forensic chem paper on 4-MEC impurities.. They did syntheses where by the alpha & beta ketone & amine groups were reversed depending on whether the amine used in the reduction was liquid base or the HCL salt. I found this interesting especially since many who have synthesized 4-MEC in recent years report that it seems to lack the intense rush in euphoria that they recall back when it first came out leading some to wonder if there was a unique isomer that was preferentially favored in the early bulk syntheses.

then again that law is so stupid and confusing, you can jail ppl for drinking water as "analog" of heroin they both have hydrogen and oxygen, right?

that's an understatement! As I often try to explain to people the "War on (some) Drugs" has always been about controlling market share for the moneychangers. It has NEVER been about protecting the public or so called “harm reduction.” This was easy to prove before COVID by pointing out that the Federal Bureau of Narcotics, the precursor to the DEA, was created by the US Treasury in 1930 long before any federal agency was created to "protect" the public from marketed food and drugs. Many of my friends on the LEFT still want to blame the phony WODs on the racism of the white man, which is understandable at a surface level based on the history of minority groups who have often been oppressed by such laws (eg prison sentence disparity between crack and cocaine possession). But, the TRUTH is the phony mask of "care" worn by all "institutions" to legitimize their existence for the "greater good" is EVIL and counterfeit. Thus, the DEA/FDA's scheduling regulations have no legitimate nor rationale foundation. Its largely based on MEDIA hype, bad science, and mythical urban legends all of which function to keep the status quo in place. https://x.com/Tim_Ludwig/status/1729242969923105242?s=20

 

[Hexenstahl]

Lol tell me why someone comes on here to warn ppl about something and ppls first instinct is to be like "hey I want to try!"

Because he has done it in the wrong way. Unfortunately people who end up doing the warning have no rudimentary knowledge in psychology, and as an ironic twist of fate end up causing the harm that they actually wanted to prevent. There is a phenomenon in behaviourism known as reverse psychology. When you tell people "don't you do XYZ" they will want to do it all the more because they perceive the "don't do it" as a limitation of their freedom to choose. They might consciously agree with the person who warns them, but the subconscious mind thinks "how dare he tells me what not to do" which expresses itself in an unexplainable increased desire to do the drug.

The correct way to warn people against something without making that thing look unintentionally more attractive, is not to say "you better don't touch this shit, it's superduper dangerous!!!", but instead give people a list of reasons (using the most unemotional tone as possible) why a substance isn't as good as they thought it is. Highlight the side-effects as much as possible, downplay the recreational potential of the drug in light of more established drugs where the safety profile is known, and especially avoid saying things like "don't do it 'cause dis shit be potent af" because to the subconscious mind more potency equals getting more high. Also, make them feel stupid if they go against your warning. If there is one thing people don't like it's feeling stupid, so tell them something like "[...] and I personally wouldn't wanna be used as a human guinea pig, but hey, we live in a free country so feel free to do the dumbest things if you want to. Nobody is stopping you". I find this to be pretty effective because you're not actively trying to discourage the other person from doing the drug, but try to make them feel incredibly retarded if they ended up doing it.

The people who end up doing the warning just do everything wrong that you can possibly do wrong and achieve the opposite of what they intended. It would be hilarious if it wasn't so sad.

 

[paracelsius]

i'm no chemist..

You dont have to be one, just ask questions you be good! fyi, I heard the guy who come up with 4-MMC aka mephedrone, one of the most successful RC besides Shulgin MDMA, that guy has no chemistry or pharmacology background! well some ppl calling him out full of s..t for taking credit but anyway....

maybe my memory is off, but if its the method I'm thinking of, I seem to recall that unlike with oxazoline, the thio cycling reagent attacks the amine instead of the OH group leaving you with the rexamino derivative instead.

Not sure the method you talking about. But since you mention OH group, I guess you talking about cyanate route, right? ie PEA + potassium cyanate-->urea--->oxazolines??,, Yeah sure if instead of cyanate you use thiocyanate KNCS, you'll get the thiourea. That one can cyclize to either oxazoline or thiazoline depends really on the conditions: desulfurization reagents would give oxazolines, acids will give you thiazolines...actually there are easier cheaper routes than the cyanate... kind of hard explaining all that without go into details and breaking BL rules! why dont you come over on vep forums or sciencemadness or DM me if you interested in chemistry

......since many who have synthesized 4-MEC in recent years report that it seems to lack the intense rush in euphoria that they recall back when it first came out leading some to wonder if there was a unique isomer that was preferentially favored in the early bulk syntheses.

Could be anything. One thing that come top my mind is the Voight rearrangement but that is with alfa-hydroxy ketones where ketone and hydroxy switched position... but I dont know hard to tell without seeing details. then again I wont surprise, the way they cook those RCs, more like witch brew, anything could happen! talking about intense euphoric rush, one cathinone everybody missed is dimethcathinone aka N,N-dimethylcathinone.. with good reason: if you look amph SAR you go from amph>=methamph>>>dimethylamph. that last one is 10xless than amph but that is not the case with cathinones!! diMCAT is actually> CAT and MCAT but am getting off topic here..

 

[paracelsius]

Because he has done it in the wrong way. Unfortunately people who end up doing the warning have no rudimentary knowledge in psychology...The people who end up doing the warning just do everything wrong that you can possibly do wrong and achieve the opposite of what they intended. It would be hilarious if it wasn't so sad.

you sure got a point here: I am no psychologist, closest I know about psychology of what we talking about here is watching my kids growing up: the more you tell them not to do something (harmful to them) the more they want to do it. Or at the very least they'd be bombarding you with why dad/mom? why why?? till you get tired and tell them bullshit story like; Santa wont be getting present if you do.. So I thought it applies to little children not grown-ups on a drug forum like BL.oh well my bet..
...anyway I am a chemist medicinal chemist with interest in drugs targeting the brain.. only way I can warn people is by the language of neurochemistry..If that can have opposite effect to HR, I guess @MOD should remove that post. Guess I'd have to learn some basic psychology once I am done learning German, technical chemical german..


oh btw wtf they talking about here?

Die verbliebene, zähe Krystallmasse wird mit wenig starker Salzsäure verrieben, auf Ton gebracht, in Wasser gelost und in verdunnutes Ammoniak gegossen. Das abgeschiedene, unschwer erstarrende Prudukt schielßt aus viel Wasser (in spitz-rhombischen Krystalen) oder aus vie1 ligroin (in mattweißen: langen Nalden) an und schmilzt bpi 111-112oC. In den gewöhnlichen organischen Lösungsmitteln, außer Petrolether, lost sich die Base leicht auf. Die heiße, wäßrige Losung reagiert stark alkalisch. Die Analyse zeigt, daß der erwartete.......

did they mention yields anywhere? Thioharnoff is thiazoline right? or thiourea??

Thx a lot
Good'day all BLighters .. Stay Safe Out There

 

[Hexenstahl]

with interest in drugs targeting the brain

That makes two of us!

oh btw wtf they talking about here?

Here, I translated it for you:

"The remaining, viscous crystal mass needs to be levigated (the act of rubbing something) with sparsely strong HCl, and brought on clay (no idea what the author means by that. Are you supposed to put the product of the chemical reaction on a piece of clay, mix with it, or what?), solve it in H2O (I suppose deionized water?) and then pour it into diluted NH3. The codeposited, solidifying (or perhaps stiffening) product XXX (the word "schielßt" contains a typo that makes it impossible to understand what the author means. If "schließt" ist meant, then the translation means "closes" which makes no sense to me. If "schießt" is meant then the translation is "shoots" which makes even less sense to me) out of much H2O in sharp-rhombic crystals, or out of much ligroin in dull looking whitish, long nails and melts between 111 - 112 °C.
The base dissolves easily in the usual organic solvents, except petroleum ether. The hot, watery solution reacts strongly alkaline. The analysis shows that the expected......"

No mention of yields anywhere, nope. Thioharnstoff is thiourea. May I ask what the source of that text is? I'd be very interested to read it.

 

[paracelsius]

..May I ask what the source of that text is? I'd be very interested to read it.

Chem Ber 1914, 47(2), p 1448. https://doi.org/10.1002/cber.19140470219
pretty old paper. I was just wondering if author mentioned any yields. No I guess what he meant the rx product (the residue.. sometime they do have clay consistency like finely suspended solids...I doubt he' rubbed on clay!! rubbed = suspended in HCl (salzsauer, yea?).. poured into ammonium hydroxide..(free basing it).... crystallized from lots of water into rhombic crystals...soluble except in ligroin..blablabla... not to worry too much I know what he’s talking about now.. Thx a lot you save my day

 

[snmfmy]

I want some!

You want some idiopathic pulmonary hypertension that has a 50% probability of killing you within 3 years? There is a reason they pulled aminorex.

 

[paracelsius]

^ pardon me, but that is bullshit..a myth, an urban legend. never been proven! here is a study in dogs:

"Haemodynamic effects of oral aminorex and amphetamine in unanaesthetized beagle dog" https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov5017563/

...There was no cumulative or residual haemodynamic effect of either drug. We therefore conclude that neither aminorex nor amphetamine readily produces sustained pulmonary hypertension in beagle dogs ....

another one in calves:

"Aminorex (Menocil) and amphetamine:acute and chronic effects on pulmonary and systemic haemodynamics in the calf" https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/5062875/

"The chronic effect of one month's treatment was to leave both systemic and pulmonary haemodynamics unchanged, and there was no depletion in endogenous catecholamines as measured by the tyramine test. In addition, the reactivity of the pulmonary vascular bed to hypoxia remained unaltered. Thus neither aminorex nor amphetamine produced pulmonary hypertension during one month's treatment in the calf .....