Thanks for your replies all.
EarthBounded said:
I personally believe phenibut can make a person more anxious....
On psychedelics specifically? Or just in general?
I do somewhat agree, I suppose, either way, that Phenibut is a strange one. I do generally find it quite anxiolytic (as I think do most people) but I have also noticed some quite situationally specific anxiogenesis starting to creep in, usually when my frequency of use is higher than usual - my willingness to deal with unfamiliar situations is reduced, and this I think triggers an increased fear response, whereas in familiar settings I will be able to relax into the moment a lot more. With more infrequent dosing the negative effects are not noticeable in my experience however - I would be interested to hear your own experience, or any that you know of, where Phenibut has been anxiogenic.
AA357 said:
I am on 700mg Soma and 25mg 2C-E at the moment. I took the Soma shortly after the peak and I'm still tripping balls, I just feel a bit wobbly.
One time last year I took 40mg Valium to calm me down from a trainwreck 300mcg LSD trip (the most Valium I have ever taken to this date). I have no tolerance to Valium, so I started off with 20mg (which is a pretty heavy dose for me). 30 minutes later I still felt awful and ended up taking another 20mg. That totally killed my anxiety and made me feel great, but contrary to what I'd expected/been told, it did absolutely nothing to the visuals. At one point I vividly recall standing in my bedroom in a Valium-induced stupor staring at my fucking wardrobes for about 15 minutes. They were breathing and appeared to be opening and shutting by themselves... I was totally mesmerized by it. Those were some of the most awesome and vivid hallucinations I have ever experienced on any drug.
I don't find that GABAergics (Valium, GHB, Soma, alcohol) dull a trip at all. They'll certainly help with any anxiety but they don't have any antiserotonergic activity so don't expect them to reliably dull a trip.
That's very interesting. To be perfectly honest I have not experimented with combining psychedelics with ANY GABAergics recently, and in my whole life time I have never experimented in a controlled setting where I would be easily able to tell either way. When I was younger I mixed alcohol and hallucinogens occasionally but drug strength and setting varied so much that looking back I really have no idea if there was any difference.
That said, I am fairly sure it has been widely anecdotally reported that there IS a dulling effect of some kind. I was thinking about this when I read your post earlier and didn't have time to respond, and it occurred to me that there are actually 2 relevant aspects to a psychedelic experience (or maybe more, but let's say 2 for simplicity's sake) - the visual element, and the introspective element, or "headspace". When I wrote this post I was admittedly mainly thinking about the visuals because hey, who doesn't like some nice psychedelic visuals, but also because the other more internal side of a trip is much harder (arguably, impossible) to actually quantify.
Following on from this train of thought, I would say it stands to reason that when your mind is clouded, you will be less able to appreciate or even perceive the more intricate aspects of the psychedelic headspace - although, of course, if reduced clarity of thought (as much as this term even makes any sense given the context) is the only issue, then it should also stand to reason that GABAergics that allow a clearer head should not have the same dulling effect. This is why I asked about Phenibut as in my experience, with infrequent use, even high doses do not affect mental acuity to any measurable degree. I do not have very much experience with benzos or other GABAergics but I would imagine that there are other such chemicals that might be similar at the right dose.
It is a bit late so I am not 100% sure I explained my thought process very well but I would appreciate your thoughts on this, regarding GABAergics effect on the headspace versus the visual aspect.
Also if anyone with a background in neurochemistry or just relevant knowledge, as ever, wants to chime in and explain why exactly GABAergics are supposed to inhibit psychedelia in serotonergic hallucinogens, or if, indeed this is the case at all, it would also be much appreciated!