Developing a predisposition to hallucinogen induced psychosis

[Quere]

I'm interested to hear about people's experience with this, ya see I used to absolutely fucking love tripping. Among my friends I was the guy who never freaked out no matter how much or what I took. And I also know alot about drugs due to sites like bluelight and a fascination with the subject. So when I was tripping I would be looking after everyone else.

So, naturally I tripped alot and for years I continued this way.

Then, a long, long time ago in a suburb far, far away, I had my first hallucinogen induced psychotic episode. Now when I say psychotic, I mean psychotic, not a bad trip, my reality was overlaid with a fucking nightmare. I had no idea why it was all happening or what the fuck was happening, but at that time there was some damn satanic, apocalyptic shit happening to reality.

I was picked up by the cops and taken to hospital because I was behaving pretty fucking weird.

In the ambulance and in the hospital i had 'regained my compusure'.

Well, i was no longer completely unaware of my surroundings. I was no longer inhabiting another (seriously fucked up) dimension. Yet now i believed, no, i knew with absolute certainty that my buddy who was with me, the cop, the nurses and the security guard by my bed were all actors trying to trick me, pull the wool over my eyes, etcetera.

Eventually (after much shenanigans with pulling IVs out of my arms in order to teach them a lesson and to let them know I knew they were all actors, not real nurses etc) I realised I was in fact, an idiot. I would not be waking up from this nightmare because it was all real, my friend, the nurses, the hospital and the crazy shit I'd done.

I literally spat on a cop. I would never do that.

And guess what?

That would not be the last time I spat on a uniformed police officer

So basically since then I have taken hallucinogens a handful of times. I've had a couple times like the old days. But I've also had two more drug induced psychotic episodes.

One of those times resulted in me losing my keys, phone and one shoe, passing out on a field (in winter). Surprisingly, i didn't die, woke up, and proceeded to break into my house and sit in a hot shower for 4 hours before returning to the scene of the crime to find my missing keys and phone in different parts of the park.

The final (hopefully) time I thought, wait, no I knew that my friends were torturing me. Yes like literally. They were actually restraining me because I was bat shit crazy-face. I then proceeded to spit on one of the police officers that came with the ambulance and was briefly hospitalized once more. By the way at one point I had seven people restraining me (cops, friends and ambulance crew) and I am not a particularly strong guy, tall, but not strong.

So I have come to the conclusion that I cannot take hallucinogens anymore under any circumstances. Well meaning friends have told me that it's all about set and setting etc but for me, due to whatever adaptive or toxic changes have occurred in my brain, I would have to be psychotic to take hallucinogens again.

So anyone else had this experience?

(lol!)

Okay probably not, but anything similar?

 

[Aeon Psyche]

Strange, in high doses I am vulnerable to psychosis because I am schizophrenic but the only type of drugs who never made me psychotic were psychedelics. And I have done some really high doses and combinations who are not meant for everyone.
I do believe my high understanding of much helps me over a bad trip just as quik as it wears off, no matter what I took. If you get lost in confusion it won't help you and you might lowering your doses or take some anti-psychotics before hand. Although that might diminish the effects of your trips...

 

[Quere]

Strange, in high doses I am vulnerable to psychosis because I am schizophrenic but the only type of drugs who never made me psychotic were psychedelics. And I have done some really high doses and combinations who are not meant for everyone.
I do believe my high understanding of much helps me over a bad trip just as quik as it wears off, no matter what I took. If you get lost in confusion it won't help you and you might lowering your doses or take some anti-psychotics before hand. Although that might diminish the effects of your trips...

Oh god. I certainly have no desire to take them again

But before it happened that first time I was absolutely the last person you would expect it to happen.

I would be completely on top of it, no matter what.

I once took 5 hits of acid, half a bottle of robitussin dm and 150mg of methylphenidate and just wandered around the city by myself happy as larry.

I was certainly crazy and reckless so I guess I just pushed it too far.

But interestingly the times I was triggered into psychosis my doses were not heroic or anything just low-moderate.

 

[Aeon Psyche]

I did not even get psychotic from a hit of moderate acid and four bottles of dxm, my strongest trip ever. not that i realised what was happening untill a long while and the whole experience lasted a week..

 

[Kaleida]

Zeta:

We've known multiple people that this happened to. The one we can speak the most about was an old friend we actually used to trip with a lot. He was fine at first but it didn't take him long until his first time really snapping during a trip, and it just snowballed from there.

We essentially became his trip sitter because he wanted to continue tripping anyway despite this so we saw him do a lot of crazy shit. He usually ended up looking terrified curled up in the fetal position and has tried to kill himself more than once while in the thick of it, but usually for psychotic reasons. ("I'm going to kill myself to prove to you that I'm already dead!") Eventually he just stopped tripping regularly but would still try again every so often just to see if it still happened, which it basically always did.

At first it took things like full dosages of LSD but eventually he was just that sensitive to anything, modest dosages of phenethylamines and dosages of tryptamines so small we wouldn't even feel them sent him soaring through other realities and speaking nonsensically for at least hours. The only thing he still liked at the end of it was DMT, because even though it made him just as crazy, it also immobilized him for the whole thing and was over quickly. It's been a while since we've heard from him now but last we did he didn't seem to have much interest in tripping anymore.

We've also known people who went from being able to handle high dosages just fine to thrashing around in a rose bush screaming about demons from a fraction of their previous dosages, or who were hospitalized after attacking their parents in mid-trip and spent weeks in there thinking all their friends were dead. The first quit tripping and became highly religious and the second later had another psychotic reaction to smoking cannabis and was hospitalized again.

We also knew someone who had an extreme, delusional, DMT-level reaction to a small amount of LSD from the get-go, but she had been previously diagnosed with a psychotic disorder, so that was less surprising.

We have dissociative identity disorder and have wondered throughout the years if this would happen to us eventually, even before we knew what we have (we were always pretty sure we had something). It hasn't yet, but we have realized that the less we repress our condition, the harder we get hit by things, especially cannabis which seems to be particularly powerful for us compared to anyone else we know. The last time we smoked it it felt a lot like tripping on salvia, but we still loved it (we love salvia too).

I'm not too worried because we already do all our trips alone (if you can call it that...) and at home in part for this reason, even before we knew what we have knowing all those people who went through that stuff made us far too cautious to risk doing it somewhere we could get caught or otherwise get ourselves into trouble. As long as we stay safe and it wears off when the drug does it's just another trip no matter how strong it gets. But that being said, we still haven't actually had a psychotic reaction on that level, even though we've had some very extreme dissociative ones, so maybe I'd change my mind if we did.

I'm sorry you had to go through those things and can't enjoy tripping anymors but luckily they were only so bad, you definitely could have gotten yourself into even more trouble depending on what all went down. Thanks for sharing your story too.

 

[Quere]

Zeta:

We've known multiple people that this happened to. The one we can speak the most about was an old friend we actually used to trip with a lot. He was fine at first but it didn't take him long until his first time really snapping during a trip, and it just snowballed from there.

We essentially became his trip sitter because he wanted to continue tripping anyway despite this so we saw him do a lot of crazy shit. He usually ended up looking terrified curled up in the fetal position and has tried to kill himself more than once while in the thick of it, but usually for psychotic reasons. ("I'm going to kill myself to prove to you that I'm already dead!") Eventually he just stopped tripping regularly but would still try again every so often just to see if it still happened, which it basically always did.

At first it took things like full dosages of LSD but eventually he was just that sensitive to anything, modest dosages of phenethylamines and dosages of tryptamines so small we wouldn't even feel them sent him soaring through other realities and speaking nonsensically for at least hours. The only thing he still liked at the end of it was DMT, because even though it made him just as crazy, it also immobilized him for the whole thing and was over quickly. It's been a while since we've heard from him now but last we did he didn't seem to have much interest in tripping anymore.

We've also known people who went from being able to handle high dosages just fine to thrashing around in a rose bush screaming about demons from a fraction of their previous dosages, or who were hospitalized after attacking their parents in mid-trip and spent weeks in there thinking all their friends were dead. The first quit tripping and became highly religious and the second later had another psychotic reaction to smoking cannabis and was hospitalized again.

We also knew someone who had an extreme, delusional, DMT-level reaction to a small amount of LSD from the get-go, but she had been previously diagnosed with a psychotic disorder, so that was less surprising.

We have dissociative identity disorder and have wondered throughout the years if this would happen to us eventually, even before we knew what we have (we were always pretty sure we had something). It hasn't yet, but we have realized that the less we repress our condition, the harder we get hit by things, especially cannabis which seems to be particularly powerful for us compared to anyone else we know. The last time we smoked it it felt a lot like tripping on salvia, but we still loved it (we love salvia too).

I'm not too worried because we already do all our trips alone (if you can call it that...) and at home in part for this reason, even before we knew what we have knowing all those people who went through that stuff made us far too cautious to risk doing it somewhere we could get caught or otherwise get ourselves into trouble. As long as we stay safe and it wears off when the drug does it's just another trip no matter how strong it gets. But that being said, we still haven't actually had a psychotic reaction on that level, even though we've had some very extreme dissociative ones, so maybe I'd change my mind if we did.

I'm sorry you had to go through those things and can't enjoy tripping anymors but luckily they were only so bad, you definitely could have gotten yourself into even more trouble depending on what all went down. Thanks for sharing your story too.

Yep I'm just glad I got to have a lot of great experiences and during the times I did snap I didn't get in too much trouble. Disorderly conduct charge the first time (which I evenyually got dropped) and then the other time (much more recent) I was in contact with the police I didn't get charged (I think because of changes in my country directing police to only charge drug users when it's in the interest of society).

But I could definitely see myself killing someone while psychotic and being completely unaware of what was happening.

I do not want to live in a forensic psychiatry unit for the forseeable future so I will not be tripping again.

@Kaleida Interestingly enough, I am extremely sensitive to cannabis (I can get high on 50mg of smoked herbal cannabis, ive weighed it with my mg scales) but I am still a regular cannabis smoker (I much prefer edibles, such as cannabis coconut oil, but smoking is more economically viable while cannabis is still illegal). I've learnt to be very careful with cannabis dosage and to ignore people who try to get me to smoke it like they do because, while I have never experienced psychotic symptoms from it, I am prone to anxiety and find cannabis past a certain dosage range highly unpleasant.

 

[TripSitterNZ]

I have been there but only for 5 mintues real time on some doses on acid where reality blows apart atom by atom and all you can see is satan. Only would happen if i mixed cannabis with psychedelics

One part is that as the ego dies you are resisting very hard and get trapped between other alternate realities while holding on inducing a psychotic break on psychedelics. Eventually you have to come to terms with what psychedelics are yes they are alternate realites but you are still on the psychical plane. Learn meditation and ground yourself. You witnessed one extreme of the duality and that is the darkness and evil that is within the fabric of creation aka lucfier, satan, whatever cultural background. This is terrifying and extremely hard to handle so the mind simply breaks from normal reality as it cant comprehend the incarnate wall of madness where the hard truths of existence are written on and all religion comes from.

 

[Quere]

I did not even get psychotic from a hit of moderate acid and four bottles of dxm, my strongest trip ever. not that i realised what was happening untill a long while and the whole experience lasted a week..

I had a similar experience when I was younger (and much more reckless) attempting that theoretical 'plateau sigma' thing with dxm.

Was chugging dxm 2-3 times a day for 3 days. That was a crazy time.

At one point I was freezing cold (it was winter) so we were walking to this cafe in the central city district with a courtyard in the back with those outdoor heaters by the tables where you could smoke cigarettes.

On the way there we were walking out of this park onto the main rd. It was very busy with loads of university students and others walking by and I tried to curl up and go to sleep in the pine needles under this pine tree. It just looked so warm and comfortable there haha. My friend got me up and we went down to the cafe where I thought 2 of my friends I was there with were aspects of my personality counselling me on issues in my life.

I remember following my friend through what I later learned was a shortcut through a clothes shop with an escalator going up to the St behind the building. All I could see was bright colours (I think from the clothes) and my friends feet.

What made this experience especially reckless and crazy is the fact that I was on an SSRI (didn't take them on the days I was using dxm but still..) and dxm is known to cause serotonin syndrome/toxicity in combination with other serotonergic neurotransmission enhancing drugs.

I was also well aware of this fact ^ but still proceeded. Now that I'm older and have worked on my issues I care a lot more about my life. But back then I was very self destructive

 

[Quere]

I have been there but only for 5 mintues real time on some doses on acid where reality blows apart atom by atom and all you can see is satan. Only would happen if i mixed cannabis with psychedelics

One part is that as the ego dies you are resisting very hard and get trapped between other alternate realities while holding on inducing a psychotic break on psychedelics. Eventually you have to come to terms with what psychedelics are yes they are alternate realites but you are still on the psychical plane. Learn meditation and ground yourself. You witnessed one extreme of the duality and that is the darkness and evil that is within the fabric of creation aka lucfier, satan, whatever cultural background. This is terrifying and extremely hard to handle so the mind simply breaks from normal reality as it cant comprehend the incarnate wall of madness where the hard truths of existence are written on and all religion comes from.

See, I hear this alot.

I have learned meditation and mindfulness for other reasons and it is highly effective for those problems.

But I believe there is something qualitatively different about a bad trip and drug induced psychosis.

There was no triggering event during the trip which I could have even applied mindfulness practices to. Not even time to take benzos or antipsychotics as every time I have gone from absolutely fine to psychosis practically instantly.

I know your comment is not meant this way, but this is what I mean about well meaning friends giving advice on the subject. As though if I could just handle myself better, was more grounded I would be fine.

That I am in fact, just doing it wrong and that is why I have had these experiences.

In my opinion if you can talk yourself down or use mindfulness to straighten yourself out then you are experiencing a bad trip not drug induced psychosis. Which is why I will never take them again.

But of course this is all just my opinion and I still think psychedelics are wonderful drugs and I will always treasure the amazing experiences I have had with them. And i am sure i am a minority in having this reaction to them.

But I just know I cannot take them anymore.

 

[yepyepwoah]

I've had psychotic type stuff happen a few times. Once it happens the first time, it just seems like stored trauma in your body. Maybe not in your physical body, but in the spiritual/etheric body.

In the end it seems to come down to "fear" to me. It's just an overwhelming grip of fear that doesn't want to let go.

If you really wanna trip again, maybe take a dose of mdma with a shorter acting psychedelic. We did that once with MDMA and DPT, and sat there going through some terrible shit still with our hearts full of love.

 

[TripSitterNZ]

psychosis is a very complex thing and the western treatment is just to sedate people heavily with medications. While "psychotics" in south america are trained to be shamans and navigate these other planes. Ram dass and tim leary books could help you process. I still have lasting scars deep in my psyche after breaking from reality years ago but i learn't to accept the divine nature of awareness and love and let go of believing in anything. I went full circle and used psychedelics to dive into those hellish places and try rewire my brain to back to how it was but still there are moments i can recongize in a trip the rabbit holes in reality not to get lost down. I practice self-inquiry. Well my psychosis didn't last that long is due to set and setting. Been outside and breaking from reality then that is a one way ticket of no way back til the cops and ambulances show to restrain you.

Not taking them again is good idea. Integration and processing those experinces will take a very long time but their is information within every experience.

My unconventional take on psychosis is that some people are more susceptible to the spirit / astral realms and when psychedelics are added into the mix they thrown to far into the abyss that no human mind can withstand the madness.

 

[Quere]

I've had psychotic type stuff happen a few times. Once it happens the first time, it just seems like stored trauma in your body. Maybe not in your physical body, but in the spiritual/etheric body.

In the end it seems to come down to "fear" to me. It's just an overwhelming grip of fear that doesn't want to let go.

If you really wanna trip again, maybe take a dose of mdma with a shorter acting psychedelic. We did that once with MDMA and DPT, and sat there going through some terrible shit still with our hearts full of love.

Yeah I agree, from my experiences and others whom I have observed it seems that once you go psychotic once, you develop a predisposition for it happening again.

The reason I had it happen THREE times before learning my lesson is that I kept thinking things like; if I take a lower dose, if I keep antipsychotics on hand, if I'm in a safe space, if I talk/meditate myself down etc It won't happen again.

But my experience is that now whatever switch in my brain has been flipped, it's just no longer safe for me to take psychedelics.

I would love to take mdma again, but until I can get it legally (which may not happen in my lifetime unfortunately), the risk is too great that what i buy may be a) not mdma (i.e a research Chem hallucinogen etc) or b) mdma but in combination with an RC or other hallucinogen.

 

[Quere]

psychosis is a very complex thing and the western treatment is just to sedate people heavily with medications. While "psychotics" in south america are trained to be shamans and navigate these other planes. Ram dass and tim leary books could help you process. I still have lasting scars deep in my psyche after breaking from reality years ago but i learn't to accept the divine nature of awareness and love and let go of believing in anything. I went full circle and used psychedelics to dive into those hellish places and try rewire my brain to back to how it was but still there are moments i can recongize in a trip the rabbit holes in reality not to get lost down. I practice self-inquiry. Well my psychosis didn't last that long is due to set and setting. Been outside and breaking from reality then that is a one way ticket of no way back til the cops and ambulances show to restrain you.

Not taking them again is good idea. Integration and processing those experinces will take a very long time but their is information within every experience.

My unconventional take on psychosis is that some people are more susceptible to the spirit / astral realms and when psychedelics are added into the mix they thrown to far into the abyss that no human mind can withstand the madness.

It is unfortunate that western medicine treats mental health the way it does.

We could learn a lot from Eastern medico-spiritual practices. Mindfulness meditation has helped my anxiety/depression far more than any western antidepressants.

Drugs like antipsychotics are certainly (very) blunt instruments used to clobber a problem that we do not clearly understand at all.

 

[Quere]

psychosis is a very complex thing and the western treatment is just to sedate people heavily with medications. While "psychotics" in south america are trained to be shamans and navigate these other planes. Ram dass and tim leary books could help you process. I still have lasting scars deep in my psyche after breaking from reality years ago but i learn't to accept the divine nature of awareness and love and let go of believing in anything. I went full circle and used psychedelics to dive into those hellish places and try rewire my brain to back to how it was but still there are moments i can recongize in a trip the rabbit holes in reality not to get lost down. I practice self-inquiry. Well my psychosis didn't last that long is due to set and setting. Been outside and breaking from reality then that is a one way ticket of no way back til the cops and ambulances show to restrain you.

Not taking them again is good idea. Integration and processing those experinces will take a very long time but their is information within every experience.

My unconventional take on psychosis is that some people are more susceptible to the spirit / astral realms and when psychedelics are added into the mix they thrown to far into the abyss that no human mind can withstand the madness.

Just noticed the NZ after your username, presumably New Zealand, I'm from NZ too

 

[TripSitterNZ]

Just noticed the NZ after your username, presumably New Zealand, I'm from NZ too

NZ cops and hospitals treat drug induced psychosis alot nicer than other places. Just last year a teenager during acid psychosis jumped out of a car at full speed on the habour bridge then jumped off the bridge and swam to shore. I heard the cops didn't charge him or anything a miracle they are alive.

The acid in NZ can be very very strong and i seen tourists come here and have psychotic breaks from dropping hits like it was their weak street acid. Alot of of acid i would do here wouldn't even have UG doses just be told its pretty strong and then bam its a strong 300 ug trip.

 

[Quere]

NZ cops and hospitals treat drug induced psychosis alot nicer than other places. Just last year a teenager during acid psychosis jumped out of a car at full speed on the habour bridge then jumped off the bridge and swam to shore. I heard the cops didn't charge him or anything a miracle they are alive.

The acid in NZ can be very very strong and i seen tourists come here and have psychotic breaks from dropping hits like it was their weak street acid. Alot of of acid i would do here wouldn't even have UG doses just be told its pretty strong and then bam its a strong 300 ug trip.

Yeah during my first psychotic episode (10 years ago) the cops charged me with disorderly conduct but the last (final) time which was between 1 and 2 yrs ago, I was very surprised to find I hadn't been charged with anything.

I figure it's a sign of how the proliferation of harm reduction philosophies have altered the way our police deal with these sorts of things these days.

 

[Aeon Psyche]

I had a similar experience when I was younger (and much more reckless) attempting that theoretical 'plateau sigma' thing with dxm.

Was chugging dxm 2-3 times a day for 3 days. That was a crazy time.

At one point I was freezing cold (it was winter) so we were walking to this cafe in the central city district with a courtyard in the back with those outdoor heaters by the tables where you could smoke cigarettes.

On the way there we were walking out of this park onto the main rd. It was very busy with loads of university students and others walking by and I tried to curl up and go to sleep in the pine needles under this pine tree. It just looked so warm and comfortable there haha. My friend got me up and we went down to the cafe where I thought 2 of my friends I was there with were aspects of my personality counselling me on issues in my life.

I remember following my friend through what I later learned was a shortcut through a clothes shop with an escalator going up to the St behind the building. All I could see was bright colours (I think from the clothes) and my friends feet.

What made this experience especially reckless and crazy is the fact that I was on an SSRI (didn't take them on the days I was using dxm but still..) and dxm is known to cause serotonin syndrome/toxicity in combination with other serotonergic neurotransmission enhancing drugs.

I was also well aware of this fact ^ but still proceeded. Now that I'm older and have worked on my issues I care a lot more about my life. But back then I was very self destructive

If you took a hit of acid on it you would be have been 'fucked up' times hundred. Disso's and the highest plateau, whichever it was, combined with psychedelics has extreme potentiation of both substances. I used over 1 gr in a few hours and then took a hit. I do not reccomend this to anyone. It was stronger than my mind could grasp and turned ages (the first day or two) into a very beautiful trip. It made me see a color I can only call rainbow. It moved by order of the rainbow so fast it would melt in one colour yet all of them together. Breathtaking. Just to mention one thing.

 

[ShroomsDude86]

Once early in 2018 I've eaten about 10g fresh mushrooms. I've had a normal light trip from it. After it wore of I've had a voice talking to me. It eventually stopped and I could go to sleep. This got worse the next day, then I've developed full blown psychosis.

I've thought there were fairies talking to me, lots of synchronicities going on. On that day I couldn't get to sleep because the voices kept me awake and I've gotten horrifying anxiety and olfactory hallucinations (I've smelled sulfur and rotten meat which made me think demons are trying to possess me. I've been into the occult a bit). On that night I've wandered around the city, thinking massive delusional shit like I am a Targeted Individual (that's a conspiracy theory) and being harrassed by government agencies, having implants, cancer, parasites (tactile hallucinations) and being poisoned with radioactive material by the polish mafia (I've been flipping shrooms and acid at a bit larger scale at that time and my LSD plug was in Poland, I've thought they wanted to get rid of me).

In the morning then I've jumped in front of a car. I've had luck and didn't get too much injured, only had some stitches on my lip.

So I've told the crew in the emergency vehicle I've had voices in my head and subsequently got transported to a psychiatric hospital. I wasn't strapped to a bed since I've been peaceful to the doctors and nurses. So I've wandered around the ward thinking I've died and being in the astral plane and causing haunting phenomena among other things by moving around and touching and moving things. Then some time after that the staff had enough of me and finally strapped me to a bed and gave me a dose of antipsychotics. Meanwhile I've thought I've gotten into purgatory and thought the voices were demons, angels, Satan and God.

Then slowly over the night everything calmed down and I've entered consensus reality again. They gave me antipsychotics for three more days. After seven days I've gotten out of the closed ward. Then I've stayed another week in the open ward and gotten finally out of the hospital against their will (they wanted to put me into rehab but that can't be forced here). After that I've moved back to my parents for a few weeks then got a job and a new apartment (I've been in university in another city where this happened).

Getting to the point, I've stayed off drugs except LSD microdoses (that was a bit risky but didn't caused problems) and kratom for half a year. I've had mushrooms, LSD, DMT, MDMA, ketamine and MXE since this happened which didn't cause any problems. I can't consume any stimulant (I've tried modafinil and amphetamines) or I get psychotic symptoms like voices or tactile hallucinations (ants, maggots and flies on my skin) for a few days after it.

TL;DR: Had a full blown psychotic break, can consume dissociatives, empathogens and psychedelics without problems, but not stimulants.

 

[Joeroe]

Strange, in high doses I am vulnerable to psychosis because I am schizophrenic but the only type of drugs who never made me psychotic were psychedelics. And I have done some really high doses and combinations who are not meant for everyone.
I do believe my high understanding of much helps me over a bad trip just as quik as it wears off, no matter what I took. If you get lost in confusion it won't help you and you might lowering your doses or take some anti-psychotics before hand. Although that might diminish the effects of your trips...

+1

 

[Foreigner]

I had a psychotic break from doing too much LSD. I was fine for the first 3-4 hours, then my mind started getting really tired. By hour 7 I was out of reality.

I think you can only stimulate and deplete your neurochemistry so much until it stops being able to cope with the psychic stress.