Misc Is kratom addiction in my head and is Imodium helping? It sound so dumb :/

[Space__Kitten]

I have taken more lope than that so how long until it starts working and how long until it stops working...I took it in the morning yesterday and by 8pm at work the cold sweats and leg pain was back and I gave in and took lope again and after an hour or so I was feeling worse so I took kratom and ibuprofen for quicker relief cause I was at work on my feet but didn't feel better until about 3-4 hours later when I was off work so I took one big dose of kratom.

No kratom at all today though, my day off...I felt sick wen I woke up I took 12mg of lope and 4 hours later I was still miserable so I took 12mg more...I feel better now I took ibuprofen once I'm worried Imma wake up sick in w/d I have work tomorrow.

 

[Space__Kitten]

Oh might try magnesium I have bad restless legs. Lol@ dxm a full dose would help for a day I used to do that years ago last time I did it with a 2 year tolerance break I was disappointed more sick than feeling good after a whole bottle on an empty stomach I think I can't get high off that anymore my body rejects it as poisen lol. I might try 100mg though. I wish I had a safe drug alternative for a few days. Right now I feel ok but the boredom is killing me, I can't even focus on a movie without feeling like something is missing.

 

[Space__Kitten]

So I feel anxious so I took 150mg dxm instead of 100 cause I used to have a highs tolerance to that and I had eaten a burglar a little bit ago and dxm dosnt devolve right with food in my tummy. I wish I could smoke weed but too risky on probation :/

 

[woos]

I have taken more lope than that so how long until it starts working and how long until it stops working...I took it in the morning yesterday and by 8pm at work the cold sweats and leg pain was back and I gave in and took lope again and after an hour or so I was feeling worse so I took kratom and ibuprofen for quicker relief cause I was at work on my feet but didn't feel better until about 3-4 hours later when I was off work so I took one big dose of kratom.

No kratom at all today though, my day off...I felt sick wen I woke up I took 12mg of lope and 4 hours later I was still miserable so I took 12mg more...I feel better now I took ibuprofen once I'm worried Imma wake up sick in w/d I have work tomorrow.

Lope takes forever to start to work. Should start to work in 4-6 hours though. If 12mg didn't really help it's probably safe to take a little more but it just feels so toxic. You can always take a little more but can't take less.

You're still going to feel a bit bad, but nothing like you would without it. Did you get some exercise? That helps a ton even though it seems hard to do. Best part is to keep positive attitude. And exercise. Really. It helps. So much. More than you can imagine. Downside is it only lasts like 4-6 hours then you have to get more exercise but hey whatever.

And yeah I'm sure a high dose of any dissociative would help, but the main thing for the low dose dxm is that it improves mood. After a few days it will stop working as well, but by then your withdrawals will be largely over. Kratom seems to have some other (although relatively mild in comparison to most other drugs) effects vs just pure mu-opiate. Sort of like how tramadol seems to be opiate plus effexor. Though Kratom w/d are really quite minor and Tramadol w/d are like 1000x worse and worse than regular opiates at least for some people. DXM helps. I'm sure like 600mg or something would largely eliminate withdrawals but the point is to help withdrawal not get messed up. 60-100mg gives some long-lasting serotonin rush along with incredibly minor dissociation. It will help you work. Use regular dxm not delsym or other timed release stuff.

If you still can't hack it, some sort of benzo (go with a sedative one if you can, anything other than xanax) will make you forget about kratom w/d, along with the lope. You can still order etizolam overnight with a credit card in the US as far as I know. (maybe I'm wrong I haven't ordered any in ages) But benzo are way more addictive than kratom.

Kratom is quite motivating and not really (as far as I know) bad for you and use tends to max out at about 30 grams a day because of how nasty it is, so it doesn't get as crazy out of control like other opiates, and plus it seems to have a point where if you take more it just makes you feel worse, so that are some real benefits. In that way it's kind of like coffee.

The good news is exercise (and I'm in crappy shape, I need to go work out myself this morning!) will give you the same feeling.

The better news is that Kratom w/d will be over soon. And you'll have a ton of money to spend on whatever else you want! Great feeling, huh?

A decent monthly kratom habit costs as much as a decent car payment ($100-300 a month). Think about that. Think about what you can buy. Get a new car. Get a new phone. Buy good food. Save up some cash for a trip. Etc. That's a *big* motivator to quit!

 

[Space__Kitten]

Money is basically the main reason I quit. Between my bf and I both taking high doses daily my paycheck a are always spent on how not to run out of kratom or caps lol. Just not worth it anymore. I still might take a higher dose of dxm later maybe tomorrow or tonight the 150mg did good for me and removed my anxiety, I use to do a ton of that stuff like 8 years ago before it mostly just started making me sick. And yah lop not kicking in fast is the down side but I set my alarm early this morning and took it and went back to sleep so I could wake up with it working (when I woke up I felt like shit and when I woke up again right now I am pretty much doing ok) but I'd rather spend a day tripping on dxm then taking another opioid to get past withdrawals, I feel more motivated today than yesterday.

 

[belfort]

No I didn't even mean it in the way you think I meant it. I meant that it is all good using an opiate for depression, until you run out, then not only are you right back to being depressed and you are going through WD. And you really shouldn't abuse SSRIs like that even if taking one extra during a fight calmed you down it should not have been the SSRI that caused it, possibly a placebo effect. They do not treat acute depression, It is a cumulative build up that cause the seratonin reuptake inhinition. But if you go off of it cold turkey you end that and it can cause some MAJOR episodes.

We have had a lot of new users come in and claim oxycodone or meth to be the best antidepressant and swear by it. But at the end of the day you can not rely on any medication to rid you of your depression, you have to fix the problem, therapy is the best way I have found to really help solve these issues. Medication is a tool to help with the worst of the symptoms, but once they become a crutch, it is game over.

kratom is diffrent than oxycontin or heroin in terms of its anti-depressant properties..i have taken them all and i find kratom to be the most functional..kratom is a much more functional anti-depressant than the ssris i have taken..what i mean is Kratom not only boosts mood but it motivates you to get up and going, something no ssri has done for me yet.. kratom doesnt even get me high in the typical opiate sense..the increased productivity while on krato is what i find to help the most..anyways, we can argue about this all day long lol

OP, 100 grams in a day is amazing to me..just wow, i get nauseated thinking about it as 5 grams does the trick for me..yep, any time a drug boosts mood or makes you much more productive or happier or outgoing in any way, it is going to have side effects..there is no drug that is free from side effects but kratom seems very mild in this area aside from the addiction..i guess it comes down to how much u spend on it, how well it still works for you as opposed to what harm it is causing you..

kratom withdrawal is not like heroin withdrawal..lol..people have told me that after months of kratom daily, they basically felt sluggish for 4-5 days and had insomnia...they werent crawling the walls in a miserable crushing depression where they pissing and shitting themselves..

 

[Space__Kitten]

The first day was actually the worst but I wasn't on lope yet, I had cold sweats soooo bad and kept sneezing and I felt like I had to move my legs or they would cramp up. Luckily lope basically diminished those symptoms to almost 0, the cold sweats were the worst for me I woke up first morning clothes and bed drenched freezing and shivering uncontrollably, my bf barely gets cold sweats mostly his back just hurts and legs hurt at about the 15 hour mark and he was sneezing a bit the first day before lope too but he hasn't been taking high doses as long as me. Without lope the withdrawl is worse that id expect, I was careless taking kratom cause I didn't see the addiction potential.

It got that high just chasing the high I guess. After about a month at a dose id have to increase my dose by about another 5-10 pills to get the same buzz and that went on for a year until we were consuming over a hundred pills to ourselfs a day and if we binged (dosing up every three hours or so) I never get nauseous on it anymore, I used to which is weird, I could take 50 pills and the only part that would make me feel sick is actually having to swollow that many pills. I don't get sick on comedown anymore just cold sweats and cramps and things.

But now it's expensive and even if I binge like crazy I can't get anywhere close to where I used to without going through most my supply way too quick and going broke.

I agree what you were saying to that guy about kratom. And about kratom compared to SSRIS...on SSRIS I had absolutely no motivation. Yes they worked to get me not suicidal and emotional but I also didn't give a shit about anything, family, work...I was just lazy, not to mention the kind I was on were kind of sedating and tended to knock me out pretty quick. Kratom made
Me happy and motivated and everything was fun I had energy but now to keep that up its so expensive.

Also how long do I have to be without kratom to not go into total withdrawl after one dose? I want to start again in the near future but be more careful like maybe every other day or something, I'm just scared if it's too soon I'll go through it all in a day and then be fiending out back at square one.

 

[Zerwas]

Also how long do I have to be without kratom to not go into total withdrawl after one dose? I want to start again in the near future but be more careful like maybe every other day or something

I am sorry but this is a very very unlikely scenario. Especially if you have been addicted to opioids and/or Kratom before. Unless you have superhuman willpower (which is rare with us addicts) you will probably just end up using every day again.
I had that happen multiple times now even after kicking Bupe last year when I was unbelievably happy to be free...that lasted about one month and then I thought "Why not order some Kratom again?"

It just took about one week to be compeltely hooked again which lasted over 8 months until now...

Controlled consume is just not possible anymore, I wouldn't even try if I were you. Just being realistic here, I know the voice inside the head that trys to convince you that you could try it and that this time it would be different but we are just fooling ourselves big time.

 

[Space__Kitten]

I know your skepticle but I did it with dxm before. It was the first drug I tried besides weed and ended up on a 6 month binge after a breakup. I almost lost my job and even though not physically addicted I'm was psychologically hooked for around 6 months doing it once or twice a day. Eventually had enough and quit, went from dxm to drinking for a few months to finally sober.

Tried dxm about a year later and never did it more than 2 days back to back and I never had the urge to like abuse it again. Took another year break started again on weekends never during the week then stopped again, never went back to how I was first hooked.

I know kratom is more opioid than that so maybe more dangerous? Not sure if that's what you mean or just addiction in general. But I've had success in the past revisiting addictions as long as I stick to a set of rules, like how I never smoke when I'm at work, that's a rule I have once I picked up smoking nicotine again.

Idk you may be right I know odds are against me, I just really hope that I can learn to use this plant but responsibly. Also this is the first somewhat-like-an-opioid I've ever been hooked on, never messed with opiates much in the past.

 

[Zerwas]

You can't compare it to DXM. Opioids are far more psychologically and physically addictive. DXM is just garbage in comparison^^
I forgot to mention that I did not stay on just Kratom these months but went through all available Opioids again.

Thinking to use it responsible after such an addiction is an illusion. Trust me, you will regret it if you start again.

Your success with nicotine is ok, but it does not transfer to an opioid-dependence, like at all.

 

[belfort]

The first day was actually the worst but I wasn't on lope yet, I had cold sweats soooo bad and kept sneezing and I felt like I had to move my legs or they would cramp up. Luckily lope basically diminished those symptoms to almost 0, the cold sweats were the worst for me I woke up first morning clothes and bed drenched freezing and shivering uncontrollably, my bf barely gets cold sweats mostly his back just hurts and legs hurt at about the 15 hour mark and he was sneezing a bit the first day before lope too but he hasn't been taking high doses as long as me. Without lope the withdrawl is worse that id expect, I was careless taking kratom cause I didn't see the addiction potential.

It got that high just chasing the high I guess. After about a month at a dose id have to increase my dose by about another 5-10 pills to get the same buzz and that went on for a year until we were consuming over a hundred pills to ourselfs a day and if we binged (dosing up every three hours or so) I never get nauseous on it anymore, I used to which is weird, I could take 50 pills and the only part that would make me feel sick is actually having to swollow that many pills. I don't get sick on comedown anymore just cold sweats and cramps and things.

But now it's expensive and even if I binge like crazy I can't get anywhere close to where I used to without going through most my supply way too quick and going broke.

I agree what you were saying to that guy about kratom. And about kratom compared to SSRIS...on SSRIS I had absolutely no motivation. Yes they worked to get me not suicidal and emotional but I also didn't give a shit about anything, family, work...I was just lazy, not to mention the kind I was on were kind of sedating and tended to knock me out pretty quick. Kratom made
Me happy and motivated and everything was fun I had energy but now to keep that up its so expensive.

Also how long do I have to be without kratom to not go into total withdrawl after one dose? I want to start again in the near future but be more careful like maybe every other day or something, I'm just scared if it's too soon I'll go through it all in a day and then be fiending out back at square one.

ugghh these questions again..no offense but for people like you that have progressed to such a degree with kratom(high dosages daily) you now want to stop but go back to it and not feel withdrawals..i understand that but the likelihood of that happening is slim to none..you will get off the kratom now, maybe stay off for a month or so but when you go back to using it, your tolerance will shoot right back up pretty quickly unless you keep your kratom use to maybe using it once or twice a week.. with drugs, once you have reached such a peak habit with it, you cant go back to how it was in the "magical days" when it worked amazing..it just cannot be done..sure, when you go back to using kratom the first day or 2 will feel great but after that, tolerance goes up and back to higher dosages..

in all honestly you are better off staying away from kratom altogether from here on out..the cats out of the bag so to speak, better off finding a new drug and dont chase the high!

 

[belfort]

I am sorry but this is a very very unlikely scenario. Especially if you have been addicted to opioids and/or Kratom before. Unless you have superhuman willpower (which is rare with us addicts) you will probably just end up using every day again.
I had that happen multiple times now even after kicking Bupe last year when I was unbelievably happy to be free...that lasted about one month and then I thought "Why not order some Kratom again?"

It just took about one week to be compeltely hooked again which lasted over 8 months until now...

Controlled consume is just not possible anymore, I wouldn't even try if I were you. Just being realistic here, I know the voice inside the head that trys to convince you that you could try it and that this time it would be different but we are just fooling ourselves big time.

i agree 100% with him..im not even sure it comes down to will power, your brain doesnt forget addiction and it snaps much too quickly right back into addict mode..even if you were to go back to using kratom down the road, you couldnt use every other day, that would far too much..you would have to use only 1-2 days a week and good luck trying to do that..

space kiten-opiate addiction is a nightmare and once it hijack your brain, game over..kratom is like opiate-light if that make sense from i can tell but it has some very strong addictive properties..i would love to know if anyone has ever eveloped a habit likr yours, then quit and then been able to go back and use sensibly..i havent seen or heard of it being done tbh..

 

[Mycophile]

i agree 100% with him..im not even sure it comes down to will power, your brain doesnt forget addiction and it snaps much too quickly right back into addict mode..even if you were to go back to using kratom down the road, you couldnt use every other day, that would far too much..you would have to use only 1-2 days a week and good luck trying to do that..

space kiten-opiate addiction is a nightmare and once it hijack your brain, game over..kratom is like opiate-light if that make sense from i can tell but it has some very strong addictive properties..i would love to know if anyone has ever eveloped a habit likr yours, then quit and then been able to go back and use sensibly..i havent seen or heard of it being done tbh..

I agree with everything you are saying EXCEPT the one or 2 days a week thing.

Some people can keep their usage to one or two days a week and feel kind of crappy for a day or two after using and that's it.

I still don't see it being that different from drinking: when I use too much Kratom it's usually only the day after that i feel kind of under the weather, and not as bad as i feel the day after drinking.

I often drink only one day a week and have a bad hangover the next day, so why is it crazy to assume someone can use Kratom only one day a week and feel kind of crappy a day or two after and wait another week to use again??

I don't think it is but I think a lot of people can't do it, while I know I can.

Out of the past year and half of using Kratom I only recently within the past couple months progressed to using 3 days a week, before that for the first year really it was one or two days a week.

If it could be done before it can be done again...you just have to accept that maybe you will feel a bit off for a couple days afterwards and be willing to tough it out and not redose rather than giving in, because redosing is what will truly get you dependent.

But this guy here is someone who used EVERY DAY for a long time if I am not incorrect.

THAT is not going to be easy if that was ALWAYS what you did to go back to using every other day or whatever...THEN I think he's probably deluding himself.

But I don't think the idea of setting new limits with your self to chip away with certain MILDER drugs (milder than heroin and oxy that is) is necessarily always crazy.

You just have to accept that circumstances have changed, and admit to yourself, for example as in my case, that even though 3 days a week worked for a while, and 2 days in a row worked for a while, that they won't anymore, and adapt your usage until you find a way to use it sporadically enough that you aren't feeling like you are putting yourself in danger of serious addiction.

 

[Space__Kitten]

Used kratom for 4 years responsibly before I started down this path of this last year and now that I'm past physical withdrawl with lope I don't even crave it, I have 100g sitting in the next room and I haven't touched it sense I decided to quit. it was mostly physical withdrawl that kept me from quiting so I feel I could take a dose down the line and be ok.But it's not a real opioid and I've used other opioids responsibly.

I am more worried about my bf though he has more addictive personality than myself and has a big influence over me cause we're so close. He's an ex meth addict 2 years clean when I found him, 6 years mostly clean now with 2 slip ups right after his dad passed away. Id rather him use almost anything else cause meth is the devil.

We both quit kratom the same day and he's been fiending for it hardcore sense he told me he caved yesterday and took 5g (only caps he could find left around the house) when I was at work and today been curled up sick again. He says maybe we can use dxm everyday for a while lol I'm like trust me that's a terrible idea, I feel like I can feel brain cells dying when I take it anymore lol. I quit cigs twice with him and made him quit too but he always ends up bringing some home months later and had got me started back on them both times giving them to me when I was intoxicated I'm always like "ok just this one it will be good with a beer or this kratom" and within a few weeks it's always daily again.

Idk just all my thoughts on it, after the first day and finding lope I'm having a pretty easy time skating through the withdrawl, especially by this day, my bf not so much, he's curled up sleeping not wanting to get out of bed. We're out of lope but I don't want to get more and mess my body up so I'm trying to go without it and dxm later to cure some of this boredom I think once I'm past this week I'll be in the clear. I hope he feels better soon too.

 

[Space__Kitten]

Some other posts popped up while I posted. Ok maybe every other day is too much that was my bfs suggestion, I'd just like to keep kratom in my pocket as one of the drugs I cycle through when bored, I've spent more of my life poly abusing drugs than addicted to a single one. I don't have a favorite high just have trouble enjoying reality. I spent more time with kratom not abusing it (4 years) compared to the year I was addicted. I do feel I can go back to it, maybe a couple times a month? I think I can as long as I have a couple other drugs to take in place of kratom for the next day to take in case I'm craving anything. I prefer psychedelics to kratom anyday but stopped doing those so I could get my life together and kratom seemed like the only drug I could successfully function on at work, at home, if I'm still high heading to work it's not gonna be obvious. I figured out of other things I tried it was the lesser of evils.

I feel if I was hard wired to be a kratom addict I would have gotten addicted sooner and it was more of a physical addiction and bad habit than anything. Like alcohol, right off the bat I was bad with it, it didn't take 4 years to show its ugly face as soon as I tried it I was instantly drinking too often. So now I know I can't drink cause it doesn't treat me well. Kratom it was just an ok drug to me, my drug of choice cause I could act sober on it. I'm not the person that looks like they do drugs I've had my job 11 years am a manager never got in trouble with the law from it and only my bf knows about my addictions.

 

[Zerwas]

Pardon me, but you are rationalizing big time here. The 4 years of controlled use did lead to your addiction and 1 year of daily excessive use. These timespans are not separated but they are a fluent transition.
You can't just say: "Well I used 4 years in a controlled manner and only 1 year daily, so the larger part of the time I wasn't addicted", this is not how it works

I don't want to be rude but I have read and heard exactly this kind of rationalization many times before, experienced it by myself and it always lead down the addiction part again.
You won't be an exception, regardless of how many reasons pop in your head why you could be.

 

[belfort]

I agree with everything you are saying EXCEPT the one or 2 days a week thing.

Some people can keep their usage to one or two days a week and feel kind of crappy for a day or two after using and that's it.

I still don't see it being that different from drinking: when I use too much Kratom it's usually only the day after that i feel kind of under the weather, and not as bad as i feel the day after drinking.

I often drink only one day a week and have a bad hangover the next day, so why is it crazy to assume someone can use Kratom only one day a week and feel kind of crappy a day or two after and wait another week to use again??

I don't think it is but I think a lot of people can't do it, while I know I can.

Out of the past year and half of using Kratom I only recently within the past couple months progressed to using 3 days a week, before that for the first year really it was one or two days a week.

If it could be done before it can be done again...you just have to accept that maybe you will feel a bit off for a couple days afterwards and be willing to tough it out and not redose rather than giving in, because redosing is what will truly get you dependent.

But this guy here is someone who used EVERY DAY for a long time if I am not incorrect.

THAT is not going to be easy if that was ALWAYS what you did to go back to using every other day or whatever...THEN I think he's probably deluding himself.

But I don't think the idea of setting new limits with your self to chip away with certain MILDER drugs (milder than heroin and oxy that is) is necessarily always crazy.

You just have to accept that circumstances have changed, and admit to yourself, for example as in my case, that even though 3 days a week worked for a while, and 2 days in a row worked for a while, that they won't anymore, and adapt your usage until you find a way to use it sporadically enough that you aren't feeling like you are putting yourself in danger of serious addiction.

im sorry man but you dont seem to grasp addiction..addiction is progressive and only get worse..if you thin y ou can go back to using kratom 1-2 a week and get the magic back without any withdrawals, then give it a shot..let us know the results but in your own statement, you have detailed how your addiction and tolerance has risen over the past year or so..thats how addiction works, it can slowly creep up on you and once it sets a stronghold, it stays there..you cant remind the receptors in your brain...it seems you think you can so i wish ya luck..

 

[belfort]

Pardon me, but you are rationalizing big time here. The 4 years of controlled use did lead to your addiction and 1 year of daily excessive use. These timespans are not separated but they are a fluent transition.
You can't just say: "Well I used 4 years in a controlled manner and only 1 year daily, so the larger part of the time I wasn't addicted", this is not how it works

I don't want to be rude but I have read and heard exactly this kind of rationalization many times before, experienced it by myself and it always lead down the addiction part again.
You won't be an exception, regardless of how many reasons pop in your head why you could be.

again, i agree with this guy..i see several people trying to rationalize their usage on here..again though, maybe space kitten is the exception but i highly doubt it...

 

[Mycophile]

im sorry man but you dont seem to grasp addiction..addiction is progressive and only get worse..if you thin y ou can go back to using kratom 1-2 a week and get the magic back without any withdrawals, then give it a shot..let us know the results but in your own statement, you have detailed how your addiction and tolerance has risen over the past year or so..thats how addiction works, it can slowly creep up on you and once it sets a stronghold, it stays there..you cant remind the receptors in your brain...it seems you think you can so i wish ya luck..

Dude, we've talked about this.

UNLIKE people who "broke the rules they set out for themselves" I never did.

I set a 3 week maximum, and I've NEVER broken it once.

I can DEFINITELY go back to 2 days a week or even one day a week if I want to as I've already done it only twice a week the past few weeks, it's been over a month since I've done 3 days a week.

The person this thread is about was a daily user, whereas even with my heroic binge doses over weekends I've NEVER exceeded 3 days a week.

Just because my tolerance has risen does NOT mean I am destined to become a daily user.

I never said I thought I could "reset the receptors in my brain"...I simply said that if I'm getting MILD withdrawals from my current use...and they are VERY mild...I'll reduce it back to one or two days a week...which actually I've already partially done...already reduced it to 2 days a week.

I'm a pretty sporadic user even if I dose very high when I do it, and how this seems to be DESTINED to become a daily thing for me because it happens for a lot of other people really confuses me.

 

[Space__Kitten]

I don't think anyone is destined to become a daily used just cause they sometimes use drugs. Like some people can drink a glass of wine with dinner or get a buzz a couple times a year but keep it a buzz don't blackout and don't crave it the next day.

I desided to deal with my cravings today to do benzedrex, please no hate just needed to get myind off it but I only done it like twice low dose just to take away anxiety. I am careful with stims don't want heart attack or addiction any stim shit feels too much like cheap meth to abuse too often.

I feel once I get through this week I'll get my energy back some and be able to think clearly about what I want do next if I wanna clean up for good for a while or find a way to control my kratom habit which I think I can do alone but worry about my bfs influence cause we both encourage each other to do stuff.