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DPMC Moderators: thegreenhand | tryptakid
The First Possible Cannabis Fatality (merged threads)
- Thread starter seethe303
- Start date
Liquid SNake
Bluelighter
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- Jan 12, 2004
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- 506
people don't die as much as they do from smokes because ppl don't smoke as much weed as they smoke ciggerettes
Blowmonkey
Bluelight Crew
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- Aug 15, 2003
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Aah, let's get this thing into Drugs in the Media where it can be further ass raped..
It sounds so.. Yeah, inconclusive..![:\](https://bluelight.org/xf/BL_Images/Orig_Emoji/wrygrin.gif "wry grin :\")
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It sounds so.. Yeah, inconclusive..
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well i tried to do the math, but i couldnt figure it out cuz ima idiot, well if the ld50 is 49mg per kg in rats, and you wiegh bout 70 kg that means ud need bout 3,000 mg, now how much thc is in one joint, do the rest for me, and find out how much he would need to smoke to die.
bowdenta
Bluelighter
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- Feb 5, 2002
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insane. jesus christ. what are the odds that the first ever cannabis death happens just 9 days before rescheduling of weed from class B to C in the UK? whats even more unbelievable is that this happened in the UK!!
one doctor says weed poisoning is what he believes the cause to be. and what does he base his claim on? ok maybe the article didn't list any other contributing factors, but how could he blame weed? he has no idea how much it takes to kill a person or how it would contribute to their death. no one does. political spin indeed
one doctor says weed poisoning is what he believes the cause to be. and what does he base his claim on? ok maybe the article didn't list any other contributing factors, but how could he blame weed? he has no idea how much it takes to kill a person or how it would contribute to their death. no one does. political spin indeed
frizzantik
Bluelight Crew
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http://www.bluelight.ru/vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=117729&r=20
as i said in the other thread.. i'd like to know how it was determined that he died from cannabis. chances are his spliffs had more tobacco in them than cannabis so what was the real culprit?
as i said in the other thread.. i'd like to know how it was determined that he died from cannabis. chances are his spliffs had more tobacco in them than cannabis so what was the real culprit?
Psychadelic_Paisly
Bluelighter
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- Feb 10, 2003
- Messages
- 2,442
CATCH
Cannabis adverts stress dangers[B/]
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/3418219.stm
Doctors fear reclassification might make cannabis seem safe
A £1m campaign to warn people that cannabis will still be harmful and illegal despite changes to the law is being launched on Thursday.
The government is targeting young people with radio adverts and leaflets before cannabis is reclassified next week from a class B to a class C drug.
Tory leader Michael Howard has said that his party would reverse the move.
His warning came after doctors' leaders and drugs charity workers expressed some concern over the reclassification.
Information packs
The latest campaign from the government's drugs information service, called Frank, warns young people that possession is still a criminal offence.
It seems to me that there is absolutely no case for what is a massive muddle in the middle.
Tory leader Michael Howard
The radio adverts will be played on 48 national and regional commercial radio stations in England.
Wales, Scotland and Northern Ireland are tailoring the adverts and leaflets to fit their existing campaigns.
Two-and-a-half million leaflets outlining the latest position on drugs and the law will be distributed.
Information packs promoting the message will be sent out to all schools drug advisors, drug action teams, drug charities, health organisations and student unions.
'Absurd'
The Tories denounced the reclassification of cannabis as "absurd".
Mr Howard told the Independent newspaper: "After thinking about this very carefully, we have come to the view that the government's decision is misconceived.
The BMA is extremely concerned that the public might think that reclassification equals 'safe'. It does not
Dr Peter Maguire
"When we return to office, we will reclassify cannabis back to Class B."
There were two "perfectly arguable" positions on cannabis, he said - that it should remain a class B drug or that it should be legalised.
Mr Howard warned: "It seems to me that there is absolutely no case for what is a massive muddle in the middle."
Prime Minister Tony Blair used Question Time in the Commons on Wednesday to reinforce the message that the police still had power of arrest in relation to possession of cannabis.
'Fully researched'
Home Office Drugs Minister Caroline Flint said the radio adverts and leaflets had been months in the making.
"They have been fully researched and tested with young people to make sure the message is both effective and credible to our target audience," she said.
"We are beginning the drive a week before reclassification to make sure it has its greatest impact."
Using the radio ads alone, the government expected to reach 81% of 15-to-17-year-olds and 41% of adults, Ms Flint said.
"We are being honest to young people about the harm cannabis can cause in comparison to drugs such as crack and heroin."
Independent charity Drugscope supports the reclassification of cannabis on 29 January and the advertising campaign, but says some people may have been led to believe that the drug was being legalised.
It says the ads should go further and talk rationally about the health risks of taking cannabis.
Dr Peter Maguire, deputy chairman of the British Medical Association's board of science, welcomed efforts to highlight the drug's dangers.
But he said: "The BMA is extremely concerned that the public might think that reclassification equals 'safe'. It does not."
Cannabis adverts stress dangers[B/]
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/3418219.stm
Doctors fear reclassification might make cannabis seem safe
A £1m campaign to warn people that cannabis will still be harmful and illegal despite changes to the law is being launched on Thursday.
The government is targeting young people with radio adverts and leaflets before cannabis is reclassified next week from a class B to a class C drug.
Tory leader Michael Howard has said that his party would reverse the move.
His warning came after doctors' leaders and drugs charity workers expressed some concern over the reclassification.
Information packs
The latest campaign from the government's drugs information service, called Frank, warns young people that possession is still a criminal offence.
It seems to me that there is absolutely no case for what is a massive muddle in the middle.
Tory leader Michael Howard
The radio adverts will be played on 48 national and regional commercial radio stations in England.
Wales, Scotland and Northern Ireland are tailoring the adverts and leaflets to fit their existing campaigns.
Two-and-a-half million leaflets outlining the latest position on drugs and the law will be distributed.
Information packs promoting the message will be sent out to all schools drug advisors, drug action teams, drug charities, health organisations and student unions.
'Absurd'
The Tories denounced the reclassification of cannabis as "absurd".
Mr Howard told the Independent newspaper: "After thinking about this very carefully, we have come to the view that the government's decision is misconceived.
The BMA is extremely concerned that the public might think that reclassification equals 'safe'. It does not
Dr Peter Maguire
"When we return to office, we will reclassify cannabis back to Class B."
There were two "perfectly arguable" positions on cannabis, he said - that it should remain a class B drug or that it should be legalised.
Mr Howard warned: "It seems to me that there is absolutely no case for what is a massive muddle in the middle."
Prime Minister Tony Blair used Question Time in the Commons on Wednesday to reinforce the message that the police still had power of arrest in relation to possession of cannabis.
'Fully researched'
Home Office Drugs Minister Caroline Flint said the radio adverts and leaflets had been months in the making.
"They have been fully researched and tested with young people to make sure the message is both effective and credible to our target audience," she said.
"We are beginning the drive a week before reclassification to make sure it has its greatest impact."
Using the radio ads alone, the government expected to reach 81% of 15-to-17-year-olds and 41% of adults, Ms Flint said.
"We are being honest to young people about the harm cannabis can cause in comparison to drugs such as crack and heroin."
Independent charity Drugscope supports the reclassification of cannabis on 29 January and the advertising campaign, but says some people may have been led to believe that the drug was being legalised.
It says the ads should go further and talk rationally about the health risks of taking cannabis.
Dr Peter Maguire, deputy chairman of the British Medical Association's board of science, welcomed efforts to highlight the drug's dangers.
But he said: "The BMA is extremely concerned that the public might think that reclassification equals 'safe'. It does not."
- Joined
- Jul 22, 2002
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- 66,950
seethe303 said:
it could have been but the "coroner recorded that single Mr Maisey...died from cannabis toxicity." (my emphasis)
while it's clear that empirical evidence shows us that marijuana is an extremely safe drug (compared to many other drugs), blowing this off and calling it bullshit - for whatever reason - seems like a kneejerk reaction.
underestimating the danger of a specific drug is surely as inadvisable as exaggerating it. BL is a harm-reduction website and an unemotional focus on the facts is, surely, essential to the mission?
alasdair
switchy85
Bluelighter
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- Dec 29, 2003
- Messages
- 270
alasdairm said:
What the coroner probably did was ASSUME marijuana was the cause of death. This is a common fallacy called "Post Hoc, Ergo Propter Hoc". This means directly, "After this, therefore because of this".
This is a perfect example because the man died, and he had smoked some joints before hand, so it must have been the weed that killed him, right? Sort of like the Columbine shooting kids. They played violent video games and listened to rock music before they killed those people, so that must have caused it. Even though many people (myself included) play and watch the same things and never kill anyone.
A lot of people smoke weed (even a LOT of weed), but only this man has died right afterward.
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- 66,950
switchy85 said:
and what you are doing is assuming that the coroner assumed...
my point stands - don't blow this off simply because you believe (or would like to believe) that it's bullshit.
if you truly want to win 'the war on drugs' do some critical thinking and take some action based on sound reasoning and factual evidence. if you ignore one side of the debate, you simply give it more power...
alasdair
dr seuss
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- Feb 3, 2001
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- 18,002
thanks to deko for finding the following:
http://www.pembrokeshirecoroner.org...s.php?autoid=46
More info.
http://www.pembrokeshirecoroner.org/coroner/faq.php#1
1) Cannabis Toxicity. What was the inquest about?
An inquest was held on 18th December 2003 into the death of Lee John Maisey who had died on 24th August 2003. A full auopsy had been carried out which had failed to reveal a cause of death. A histological examination also failed to establish a cause of death and, in consequence, a toxicological examination on blood samples obtained was carried out by Forensic Alliance. The samples showed a high concentration of Carboxy-THC, consistent with heavy cannabis usage. There were also traces of cannabidiol, indicating that cannabis and/or cannabis resin was used within a few hours of death. In the view of the pathologist, and in the absence of any other significant abnormality in spite of exhaustive investigation,it was likely that death occurred as a manifestation of cannabis toxicity. The coroner recorded a verdict of death by misadventure and that the cause of death was probable cannabis toxicity.
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so basically they found no cause, and attributed it to cannabis.
guys, at least try and see what's going on behind this. cannabis is being declassified in the uk now. there have been three stories in the past weeks where coroners have largely offered their personal opinions about the perils of cannabis use.
now, bear in mind - again - that these views are representative of a minority of medical, professional and public opinion. i'm sure there are rogue coroners/judges in other countries who insist that marijuana causes permanent insanity and makes you want to eat children. the public want declassification and probably legalisation; the government responded, which is why i can walk down the street smoking a joint and not worry. although that's been the case for the five years i've lived here, so...
as for this:
hey man, with all due respect, what the fuck are you on about?
this article is indeed bullshit. but hey, at least it's not fox. or cnn. or any number of incredibly self-absorbed propagandist piss that passes for news where you come from.
everything about england sucks - what, presumably you mean the fact that we can walk down the street smoking joints? or that drugs are cheap? or that mushrooms are legally available? damn, your country scheduled amyl nitrites - what a fucking joke.
when it comes to drug hysteria and misinformation, i'm afraid that england merely attended a few lessons at the US govt. school of indoctrination. you should be familiar with the US's policy combining wholesale exportation of anti-drug propaganda and coercive adoption of harsh anti-drug legislation, backed by sanctions?
at least england doesn't try to tell the rest of the world that they should lock up their drug users. in fact, my friend, if it wasn't for the US government's sustained application of fear-mongering, we probably wouldn't even be having this debate because cannabis would have REMAINED legal in the uk. after all, when the Home Office was initially asked to criminalise cannabis, they saw no need to and refused three times. read up on the US involvement in the decision and you may be suprised.
have you ever been to england?
it might also suprise you.
http://www.pembrokeshirecoroner.org...s.php?autoid=46
More info.
http://www.pembrokeshirecoroner.org/coroner/faq.php#1
1) Cannabis Toxicity. What was the inquest about?
An inquest was held on 18th December 2003 into the death of Lee John Maisey who had died on 24th August 2003. A full auopsy had been carried out which had failed to reveal a cause of death. A histological examination also failed to establish a cause of death and, in consequence, a toxicological examination on blood samples obtained was carried out by Forensic Alliance. The samples showed a high concentration of Carboxy-THC, consistent with heavy cannabis usage. There were also traces of cannabidiol, indicating that cannabis and/or cannabis resin was used within a few hours of death. In the view of the pathologist, and in the absence of any other significant abnormality in spite of exhaustive investigation,it was likely that death occurred as a manifestation of cannabis toxicity. The coroner recorded a verdict of death by misadventure and that the cause of death was probable cannabis toxicity.
-------------
so basically they found no cause, and attributed it to cannabis.
guys, at least try and see what's going on behind this. cannabis is being declassified in the uk now. there have been three stories in the past weeks where coroners have largely offered their personal opinions about the perils of cannabis use.
now, bear in mind - again - that these views are representative of a minority of medical, professional and public opinion. i'm sure there are rogue coroners/judges in other countries who insist that marijuana causes permanent insanity and makes you want to eat children. the public want declassification and probably legalisation; the government responded, which is why i can walk down the street smoking a joint and not worry. although that's been the case for the five years i've lived here, so...
as for this:
hey man, with all due respect, what the fuck are you on about?
this article is indeed bullshit. but hey, at least it's not fox. or cnn. or any number of incredibly self-absorbed propagandist piss that passes for news where you come from
. everything about england sucks - what, presumably you mean the fact that we can walk down the street smoking joints? or that drugs are cheap? or that mushrooms are legally available? damn, your country scheduled amyl nitrites - what a fucking joke.
when it comes to drug hysteria and misinformation, i'm afraid that england merely attended a few lessons at the US govt. school of indoctrination. you should be familiar with the US's policy combining wholesale exportation of anti-drug propaganda and coercive adoption of harsh anti-drug legislation, backed by sanctions?
at least england doesn't try to tell the rest of the world that they should lock up their drug users. in fact, my friend, if it wasn't for the US government's sustained application of fear-mongering, we probably wouldn't even be having this debate because cannabis would have REMAINED legal in the uk. after all, when the Home Office was initially asked to criminalise cannabis, they saw no need to and refused three times. read up on the US involvement in the decision and you may be suprised.
have you ever been to england?
it might also suprise you.
Xenomaniac
Bluelighter
- Joined
- Jun 9, 2002
- Messages
- 799
ha knew it was bullshit!
Monster_ZERO
Bluelighter
- Joined
- Feb 20, 2002
- Messages
- 1,306
Maybe there is a more plausible explanation?
from: http://www.tenby-today.co.uk/news/newsdetail.cfm?id=71730
The effects of alcohol withdrawal.
from: http://www.tenby-today.co.uk/news/newsdetail.cfm?id=71730
The effects of alcohol withdrawal.
plastic bathmat
Bluelighter
- Joined
- Jan 24, 2004
- Messages
- 31
Yep, I'm sorry, but there's every likelihood that the coroner was himself an anti-dope, telegraph reading fuckwit and put it down to that. I notice they did a tox screen and only cannabix turned up, but have they given any indication as to how the cannabis killed him? Just toxicity? Any evidence then? No? Never mind, it's never stoppped us media types before. 6 joints a day for 11 years? Big woop - I've been smoking constantly now for about 9, and I probably have about 10 bongs a day. Why am I not dead then? Why aren't more people dead? I know folk have different tolerance levels, but surely we'd be seeing more than 1 death.... And the fact he smoked 6 joints for 11 years means fuck all - it only stays in your system for 3 months. Now, fair enough, if they were saying he'd had some kind of long term health problem as a result, the fact he'd smoked for years would be pertinent, but if he died from 'toxicity' then those facts mean fuck all. As far as I'm aware, this isn't the first reported death from cannabis in the UK, it's the first reported case in the world, and all the information just stinks. I am completely convinced it's utter bollocks.
And dr seuss - spot on. If it wasn't for America's persistent attempts to act like the scooby gang at the start of the century, the whole world'd still be tokeing. We would have gotten away for it too if it wasn't for those pesky yankees.
I'm not english - I'm scottish, which probably gives me more right to come out with stupid, ignorant, bigoted comments a la The Wood, but I won't because thus far I've managed to keep my braincells intact. What a fucking stupid thing to say. I've spent a lot of time living in the states, and one thing that's beyond question is the fact that your journalism, particularly televisual journalism, is amongst the biggest pile of dumbed down crap I've ever seen. I'll admit, we have our total turkey papers - this article was in the Telegraph, which is a right-wing ragpile, but still. I'd be very surprised if I found out you'd even visited england, so until you do try using your brain before posting buttmunch comments again.
And dr seuss - spot on. If it wasn't for America's persistent attempts to act like the scooby gang at the start of the century, the whole world'd still be tokeing. We would have gotten away for it too if it wasn't for those pesky yankees.
I'm not english - I'm scottish, which probably gives me more right to come out with stupid, ignorant, bigoted comments a la The Wood, but I won't because thus far I've managed to keep my braincells intact. What a fucking stupid thing to say. I've spent a lot of time living in the states, and one thing that's beyond question is the fact that your journalism, particularly televisual journalism, is amongst the biggest pile of dumbed down crap I've ever seen. I'll admit, we have our total turkey papers - this article was in the Telegraph, which is a right-wing ragpile, but still. I'd be very surprised if I found out you'd even visited england, so until you do try using your brain before posting buttmunch comments again.
agreed
I agree with the UK guys...hell the people overseas are going to the people if anyone is to help crush the DEA and their senseless butchering of lives with the ridiculous drug laws that we have. I wish I could say I'd still be around to see it all happen, but it probably won't be in my lifetime. But hey, that's why I'm moving out of the US as soon as I'm on my feet and able and done serving my sentence here for drug "crimes."
I agree with the UK guys...hell the people overseas are going to the people if anyone is to help crush the DEA and their senseless butchering of lives with the ridiculous drug laws that we have. I wish I could say I'd still be around to see it all happen, but it probably won't be in my lifetime. But hey, that's why I'm moving out of the US as soon as I'm on my feet and able and done serving my sentence here for drug "crimes."