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  • AADD Moderators: swilow | Vagabond696

Quitting/Tapering Thread.

hey only.

sounds like you're going through a tough patch mate.

i gotta say - i really agree with halif's advice

If you can I strongly recommend that you go to a doctor and seek out some help with this situation you're in. It sounds like you're in a bit of a spot which is hard to get out of. Your last few posts have mentioned taking codeine, seroquel, modafinil, pregabalin (Lyrica), and alcohol. I don't think you are going to climb out of this hole you're in by using this and that to combat immediate discomfort.
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believe me - this guy knows what he's talking about (better than most) - and i agree; this sounds like it's getting a bit past the point that you can expect to be able to deal with it on your own.
i know that i got a lot of help when i sought out addiction counselling, years ago. it was free and very supportive, and really helped me get my life together (more than once, actually).
addiction + poverty + depression is a fucking scary place to be in.

all the best man - thanks for keeping us updated, keep it up :)



and crankinit - good luck man - i know you can get through this shit.
expect to feel shitty for a bit - maybe sad, maybe angry, maybe both - but i think it's worth it, and it sounds like you've stabilised your life, being on subs and not having to score every day or whatever.
keep us posted :)
 
Thanks for the support.

and I do want to move on with my life. There's so much shit I want to start making progress on, so I gotta get this done. If it's gonna suck, better to just get it out of the way. The only way out is through...
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That makes me confident on your behalf because that's the crux of it: You can't heal and progress until you've got past the hurdle. It won't make things easier, but if you want change there's only one way to go.

Do you still get PAWS style symptoms, or is it more dealing with the psychological side of life post-opiates?
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One of the biggest let downs of the getting sober journey was the lack of a clear finish line. I can definitely say I am in better mental and physical health now compared to ten months, or even four months ago. It's hard to say, however, whether or not I have any symptoms left. What's likely is that I am simply re-learning what my natural state is and dealing with the normal things that were masked by opiate and other drug use.

Basically, you'll find everything were you left it. Did you have trouble sleeping before? Muscle pain? Depression? Difficulty accepting the way certain things in life are? It's all still there and it takes time to get used to living with it in a 'normal' way. During the acute withdrawal you'l probably be a mess of emotions, insomnia, and all that other stuff that any opiate user knows about. During that time I would think to myself how amazing it was going to be when I could just do the basics again; "it'll be so good to just sleep, and have an appetite, and not feel desolate".

You know what it's like when you are sick with food poisoning or the flu and there's a turning point where you start to feel dramatically better? Suddenly you're not nauseous or sweating hot and cold and it feels so good just to be not sick. That sweet relief turning point never happened for me with the withdrawals. It just got less bad in stages. The process was protracted to the extent that it's only now I can look back and realise things like, I haven't had RLS for at least two months; I don't have random sweat break out on my forehead anymore; I have normal toilet habits.

Unfortunately, I do also have trouble sleeping a whole night through and recurring back and shoulder pain issues and issues with low mood. I've also been drinking alcohol quite heavily once or twice a week. All of those things have been part of my life since I was in my late teens. They never left, they just got numbed out. Now they're back and I have to re-learn ways to deal with them. But the point is that I am dealing with them and that is living. You make do the best you can and hopefully there's some progress or enrichment which comes out of it.

I hope this isn't all sounding like a big downer. It's important to have a realistic outlook, however. What I can say in favour of being dependence free is this: There is an empowering freedom in knowing that you aren't hours away from going into withdrawals. The burden of having an internal timer constantly running down is probably bigger than you realise. Once you see that you can go day to day and week to week without the chemical, you can breathe more freely. You aren't perpetually trying to outrun something awful. Also, you might notice that you can be much more present in your relationships. The quality of your interaction with people you care about improves immensely because you can give them your attention fully. You aren't fogged out or suffering withdrawals and you can empathise with them normally again. Those two aspects of being sober make it worth the considerable effort in getting clean.
 
Brilliant post.

I especially love this bit;

You know what it's like when you are sick with food poisoning or the flu and there's a turning point where you start to feel dramatically better? Suddenly you're not nauseous or sweating hot and cold and it feels so good just to be not sick. That sweet relief turning point never happened for me with the withdrawals. It just got less bad in stages. The process was protracted to the extent that it's only now I can look back and realise things like, I haven't had RLS for at least two months; I don't have random sweat break out on my forehead anymore; I have normal toilet habits
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I couldn't have put it so well - it really sums up a lot of my feelings too.
I think that's part of the reason it's a difficult journey - there are no clear "rewards" (something we addicts get used to propping ourselves up with) - apart from the longer term, big picture realisation that "hey, my life and mental health are way less fucked up than when i was using".
I try to channel that into my motivation to stay clean - like realise all the good things about kicking addictive drugs, and learning to cherish those things.
Quitting opiates is so liberating - but we're often too distracted to notice it.
 
Hey guys
Cheers space junk

Yeah I saw a doctor. The most understanding and helpful doctor I've ever come across. Didn't label me, saw a human being not an addict or a this or that. Gave me scripts I need for detox. Gave me a medical certificate for work to take the rest of the week off.

So I'm on day 2 no codeine today.
I'm doing OK. Got sleep last night.

Crankinit, good to hear you are taking the jump.
 
Only - that's great man, i'm really glad to hear that.

IMO "comfort meds" are essential for coming off opiates. It certainly can make the whole ordeal more manageable, and even if it's "just" a psychological help - the psychological side is probably the hardest bit of kicking, in my experience.
 
End of day 3..

Im OK. Have been talking a plethora of comfort meds, I have to admit.
But Im getting free of that crap so I don't mind.

See what tomorrow brings.
I really feel for those that have gone through harder shit. Sending my love out to those in hard times..
 
I've been snorting fentanyl powder for a little over 6 months. Every day a bump or more roughly every 3 hours. A few weeks ago I quit cold turkey for 8 days straight. The 9th day I still didn't feel right at all. No energy to even get up and walk around or do anything. I got scared I wouldn't ever be right again and I had to be back at work the next day so I used again and have been for a week and a half now. I don't know what to do now cause I can't take off work again but I want to quit. Anybody else dealt with fentanyl addiction and can tell me more about how they felt or how long it will take to feel normal again?
 
Hey Danny Boy,

I unfortunately can't help you because I was only on codeine. Some large doses, although I don't think it compares at all. But there are people on here that definitely can help.

I do no a good doctor that will definitely be able to help you if you are in Sydney though. As a lot of doctors dont know or care and will in most cases be judgemental imo.

I did find that by day 9 last quit I still didnt feel right tho.

And I'm not sure I understand the paws thing either. After the rough withdrawal, there is that fatigue that makes it hard to get out of bed and do anything. Work is hard, to say the least. How long should this last, and what can be done to make it better? Exercise, things like wellbutrin etc?

Im on day 5 now.
 
Start of day 6

The rls woke me up. But luckily I have clonodine. Either way I'm out working today.

I have to get up and do something now I guess.

I have some fairly bad aches, but I think I'm just used to feeling a bit high all the time. So I'm ok..I find taking Valium makes me feel like crap the next day. So I haven't taken any yesterday
 
That's awesome man! You did it!
I'm so happy for you. You should be very proud :)
 
Well, that didn't go to plan :| I made it 30 hours cold before I started fantasizing about amputation as a cure for leg cramps, so I decided to change tactics and take the smallest possible dose at the longest possible interval I could manage and try to just ride along in that (not so) sweet spot until I get down to zero. I went a few days taking 1/8mg every 8 - 10 hours, which was enough of a drop that I was still sweaty and cramped and queasy but not so much that I wanted to stab my thigh muscles (seriously, the cramps, holy fuck the cramps).

Lots of panadol, valium, but my tolerance is so high the latter doesn't do a whole lot. Voltaren helps the most of what I have on hand, but it eats holes in my stomach. Surprisingly, lots of weed, which, usually I'm not a big fan of, but it gives a nice buffer from the worst of the symptoms and especially helps with the stomach stuff.

I'm moderately frustrated, but on the bright side I guess it's still a 40% dose reduction in under a week ( if you're counting the drop from 5/8mg to 1/2mg I made last week), which is more progress than I've made in any given month this year.

If the jump isn't happening just yet then at least I can speed up my jog to the diving block. No more of this bullshit "ok I'll make a tiny drop every week and just feel kinda shitty for 5 days then just as I get back to normal I get to drop another tiny scrap and do that for months on end and use it as an excuse to not do anything with my life" nonsense. I'm really over the back and forth.

Anyway I woke up tonight starting to feel a bit better (aka. I was able to get up and type this), so I've dropped the dose another 15% (having to cut the strips into 1/8mg slices, then dissolve those in water in a plunger and squirt out the right amount of the solution. Every 8 hours. Fuck whoever designed these things), and if that's not enough then I'll kick it up to 25% tomorrow. Instead of setting specific goals I'm just going to keep the w/d's up at a constant "just this side of tolerable" pace until I eventually get all the way down. No more breaks, no more breathers. The way out is through :)

Halif, I appreciate the post man. You're right about being realistic, and I appreciate it, I guess I just wanted to get an idea of what I'm in for, long term.

I'm honestly not hugely worried about a lot of the lifestyle stuff - I'm far from where I want to be, but I've definitely made some huge steps with the kind of stuff you're talking about. I've lost almost all the weight I put on while I was using, my posture is better than it's been since I was a kid so I get minimal aches and pains of that kind, I'm still figuring out healthy eating but my diet is much improved. I had a nasty few weeks with meth and booze in August but before that I managed a solid 18 months of sobriety sans-prescriptions (and I did cut that shit off after 2 weeks despite easy access to dirt cheap gear). My mental health is also vastly improved and I've worked through a lot of the shit that got me self medicating in the first place. More importantly, for the first time I've started to put together a pretty solid idea of what I want out of life -
I've got genuine plans for the future, which was something inconceivable to me for so long. But it's stuff I just can't do tied to a pharmacy, dissolving yellow plastic goop in my mouth twice a day to function. So they gotta go.

What "does" concern me is the PAWS, mostly from the physical point of view (cramps and energy levels are my main concerns, especially the latter). Obviously after 6 years of subs and nearly 3 years using on and off before that I'm not just going to bounce back after a fortnight or whatever, but like the withdrawals themselves, I'm not really sure what to expect in terms of symptoms and severity. But I guess there's only one way to find out.

Thanks guys.


only said:
Day 8

Ive done it. Feeling OK again
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That's awesome dude, be proud :) And be really damn glad you're not one of those poor suckers who's going to get caught out in the cold when the pharmacies stop selling it in January.
 
crankinit, you're doing great by the sounds of it man. i've tapered with tiny bits of other opiates, the way you're describing.
it's amazingly potent, but in my experience (which, granted, isn't that relevant here because you're actually kicking bupe itself not doing rapid bupe taper) the less you are on when you jump off, the less severe the WDs tend to be.

can you tell your prescribing doc that you're kicking (if you haven't?) get them to script you some comfort meds (namely clonidine)?

keep pushing through man, you'll get there. there's no right way t o kick a habit - just some ways are better than others. do what feels right for you.
 
Thanks man - that's what I'm hoping for. I figure if I made 30 hours from 5/8mg, then after that jump down by 40% in 3-ish days, then I should be able to keep the fast tapering up another week or two, get down to 1/8th or even 1/16th and then jump there, which will hopefully be easier. And if not, then I can start extending the gap between doses and doing it that way, but I hope I will have chewed through most of the pain by then.

I'm not sure about you but there definitely seems to be some weirdness going on with the lower dose duration. When I was on 24mg I could go 30+ hours without dosing, and even 8mg would hold me for a solid day. But ever since I got into the 1mg range it just doesn't seem to last any longer than H or morphine did. I'm cramping up in 8 - 10 hours, but at least with smack there was a nod at the end of it :/ With subs you dissolve gunk in your mouth and feel slightly less shitty.

As for my doctor, yeah she knows what's up. We discussed clonidine but in the end decided against it for now. I've spoken to her and another doctor, and both said it wouldn't help a whole ton with the RLS/cramps and would be a potential issue with my already low blood pressure. But it's not off the table entirely, so if it comes down to it I'll see where my BP is at and maybe try a low dose.

I also have some seroquel as a last resort for sleep. Definite last resort, because I don't want to take them and then "not" fall asleep (been there, it's awful), but I might be able to just sedate myself through some of the rougher patches if it comes to that.
 
Hello all. I have been registered to the forum since 2015 but am back seeking guidance for tapering a 60 mg daily oxycodone habit that has stretched on for roughly 3 years (i quit cold turkey in 2015 with the help of this forum but relaapsed a few months later).

This time I am more motivated than I have ever been to finally quit for good! Since I have been taking the oxy for a longer period of time this go round, I want to go the taper route. I have been able to ween down to 40 mg daily (started tapering roughly 2 weeks ago from 60 mg) but I know it is going to start to get difficult. While I know I am going to start to experience some withdrawl symptoms, I'm trying to keep them to as manageable as possible so I can still go about a normal work day.

My question is - what would everyone recommend as far a s a tapering schedule? I understand everyone is completely different but any advice would be extremely helpful. This is the schedule I am using as of now, but I wonder if I should try to either shorten or extend it.


  • Days 1-10: take 50 mg of oxycodone per day
  • Days 11-20: take 40 mg of oxycodone per day
  • Days 21-30: take 30 mg of oxycodone per day
  • Days 31-40: take 20 mg of oxycodone per day
  • Days 41-50: take 15 mg of oxycodone per day
  • Days 51-60: take 10 mg of oxycodone per day
  • Days 61-80: take 5 mg of oxycodone per day
  • Day 81: come off oxycodone completely

Thanks in advance!
 
Hi Sta071

The taper schedule you mentioned sounds very drawn out. Are you good at sticking to fixed schedules? The longer the taper the higher potential for blow outs/set backs. It's down to how you handle things; a sprint of acute discomfort or a marathon of moderate discomfort? I understand you would want to mitigate the symptoms as much as possible if you're working. Anyway, as Spacejunk said a coupe of posts up:

there's no right way t o kick a habit - just some ways are better than others. do what feels right for you.
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You said you quite cold turkey last time. Was that something you initiated or were you forced off? How did you handle it?
 
Thanks for the responses Halif2. I chose to quit cold turkey last time and though I got through it it was rough physically and mentally. The reason I'm going with this taper schedule (so far) is bc I've been taking these daily over a longer period of time then when i went cold turkey before so I feel like the withdrawls are going to be worse. Based on research I've done it seems like if you are going to taper after taking for a few years, you should draw it out. However, you could be totally right. For example, if I cut this down to 5 days per round as opposed to 10 days, how much worse could it be? Maybe significant or maybe minimal. Currently I'm 5 days into the 40 mg dose, so based on the schedule I still have 5 days left. I'm thinking of cutting it down after a week, and then maybe going in increments of 5 mg every 3-5 days. I keep hearing "the lower you go, the slower you go" though, so maybe I should draw it out as planned. You're right, there's no right way, I'm just trying to find what's the best way for me and only I can figure that out I suppose. I'm extremely motivated to kick once and for all this time though after I see how this has affected my life & so far so good.
 
Based on research I've done it seems like if you are going to taper after taking for a few years, you should draw it out.
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That's a pretty reliable rule, for sure.

I'm just trying to find what's the best way for me and only I can figure that out I suppose. I'm extremely motivated to kick once and for all this time though after I see how this has affected my life & so far so good.
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Sounds like the right approach and right attitude to see it through to the end. I hope it goes as smoothly as possible for you.
 
0.1875.mg, or 3/32mg, as of this morning. Got a full night's sleep and woke up feeling reasonably sorta ok-ish, so I figured it's time to drop again. Cramps have eased up enormously, possibly due to the baclofen, possibly just the weirdness of w/d, although they've been replaced by shitty cold sweats and goosebumps which have me resetting the aircon every 10 minutes. But they're more tolerable by far, and after getting some sleep I can focus enough to do some reading to keep my mind off things, which I've always found to be the best way to pass the time when hanging out.

One more drop down to 1/16mg in probably 2 or 3 days, then I guess try jump again at the end of the week. I gotta believe that jumping from 1/16mg is about as easy as it's going to get.
 
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