Curious why everyone writes DOPr with a lowercase r, when Shulgin capitalized it. Very minor detail, but is there some significance to it?
Having never tried a DOx, I am curious about the overall, general differences between DOx and 2C-x. I thought the amphetamine derivatives would be more stimulating and they are obviously longer lasting. But neverwing mentioned above how 2cp is more stimulating than DOPR.
The “amphetamine” part of the name has always been a bit off putting to me even though I know that doesn’t make sense. I’m a fan of psychedelics but that’s about it for drugs.
Are DOx considered strictly psychedelics? From the descriptions I’ve read they certainly seem so, but I’m wondering does it feel like a mix of a psychedelic and a stimulant? I guess that could be said for certain 2cx or 4 sub tryouts too - the combo of psych and stim. Sorry this is not the right thread for my questions.
Yeah, what Nervewing and Xorkoth said. Shulgin's nomenclature is ultimately pretty arbitrary, and he talks about that in PIHKAL at length. It's not a formal system, but it's a better than the completely arbitrary numbers and the less unwieldy than going full IUPAC.
I don't have enough experience with the class to say for sure, but I will say that DOM and DOC both share a quality of stimulation that is unlike that of other non-amphetamine psychedelics. I am not aware of any pharmacological basis for this (Nervewing's info is on point,) so I'm inclined to attribute it to placebo on my part. Let me just say that I generally hate stimution when on psychedelics. I tend to experience it as anxiety, something I'm not otherwise prone to in daily life. I also do enjoy stimulants, but don't use them recreationally with the exception of methylxanthines like caffeine. The stimulation I get from drugs like 5-MeO-MET or 2C-B feels uncomfortable to me, gritty and forced and enervating. The stimulation I get from DOM and DOC is *nothing* like that. Instead, I feel secure and content, strong, and stable. It's like an exceedingly grounded dexedrine, where I actually feel calm. Maybe I just have undiagnosed ADHD, who knows? ;-) But yeah, I actually feel much calmer and less scattered and tweaky with DOM and DOC than I do on many tryptamine, lysergamide, and phenethylamine psychedelics.
On the other hand, that could also because DOM is a bit on the empty/neutral side of things in my experience, and chlorine substitutions (at least in 2C-C) seem to be sedating for people. DOPr sounds rather dissociative, so that may contribute. Early reports of DOB were that it was a very gritty stimulating psychedelic, but the duration there could also be a factor. I really wish I knew.
As for whether or not the DOx are psychedelics, I'm on the fence. Some (DOPr, DOM, DOI, DOC, DOB) most definitely are true, dyed-in-the-wool psychedelics entire. Some of the others (looking at you, DOF...DOET...) are psychedelics, sure, but not necessarily in a sense that would be recognized by everyone. DOiP seems to be psychedelic, but mostly stimulating, I think? And then there are the 3C-x, which are a whole mess of what sounds like might be as many as three different phases of activity.
And as for the DOx being more hardcore than the 2C-x class, I wouldn't say that at all. I used to think the same thing. Yes, they usually last longer and are harder to abort with benzos, but that's about all that makes is more challenging about them as a rule imo. 2C-E is nuts, and while I've heard that DOM can be that way, 2C-E as a rule is a mind melter. 2C-P sounds every bit as full value as DOPr and used to reguarly be compared to 2C-E in intensity. Based on 4-5 trips so far, I find DOM and DOC to be no more or less intimidating for me than the 2C-x drugs, which to be honest I never expected. If anything, I've found them to be more grounded and of this world, more mentally clear and less dementing.
For me both DOC and DOI were very subtle and mostly just peripheral stimulation. Could have been the dose, 2-3mg
For each (been a looooong time)
then again 2CE was super subtle for me, whereas 2c-I and B (And 2cbfly) are very active in my bioassay chalice
Whoah. Yeah, if that's the case, then I think it will be hard to predict how you will react. I know of a sizeable handful of people who find 2C-E to be nothing but eye candy, but they're definitely a tiny minority. 2C-I and 2C-B-FLY are often described as being lightweight. YMMV, but 2-3mg of DOC should be plenty. DOI...well, I'm not interested in exploring that one, I don't think. You never know, but it doesn't sound like anything I would want to take except as a microdose for inflammation.
Do you find that hiking or moving around to be the best way to curb bodyload from other psychedelics as well, 2ce for example?
I’ve heard others suggest that you lay down relatively still for the 2ce comeup, but I’ve wondered if that just makes me more focused on it
Yes, I wanted to mention that. With both DOM and DOC, I do find that the first two hours may give me some excess somatic energy that I need to release through hiking or that sort of thing, otherwise it can be uncomfortable. After that, though, I can pretty much lay on the couch for the rest of it if I feel like it, or dance the night away.
sounds quite interesting. Could see it being an introduction to the DOx family, at least if I was the previous decade’s porkstock!
