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The man made substance known as LSD vs. the natural fungi known also known as shrooms

LazyTheGreat

LazyTheGreat

Bluelighter
Joined
Apr 6, 2016
Messages
72
Hello Bluelighters, I have a few questions for you all. I have been experimenting with LSD for a while now and have recently experimented with shrooms for the first time. During my shroom experience I had an insight from the powers that be. For some reason I believed that LSD was scientifically engineered to change the way a person is, to an extent where they can possibly become some sort of superhuman. On the other hand shrooms were made to be more "fun" and in a way more spiritual. That was just a quick thought loop I found my mind wandering down. Is what I thought true? I have no idea but for some reason at the time my mind told me that. So my question to you all is what can I get out of a shroom trip that I can't get from an LSD trip? Like I said I am an LSD user and I know shroom experiences are similar yet completely different but what have I been missing out on? I enjoyed my shroom experience and I had a magical trip, yet I don't know if I should continue experimenting with LSD or switch over and experiment with shrooms.
 
There's no reason why you can't use both :)

I personally find that acid feels more like a "drug", whereas shrooms are more of spiritual/at one with nature feeling, but it's more of an experience than a high. Though that's not to say that I haven't had some insanely euphoric highs from shrooms. It's just that for me, they're far more touchy and it's much easier for a shroom trip to get uncomfortable, not necessarily bad but just edgy. Also, they're often unpredictable for me in that sometimes I'll get a trip that's really euphoric, lighthearted, and recreational whereas others will be much more serious, not bad, but just deeper trips that really require perfect set and setting. I still like shrooms very much and appreciate the insights they've showed me. LSD is just so much fun and profound. I've yet to have anything less than a wonderful trip and set and setting isn't as touchy as it can be with shrooms. LSD feels more intense physically and even mentally but the mindfuck is much clearer to me, easier to navigate. I feel very comfortable with higher doses of acid but shrooms higher doses are a special occasion thing because the setting really has to be perfect for me. I love lower doses of shrooms regularly while I'm outside in nature, it's such a beautiful, magical, unified feeling. Definitely experiment with shrooms if you want, they have a certain dreamy magic as you lnow, nothing wrong with exploring that side of psychedelia As well. But there's no reason why you can't have fun with both, if you love lsd by all means, enjoy it too. just be safe :)
 
It's kind of a coincidence I think that acid feels 'sharper' or more clinical than mushrooms, LSD is semisynthetic: it is nearly the same as the starting product taken out of ergot fungus (although the small modification makes a big difference in effect). It could have been just as well that LSD was found in nature as is, or that hypothetically psilocin / psilocybin weren't and we would have to make them synthetically, developing them after discovering DMT.

The main reasons why you feel the way you do, is that:
1. It is a sort of placebo / suggestion, you know mushrooms are natural so you unconsciously program your mind to color the experience as 'natural'. I've had these exact feelings plenty of times but it was when having experienced feeling extremely natural and my 'native' self on LSD or synthetic mescaline as well as plain mentally disturbing mushroom experiences that this distinction started to muddle.

2. The other part is that natural products are usually a mix (often a very rich mixture) of chemicals whereas synthetic drugs are usually one single pure chemical compound.
The natural drug mixtures from plants, fungi or animals can also contain drugs that attenuate each other, synergize or mellow each other out - for the reason that they tend to be alike, but the differences can have an effect of the brain of balancing out.

The cannabis chemicals THC and CBD do that: CBD softens the very lucid and sharp psychedelic feeling THC. I have made extracts from cannabis, and also tried epimerization to convert a lot of cannabis chemicals to delta-9-THC and it felt very 'synthetic' and sharp, not unlike some synthetic cannabinoids that are sold today. Remember that this was originally chemicals from cannabis - so natural products. Refining them does not turn them into synthetic chemicals if you perhaps think that, you don't really alter them (apart from the epimerization i did).

We have learned to associate pure and unhindered effects with synthetic products because they tend to act that way: as far as one single type of action in the brain goes very two-dimensional.

Yes LSD works on a number of different receptors in the body, but those don't very directly counteract each other in special ways like the THC and CBD in cannabis can.

You are probably not surprised to hear at this point that synthetic psilocin (found in mushrooms) felt pretty sharp and artificial to me. And trying DMT taken from plants or made in lab (I also tried those both) have also shown me that the above rules apply, and that it is pointless to differentiate between natural and synthetic origin, but only useful to consider if you are dealing with a pure chemical or a mixture.

I'm sure that you can carefully mix 20 synthetic psychedelics together and apply them to parsley or some other herb, and if you tell a person taking it very little it may feel super 'natural' to them. (Not supernatural lol)

If you understand all this, I think you see that none of these drugs are 'meant to' be something to us, there are just reasons why we feel this difference between natural and artificial drugs, but fundamentally there is no difference.

Finally, also remember that all chemicals at one point were derived from nature so even that distinction of origins doesn't fly. Historically shamans / medicine men have 'developed' or engineered relationships with psychoactive plants / fungi / animals and made them meaningful.
We mostly consider those that have proven to be useful allies, with which we have long and rich relationships.
But nature also provides very disturbing and toxic chemicals such as scopolamine that would turn our love for nature around entirely so to speak. That people attribute 'evil' or 'demonic' properties to such drugs is simply proof that our superstition will find an explanation that our feeling quickly says makes sense... but turns out to be pretty ignorant the more you actually find out about the facts.
 
I like LSD more. It has dopaminergic and noradrenergic effects, that psilocin lacks. As well as NMDA-effects. Many shrooms have toxins in them that also tend to spoil some of the psychedelic effects by adding to the vasoconstriction, or by causing stomach problems or nausea. Especially cubensis strains. Psylocibe cyanescens, azurescens and semilancaeta tend to be cleaner and more powerfull and euphoric.
The natural vs synthetic is not realy a point in my view. There are seeds and roots that contain natural lysergic's, wich when fresh have effects, very simmilar to those of LSD.
 
LazyTheGreat said:
.............. For some reason I believed that LSD was scientifically engineered to change the way a person is, to an extent where they can possibly become some sort of superhuman............
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That's exactly what 40 years of acid use has done for me

Yours sincerely,

Clark Kunt =D
 
I started taking shrooms 5 or 6 times before my first acid trip. Honestly i never felt anything from the shrooms. Everyone tells me im nuts lil. First time I dropped acid it was along with shrooms and after that now everytime ive done shrooms by themselves, I get a decent trip off of them. Personally I do prefer my blotter though.
 
morphine-dreams said:
There's no reason why you can't use both :)

I personally find that acid feels more like a "drug", whereas shrooms are more of spiritual/at one with nature feeling, but it's more of an experience than a high. Though that's not to say that I haven't had some insanely euphoric highs from shrooms. It's just that for me, they're far more touchy and it's much easier for a shroom trip to get uncomfortable, not necessarily bad but just edgy. Also, they're often unpredictable for me in that sometimes I'll get a trip that's really euphoric, lighthearted, and recreational whereas others will be much more serious, not bad, but just deeper trips that really require perfect set and setting. I still like shrooms very much and appreciate the insights they've showed me. LSD is just so much fun and profound. I've yet to have anything less than a wonderful trip and set and setting isn't as touchy as it can be with shrooms. LSD feels more intense physically and even mentally but the mindfuck is much clearer to me, easier to navigate. I feel very comfortable with higher doses of acid but shrooms higher doses are a special occasion thing because the setting really has to be perfect for me. I love lower doses of shrooms regularly while I'm outside in nature, it's such a beautiful, magical, unified feeling. Definitely experiment with shrooms if you want, they have a certain dreamy magic as you lnow, nothing wrong with exploring that side of psychedelia As well. But there's no reason why you can't have fun with both, if you love lsd by all means, enjoy it too. just be safe :)
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When would you say would be the right time to use each of the substances? If I wanted to direct my life into a direction of success is one of these substances a better choice?
 
What I like about LSD is that an amount necessary for you to trip your face off can be fit unto tiny pieces of paper
 
I think you stray across a dangerously thin line when you begin to join psychedelics with being superhuman. That's when you can end up believing too much into what you thought about when you take them and not everything garnered from a trip can be of any use. LSD was actually designed to be used as a medication completely unrelated to it's uses today so it can be guaranteed that LSD was not devised for such a task of making humans superhuman then again, if you refer to the CIA testing you will see that they believed something similar until they too realized that LSD was not able to make humans any different other than to perhaps make them confused, disorientated or burst out with laughter and theories on life and the world around us.

LSD is a man-made drug and it feels completely different to mushrooms although it is a much more amazing substance in my opinion because it seems to unlock doors in the mind that no other psychedelic has been able to do, at least for me anyway. I've always seen mushrooms to be more therapeutic than LSD and I've seen LSD to be therapeutic only in a different way. Mushrooms can get the monsters out of people right then and there during the trip, you may cry, you may get angry, you may wish at that moment to end the trip but they have a wondrous ability to give you answers to questions you've been asking all the time and Terence McKenna found mushrooms to do the same for him. If you did that on LSD then I could imagine you may end up hurting yourself or causing yourself some sort of anxiety attack or brief acid paranoia whereas with mushrooms, it's completely different. Then again, this is just my own opinion based on my own experiences.

Mushrooms are definitely more spiritually connected natural tools for accessing altered states of consciousness whereas LSD is a more swirly euphoric prize winning 'out of your mind' in awe and wonder tool for accessing altered states of consciousness then again, I suppose it depends on set and setting and what you want from the trip or what the trip wants from you. I'd take mushrooms over LSD any day if my experiences were aimed at being spiritually enlightening at one with the Earth and it's natural beauty sorta experience whereas I'd take LSD any day over mushrooms if I wanted to break open my mind, be surprised, entertained and smacked in the face with weird and wonderful color, textures, sounds, feelings and an ability to break away from the ego, the self and what you know about the world unlike I've experienced with any other psychedelic to date.

As for superhuman...
I'd stick to ground floor trips if I were you OP!
 
It has nothing to do with being man-made... even if LSD can be sharper around the edges than mushrooms in certain ways that would all be nothing but a coincidence and not a result of being man-made... it's pretty much shown in previous posts.

That you have a preference for mushrooms is something you are completely entitled to, and prejudice when considering man-made versus natural is something you would share with countless other people. However it couldn't hurt to read the thread well and realize the flaws in such a prejudice.. :)

Lysergamides in the series LSD was in, that Sandoz developed, were indeed intended for iirc inducing labor in pregnant women. However that proves absolutely nothing about the potential LSD turned out to have when it was accidentally 'rediscovered' as a psychedelic.
MDMA was initially shelved for like ten years originally intended as something like an insecticide or whatever, before rediscovered as the drug it is. The original intentions are absolutely irrelevant.

I totally agree that trying to become superhuman or attempting to acutely achieve enlightenment etc are vainglorious and potentially dangerous ways to try and use psychedelics... However if you water down these ideas, I do agree that LSD, mushrooms and many more psychedelics have the power to help in the life-long process of trying to stay/become a conscious, open-minded, compassionate and good (as in moral / righteous in self-evident ways) person. Not better than others, that would be completely defeating the whole idea.

Sorry that LSD seems to be rough for you, but I assure you that not everyone gets the same effects you get. LSD has taught me plenty of things as well, often more clear and useful, while mushrooms give me more of a 'narrative': a teacher telling a story, but often in my case one who is no stranger to 'corporal' (spiritual) punishment. But in my belief the approach is very different: mushrooms seems to work better through feeling and intuition while LSD is more rational and lucid in the manner of teaching. Both have their own value and it depends on the person which may fit better.

For me mushrooms have been incomparably more unforgiving, torturing and insane feeling than LSD. You're welcome to post recommendations for other people on the forum but to be honest, it sounds a bit too much like you are presenting your own experiences as fact.
To each their own.
 
^I agree so much with that last paragraph. Even though they've taught me a lot, and have given me incredible highs, bad shroom trips are fucking awful and once it's going bad, good luck getting out of that thought loop.

And yet, my first psychedelic experience ever was a +++ full ego death trip from hell on shrooms where I split into 6 alternate egos and saw each of them making choices mirroring mine and leading to horrible lives and ultimately, horrible, early deaths, except for one where I quit all drugs, thought I went permanently insane and regretted doing shrooms more than I even knew I was capable of regretting something.

6 months later I'm tripping all the time on shrooms and acid lol, I like to think I figured a lot of things out emotionally but most people would probably say I'm just crazier than ever :p

But seriously, even though I got to the bottom of what caused my bad trips (anxiety), actual anxiety, and recently had the best ever trip on 330ug acid (does vividly reliving childhood memories as if you are actually going back in time and experiencing it with all the same emotions count as breaking through?), shrooms STILL kicked my ass recently over nothing in particular, just bad setting. I was actually having a great trip at first but then my friend started having a bad trip, but wasn't freaking out or anything, and that was enough for mine to go bad too. I was just caught in a stupid thought loop that was literally about having a bad trip, like "ugh god, not again". At this point bad shroom trips are more annoying than anything because I'm used to them. Shrooms are like that friend that can be really fun but leaves you out to dry when you need them. Maybe that's too harsh. They're just sooo damn touchy and if you try to control the trip, like you can with acid to an extent, it'll just make it worse. I've had some uncomfortable moments on acid, but they were always short lived and never turned into a bad trip.

On the other hand, one of my friends loves shrooms, never finds them very hard to handle, but couldn't handle acid at all. It varies for everyone. I love shrooms even though they don't always love me back, but Lucy has never been bad to me. I never get nausea on acid either, while its inevitable for me to some extent on a higher dose of shrooms.
 
morphine-dreams said:
^I agree so much with that last paragraph. Even though they've taught me a lot, and have given me incredible highs, bad shroom trips are fucking awful and once it's going bad, good luck getting out of that thought loop.

And yet, my first psychedelic experience ever was a +++ full ego death trip from hell on shrooms where I split into 6 alternate egos and saw each of them making choices mirroring mine and leading to horrible lives and ultimately, horrible, early deaths, except for one where I quit all drugs, thought I went permanently insane and regretted doing shrooms more than I even knew I was capable of regretting something.

6 months later I'm tripping all the time on shrooms and acid lol, I like to think I figured a lot of things out emotionally but most people would probably say I'm just crazier than ever :p

But seriously, even though I got to the bottom of what caused my bad trips (anxiety), actual anxiety, and recently had the best ever trip on 330ug acid (does vividly reliving childhood memories as if you are actually going back in time and experiencing it with all the same emotions count as breaking through?), shrooms STILL kicked my ass recently over nothing in particular, just bad setting. I was actually having a great trip at first but then my friend started having a bad trip, but wasn't freaking out or anything, and that was enough for mine to go bad too. I was just caught in a stupid thought loop that was literally about having a bad trip, like "ugh god, not again". At this point bad shroom trips are more annoying than anything because I'm used to them. Shrooms are like that friend that can be really fun but leaves you out to dry when you need them. Maybe that's too harsh. They're just sooo damn touchy and if you try to control the trip, like you can with acid to an extent, it'll just make it worse. I've had some uncomfortable moments on acid, but they were always short lived and never turned into a bad trip.

On the other hand, one of my friends loves shrooms, never finds them very hard to handle, but couldn't handle acid at all. It varies for everyone. I love shrooms even though they don't always love me back, but Lucy has never been bad to me. I never get nausea on acid either, while its inevitable for me to some extent on a higher dose of shrooms.
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I think with any psychedelic you need a solid understanding of your illnesses (if you have any). Like for example someone who has social anxiety. Understanding how social anxiety works and accepting it's horrible side effects on a persons social life under psychedelics could be very beneficial for their recovery. It's how they get end of life cancer patients to come to terms with their illness; they begin by explaining it and after a while they already know so much about it, they engage with a therapist who tells them the unfortunate truths and qualms they may face in this life and then they take psychedelics and with all that information, even if their illness isn't resolved which obviously it wont (seeing as it's cancer) they come to terms with it and then they can start living again. I've found mushrooms to be fantastic as therapy tools and last September in 2015 I used them to delve deep into my mind and see what I could find and man, it was hard! If anything you might of even called it a 'bad' trip and during those hours I cried and got angry and felt bitterness and resentment for the people who had caused me grief in the past, I even tossed and turned in my bed just begging to go to sleep and at the time, it felt so hard to feel 'normal' but during those moments I was healing!

I was healing because I was going through what a client would go through after 60 hours of therapy! I was reaching the pinnacle of my problems and was able to get out my emotions and effectively talk to my inner me and reassure myself that those experiences weren't my fault and that certain people in this world are born to be evil and wicked and nasty and as much as it sounds really personal and it is, I know that millions of other people have gone through the same experiences and some of them have even taken mushrooms and reaped great benefits from them! Anyway, I awoke the next day and I can't even begin to tell you how happy and well I felt inside and in my mind, it felt like I had a huge weight pulled off my shoulders and I felt alive again. I felt like that night I had forgiven the world and my enemies and everyone that had hurt me and even though it was awful to go through that, that's how we humans heal!

I guess what I learned from it is this; not every 'bad' trip is actually bad. People just fear getting deep into the catacombs of their minds and there like everyone else you will find deep set problems and neuroses and ills and woes because come on man, life is a struggle! And when they get deep into their mind and end up in negative thought loops like you say, they run away. They don't sit calmly and think of something positive and embrace their sorrow and disgrace and pity and illness, they fight it and try and control the trip and that's when they lose because you can't control your trip, not like that anyway otherwise tripping wouldn't be what we know it to be in the first place. Some of my best experiences have been at the time of consumption and peak some of my worst but I learned sooooooooo much from them about myself. You just have to be mindful, accepting, forgiving and non-judgemental, you need to understand and be aware and have knowledge and from then on wards, there isn't much that you can't decipher in the world around you... that's why people meditate, study psychology, study themselves... so that they can have a better more refined and defined outlook on their life and maybe other people's too.

Your problems are your own. Own them and cherish them. And learn from them. That's how I see it anyway, but each to their own I guess :)
 
I completely agree that bad trips aren't necessarily bad, they've actually always been as helpful in the long run as good trips. I don't feel like getting into too much detail, but I have actually gotten to the bottom of a lot of my issues thanks to psychedelics and resolved them. Psychedelics have changed my life. Like I said, I love mushrooms and they have helped me tremendously, but I still find them to be much more sensitive when it comes to setting. Even when I'm in a great mindset, if someone who's tripping with me starts having a bad trip, that pretty much guarantees I'm going there with them, whereas on lsd I've yet to have a bad trip, even in a less than ideal setting. I absolutely get what you're saying but I still find mushrooms to be more unpredictable. I've also had the most incredible mushroom trips while not being in an ideal mindset, lsd is just more stable for me I guess, if that makes sense. It's not getting deep into my head that makes me uncomfortable (not anymore, anyway), it's just annoying that if something goes wrong my setting on shrooms it guarantees the trip is going to go south and even when I understand the cause, I'm pretty much at mercy of my trip. With lsd, I can explore the deeper parts of my.mind without the beatdown, not that the beatdown isn't a good thing sometimes, but lsd is just smoother. Darker thoughts are met with positive revelations rather than thought loops. Things can get weird, but never bad. They've both taught me a lot about myself, but shrooms can be tough love while lsd has always been more like a gentle guide. Believe me though, I've learned more about myself than I could've imagined. It's so much that I really can't go into it, I don't even know if I could effectively put it into writing. And there's still so much to learn, the more you learn, the more questions you have. My last lsd experience was absolutely mind blowing, life changing I think. It changed my outlook on my entire life in a very positive way.
 
mountainrange said:
.If you did that on LSD then I could imagine you may end up hurting yourself or causing yourself some sort of anxiety attack or brief acid paranoia whereas with mushrooms, it's completely different.
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That's exactly what I did so what ya think I should do now?
 
Solipsis said:
.However it couldn't hurt to read the thread well and realize the flaws in such a prejudice.. :)
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So I'm now asking myself the question what an i missing? This question brings out my curiosity and I must ask for help. So if you have any wisdom to what you think I'm missing please be kind of to share with me wise one
Solipsis said:
.
For me mushrooms have been incomparably more unforgiving, torturing and insane feeling than LSD.
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You see from my perspective you just described how I feel on LSD
 
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