Tryptamines Psilomethoxin Church

[Opi_Kid_Rock]

I would join their church just to be able to experience 5meo dmt for the first time. Then whether I stay with the church is another story.

 

[Didgital]

I spoke to a well-trusted source who has analysed a sample from the Psilomethoxin Church. It was analysed to be 5-MeO-DMT, not 4-HO-5-MeO-DMT. It appears that when using Psilocybe to biotransform tryptamines, it will only 4-hydroxylate base tryptamines and not 5-methoxy tryptamines (I'll assume reasons of steric bulk).

That's pretty wild in multiple ways. 1) that it won't hydoxylate 5-meo tryptamines. 2) they are openly selling a controlled substance and 3) 5-meo-DMT isn't even orally active.


Also I don't understand how there is no psilocybin? Even on their site they claim these mushrooms do not contain any controlled substance (lies apparently), but even if this doping worked, why would the mushroom decide to stop producing psilocybin. That doesn't make any sense to me.

 

[TripSitterNZ]

this was uploaded today by martin ball well known 5 meo dmt dude

 

[Hexagon Sun]

Count me as a hardcore psilometoxian churcher starting right today.

My faith is pentadimensional too.

My sweat drops give positive in all known drug tests.

Aleluyah.

Now I really want to psilometoxize myself and it seems the compound doesnt even exist yet. For fooks sake

 

[Ismene2]

I remember the DPT church - was it "Temple of inner light"? Apparantly it was two blokes living in a hovel in new york trying to get young girls into the "Temple" so they could sniff their flange.

 

[Xorkoth]

Apparently you can inject/infuse certain tryptamines such as NN DMT or, in this case 5-MeO-DMT into growing psilocybe mushrooms and it will biotransform it into 4-Hydroxy-5-MeO-DMT !

yeah, it's been known for some time that if you infuse any tryptamine (though I thought it was any base tryptamine, I didn't realize it would work for a 5-MeO), into the growing medium for psilocybin mushrooms, they will synthesize the 4-HO of that tryptamine (and probably the 4-phosphoryloxy as well). It was originally attempted with DiPT, and it produced 4-HO-DiPT. I believe it was successfully tried with some others as well, but I'm not sure. Although apparently it works with 5-MeO-DMT, so I'd imagine it would work with any of them.

 

[porkstock]

This material 4-HO-5-MeO-DMT is listed under known tryptamines on pg 754 of TiHKAL.
Shulgin also mentions being told of Mark Julia in France making 4-HO-5-MeO-MET. (Shall we call it psilometocin?) He couldn't find it in the literature and said "I want to search this out."

Wonder what Shulgin would think of the Church of Psilomethoxin?

Edit
"In approximately 2005, the great chemist and pharmacologist, Alexander Shulgin, published an article on his website Cognitive Liberty wherein he theorized that Psilomethoxin could potentially be produced by feeding 5-MEO-DMT (the “God Molecule”) to sacred mushroom substrates. In the article, Shulgin noted his interest in Psilomethoxin and also acknowledged that the synthesis of Psilomethoxin is extremely onerous and not practical to undergo."

 

[Xorkoth]

That's pretty wild in multiple ways. 1) that it won't hydoxylate 5-meo tryptamines. 2) they are openly selling a controlled substance and 3) 5-meo-DMT isn't even orally active.


Also I don't understand how there is no psilocybin? Even on their site they claim these mushrooms do not contain any controlled substance (lies apparently), but even if this doping worked, why would the mushroom decide to stop producing psilocybin. That doesn't make any sense to me.

Seems like an attempt to try to sell mushrooms under the radar, honestly. I bet they're just selling mushrooms. Or if they're not exchanging them for "donations", they're just wanting to eat mushrooms.

 

[plumbus-nine]

Reminds me of the Sacred Mushroom Church of Switzerland. It was made up pretty professional but by a single guy and the main intent was to exchange shrooms for donations, and to circumvent the law which recently illegalized shrooms in Switzerland. That guy ran it for a couple of years and then was arrested and let rotting in jail/solitary confinement for I believe 4 years.

After that time he opened another "Church", this time based on fly agaric which is still legal. Don't know whether this still exists.

 

[Bitchniggaz]

Theres a few bufo churches in the southwest, "Universal Shamans of the New Tomorrow" "Church of Toad of Light" I forget which one but they unfortunately do not consider synthetic 5-meo-DMT to be holy, so they continue to milk wild toad.

There's at least one non NAC peyote church "The Peyote Way Church of God". I was offered membership for free but declined.

An ayahuasca church "aya quest native americas" located in kentucky of all places.

Santo Daime (which I actually would like to attend a ceremony just to see it)

And of course the "temple of true inner light" which uses DPT as their primary sacrament. I don't know if they still exist? (Me and DPT dont seem to agree with eachother)

Then there's the especially weird reddit cult called Cantelmoism which there is a pretty interesting vice article about.

Dpt is def hard to get a sweetspot with.
Snorted ive never had a good experience, but low dose intramuskular was a very nice experience.

I just stay far away from the breakthrough, just been Pure Hell every time.

 

[Didgital]

Dpt is def hard to get a sweetspot with.
Snorted ive never had a good experience, but low dose intramuskular was a very nice experience.

I just stay far away from the breakthrough, just been Pure Hell every time.

I guess I had one decent experience with it that wasnt so bad. But I just dont see hardly any resemblance to DMT and I've taken 200mg intranasal. Agreed, it was pretty hellish, and I may never touch the substance again.

 

[Xorkoth]

Holy shit, 200mg is a MASSIVE dose of DPT. No wonder you had a bad time! I haven't taken it yet (still), but I am thinking of going for 40mg.

 

[Latherdome]

I’m a new member of the church, and after a few days’ trial of the mushroom powder they send, refered to it as sacrament without wink or irony. I have now microdosed between 300 and 75mg daily for almost a month. I have reason to suppose this equates to similar active dose as psilocybin/psilocin in potent cubensis, all well under 10mg. It’s extremely functional. Am taking today off like yesterday because even 75mg was feeling too stimulating.

I have extensive experience (17 years) of foraged psilocybes at all dose ranges. This is very distinct from psilocybin/psilocin in feel and effects, and I’ve experienced either no tolerance or possibly even reverse tolerance, which I’m told is characteristic of 5-meo-dmt. Which isn’t orally active, while this certainly is. (I have no 5 experience other than with this alleged similar compound. What I read of 5’s “gentle afterglow” aligns with my microdose experience of this substance.)

I’ve written up experience reports in private forums as well as Reddit. I’d rather not repeat, but I’m loving it for powerful antidepressant effect, open-heartedness, feels very loving, lucid, gentle. My experience in no way supports allegation this is a scam. Skepticism is good, but I see no reason for cynicism. As for religion, it's a non-dogmatic church. Psychedelics have been important to my spirituality as long as I've known them. Personally, I find some of the metaphysical copy on the website as intelligible as dolphin language.

As for the failure of GCMS to show the presence of Pm, see https://psilomethoxin.com/psilomethoxin-the-history-testing-pharmacodynamics-and-pharmacokinetics/

As for the neurotoxicity of dihydroxytryptamines, a different though similar class of compounds, none of which are known metabolites of Pm, if you read the 1973 paper you see they injected a few mg of the not-Pm compound straight into brains of rats. Compare oral/systemic dose in a human adjusted for body weight with local injection in rat, you’ll see it is several orders off. Church reports no adverse experience reports after a year’s bio-assay among over 500 people, over 25K doses. Yes, I know I’m taking some risk, cave-man style. Might just have to wait for my autopsy.

 

[G_Chem]

I’m a new member of the church, and after a few days’ trial of the mushroom powder they send, refered to it as sacrament without wink or irony. I have now microdosed between 300 and 75mg daily for almost a month. I have reason to suppose this equates to similar active dose as psilocybin/psilocin in potent cubensis, all well under 10mg. It’s extremely functional. Am taking today off like yesterday because even 75mg was feeling too stimulating.

I have extensive experience (17 years) of foraged psilocybes at all dose ranges. This is very distinct from psilocybin/psilocin in feel and effects, and I’ve experienced either no tolerance or possibly even reverse tolerance, which I’m told is characteristic of 5-meo-dmt. Which isn’t orally active, while this certainly is. (I have no 5 experience other than with this alleged similar compound. What I read of 5’s “gentle afterglow” aligns with my microdose experience of this substance.)

I’ve written up experience reports in private forums as well as Reddit. I’d rather not repeat, but I’m loving it for powerful antidepressant effect, open-heartedness, feels very loving, lucid, gentle. My experience in no way supports allegation this is a scam.

As for the failure of GCMS to show the presence of Pm, see https://psilomethoxin.com/psilomethoxin-the-history-testing-pharmacodynamics-and-pharmacokinetics/

As for the neurotoxicity of dihydroxytryptamines, a different though similar class of compounds, none of which are known metabolites of Pm, if you read the 1973 paper you see they injected a few mg of the not-Pm compound straight into brains of rats. Compare oral/systemic dose in a human adjusted for body weight with local injection in rat, you’ll see it is several orders off. Church reports no adverse experience reports after a year’s bio-assay among over 500 people, over 25K doses. Yes, I know I’m taking some risk. Might just have to wait for my autopsy.

So it can be extracted out no problem but can’t withstand the demands of a GC/MS? I call BS. I love how they use the term “destructive” to describe GCMS testing, a word that evokes certain emotions, clever.

-GC

 

[Latherdome]

I spoke to a well-trusted source who has analysed a sample from the Psilomethoxin Church. It was analysed to be 5-MeO-DMT, not 4-HO-5-MeO-DMT. It appears that when using Psilocybe to biotransform tryptamines, it will only 4-hydroxylate base tryptamines and not 5-methoxy tryptamines (I'll assume reasons of steric bulk).

What was the process, and the level of confidence in being able to differentiate the two? I confirm by bio-assay that this is orally active without MAOI, while 5 is not. Do you have any guesses that explain my experience?

 

[Juicewrldfan]

Really interesting post. I am familiar with aya quest. Its difficult to say if its a money grab or not, but it does seem to be. I mean they are offering actual ayuahsca, but you have to PAY to become a "member" of the church first. And then the ceremony is about a 800 dollars if I remember right. Plus the guy thats the "shaman" did some hard time for bank robberies. He was leading that life, but then met a guy in prison that told him about ayhuasca and when they were both released he mailed him some to try. After that he said it changed his life, so I dont know, maybe they have true intentions.

They also offer to mail it to you and do a virtual trip. Again, very expensive. And they are not the kind of people i would like to trip with I dont think. Just has kind of a weird vibe.

I'll stick to my clearnet psilocybin vendor that has the balls to advertise and ship to all 50 states. I am still not sure how/why the DEA hasn't raided them yet. This clearnet vendor has been operating for several years too. And they are very real psilocybin cubensis. It just boggles me how they are able to ship to all 50 states and not get into any trouble even though they operate from a decriminalized zone. I mean they are essential trafficking across state lines. I am not complaining though. I am very happy for the services they provide. It has been healing and life changing for me. I am forever grateful.

 

[G_Chem]

Really interesting post. I am familiar with aya quest. Its difficult to say if its a money grab or not, but it does seem to be. I mean they are offering actual ayuahsca, but you have to PAY to become a "member" of the church first. And then the ceremony is about a 800 dollars if I remember right. Plus the guy thats the "shaman" did some hard time for bank robberies. He was leading that life, but then met a guy in prison that told him about ayhuasca and when they were both released he mailed him some to try. After that he said it changed his life, so I dont know, maybe they have true intentions.

They also offer to mail it to you and do a virtual trip. Again, very expensive. And they are not the kind of people i would like to trip with I dont think. Just has kind of a weird vibe.

I'll stick to my clearnet psilocybin vendor that has the balls to advertise and ship to all 50 states. I am still not sure how/why the DEA hasn't raided them yet. This clearnet vendor has been operating for several years too. And they are very real psilocybin cubensis. It just boggles me how they are able to ship to all 50 states and not get into any trouble even though they operate from a decriminalized zone. I mean they are essential traficking across state lines. I am not complaining though. I am very happy for the services they provide. It has been healing and life changing for me. I am forever grateful.

These aren’t healers, they are grifters. And people hurting are a prime target. Id say if someone is charging you anymore than 50-100$, they are scamming you.

I also don’t understand why people don’t just make these things themselves, particularly Ayahuasca. It’s a damn tea, involves two ingredients you can buy clearnet, like I just don’t get it..

I think it always comes back to the myth that these drugs only work if you have a “shaman” (aka ex felon trying to clean you out) to help you facilitate and integrate the experience. We are our own guides, we chose our destiny. The moment you give up your right and self agency a lot of bad things can happen.

-GC

 

[cosmic charlie]

yeah, it's been known for some time that if you infuse any tryptamine (though I thought it was any base tryptamine, I didn't realize it would work for a 5-MeO), into the growing medium for psilocybin mushrooms, they will synthesize the 4-HO of that tryptamine (and probably the 4-phosphoryloxy as well). It was originally attempted with DiPT, and it produced 4-HO-DiPT. I believe it was successfully tried with some others as well, but I'm not sure. Although apparently it works with 5-MeO-DMT, so I'd imagine it would work with any of them.

Back in the day in PD there was a guy who was doing these exact experiments with Mushrooms. Believe he had tried it with both DiPT and MiPT and he claimed they absolutely felt different than regular Psilocybin containing Mushrooms. Always found this to be so fascinating, would love to try some that have MPT or DPT infused into them. There is a thread about it but im having trouble finding it with the search engine.

 

[Juicewrldfan]

These aren’t healers, they are grifters. And people hurting are a prime target. Id say if someone is charging you anymore than 50-100$, they are scamming you.

I also don’t understand why people don’t just make these things themselves, particularly Ayahuasca. It’s a damn tea, involves two ingredients you can buy clearnet, like I just don’t get it..

I think it always comes back to the myth that these drugs only work if you have a “shaman” (aka ex felon trying to clean you out) to help you facilitate and integrate the experience. We are our own guides, we chose our destiny. The moment you give up your right and self agency a lot of bad things can happen.

-GC

I agree full-heartedly. While, I do want it to be legal to obtain psilocybin and other psychedelics without a prescription. I do fear that once the FDA approves it that they are going to make it so you have to have a prescription, but maybe not because all of these stores are opening where you can purchase psilocybin without a prescription in decriminalized zones. And while I never want it to be by prescription only, I do see the value in having psychedelic assisted pyschotherapy. In fact, I have yet to experience a heroic dose and I want to, but I just don't think that its necessarily safe for me to on my own, because my wife is the only one here with me and she couldn't stop me physically if i happened to be freaking out for God knows what reason. I doubt that would happen, but I want to be safe ya know.

I say that to say that, if/when they open up psychedelic assisted pscyhotherapy in my area. I plan on going so that I can experience a heroic dose in a safe place. My current therapist that I have a very strong bond with, is very much into psychedelics and is going to open their own clinic when it is legal. I trust her. She really cares about her patients and one of my greatest fears about pyschedelic clinics opening is that they will end up being like the ketamine clinics. In my experience the ketamine clinics are extremely over priced and do not offer anything other than the drug. I tried ketamine for treatment resistance depression and it just didn't work for me despite never having done ketamine before that. Basically, you pay a very large sum of money (not pricing because forum rules) for just the drug, which is relatively inexpensive for the clinic to buy, and they administer the drug, but thats it. There is no therapy at all. Just get the drug then leave. And some of these places don't believe the pyschedelic experience is important to the healing effect of ketamine so they administer sub par doses that I believe have zero therapeutic effect. I really believe that the psychedelic experience is critical to the healing provided by things like psilocybin and especially ketamine. Anyway, I know that if she opens the clinic that she will not be ripping people off and will give them the full treatment of the psychedelic experience and integration therapy. As I was saying, my fear is that a bunch of clinics are going to open with money grabbers providing subpar services.

The good news is that some of the leading researches on psilocybin assisted therapy, are finding that the psychedelic experience is in fact important to the healing properties. They did some study where they administered a true 5ht2a antagonist at the same time as psilocybin and found that it wasn't as beneficial as without the 5ht2a antagonist. I don't even know why they need to do a study for that. I mean it would seem like its common sense that blocking the drugs main effect would result in little to no benefit from the drug.

 

[F.U.B.A.R.]

These aren’t healers, they are grifters. And people hurting are a prime target. Id say if someone is charging you anymore than 50-100$, they are scamming you.

I also don’t understand why people don’t just make these things themselves, particularly Ayahuasca. It’s a damn tea, involves two ingredients you can buy clearnet, like I just don’t get it..

I think it always comes back to the myth that these drugs only work if you have a “shaman” (aka ex felon trying to clean you out) to help you facilitate and integrate the experience. We are our own guides, we chose our destiny. The moment you give up your right and self agency a lot of bad things can happen.

-GC

Absolutely. A trip sitter that you've never met is a fuckin threat in my opinion.

Shaman or charlatan?

Same fuckin thing...