Opioids Opiates: Stimulating or Sedating

[silver_lining]

I don't know if i'm just weird, but everytime I end up super stimulated rather than nodding out.

Except for Poppy Tea > heavy doses make me nod out for a few days.

But all the pills do the opposite.

Not a fan. Probably a good thing lol. I only touch em last resort for pain, and minimize the dose.

 

[Snafu in the Void]

It's always a combination of both for me.

Typically the true opiates, like opium, morphine and heroin, are more sedating. (Heroin is technically an opioid I guess, but metabolizes into morphine).

The semi synthetic stuff (opioids) tends to be more stimulating and can give me insomnia (oxy, hydros and other pharma).

 

[DeathIndustrial88]

It's a combo for me as well.

I actually find heroin quite stimulating, with a mix of nods that set in for a bit during some point of the effects.\


And by "stimulating", I'm not talking about the effects one would think of from stimulant drugs.
It's more of just a sudden desire to want to be more productive, while also not having physical pain & depression holding me back from being able to get whatever it is done. It feels very natural, where as stimulant/amphetamine stimulation feels forced & edgy.

It also depends on the opioid & my tolerance for me. For example, in the beginning, buprenorphine was quite stimulating & even made me chatty, but after years of being on it, I actually find bupe way more "heavy" feeling than heroin even.

When I use heroin, I get a clear mind, energy, motivation to get shit done, feel content & peaceful. I almost can't even tell that I'm "high", it's just this natural feeling of being pain-free & in a super good mood.
But when I take bupe, I feel tired, heavy, lethargic, bored, flat, etc..


So there's so many variables at play here. It's typically stated that thebaine derivatives are more stimulating (i.e. - oxy, hydro, bupe)... But I've never seen any evidence or science backing up why they would be more stimulating, other than the fact that thebaine is a convulsant.


So in the end, most opioids are a mix of both stimulating & sedating for me, but some are a lot "heavier" feeling than others. And i'm sure personal bio-chemistry has a hand in it as well.

 

[DeathIndustrial88]

It's always a combination of both for me.

Typically the true opiates, like opium, morphine and heroin, are more sedating. (Heroin is technically an opioid I guess, but metabolizes into morphine).

The semi synthetic stuff (opioids) tends to be more stimulating and can give me insomnia (oxy, hydros and other pharma).

Isn't heroin technically "semi-synthetic" as well though? It's basically fast acting morphine, but with extra active metabolites that make it feel better than morphine.

 

[silver_lining]

It's a combo for me as well.

I actually find heroin quite stimulating, with a mix of nods that set in for a bit during some point of the effects.


It also depends on the opioid & my tolerance for me. For example, in the beginning, buprenorphine was quite stimulating & even made me chatty, but after years of being on it, I actually find bupe way more "heavy" feeling than heroin even.

When I use heroin, I get a clear mind, energy, motivation to get shit done, feel content & peaceful. I almost can't even tell that I'm "high", it's just this natural feeling of being pain-free & in a super good mood.
But when I take bupe, I feel tired, heavy, lethargic, bored, flat, etc..


So there's so many variables at play here. It's typically stated that thebaine derivatives are more stimulating (i.e. - oxy, hydro, bupe)... But I've never seen any evidence or science backing up why they would be more stimulating, other than the fact that thebaine is a convulsant.


So in the end, most opioids are a mix of both stimulating & sedating for me, but some are a lot "heavier" feeling than others. And i'm sure personal bio-chemistry has a hand in it as well.

The most stimulating of them all for me is Tapentadol. I freak'n hate it. All i want to do is go down. Heroin was very stimulating for me as well, but I only snorted it once on accident. Bought 4 grams of blow in Cancun, one of which was heroin. Whooops. Didn't stop me from finishing the entire bag lol

 

[F.U.B.A.R.]

Definitely both. That's why I loved them...

 

[Juicewrldfan]

It's a combo for me as well.

I actually find heroin quite stimulating, with a mix of nods that set in for a bit during some point of the effects.\


And by "stimulating", I'm not talking about the effects one would think of from stimulant drugs.
It's more of just a sudden desire to want to be more productive, while also not having physical pain & depression holding me back from being able to get whatever it is done. It feels very natural, where as stimulant/amphetamine stimulation feels forced & edgy.

It also depends on the opioid & my tolerance for me. For example, in the beginning, buprenorphine was quite stimulating & even made me chatty, but after years of being on it, I actually find bupe way more "heavy" feeling than heroin even.

When I use heroin, I get a clear mind, energy, motivation to get shit done, feel content & peaceful. I almost can't even tell that I'm "high", it's just this natural feeling of being pain-free & in a super good mood.
But when I take bupe, I feel tired, heavy, lethargic, bored, flat, etc..


So there's so many variables at play here. It's typically stated that thebaine derivatives are more stimulating (i.e. - oxy, hydro, bupe)... But I've never seen any evidence or science backing up why they would be more stimulating, other than the fact that thebaine is a convulsant.


So in the end, most opioids are a mix of both stimulating & sedating for me, but some are a lot "heavier" feeling than others. And i'm sure personal bio-chemistry has a hand in it as well.

This is exactly how it is for me too.

 

[DeathIndustrial88]

The most stimulating of them all for me is Tapentadol. I freak'n hate it. All i want to do is go down. Heroin was very stimulating for me as well, but I only snorted it once on accident. Bought 4 grams of blow in Cancun, one of which was heroin. Whooops. Didn't stop me from finishing the entire bag lol

I've never had a chance to try tapentadol.

I think I've read it has DNRI properties though, right? I would think that would put a cap on how much euphoria it could give & possibly even make the experience more jittery & uncomfortable. But maybe I'm wrong.

 

[silver_lining]

I've never had a chance to try tapentadol.

I think I've read it has DNRI properties though, right? I would think that would put a cap on how much euphoria it could give & possibly even make the experience more jittery & uncomfortable. But maybe I'm wrong.

Sounds about right. So gross. Feels more like a meth comedown

 

[tryptakid]

I've always felt that opioids exert a biphasic effect: Lower doses are stimulating (in a manic rather than speedy sort of way) while high doses are sedating. This is further impacted by the type of opioid you're using, with some being more prone to that manic stimulating effect (like oxycodone) while others are more prone to edge towards sedation (like hydrocodone).

I've also read that there may be a link between opioids derived from opium alkaloids, and the tendency towards stimulation or sedation, with thebaine related opioids tending towards stimulation while morphine/codeine derived opioids tendings towards sedation. Given that these are all pretty subjective effects, I can't confirm that this is true, but it seems plausible in my own experience.

 

[Juicewrldfan]

Ya know, I was just thinking - the Nursing director at the treatment facility I was at for two months last year was discussing me having adhd and how I didn’t buy that I had it. (The actual clinical director and assistant clinical director both said I did - doctors)

She said “ well do you get stimulated or sedated when you take opiates” I said “stimulated almost 90 percent of the time unless I take a very large dose or fentanyl”

She says that means I have adhd LOL

I don’t buy it still that that is a good determination with that being the evidence.

The clinical director said that it isn’t true that opioids/opiates stimulate people with adhd instead of sedates them…

 

[Dextro .45]

Oxycodone synthesized from theBaine has a stimulating profile, as apposed to Morphine type opioids, Heroin, Dilaudid, Morphine, etc

Oxycodone is the best opioid ever synthesized. It has a profile most similar to Cocaine according to a NAZI scientific test during WWII …..Eukadol (Oxycodone) is a powerful opioid analgesic, possessing a stimulating type narcotic euphoria most similar to Cocaine.

Oxy-IR 5/10/20
OxyContin 20/40/80/160 (original formula)
Oxycodone HCL (API compounding powder) 100 gram jar

…..what I’d do for that

plus Ritalin & Dexedrine / Desoxyn
plus Valium / Ativan / Xanax

 

[Juicewrldfan]

Oxycodone synthesized from theBaine has a stimulating profile, as apposed to Morphine type opioids, Heroin, Dilaudid, Morphine, etc

Oxycodone is the best opioid ever synthesized. It has a profile most similar to Cocaine according to a NAZI scientific test during WWII …..Eukadol (Oxycodone) is a powerful opioid analgesic, possessing a stimulating type narcotic euphoria most similar to Cocaine.

Oxy-IR 5/10/20
OxyContin 20/40/80/160 (original formula)
Oxycodone HCL (API compounding powder) 100 gram jar

…..what I’d do for that

plus Ritalin & Dexedrine / Desoxyn
plus Valium / Ativan / Xanax

Yeah - that’s what I found to be pretty accurate ime, especially with Oxy. It’s like the most stimulating opiate when my tolerance was lower.

Enter heroin (real heroin before fentanyl) - it still stimulated me 90 percent of the time and sometimes I’d nod in higher doses but not stimulating like adderral. Not really sure why that is but I don’t buy that it’s from adhd. Well maybe like a small adderral dose but not so sexually stimulating.

More akin to motivating to be productive and social fluidity.

True stims = all bad for me…just end up in a dark corner with just the dim light of my phone flashing as boobies bounce around the screen - for weeks…

I don’t touch any amphetamine or cocaine. If it’s sexually stimulating on that level I don’t touch it anymore. Shit is so unhealthy the way it makes me.

Everyone is very different obviously. That’s just my experiences

 

[AngelsandFairiesarereal]

I've never had a chance to try tapentadol

Yea me neither, I’ve heard some people compare it to tramadol

 

[DeathIndustrial88]

Yea me neither, I’ve heard some people compare it to tramadol

Oooh, I found tramadol rather enjoyable all through out my 20's at doses of around 400mg a day. Very long lasting. Was long before I got into heroin though. But the nods I got from tramadol around 1.5hr into the effects were very reminiscent of the nods I got from heroin later on.

I don't get much from trams now a days in my 30's for some reason (all opioids have lost some magic after being on bupe for 8 years almost... i'm starting to wonder why, but I guess that's for a different post lol)... but for almost a decade, I was obsessed with tramadol & absolutely loved it. I'd still take it if I could. lol Although if I had the choice between heroin or tramadol, I'm of course going with the brown. lol

Sounds about right. So gross. Feels more like a meth comedown

Interesting! Yeah my first thought was of Wellbutrin or a weak ritalin "buzz", where there's very little euphoria & just a shitty sense of dysphoria & jitters. Yuck!



Got called a "junkie" for the 90 billionth time by a redditor tonight. lol I try my best every day to educate people online about why heroin/opioids are so unfairly stigmatized & why it's hypocritical to allow alcohol in society but shun & even punish those who use anything else that isn't as toxic as alcohol. But people are so fucking brainwashed & conditioned to believe that opiates are some how more "deadly" than alcohol or that the people who use them just couldn't possibly live a normal functioning life on them, which is just bullshit. So much ignorance out there still in 2024.

 

[Juicewrldfan]

Man I used to take way too many trams. I’d have to take like 15-20 per dose back in the day. They are cool.

***Please note: This was before I knew the seizure risk and I was also a suicidal mess taking risks with my life carelessly by not educating myself and not caring so please don’t take doses above I believe 400mg.

 

[DeathIndustrial88]

I've always felt that opioids exert a biphasic effect: Lower doses are stimulating (in a manic rather than speedy sort of way) while high doses are sedating. This is further impacted by the type of opioid you're using, with some being more prone to that manic stimulating effect (like oxycodone) while others are more prone to edge towards sedation (like hydrocodone).

I've also read that there may be a link between opioids derived from opium alkaloids, and the tendency towards stimulation or sedation, with thebaine related opioids tending towards stimulation while morphine/codeine derived opioids tendings towards sedation. Given that these are all pretty subjective effects, I can't confirm that this is true, but it seems plausible in my own experience.

This is true too, I think.

Although I've had experiences that contradicted this... like higher doses of H making me stimulated. But then again it's usually when I already have a tolerance.


I feel like most opioids have stimulating and sedating properties. Some opioids start off stimulating & then fade into sedation & then some opioids are sedating at first & then you feel stimulated towards the end of it. Dosage, tolerance & the opioid matters.


I've heard the same about thebaine as well, although I am skeptical because the only reason thebaine is considered "stimulating" is because it's a convulsant. But almost all opioids are considered "convulsants" anyways since they inhibit gaba to a degree. But I'm not sure if gaba inhibition (or convulsant activity) would be "stimulating" in the sense that we think of it.



Another thing people are forgetting is histamine. Histamine also can play a role in stimulation. So the more histamine release from an opioid (like heroin), the more stimulation/insomnia you can end up with. Or at least that's been my experience. And drugs like Modafinil show that histamine release plays a role in alertness & wakefulness.

This also lines up in my experience with opioids with the least amount of histamine release being more sedating (like bupe, fentanyl, etc..) at least for me. Although there have been times I've felt "stimulated" on bupe as well & I've never felt any histamine release from it, so I don't think it can really even be narrowed down to any one single factor.

 

[DeathIndustrial88]

Man I used to take way too many trams. I’d have to take like 15-20 per dose back in the day. They are cool.

***Please note: This was before I knew the seizure risk and I was also a suicidal mess taking risks with my life carelessly by not educating myself and not caring so please don’t take doses above I believe 400mg.

I stupidly took waay too many trams in the beginning too (my early 20's)...

I thankfully never had a seizure, but I would get twitchy & feel weird if I took the dose past 400mg, almost like I was about to have a seizure or something. That alone was enough for me to say "fuck that" when raising the dose, except in cases where I had a strong benzo on hand or already in my system.

Trams were pretty nice back then though. I use to collect so much music & literally listen to it over & over & over & never get bored of it. It also gave me a ton of energy to where I would work out, lift weights & go for long ass walks with my headphones on. I definitely miss those days, long gone now.

 

[foodcrisis]

@ the OP, i have a theory that people taking lower doses of opiates makes them breath better so that might be kind of pick them up. like a subtle lower blood pressure affects them to take breathes that pick the brain up more... but about the cup of tea causing nodding, if you took more pills you'd probably have the same effect. pills must just hit you differently and you need more... google says that poppy tea usually only lasts like 6-8 hours, sounds like any opiate, so it sounds like you must be going into some deep meditations or something to stay nodding for days. maybe you keep upping the doses or something?

opiates definitely make me lazy even in low doses though. my cousin says she takes percocet or vicodin and will clean the house. she's smokes nicotine too, maybe that effects some people.

 

[tryptakid]

Another thing people are forgetting is histamine. Histamine also can play a role in stimulation. So the more histamine release from an opioid (like heroin), the more stimulation/insomnia you can end up with. Or at least that's been my experience. And drugs like Modafinil show that histamine release plays a role in alertness & wakefulness.

This also lines up in my experience with opioids with the least amount of histamine release being more sedating (like bupe, fentanyl, etc..) at least for me. Although there have been times I've felt "stimulated" on bupe as well & I've never felt any histamine release from it, so I don't think it can really even be narrowed down to any one single factor.

I actually never thought about the histamine connection, but it makes total sense. Thanks for that piece of knowledge! Also makes sense why combining benadryl/anti-histamines in general with opioids is highly potentiating, even more significantly than benzos, they have a little pharmacological ballet!