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  • BDD Moderators: Keif’ Richards | negrogesic

Is heroin safer than cigarettes? (If done right)

From what I know about cigarettes : YOU SHOULDN'T SMOKE IT IS VERY BAD FOR YOU AND DOES DO SERIOUS DAMAGE LONG TERM.
Heroin is made from natural opium poppies and with precautions can be helpful if not taken excessively but with responsibility instead. The pure and natural opium is just miraculous in my biased and mho.
It is just my perspective, however.

Yeah, good ol mother nature.

Natural products are always best... Like.. Ricin, or uranium, or botulism, or small pox, or anthrax.

I'm sorry but this is the second "but it's so natural!" post I've seen on this thread I held my tongue the first time.

I recognize neither you nor the previous poster actually said "it's natural and thus good for you". But.. If that's not the implication, why say it at all? People don't sell "all natural organic iron supplements" because they think those words are just more detailed.
 
Tobacco in natural American spirits are untreated. Death cap mushrooms are dangerous deadly yea but we have tried that before.
 
Pharmaceutical heroin administered correctly is undoubtedly far 'safer' than smoking cigarettes.

But smoking street heroin is a shortcut to COPD. I cant believe how many people in their 20s and 30s have got COPD in my town from smoking brown. Then there's all the IV users with DVT and missing limbs...
 
Yeah, good ol mother nature.

Natural products are always best... Like.. Ricin, or uranium, or botulism, or small pox, or anthrax.

I'm sorry but this is the second "but it's so natural!" post I've seen on this thread I held my tongue the first time.

I recognize neither you nor the previous poster actually said "it's natural and thus good for you". But.. If that's not the implication, why say it at all? People don't sell "all natural organic iron supplements" because they think those words are just more detailed.
Well, better for ME. If I had to pick one.
And everyone shouldn't smoke because it's really NOT GOOD FOR THEM.

However, everyone is going to do what THEY want to do.

What is the topic now anyway.

Let me see.

Both are terrible and are not necessary for survival. But just a crutch for comfort.

Soo. I would say. Try not to get 'involved' with both if it really isn't necessary. ♡

Just an opinion though. I still need to work on my rocket science degree Fo Sho. ☹☹☹☹☹ 👅



edit: And I guess it's just not black and white. And eww that was terrible but no pun was really intended at all.
 
And I guess for some cigarettes are better than heroin. ♡♡ BUT cigarettes still ARE NOT GOOD FOR YOU.
 
Yeah, good ol mother nature.

Natural products are always best... Like.. Ricin, or uranium, or botulism, or small pox, or anthrax.

I'm sorry but this is the second "but it's so natural!" post I've seen on this thread I held my tongue the first time.

I recognize neither you nor the previous poster actually said "it's natural and thus good for you". But.. If that's not the implication, why say it at all? People don't sell "all natural organic iron supplements" because they think those words are just more detailed.
Awesome. As always !! 👍🏽
 
Natural products are always best... Like.. Ricin, or uranium, or botulism, or small pox, or anthrax.

I'm sorry but this is the second "but it's so natural!" post I've seen on this thread I held my tongue the first time.

I recognize neither you nor the previous poster actually said "it's natural and thus good for you". But.. If that's not the implication, why say it at all? People don't sell "all natural organic iron supplements" because they think those words are just more detailed.

I don't really understand the issue with synthesized / "unnatural" chemicals, and why being part of nature is such a healthy thing. Nature is about survival, these chemicals that plants & mushrooms produce were made to kill so that nobody eats the fucking plant / mushroom. There was never any "intent" of having animals big and intelligent enough to poison themselves "in moderation"

If you go into the woods and pick the wrong mushroom that looks 100% like a tasty mushroom, you might end up dead. 100% natural though.
 
My mother always hated cigarettes (and my father) so much she once said "I would rather you do cocaine than smoke cigarettes"

But yeah, I mean if you use hard drugs responsibly I'm sure it has a lower long term mortality rate than tobacco. Thing is the vast majority of people can not use drugs responsibly.
 
It probably depends on your belief/view but I don't see the development of these alkaloids as an intentional way to ward off animals. I believe it is more likely that random changes via evolution occurred and then these plants found such changes more advantageous since the presence of the alkaloids served to protect them.

This could have also swung another way. Some of the plants that humans found psychoactive may have flourished better once the agricultural age came about, because then some humans may have started cultivating these plants causing them to flourish yet in a different way.

So I don't believe the developement of such chemicals in plants was ever intended for anything.

My point being that there likely isn't any intent, just random changes. But, of course, then one may start to contemplate god / intelligent design / etc . So who really knows? Maybe there is some intent but even then the intent via evolution of DNA is probably to just to make random changes and see what works.

So yes I don't agree that 'natural' things are somehow better/safer than man made ones. There are plenty of examples and counter examples on either end...
 
It probably depends on your belief/view but I don't see the development of these alkaloids as an intentional way to ward off animals. I believe it is more likely that random changes via evolution occurred and then these plants found such changes more advantageous since the presence of the alkaloids served to protect them.

This could have also swung another way. Some of the plants that humans found psychoactive may have flourished better once the agricultural age came about, because then some humans may have started cultivating these plants causing them to flourish yet in a different way.

So I don't believe the developement of such chemicals in plants was ever intended for anything.

My point being that there likely isn't any intent, just random changes. But, of course, then one may start to contemplate god / intelligent design / etc . So who really knows? Maybe there is some intent but even then the intent via evolution of DNA is probably to just to make random changes and see what works.

So yes I don't agree that 'natural' things are somehow better/safer than man made ones. There are plenty of examples and counter examples on either end...
Hence why I put intent in quotation marks.
Of course nature doesn't think, nature adapts. But plants had a lot more time adapting, so the fact that such poisons(psychotrope, dissociative) were still in play when the little toddler of evolution called mankind came into existance just means they were very effective at keeping the plant alive, or the gene(s) wouldn't have spread like that.
 
Hence why I put intent in quotation marks.
Of course nature doesn't think, nature adapts. But plants had a lot more time adapting, so the fact that such poisons(psychotrope, dissociative) were still in play when the little toddler of evolution called mankind came into existance just means they were very effective at keeping the plant alive, or the gene(s) wouldn't have spread like that.

Plants: I have evolved poisonous alkaloids to deter predation and help me survive

Humans: creates fire and randomly starts smoking shit

Plants: ......dude you're breaking the rules wtf!!!
 
Confession. Aged 40, 3500 MDMA pills in the old days under my belt, most other drugs, recently 80 tabs of acid in 18 days...

But I honestly have never even had a single puff on a tailored cigiarette.

Must be an untypical specific demographic.
 
I don't really understand the issue with synthesized / "unnatural" chemicals, and why being part of nature is such a healthy thing. Nature is about survival, these chemicals that plants & mushrooms produce were made to kill so that nobody eats the fucking plant / mushroom. There was never any "intent" of having animals big and intelligent enough to poison themselves "in moderation"

If you go into the woods and pick the wrong mushroom that looks 100% like a tasty mushroom, you might end up dead. 100% natural though.
Well I am sure there is a good natural and a bad natural. You know like yin and yang and for every action there can be a reaction.
But there are also chemicals that are like processed food ; no good.
I am just saying, there are a lot of good things in nature. LIKE VERY GOOD.
I guess. There has to be good and bad in everything.
Gawd I hope I am on topic. I'll go back and look. 👀
 
It's pretty simple. Chronically, if you don't die from an overdose->respiratory depression, than yes, there aren't a lot of negative health consequences involved when using Opioids. It has been said that, all things being equal (no dangerous substances in drugs, safe injection technique etc.), the most dangerous aspect of chronic Opioid use is the potential for gastrointestinal distress like severe constipation leading potentially to complications like toxic megacolon. There are options for reducing the risk of this sort of thing like, fiber in your diet, use of laxatives etc. The goal is just to stay ahead of the problem before it actually becomes a problem that you can't handle.

The primary active chemical in tobacco is Nicotine and Nicotine is a known carcinogen to humans. This means we know that it has a well-established propensity for causing cancers to parts of the body it comes into contact with. This could be the mouth and throat if using dip/chew, the sinuses and throat if using snuff and the mouth, throat and lungs if inhaling the Nicotine by way of cigarettes, cigars and even vaporizers. Vaporizers are arguably safer as their vapor does not contain the same level of tar and other harmful substances, but Nicotine itself will always be a carcinogen.

In short, Opioids are typically more dangerous in an acute setting, whereas Nicotine tends to cause harm mostly through chronic, sustained usage.
 
Give me lifetime stash of pharma grade opioids, in every dose (think smaller not higher here) that is precise, on the one hand, or nicotine in any shape or form, on the other...and then ask me - "You have to choose one or the other. If you live X amount of years 'this threat' will not be executed.".

If I would have to choose, I would go with opioids, based on my currentknowledge. But I think that this hits the nail in the current predicament:

Yeah, technically doing heroin causes ;less damage than smoking cigarettes. Someone could be addicted to heroin their whole lives and other than a crippling addiction, if they always got pure stuff and knew what they were taking, and practiced safe ingestion methods, it wouldn't cause them nearly as much damage as cigarettes over time.

But you don't risk overdose from cigarettes. And you don't risk ODing on fentanyl or accidentally die from cigarettes that are much more pure than you're used to.

So in practice, no it's definitely not safer.
 
Nature is about survival, these chemicals that plants & mushrooms produce were made to kill so that nobody eats the fucking plant / mushroom
Alright but in all fairness: the alkaloids in E.coca developed over time to ward off attacks not to kill the attackers! :ROFLMAO: The poor little buggers are still susceptible to attacks. And somebody or something messed up royally there and short changed them too i.e. not the most hardy or adaptable of flora on the planet either (not the more desirable species anyway).

What the Opium Poppy was thinking about is beyond me though. And the buggers will grow just about anywhere to boot. And not to mention them being FUGLY!

A message in the above somewhere maybe? Just a thought.

Some of the best, and funniest in some cases, shit I've read on this site on this thread though! :ROFLMAO:
 
Friends like these huh Gary.

I’d recommend reading the botany of desire by pollack. The relationship of plants and animals.
 
I'm not a huge fan of the "hey, what if...", "what would happen if..." et cetera. I'm not saying that this thread or its contents violate any of our rules explicitly, but I feel its way more in the spirit of who we are and what we are about to only make threads when we are truly concerned about our safety involving potentially dangerous drugs. Is Nicotine a drug? Yes. Is it potentially and even, often, harmful? Yes. However, the harmful nature of Nicotine is well-understood by practically everyone here. The use of Nicotine and the use of Opioids are pretty unrelated as far as our mission of Harm Reduction is concerned. Cigarettes can and often do harm those who use them chronically. We can pretty much tag it, bag it and move on.

Although these are both drugs, as we have established, the way they are used and the effects of said use make them pretty much impossible to compare in any kind of meaningful way. Hugs, please just consider only making threads that are dedicated directly to your immediate or "in the near future" health and/or threads that you know could really benefit your peers. Again, you have broken no rules, but I'm not a huge fan of random curiosities occupying our front page. Does this make sense?
 
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