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Opioids Opiates Do Cure Depression More Effectively Than Anything else with a proper regimen

I would really appreciate it if you would read both the OP as as well as this one completely in order to get the full idea, plus I even used HTML symbols and I'd hate to see my hard work go to waste=D

I posted this simply for informational purposes and for discussion. I wasn't trying to "Appeal to Loudness" so I'd appreciate it if we could be civil and polite to one-another like most everyone else here.


Most everyone here did not enter your thread with 45 pt. font and giant lettering- that was edited down by a moderator- exclaiming the virtues of opiate addiction. I'm surprised the MOD edited down your font as opposed to closing this less than useless thread.

I could careless what you think about fentanyl. I had pure fent hcl that i through out. It Sucks!!! If you wanna extol an opiate, why not hydromorphone. Better yet how bout none at all.

"
If there is a pill that does cure depression after a few uses and then can be stopped without the symptoms returning I would love to hear about it.
"

looking for a chemical to change a lifestyle is the among most fruitless ways to waste your life. And it comes from a complete lack of understanding of drugs. A drug is simply a single chemical that can modify a single or many biological processes due to the shape of the molecule and it's interaction with such biological processes. As Sam Harris said, drugs are "extremely blunt instruments", particularly for psychological illness. To find a drug that cures depression is like looking for a wooden club that can screw in a Phillips-head.
 
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5 mg of hydrocodone is how I got started. Turned into a full blown heroin addiction over the course of 10 years.
 
Methadone used to do the trick. My generation went straight to methadone for years until new routines applied.
 
I know a guy who would shoot 7 grams a day of black tar. Sounds impossible to me, but do you think it's possible to get that tolerant?

Well at my worst i was shooting around 300mg's of dilaudid a day. So id say if supply permitted you could shoot 7 grams of black tar a day.
 
Damn man, those heavy habbits sound increadibly expesive financially. The potential for tolerance to skyrocket is very true with opiates tho. In mouse studies, you can have a 10-fold increase in tolerance, or E.D.- effective dose- in a matter of a few days. I tried to keep the lines im doing just as big as when i started, but it's so easy to just to fatter lines and pretend you did the same amount :)
 
Much depression isn't just caused by serotonin deficiency, but is also caused by dopamine and/or endorphin deficiency. I am suggesting that opioids may be effective at treating dopimine and/or endorphin related depression. If one's depression is caused by serotonin and dopamine deficiency, one could take a SSRI along with an opioid. I suggested fentanyl due to it's short half life. A doctor friend of mine told me a theory that as soon as an opiate wears off, the body attempts to compensate by producing more endorphins, but only so long as the body isn't constantly in a state where there is a high level of non bodily-produced opioids in the brain. So it may be possible that in the body's attempt to compensate, it produces slightly more natural opioids, as well as having a tri-daily boost.

Dopamine based depression is debilitating. It makes it where nothing you do ever feels worth it. In severe cases, it's almost like living in a state of constant cocaine comedown; not fun. The withdrawal from the drugs used to treat it, such as wellbutrin, aren't much if any better than opioid withdrawal. Opioids also seem to accomplish the job better than medicines for dopamine related depression.

Now, I'm not saying that opiates are the answer to all depression, but specific targeted types that are either dopamine or endorphin related. I'm also not suggesting anyone to take large doses. I'm suggesting micro-doses, so to speak. Dosages this low are unlikely to produce any significantly pronounced withdrawal symptoms, and those symptoms, should they arise, can be almost fully diminished with the use of 900mg gabapentin every 8 hours and a benzo, personally I use valium.

Depression (or any mental disorder, for that matter) caused by chemical imbalance is at best an overgeneralization, and at worst, a dangerous fallacy promoted by pharmaceutical companies and unscrupulous medical professionals. It's not as simple as identifying a neurotransmitter deficiency and taking something to "correct" the imbalance. There's plenty of information on this topic available online, see the following articles for instance:

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1518691/

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1277931/
 
^^^ check out the last paragraph of post three post up detailing this, better yet, here it is:

"looking for a chemical to change a lifestyle is the among most fruitless ways to waste your life. And it comes from a complete lack of understanding of drugs. A drug is simply a single chemical that can modify a single or many biological processes due to the shape of the molecule and it's interaction with such biological processes. As Sam Harris said, drugs are "extremely blunt instruments", particularly for psychological illness. To find a drug that cures depression is like looking for a wooden club that can screw in a Phillips-head. "
 
"To find a drug that cures depression is like looking for a wooden club that can screw in a Phillips-head."

LOVE this quote.
 
Most everyone here did not enter your thread with 45 pt. font and giant lettering- that was edited down by a moderator- exclaiming the virtues of opiate addiction. I'm surprised the MOD edited down your font as opposed to closing this less than useless thread.

I could careless what you think about fentanyl. I had pure fent hcl that i through out. It Sucks!!! If you wanna extol an opiate, why not hydromorphone. Better yet how bout none at all.

"
If there is a pill that does cure depression after a few uses and then can be stopped without the symptoms returning I would love to hear about it.
"

looking for a chemical to change a lifestyle is the among most fruitless ways to waste your life. And it comes from a complete lack of understanding of drugs. A drug is simply a single chemical that can modify a single or many biological processes due to the shape of the molecule and it's interaction with such biological processes. As Sam Harris said, drugs are "extremely blunt instruments", particularly for psychological illness. To find a drug that cures depression is like looking for a wooden club that can screw in a Phillips-head.

I am new to this forum, signed up months ago, and that's when I read the rules, so I hope that one day you can find it in your heard to forgive my memory as it's not fully photographic.


5 mg of hydrocodone is how I got started. Turned into a full blown heroin addiction over the course of 10 years.

That's how everyone got started their addiction, whether it be cigarettes, alcahol, cocaine, benzos, queludes, opioids, etc. That doesn't prevent addictive drugs from being prescribed for genuine mental and health problems; by this already accepted reasoning, why shouldn't micro-doses of fentanyl be prescribed for depression if it works? We as a society have determined that the rick is worth the reward when it comes to pain, insomnia, or anxiety vs. addiction potential. Hydrocodone is one of the most proscribed drugs in the USA, oxycodone in most others, so just because it's potentially addictive and has abuse potential is no reason to rule it out as a treatment. If we lived life by that logic, we'd need police authorization to buy "sniffable" paint thinner8). At one point a few years back, I remember seeing on the news that high school kids were throwing "pharming parties" where each one would bring a bottle of their own or a relative's drugs, everything from ambien to zyrtec, throw 'em all in a bowl and swallow a handful with a glass of beer. Point is, nothing is without abuse potential, granted some things are more abusable than others.

Also, think about this, if someone was prescribed 10μg 3x per day in a one month supply at a time, they only have 900&#956g fentanyl citrate per month avaible to be abused, which would only make for the equivalent of IV 45mg morphine assuming that the patient doesn't iv the stuff, if they IV it instead, they would have roughly 65mg IV morphine equivalent. That's roughly the same morphine equivalent as an average hydrocodone script, but the half life is 1/4th that of the hydrocodone's.

One more thing, everyone here seems to think that this is such a bad idea just because it contains the "F Word" of drugs, yet so many people are on the bandwagon for lsd microdosing. In reality, for either one of those, if you stick to the planned regimen, than nothing bad will happen, but when you abuse it, all goes to hell.
 
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That's actually a long standing myth. There's a significant percentage of people who use antidepressants only transiently (e.g. 6 months to a year) while they get their emotions in check and into a more stable lifestyle and then they discontinue them. Think about it, if you're too depressed to even get out of bed in the morning, you may need something to give you the motivation to accomplish things in your life to the point where you can get up in the morning.

Not everyone who goes on antidepressants will need to keep taking them, and not everyone who discontinues them will have hellish withdrawals.

And even if you do have to keep taking antidepressants the rest of your life, so what? Isn't that preferable to living in misery? (If you can come up with that against anidepressants then there the same argument for avoiding retroviral treatment for HIV, or immunosupressants for organ recipients - they're fucked anyway?)



NMDA antagonists (e.g. ketamine) do this in some people.

I appreciate your post sekio,
I stand corrected.
I am commenting on the experiences of loved ones and several friends. They are handed prescriptions without a word about an exit strategy and bounced around from one drug to the next.
I realize they must be useful to some and am not saying they are useless.
I only make this point because some have been critical of opioid use because of withdrawals and dependency, the fact that they must continue to be taken to avoid these things.
I obviously would not criticize anyone for taking any needed medication especially HIV meds and the like, but the same should be said for a person who chooses to medicate with opioids. Is it healthy? Is it a good life desicion? Maybe not but some people choose this way of life.

"And even if you do have to keep taking opioids the rest of your life, so what? Isn't that preferable to living in misery?"
(I changed the word to illustrate my point)

The point about the magic bullet cure was more sarcasm than anything and I apologize.
I have seen some research into these kinds of treatments but am no expert.
 
No insults but here is where I believe you to be mistaken. If you run out of antidepressants, yes you can go through some really bad WDs and the symptoms will return. However, with opiates when you run out depending on how addicted you are, that is never the end of the line. Would you be willing to risk life and liberty by doing an armed robbery at a pharmacy for prozac? or ANY medication for that matter that is not scheduled? Not likely... Would you do it for opioids? Maybe you wouldn't but people do it every day? I have lied, cheated, and stolen from those that I love most in my life to support the use of my opiates. But if my viibryd ran out, I would not even CONSIDER doing that. Opiates ruin lives. and that is about the sum of it. Even for those who need them.

This is a very solid point and I won't argue with it.

All I can say is, it differs greatly from person to person.
I have seen my fair share of lying, cheating, stealing addicts, but I have also seen an equal number of honest, hardworking addicts who will simply man up and endure the withdrawals and get on with life.
 
That's actually a long standing myth. There's a significant percentage of people who use antidepressants only transiently (e.g. 6 months to a year) while they get their emotions in check and into a more stable lifestyle and then they discontinue them. Think about it, if you're too depressed to even get out of bed in the morning, you may need something to give you the motivation to accomplish things in your life to the point where you can get up in the morning.

Not everyone who goes on antidepressants will need to keep taking them, and not everyone who discontinues them will have hellish withdrawals.

And even if you do have to keep taking antidepressants the rest of your life, so what? Isn't that preferable to living in misery? (If you can come up with that against anidepressants then there the same argument for avoiding retroviral treatment for HIV, or immunosupressants for organ recipients - they're fucked anyway?)


NMDA antagonists (e.g. ketamine) do this in some people.

Yes, the feeling we pursue to find our own motivation. What makes us happy, other than drugs obviously.
It´s a long process but I suppose it´s about believing that is possible. Achieving that other level.
 
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I know I missed the last 5 years here on bluelight... but this was never a common thread back in '05-'10 now that I am back, it seems like everyday this topic comes up. What is this? Is this a trend that has been coming up in the past couple years? Because it is dangerous. Using opiates for AD is even worse than using them to get high. Using to get high usually you know what you're getting into. This using for AD is well... I just don't see it ending well. This is a serious question by the way is this a growing trend?

I've only known of one person legitimately prescribed oxy for major depression & ptsd. By a psychiatrist. Even then, I didn't believe it, thought he was mistaken in either the drug or it's purpose.

My PM told me once that oxycodone in particular "rewards" the brain. Nothing new there lol.

Rtp
 
It was interesting to know I can try to develop my own healthy reward system, through hobbies, exercising etc.
Something that can make life bearable without opiates.
 
obviously you never read Phreex's posts about trying to get opiates prescribed for depression. he was on to something and wish someone would pick up where he left off.(R.I.P)
 
ya off label use of opiates cure depression for sure, but no doctor will prescribe them for that. :(
 
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