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☛ Official ☚ The Big & Dandy DOC Thread - Third opinion

It's not that it's strongly empathic, though it is, some, it's that DOC is a damn strong drug. I've had both good and lackluster results trying to add things to DOC. I've tried combining tryptamines or phenethylamines about 10-12 hours after dosing, and it's been a waste some of the times, yet others it's been wonderful. There's no harm in it, maybe you'll have a great combo effect, I only tried combining with MDMA once because I rarely have MDMA at hand.
 
Fuck, I love DOC, but it's so long lasting that I don't think I'll have time for it in the future I've got ahead, except for maybe some 2-3 days festival? (That I just tend to do once or twice a year now...). It was the main drug I took on my early years (From 18 to 20 years old) but those were some reckless times without worries or goals on life. Last time I took a DOx was DOM this year at a 2 days festival and I was a bit grumpy the second day and just wanting the whole looooong stimulant afterglow to come down in order to be able to get some sleep.

I think I'll stick to LSD for my parties in advance... I'm getting annoyingly old :(
 
DOC is a most interesting substance indeed. I took 1.5mg IM and the come up was definitely shortened, but overall duration was largely unchanged.
It also seems to raise tolerance much more than any other substance I've tried. Due to timings I was tripping on a Thursday and then the following Saturday (not a normal event, just circumstance!).
I took two hits of decent LSD (1.5 have given me a decent strong trip in the past) along with 250ug of ALD52. I got some effect, but barely anything. Another 250ug of ALD after 1.5 hours and still disappointing. In for a penny, in for a pound, and 20mg 2C-E rectal finally gave some payback. Not something I would repeat as the sheer quantities involved were stupid.
I rarely trip close in succession like that, but when I have then I can usually get a decent trip. It seems that the DOC raises tolerance to stupid levels.

I should add that a six week break from psychedelics is now on the cards!
 
I understand that DOC isn't for everybody, but few psychedelics are. To dismiss it as being an illegitimate psychedelic just because you couldn't appreciate it is absurd. I have had many experiences with DOC and found it to be one of the most pleasant and well-rounded psychedelics I have taken. I would actually favour it in certain situations over mushrooms or LSD as I find it to be a very lucid experience.

I have always been able to communicate clearly and compose thoughts while on DOC. I enjoy the perspective shift that I get from psilocybin and LSD, but it can be a fair bit to process. DOC I find to be less complex, which can be a good thing when I am just looking to have a fun time.
 
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whynaught said:
DOC is absolute shit. It's like a body load of seratonigenic hallucinogens except no introspection, insight, spiritual effects. When I came down off it my brain would like shut off for a second just laying there.. kind of like dying for a second and coming back. I'd see a bright light or a tree with light behind it and come back like fuck I think my brain just about died. Take legitimate psychedelics.. you want ego death not actual death...
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Yeah we're all affected differently. For me this doesn't describe DOC at all. It definitely has more bodyload than LSD for example, but I find it has some great effects. I wouldn't use it for a spiritual breakthrough sort of experience, but it's really good for working through emotional or mental things, or getting interesting perspectives on the world or universe. Very introspective for me. After the peak it makes me feel really smart, like I'm operating at 110% mental capacity.

This is how it works for me... different strokes for different folks. Lots of people really like it but some don't.
 
psy997 said:
By following Saturday do you mean two days later or eight?
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Two days later. Like I said, it's not a normal occurrence, and I wouldn't do it again (certainly not two days after taking DOC), but I was with an old friend who I won't see again for about a year. DOC is, IMHO a great psychedelic, but produces a very high tolerance in other substances in my opinion hence the time to take a break.
 
A bit more speedy than LSD. I wouldn't say has a bad bodyload, but the long duration can be exhausting and to get some sleep might take a long time.
For me DOC is a winner, though a just once a year thing. I can understand other people don't liking it...just like flavours.
 
For me the physical effects were fairly uncomfortable until I got outside and got moving. And this is from someone who has almost no issue with bodyload ever, and when I do, am able to breathe / yoga / stretch my way out of it fairly easily.

A "microdose" of .75mg two days after a 1.75mg trip had me feeling like dying inside my apartment to the point that I took a shot of vodka and doses of tianeptine throughout the day to try and combat it.

To me this chemical is the epitome of one to only take when physical activity is guaranteed and plentiful. Trying to take it and stay inside is asking for trouble.
 
My experience agrees much with psy997's. I spent pretty much my whole 2.5 mg trip inside at home, and the body load was pretty uncomfortable for a solid ten hours, honestly one of the worst I've ever had from any drug. By comparison, LSD is so clean to me that if I wasn't hallucinating I might not even realize I'm on a drug.

The psychedelic effects of DOC were great for me, but it really wasn't conducive to the kinds of trips I've been doing lately, like lying down and meditating with tryptamines. Next time I'll definitely only use it when there are opportunities for physical activity, or at least a much larger safe space to pace around in.
 
whynaught said:
DOC is absolute shit. It's like a body load of seratonigenic hallucinogens except no introspection, insight, spiritual effects. When I came down off it my brain would like shut off for a second just laying there.. kind of like dying for a second and coming back. I'd see a bright light or a tree with light behind it and come back like fuck I think my brain just about died. Take legitimate psychedelics.. you want ego death not actual death...
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Sorry that you don't get introspection or insight etc from it, but there is no reason to suspect that a zap like the one you describe is dangerous. I've had something exactly like that on mescaline and yes it was abrupt and a bit scary and I was completely gone for a second, then it repeated and got longer and longer. I'd rate it as some kind of an OOBE but also akin to ego death. I'd call mescaline pretty legitimate.
Then there's also the brain zaps MDMA, mushrooms and SSRI withdrawal are notorious for but those aren't considered harmful either...

But you're allowed to dislike DOC of course.

I liked it and would do it again, whereas with DOB I'm quite done.
 
psy997 said:
For me the physical effects were fairly uncomfortable until I got outside and got moving. And this is from someone who has almost no issue with bodyload ever, and when I do, am able to breathe / yoga / stretch my way out of it fairly easily.

A "microdose" of .75mg two days after a 1.75mg trip had me feeling like dying inside my apartment to the point that I took a shot of vodka and doses of tianeptine throughout the day to try and combat it.

To me this chemical is the epitome of one to only take when physical activity is guaranteed and plentiful. Trying to take it and stay inside is asking for trouble.
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Indeed, I only take DOC when I'm going to spend the day outside. I love it for hiking and camping, or a music festival. If I am moving around and exerting energy I find the body high to feel great. If I sit around at home, it's pretty overwhelming and uncomfortable.
 
It's interesting how you describe this "zap" of ego death/unconsciousness.

I haven't had that, but I *did* tend to get these sort of longer-lasting fugue-like states fading in an out for as long as an hour.

By which I mean just... blankly staring, no movement, no thoughts. And time would pass me by and I'd wonder if I'd fallen asleep or something but then I'd just realize that no, I had just... stopped thinking.

It didn't feel dangerous at all. I did find it unpleasant though. To me it was just a sort of viscerally-synched expression of the confusion that the drug can produce--it's a strange one in that regard: I find it very "level" in nature. Not manic like LSD or chaotic like tryptamines. More sobering--not boring or uninsightful... just sobering. At its best (hours in, past the peak, but not so far past that you're just wishing you could sleep) it provides for a seriously cognitive kind of psychedelia--actual hard thinking, rather than just confusing delusions of patterns and connections where none exist or where your sober self already would have known they exist.

But at its worst... at the head of the comeup, it feels (to me) like you're being pressed back into your seat under the weight of a heavy acceleration. Like launching in a drag race. Or blasting off in a rocket ship. That analogy exists for DMT because it feels like it takes you rapidly into another world... but the actual sensation of it seems much more apt when describing DOC. You feel it mentally as well as physically. You're wide awake and full of energy... yet unable to move, unable to talk, even thinking is slow and difficult--it's hard to draw your mind to something outside of the raw sensory overload (even though, at least for me, there are never any visuals yet at this point).

Except the launch takes two hours instead of two minutes.

Luckily, you feel *instantly* better once you manage to force yourself to start moving around. Once you're moving, you suddenly feel like motion takes no effort at all, and it's *stillness* that exhausts you.

FYI I've gotten similar states from other drugs, including sunifiram, fasoracetam, and tianeptine. I'd imagine that taking tianeptine with DOC would make that confusion more likely to pop up.
 
Yeah the comeup 2-3 hours can really suck and range from uncomfortable to weird or apparently worse. IMO assuming you have the energy to go the duration, it's the main downside to DOC - I didn't have many others.
I think it probably really pays to find a way to skip or ramp up that comeup quickly like by nasal or vaped administration?

Your fugue state sounds like dissociation and even amnesia... In xIHKAL sometimes such strange states of consciousness are described like Beth state or fugue state. I wouldn't be too quick to categorize a drug based on a limited number of times or limited number of people who react that way.

Interesting that sunifiram also caused something like that, would not have expected it.
 
Great post InterestingFACT! The levelness you describe is spot on with my experience, so aptly described. The rest as well, but I just had to say something having seen that aspect mentioned.
 
InterestingFACT said:
I haven't had that, but I *did* tend to get these sort of longer-lasting fugue-like states fading in an out for as long as an hour.

By which I mean just... blankly staring, no movement, no thoughts. And time would pass me by and I'd wonder if I'd fallen asleep or something but then I'd just realize that no, I had just... stopped thinking.

It didn't feel dangerous at all. I did find it unpleasant though. To me it was just a sort of viscerally-synched expression of the confusion that the drug can produce--it's a strange one in that regard: I find it very "level" in nature. Not manic like LSD or chaotic like tryptamines. More sobering--not boring or uninsightful... just sobering. At its best (hours in, past the peak, but not so far past that you're just wishing you could sleep) it provides for a seriously cognitive kind of psychedelia--actual hard thinking, rather than just confusing delusions of patterns and connections where none exist or where your sober self already would have known they exist.
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I can really relate to this, but I wouldn't have been able to put it into words. Your description just gave me a Deja Vu feeling. Great analysis!
 
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