Okay. Wow, you guys are thickheaded on one issue. This rave was illegal. This rave was illegal. This rave was ILLEGAL. Do you not understand this? The man who organized this event did not obtain *any* mass gathering permits from Utah county. He did get a mass gathering permit from the state, but he did not seek the approval of the county he was in.
SOURCE: SALT LAKE TRIBUNE.
The article is even posted in this thread, I believe page two or three. I even bought the god damn newspaper with the article!!! So quit saying it was legal, because it was not. So next time when you argue something, make sure you have the facts first. Saying this rave was legal is a lie, is misinformation, and completely false.
I do not think this rave is illegal, I *know* it is illegal. The Utah County Police Department also regarded and commented the illegality of the rave as well as politicians of Utah County. Of course, those who create the laws as well as those who enforce it can't be trusted on that right? So that is why I posted the article.
funkyboyfloyd, you do not know me at all, you do not know my life, so don't try to claim you do kid. I have shed much insight on my life on this website, but obviously you haven't even been here long enough to see that. For your information, I use. I am far from a cop, it is hilarious you people are comparing me to one! I can't stand them personally, and I think it takes a certain and specific kind of person to become a cop.
I post in the media section to post my unbiased comments and acknowledge fact in the face of those who are biased. Yes, drugs should be legal. Yes, we should be able to rave 24/7 if we wish to. Yes, cops suck. Yes, if we are not bothering anyone with our drug usage in a fucking deserted valley with some music, friends, and drugs, we should be able to without big brother breathing down our neck. Unfortunately, that is not how the America is today, and we must play by the rules if we want to make a change in that direction. You must abandon emotion in this kind of case and look at the facts.
My heart goes out to those who were busted and mistreated in the rave. However, by the book, there was nothing wrong with the police conduct, and everything wrong with the rave. It is up to us to make a change to make sure we can do this without this kind of shit happening, but we have to do it by the book.
It is okay for pigs to treat "peeps" like this because it is their job. Ever heard of guilt by association? When a drug or weapon is found, everyone in the vicinity is treated as a potential threat and suspect. It is also for their own protection. Out of the thousands there, who knows who has a gun and to secondguess because you don't want someone to scrape their elbow may result in serious injury or death. Is that chance small? Yea. But are you willing to bet your life that no one in that huge crowd had a gun and may want to attack the cops out of fear, mental instability, or anger?
You know what, sorry about the murderers. But they were only two potential nutcases. The rave was filled with a *potential* thousands of nutcases. In the case of two people, they are alot easier to secure and put into custody.
Wow. Making this event as an excuse to blow on Bush. That is a low blow. You are using complete emotion and insubstantial guesswork to turn this into something against Bush. Please, if you are going to bash anyone, especially the President of America, make your bashes based on fact. You wouldn't do that to a stranger would you? You wouldn't attack someone, verbal or otherwise, without having concrete evidence, would you? I'm afraid of the answer...
Actually, I believe the majority of those against Bush are anti-American. Why? For example, many say "Get the fuck out of Iraq!". Many say "We should desert Israel". Many say "9/11, Breslan, Madrid, New York, London are not reason enough for attacking the terrorists". Well, I wonder what bin Laden, Al-Qaeda, Al-Jezer, and Hamas would say. But that is off tangent.
DarthMom, I do not want to live in a world where police are violent. I, however, have the "power" of empathy. I understand the police have a tough job; they are constantly putting their life on the line for the security of the community, for the safety of Joe Citizen, and are simply following orders from representatives of the community. But besides that, there are often cases of police brutality. I have been victim of such myself. I do wish the police were perfect and were not so overzealous and aggresive in cases where it is completely unnecessary. But hey, what can you do? We can complain, which does make some difference, but like crime, it will always exist.
Perhaps their claim about injuries was in regard to what they perceived as major injuries. No one had any injuries they wouldn't heal from in a month. However that is probably the result of pressure from media.
So one person was found with a gun. Whoop right? Well, sorry to tell you this, but the police are not psychic. They did not know that. The police had no clue how many nutcases, guns, or violent drunks were at the rave. And probably, as a result of the Drug Misinformation Campaign in America, they believed that everyone at the rave was under the influence of the Deadly Ecstasy, which makes you attack those you don't like with superhuman force.
My point being in the last paragraph, besides the sad truth of how terrible the current drug policy is in America, is that they could not be sure. Better to be safe than sorry. If they had assumed everyone their was nice and unarmed, and had came into the rave, wha twould happen if they were wrong and some psychotic lunatic attacked? Even you cannot deny that at least one lunatic showed up. There are lunatics everywhere.
OR, they could assume everyone was dangerous. That way when someone attacks, they were prepared and safe. Better to scrape some elbows than lose a life right? It is a matter of pespective. It is similiar to Iraq. If they DID have WMDs, and we chose to ignore it, and they chose to attack America, we wouldve lost millions in lives and billions in damage. If they didn't have WMDs and we go in, we lose a couple thousand lives and a few billion dollars, but we gain an ally, we free a country under a terrible dictator, and we eliminate some terrorists. No one can deny that Iraq is a better place now, and there is nothing wrong with freeing a country from tyranny. That was a little off tangent, but a good example.
I was not aware there was security. It is just sad that the organizer tried so hard to make this work and was just forgetful enough to not get the right mass gathering pass from the county. You are again misguided Darthmom, as I have posted many times on this thread, this rave was *ILLEGAL*.
SheeshKeebab.... well, yes I would think so. A scraped knee or a bruised arm is nothing to raise Kaine about. A broken arm or some deep cut, that would be pretty serious and excessive force if you were not resisting arrest.
Also, SheeshKeebab, I have no doubt that this event was made as a showcase, a threat and warning for future events. I completely agree with you here, the mass gathering permit violation was a front for the police to barge in and bust everyone on drug charges. It is like getting pulled over and then the cop having dogs sniff your car, and then busted for drugs. If the organizer had the correct mass gathering permits, this would not have happened.
Personally, I think the ravers should be pissed at the organizer for fucking up this bad! Sixty people arrested and fucked in the ass by the cops simply because he did not get a permit from the county. They should literally hang his ass for being so incompetant!!!
skiforlife, can you please provide sources or proof of your statement about how our country is run by such characters? Please back your claims with fact before making such outlandish claims. And regardless, they are an extreme minority compared to the legitamate characters running the country.
I don't believe anyone got the shit beat out of them by batons in this raid. Again, please provide a reliable source or proof of this before making such an outlandish claim.
Again, legality did not "take a back seat". This rave was clearly illegal, and no one in the right mind would have a reasonable doubt drugs would be present at this rave. This was no event where "religiously influenced" will was pushed on others. Perhaps the laws which were created in regards to the illegality of the rave and the drugs found there were religiously influenced, but not this episode. The police only carried out their jobs.
CONCLUSION: This rave was completely illegal, and I have sourced this fact. You can also take a look at the Utah County Code, which is probably available online. I completely agree that the police used this simple violation as a front to make multiple drug busts and showcase that illegal raves with drugs will not be tolerated.
I believe that this raid was actually a case of extreme unbrutality because no one was hospitalized in this event. If you even scream "Bomb" in a crowded area with thousands of people, there will most likely be at least one hospitalization. Fuck, there was a Beatles concert where people died just from the quick moving crowd! The police were looking out for their own safety first as they conducted the raid, and a few elbows were scraped. Better that then being caught off guard and shot though.
The current Drug Policy in America is draconian and extremely misleading. I have no doubt this contributed to some of the scraped elbows of this event. We should take this event as an example of why we must legally protest our current drug standards, and lobby for a complete reform.