Misc (Safe) Legal Highs anyone?

[Scrofula]

I also agree with speed king. Traditionally prepared kava root powder is wonderful if you just want something to change your headspace, and it isn't physically addictive. Kava is great stuff

It does do awful things to your liver though. I actually got a pretty bad rash after using a lot of plain old domestic extract, which seems to be one of those 20% incidence things with it.

 

[Slow_Mobius]

It does do awful things to your liver though. I actually got a pretty bad rash after using a lot of plain old domestic extract, which seems to be one of those 20% incidence things with it.

That's largely a myth. The aerial parts of the plant can contain heptotoxic compounds that are efficiently extracted with many organic solvents, but the roots from noble kava cultivars are perfectly safe.

For this reason, it's a good idea to avoid kava extracts and stick to getting noble root powder from reputed vendors. You can still get something called kava dermopathy with heavy use, but it will eventually go away with cessation and it's pretty harmless. The dermopathy can usually be avoided by straining out the powder with a very fine mesh.

However, kava still inhibits many liver enzymes, so it can interact with a lot of medications and it's still a good idea to avoid taking it with other drugs that are extensively metabolized by the liver (like alcohol or Tylenol)

 

[Speed King]

remember that this boils down to your mileage may vary. We are not promising anything. Now it works correctly for the right people. They know who they are,
Best advice? take it with a sober friend to get the most out of the experience. It is effective if you don't abuse it. Watch your liver while taking healthy dosages. Getting a liver check up or simply not drinking or burdening the liver, You should be fine,

 

[~kira~]

You took 40mg after being clean for years? I’m not surprised you got nauseus...I bet you were itching to high hell too, I’m amazed you even managed to stay awake. You started way too high - try taking a much lower dose, similar to the doses you took when you first started.

Yeah I know. Well this was a year or 2 ago. I had 1 pill that was available. Decided not to take half and yeah, ended up sick and just slept. No itch or anything. lol. But I don't talk to anyone that does any of that anymore.

If you have had problems control your substance use in the past kratom is probably best avoided. The dependency with it is relatively minor compared to other opioids, but it is still really shitty and, other than the fact it is legal, can totally rule ones like any other habit forming substance.

My question is, are you looking for a recreational kinda high or something for more special occassions? I’d look into entheogens if you’re okay with only using once in a while. But there aren’t many safe and legal substances that can be used recreationally on a daily basis without many issues other than cannabis.

I think the more important question is what substances the OP has had issues with in the past? Or addictive/compulsive type behaviors? Like, what is it that you are working on in terms of improving your health? If you’re struggled with a type of substance in the past it’s best to avoid similar substance for recreational use (e.g. if you’ve had issues with alcohol avoid gabaergic stuff like phenibut; if you’ve struggled with opioids, avoid kratom or other opioids like substances).

I’d strongly recommend putting your efforts into learning new healthy skills. Learn how to practice mindfulness based meditation, learn xigong/tai chi or a martial art, learn how to make pottery or paint, learn how to compose music or play an instrument, etc. in other words, drugs are fun but if you put your efforts into seriously learning how to use drugs at the cost of other healthier pursuits it is unlikely to end well.

And you will always be able to trip balls once in a while if you put your time into healthier activities. I’d strongly suggest broadening your horizons outside drug use and then just taking a trip to Central America to enjoy some ayahuasca or take a trip to the Netherlands and enjoy some legal shrooms. Save the drug experiences for something really special.

Do you have medical/mental health concerns that lead you to want to explore recreational drug use as self medication? That is totally legitimate in my book, it’s just something you need to go about very carefully, especially if you’ve struggled with drug related issues in the past.

I fell into the regular kratom use thing, which isn’t so bad but it’s still a PITA (primarily just because it is getting expensive). But it’s easy to keep from using other drugs. The only stuff I feel like I can really use safely is limited to occasional benzo use (but I’m not willing to put myself at risk buying them on the black market, so I don’t really use them often), occasional cannabis (I enjoy small doses at the end of the day sometimes before bed) and especially stuff like mescaline and ketamine.

Perhaps you can look into a ketamine treatment OP? Especially if you’ve struggled with depression or other mental health issues and just need to scratch the drug itch, you might really benefit from it.

Mescaline is my favorite though. Felonious cactophagy 4 life

Thank you for the advice! And you hit it spot on the head. I actually am learning how to produce music now. But having a clear mind (which I don't at all!) is the best thing when making music. I have severely bad anxiety, but don't have a doctor since I can't afford one. (I probably could, but rent and other bills are important.) So the main reason for this thread was to help myself relax, and well hopefully this can help someone that is thinking about taking some type of "legal high" I do like to drink, and at times it has been pretty bad, but now a days I try to limit myself. We've touched base with a few on this thread, and hopefully this will eventually have enough info to help someone. But again, thank you for the kind words and advice!

It's borderline imo, but there has been some valuable HR advice.
I'm sorry it has been boderline... :/ trying to keep it from getting closed!

I second everything TPD said above. Kratom is amazing for pain relief, but the addiction and WD make it not worth using recreationally.

I also agree with speed king. Traditionally prepared kava root powder is wonderful if you just want something to change your headspace, and it isn't physically addictive. Kava is great stuff

I've heard of Kava, have never tried it or looked into buying it. I try and research things, like Kava and Kratom for example. I usually will pass on anything that is bad for your heart or liver. (Obviously alcohol is bad for both, but I try to limit myself.)

That's largely a myth. The aerial parts of the plant can contain nephrotoxic compounds that are efficiently extracted with many organic solvents, but the roots from noble kava cultivars are perfectly safe.

For this reason, it's a good idea to avoid kava extracts and stick to getting noble root powder from reputed vendors. You can still get something called kava dermopathy with heavy use, but it will eventually go away with cessation and it's pretty harmless. The dermopathy can usually be avoided by straining out the powder with a very fine mesh.

However, kava still inhibits many liver enzymes, so it can interact with a lot of medications and it's still a good idea to avoid taking it with other drugs that are extensively metabolized by the liver (like alcohol or Tylenol)

^If you drink L-Theanine, or supplements of L-Theanine, it actually can help your liver process and get rid of the bad stuff you but in your body, also eliminating many free radicals (cancer causing cells) HUGE NOTE though, if you take L-Theanine before drinking, it cuts your alcohol tolerance in half! So the same thing could apply to other substances. Oh, and for anyone that does not know, L-Theanine is an ingredient in green tea, which is very healthy. Maybe L-Theanine could help your liver out before taking Kava?

 

[Scrofula]

Mr. Mobius, sir, the rash certainly wasn't a myth.

I'm not trying to scare anyone off of Kava, except women who are pregnant or nursing, the elderly, infirm, renal or hepatic impaired, etc.

Just sharing my experience.



I'm thinking there's a sizable number of Europeans with some cytochrome allele that gives them trouble with kava lactones. I know I'm in the 5% with at least one of those alleles, from past drug issues.

 

[Slow_Mobius]

Mr. Mobius, sir, the rash certainly wasn't a myth.

I'm not trying to scare anyone off of Kava, except women who are pregnant or nursing, the elderly, infirm, renal or hepatic impaired, etc.

Just sharing my experience.



I'm thinking there's a sizable number of Europeans with some cytochrome allele that gives them trouble with kava lactones. I know I'm in the 5% with at least one of those alleles, from past drug issues.

Can you describe it? It might have been the well documented dermopathy that I mentioned. And didn't you say you used an extract? Anything that wasn't certified noble kava might have had aerial portions or non-noble cultivars which are associated with a lot of negative side effects. There are a lot of potentially dangerous and unhealthy kava products sold on the market, such as many extracts, that are especially bad about giving side effects.

A traditional prep with Noble root powder is way different from extracts and shoddy products made from non-noble cultivars or aerial parts of the plant.

 

[Scrofula]

No, I absolutely agree with you that it resembled the dermopathy that I read about after I got a rash that went away when I quit.

I personally don't buy extracts and tinctures like you'd find at the Vitamin Shoppe or Whole Foods, but I drank a bunch someone got for me. This was box-is-fancier-than-usual stuff, and did seem to have a pleasant effect (I did drink a lot of it, not expecting anything).

So for all I know it was full of dioxins and organic lawn clippings.

(But that is the stuff people go out and buy. A scan through some of the kava stuff on this board and others feels a bit like homebrew ayahuasca on the DMT nexus. First stop for the guy who gets Kava recommended cause he finally quit booze and needs to relax, is going to be Walgreens.

I guess my point is that it's not a myth that "Kava" can give you a case of pruritis. And therefore even bad supermarket stuff that won't give you a buzz might still hurt your liver.)

 

[Slow_Mobius]

When I said that's largely a myth, I was just referring to your comment that it does awful stuff to your liver. My bad for not making that clear.

There are plenty of kava products on the market that could be bad for your liver, but noble kava root powder is safe for the vast majority of people. However, as with anything that requires extensive liver metabolism, people with pre-existing liver problems should avoid it, and it should not be taken with other drugs that are extensively metabolized by the liver.

 

[FuckinAcidMan]

Running and doing pull ups/crunches/push ups gives a solid endorphin/endocannabinoid buzz. Eating really good cookies you baked yourself. Masturbation/sex after not orgasming for several days is pretty intense.

Drug wise L-theanine is a solid psychoactive. It can be consumed in psychoactive quantities through green or white teas, or if you want to avoid the caffeine it comes alone in supplements.

 

[Jabberwocky]

Well, if you had a safe, legal drug that could give you heroin nods, you'd be God Ruler of Earth.

...100%

 

[Scrofula]

Running and doing pull ups/crunches/push ups gives a solid endorphin/endocannabinoid buzz. Eating really good cookies you baked yourself. Masturbation/sex after not orgasming for several days is pretty intense.

Drug wise L-theanine is a solid psychoactive. It can be consumed in psychoactive quantities through green or white teas, or if you want to avoid the caffeine it comes alone in supplements.

I've had had psychoactive experiences consuming enormous amounts of concentrated green tea; it feels like you've opened a new dimension of ultra-clarity, not as jaw-clenching as coffee. Haven't had any success with just the supplements.

If you want an easy endorphin rush without the effort of jogging too far, capsaicin will do it. Pour a good half-cup of tobasco in with your soup, and a half-hour later you will feel a no-shit, legit rush like a modest snort of your favorite illicit stimulant. It's great at lunchtime, like a happy caffeine jolt for your afternoon. You have to work up to it, esp. to handle the later deposit, but then you'll be good.

Of course, pain in general can get that going; I found being thrashed with stinging nettles on my face, ears, and arms over twelve hours gave me a sustained endorphin high.

 

[~kira~]

Running and doing pull ups/crunches/push ups gives a solid endorphin/endocannabinoid buzz. Eating really good cookies you baked yourself. Masturbation/sex after not orgasming for several days is pretty intense.

Drug wise L-theanine is a solid psychoactive. It can be consumed in psychoactive quantities through green or white teas, or if you want to avoid the caffeine it comes alone in supplements.

Also black tea I believe. I have a decaf version of that since I can't find a supplement. Healthy for you and makes you relaxed!

 

[Chemist4Hire]

I was on FB earlier and saw an oldddd post from maybe 7 years ago, I remember making the post. It was one of the best and first times I had taken any type of pill. It was the best feeling ever. For some reason my favorite thing back then was listening to upbeat music in the dark wearing a snuggie (not kidding!) and basically nodding in and out. Feeling warm and fuzzy. It was a pleasant experience. I never took pills accessibly,only very moderate. Now in todays time I am trying to be as healthy as I can at the moment. I've been clean from pills for a good 3 or 4 years. I was wondering if there is anything out there that is safe (in moderation) but can give you those nodding out phases. So far I have tried Diphenhydramine (Benadryl 25mg) and that makes me pretty tired and gives me some cool vivid dreams, and melatonin (5mg). But I actually use that to help me fall asleep. I know neither is good for your body in high doses. I tend to stay on the very low side of things. Is there anything else out there that is safe in low doses to achieve this type of effect?

Sorry if this is in the wrong section! I debated for a few mins to myself wondering which section this would be ok in. lol

Please educate yourself and use moderation with every substance I'm about to list.
Some can be lethal and most are addictive.

Kratom

Blue lotus

Poppy seed tea

 

[FuckinAcidMan]

I've had had psychoactive experiences consuming enormous amounts of concentrated green tea; it feels like you've opened a new dimension of ultra-clarity, not as jaw-clenching as coffee. Haven't had any success with just the supplements.

If you want an easy endorphin rush without the effort of jogging too far, capsaicin will do it. Pour a good half-cup of tobasco in with your soup, and a half-hour later you will feel a no-shit, legit rush like a modest snort of your favorite illicit stimulant. It's great at lunchtime, like a happy caffeine jolt for your afternoon. You have to work up to it, esp. to handle the later deposit, but then you'll be good.

Of course, pain in general can get that going; I found being thrashed with stinging nettles on my face, ears, and arms over twelve hours gave me a sustained endorphin high.

In what context did you have to continue getting thrashed by stinging nettles all over for half a day? That sounds horrific, man.

 

[Scrofula]

I got myself stuck in a ravine with dense chaparral last year. They sent helicopters and dogs to find me but I eventually crawled out, missing most of my skin.

I had not choice but to push through this goddam nettle forest, and even with my sleeves and hood on it was just like being beat with the things. I'm not kidding that after an hour it became a sort of warm, glowing feeling and almost giddy, and i stopped tensing and flinching and started welcoming the warmth. My hands and ears were just hot and buzzing.

Definite endorphin rush, kids. Took a week to get most of my sense of touch back, so plan accordingly.

 

[FuckinAcidMan]

Jesus fucking christ again that sounds just agonizing. I feel like at least you're probably scarred up good and proper by now, a year later. That's a hell of an experience to have lived through! It's pretty badass you just kept doing it until it became pleasant.

 

[~kira~]

Please educate yourself and use moderation with every substance I'm about to list.
Some can be lethal and most are addictive.

Kratom

Blue lotus

Poppy seed tea

I'm still on the fence about Kratom.
I just read a bit on Blue Lotus and I might actually try this. Seems to be right up my alley.
Ahh Poppy Seed Tea...forgot about this one. I remember a few years ago I heard about this, and when I went shopping for groceries I bought 4 or so bags of poppy bagels, and scraped all of the seeds off. Lol. It did work a little, but nothing intense or crazy. I tried maybe 3 or 4 times with 1 time actually feeling little effects. Then I read about the possibility of OD and I stopped. Haven't heard of this until today. lol

 

[FuckinAcidMan]

Kratom is the bee's knee's man. I actually enjoy the flavor of a really nicely ground and de stemmed batch of kratom made into tea, and the particular clarity and energy it brings over pharmaceutical opiods. Having never tried real opium I am going to assume it blows kratom out of the water, but that's getting off topic. Kratom is a good buzz, and it's for the most part easily acquired through legal means. It's really addictive though, for what seems to be an otherwise pretty harmless substance to use. Physical dependence is possible but honestly withdrawing is not too bad. It's like quitting coffee and pot at the same time you're just cranky and tired and food isn't super interesting. There are some distinct chills sort of like opiate withdrawal but they aren't as pronounced or agonizingly uncomfortable.

Also black tea I believe. I have a decaf version of that since I can't find a supplement. Healthy for you and makes you relaxed!

And yes black tea as well! I almost forget black tea exists because it's so common it might as well be water in the south, and we refer to it as sweet tea lol. No one calls it black tea where I live it's weird. It's actually really unpopular served hot, black tea in georgia is almost always served as sweet or iced tea. Green tea is usually served hot and is thought of as a "coffee substitute." In fact if you do happen to order a hot black tea at like a breakfast place they call it an "english" or "breakfast" tea instead of black tea, since black tea is just called iced tea or "tea". Most people I have met in the south don't even really know about white tea, which I love as it's really mild in caffeine content but pretty rich in L-theanine and is very mild to the taste, it's good for like winding down from a long day coming down from stronger caffeine sources.

 

[~kira~]

Kratom is the bee's knee's man. I actually enjoy the flavor of a really nicely ground and de stemmed batch of kratom made into tea, and the particular clarity and energy it brings over pharmaceutical opiods. Having never tried real opium I am going to assume it blows kratom out of the water, but that's getting off topic. Kratom is a good buzz, and it's for the most part easily acquired through legal means. It's really addictive though, for what seems to be an otherwise pretty harmless substance to use. Physical dependence is possible but honestly withdrawing is not too bad. It's like quitting coffee and pot at the same time you're just cranky and tired and food isn't super interesting. There are some distinct chills sort of like opiate withdrawal but they aren't as pronounced or agonizingly uncomfortable.



And yes black tea as well! I almost forget black tea exists because it's so common it might as well be water in the south, and we refer to it as sweet tea lol. No one calls it black tea where I live it's weird. It's actually really unpopular served hot, black tea in georgia is almost always served as sweet or iced tea. Green tea is usually served hot and is thought of as a "coffee substitute." In fact if you do happen to order a hot black tea at like a breakfast place they call it an "english" or "breakfast" tea instead of black tea, since black tea is just called iced tea or "tea". Most people I have met in the south don't even really know about white tea, which I love as it's really mild in caffeine content but pretty rich in L-theanine and is very mild to the taste, it's good for like winding down from a long day coming down from stronger caffeine sources.

If that withdraw is like giving up coffee, or weed, I might just jump off of a cliff instead of do that. I could never fathom getting rid of coffee lol
Wait.. you can make tea out of Kratom...? lol Is there any necessary steps to do this?

Interesting. lol. I never knew black tea was called sweet tea in the south. We have sweet tea up here, maybe that is basically black tea? lol I'm not really sure. I ave heard of white tea, but have never tried it. I see so many teas when I buy my green and black tea. Eventually I would like to try them all. I always thought black tea is supposed to be served hot to get the most out of the benefits of it, but maybe I'm wrong
I love a good mild tea. I will have to try this tea sometime very soon. Thank you for the insight on this white tea, and kratom.

 

[LucidSDreamr]

I got myself stuck in a ravine with dense chaparral last year. They sent helicopters and dogs to find me but I eventually crawled out, missing most of my skin.

I had not choice but to push through this goddam nettle forest, and even with my sleeves and hood on it was just like being beat with the things. I'm not kidding that after an hour it became a sort of warm, glowing feeling and almost giddy, and i stopped tensing and flinching and started welcoming the warmth. My hands and ears were just hot and buzzing.

Definite endorphin rush, kids. Took a week to get most of my sense of touch back, so plan accordingly.

how did you get stuck in a ravine ?