Death with dignity

[Jabberwocky]

i just got back from the nursing home where a family member is dying
I don’t know how long it’s going to be they are no longer conscious or able to swallow
they are on morphine and let out these moans of pain even though the nurses say they are not in pain
they sound like they are in pain
i feel like the nurses are lying not out of malice but out of kindness

I wanted to know what people thought about euthanasia for human beings
I struggle with it because I wouldn’t let my pets suffer the way we let our closest family members suffer but then as we touched on in another thread I have a fear if you bail out early that you get a penalty and are reincarnated back a step
does that count if you are dying of a terminal illness?

I wish the rules were clearer

in the USA we have the MOLST form which I have mine filled out and my best friend as my healthcare proxy
I don’t want anyone to have to wonder what I wanted and I don’t want to wake up and be worse off then I am already

I feel guilty that I just want my relative to pass because they are suffering I feel like normal people want to hold on as long as possible and as usual I am not a normal person

 

[Lil'LinaptkSix]

I wouldn’t let my pets suffer

Me either.
As a matter of fact me and my SO were talking a few days ago and the subject of our cats health came up. We discussed suffering down the road and we both do not want to have this. So... we discussed acquiring some carfent at some point to ease thier way when the time comes. Then she said that that would be her choice of passing too if it came to a suffering end. Shit, I am down with it myself and been talking of this for many years cause if I get to a point where I am all fucked up and a serious burden on another I will check the fuck out with something.

I feel guilty

I fail to see where wanting a suffering loved one to be relieved if there is no chance of remission would cause guilt. I see empathy and mercy. Just my opinion.

 

[assclass]

Sounds like something that could be afforded to all, but will remain a luxury for the few.

 

[jasperkent]

I absolutely support euthanasia, whether for pets or human loved ones.
It's just the decent thing to do.
I hope that if I get in that condition (and I can't do it myself) someone would take pity and do me the favor.

PS-- When I worked at the animal shelter I assisted in the euthanasia of hundreds of animals. I also stole and abused the drug we used (pentobarbital). I ODed on it twice.
Great way to go.

 

[assclass]

I absolutely support euthanasia, whether for pets or human loved ones.
It's just the decent thing to do.
I hope that if I get in that condition (and I can't do it myself) someone would take pity and do me the favor.

PS-- When I worked at the animal shelter I assisted in the euthanasia of hundreds of animals. I also stole and abused the drug we used (pentobarbital). I ODed on it twice.
Great way to go.

I also think its a decent thing to do, but here, some people consider it because the government disability programs leave them in terrible poverty.

Some view it as a way for the wealthy political class to ride themselves of burdens like the poor disabled

 

[Xorkoth]

My dad got sick with ALS, and it took 7 years for him to die. The first 3, he could still do most stuff, but with limitations, but the last 4 years were horrible. He became entirely paralyzed eventually except for his head. And then even his head was paralyzed. He could only breathe with a machine, and towards the end, couldn't even talk. He was absolutely miserable, and it dramatically changed my parents' relationship. They were always very in love, each others' best friends, very affectionate. But my mom was his caretaker and after years of having to scratch his face every time he had an itch, hoist him onto the toilet to shit, and countless other things, and his accompanying anxiety about it, she grew to resent him. And he knew that, and it crushed him. Before it got that bad, but after it got really bad, he broke down one time when I was visiting (I was the only one who didn't start to treat him as an annoying invalid because I live far away so I only saw him sometimes), and told me he wished he had been hit by a bus, that he is literally in hell, every moment of every day is horrible, and he just wanted to die. I am almost positive he then was going to ask me if I could kill him, but then didn't. He started to say he wanted to ask me for something, but then said nevermind and just cried. He felt he had no dignity, no joy, only suffering, and worst of all for him, was that he didn't want to make our lives harder, and he didn't want us to remember him as the pathetic, sick, miserable burden that he had become, but as the healthy father, husband, friend, and provider that he always was before.

Before he got really sick, he told us that if he had to be kept alive with a breathing machine, that he didn't want to live and we should let him go. But then he got inspired by some famous guy who had ALS who lived for 10 years, most of it fully paralyzed and with a breathing machine, and during that time he started charities and lived his life and was pretty happy. It didn't work out that way with my dad, his personality was such that being helpless like that did not work for him. It was confusing because once it got that bad, he wouldn't say we should let him die, and my mom was stubbornly hanging on and wouldn't have let it happen anyway. The whole ordeal ruined the last 7 years of his life, right when he was finally able to retire and h and my mom were going to do all the stuff they'd always wanted to do. And it caused huge amounts of pain in the rest of us... guilt, shame, grief, anger, the whole spectrum.

The story was to illustrate how painful it can be for everyone when someone is not able to die in dignity. In my dad's case, he didn't actually seek euthanasia, though I know he wanted to. But if he HAD asked me to kill him, and I could have actually done that, and if I actually HAD done it, I could have gone to jail for murder. And if he had killed himself, his life insurance wouldn't have worked (I think that's how it works anyway). But, truly, had he been comfortable with seeking euthanasia once it got to where he had no quality of life, it would have saved all of us so much pain, especially he and my mom. There wouldn't have been all that time for all the resentment and anger to build up. I wouldn't, even today, have a hard time recalling my dad as he was before he was a quadriplegic invalid who hated his life.

 

[Jabberwocky]

My dad got sick with ALS, and it took 7 years for him to die. The first 3, he could still do most stuff, but with limitations, but the last 4 years were horrible. He became entirely paralyzed eventually except for his head. And then even his head was paralyzed. He could only breathe with a machine, and towards the end, couldn't even talk. He was absolutely miserable, and it dramatically changed my parents' relationship. They were always very in love, each others' best friends, very affectionate. But my mom was his caretaker and after years of having to scratch his face every time he had an itch, hoist him onto the toilet to shit, and countless other things, and his accompanying anxiety about it, she grew to resent him. And he knew that, and it crushed him. Before it got that bad, but after it got really bad, he broke down one time when I was visiting (I was the only one who didn't start to treat him as an annoying invalid because I live far away so I only saw him sometimes), and told me he wished he had been hit by a bus, that he is literally in hell, every moment of every day is horrible, and he just wanted to die. I am almost positive he then was going to ask me if I could kill him, but then didn't. He started to say he wanted to ask me for something, but then said nevermind and just cried. He felt he had no dignity, no joy, only suffering, and worst of all for him, was that he didn't want to make our lives harder, and he didn't want us to remember him as the pathetic, sick, miserable burden that he had become, but as the healthy father, husband, friend, and provider that he always was before.

Before he got really sick, he told us that if he had to be kept alive with a breathing machine, that he didn't want to live and we should let him go. But then he got inspired by some famous guy who had ALS who lived for 10 years, most of it fully paralyzed and with a breathing machine, and during that time he started charities and lived his life and was pretty happy. It didn't work out that way with my dad, his personality was such that being helpless like that did not work for him. It was confusing because once it got that bad, he wouldn't say we should let him die, and my mom was stubbornly hanging on and wouldn't have let it happen anyway. The whole ordeal ruined the last 7 years of his life, right when he was finally able to retire and h and my mom were going to do all the stuff they'd always wanted to do. And it caused huge amounts of pain in the rest of us... guilt, shame, grief, anger, the whole spectrum.

The story was to illustrate how painful it can be for everyone when someone is not able to die in dignity. In my dad's case, he didn't actually seek euthanasia, though I know he wanted to. But if he HAD asked me to kill him, and I could have actually done that, and if I actually HAD done it, I could have gone to jail for murder. And if he had killed himself, his life insurance wouldn't have worked (I think that's how it works anyway). But, truly, had he been comfortable with seeking euthanasia once it got to where he had no quality of life, it would have saved all of us so much pain, especially he and my mom. There wouldn't have been all that time for all the resentment and anger to build up. I wouldn't, even today, have a hard time recalling my dad as he was before he was a quadriplegic invalid who hated his life.

I’m sorry that is really sad. ALS is a terrible disease. It’s heartbreaking and you’re right if you help him to die you could go to jail, prison actually for murder. With insurance companies it depends I know that some of them pay out for suicide but not all of them. That is something that you would have to check the individual policy for.

But I think something like euthanasia is better emotionally and medically for the patient and the family. This is my opinion. There will be no mistakes and there is no feeling of shame or like you are doing anything wrong. It was actually a documentary on assisted suicide in Belgium with a man who had Als it was called a death in Belgium. This subject was on my mind a lot and watching that documentary was really informative. Having it be legal and overseen by someone who had the right amount of medication to make sure that your loved one passed away and didn’t just suffer an overdose and end up in a coma or brain damaged. Being able to have family or whomever you wanted to have by your side it instead of having to do it all alone. Being able to do it out in the open and not shocking your family and also your family be able tell the truth about what happened without any stigma.. Again just my opinion.

I hope that made sense. I feel like I know what I mean but I can’t make it make sense.

I am sorry about your dad.

 

[nznity]

i just got back from the nursing home where a family member is dying
I don’t know how long it’s going to be they are no longer conscious or able to swallow
they are on morphine and let out these moans of pain even though the nurses say they are not in pain
they sound like they are in pain
i feel like the nurses are lying not out of malice but out of kindness

I wanted to know what people thought about euthanasia for human beings
I struggle with it because I wouldn’t let my pets suffer the way we let our closest family members suffer but then as we touched on in another thread I have a fear if you bail out early that you get a penalty and are reincarnated back a step
does that count if you are dying of a terminal illness?

I wish the rules were clearer

in the USA we have the MOLST form which I have mine filled out and my best friend as my healthcare proxy
I don’t want anyone to have to wonder what I wanted and I don’t want to wake up and be worse off then I am already

I feel guilty that I just want my relative to pass because they are suffering I feel like normal people want to hold on as long as possible and as usual I am not a normal person

I reacted "wtf" bcs seriously let's be honest, your relative IS IN PAIN otherwise he/she wouldn't be moaning. The nurses don't say shit cause they already got a lot to deal with 20+more patients sometimes even more and also they say that so that you're more quiet. Erhmmm, you mention karma and regression, that if your family member dies by euthanasia he/she will reincarnate in a less evolved entity/being. Well, this clearly doesn't apply for that.it would be if he/she killed their self interrupting the course of her life before achieving things in life and stuff but in this case if I'm not mistaken your relative is either very old or still young but on a position where he/she is very ill so like I said, it doesn't apply.
If you think your relative is suffering euthanasia is not a bad idea, unnecessary suffering sucks so much and some drs/nurses don't rly give a fk bout it.so I think in this case (idk the laws of the place you're in but) euthanasia wouldn't be wrong/unethical or any of that bs. Let's end the Stigma plzzzz ❤

 

[Xorkoth]

I’m sorry that is really sad. ALS is a terrible disease. It’s heartbreaking and you’re right if you help him to die you could go to jail, prison actually for murder. With insurance companies it depends I know that some of them pay out for suicide but not all of them. That is something that you would have to check the individual policy for.

But I think something like euthanasia is better emotionally and medically for the patient and the family. This is my opinion. There will be no mistakes and there is no feeling of shame or like you are doing anything wrong. It was actually a documentary on assisted suicide in Belgium with a man who had Als it was called a death in Belgium. This subject was on my mind a lot and watching that documentary was really informative. Having it be legal and overseen by someone who had the right amount of medication to make sure that your loved one passed away and didn’t just suffer an overdose and end up in a coma or brain damaged. Being able to have family or whomever you wanted to have by your side it instead of having to do it all alone. Being able to do it out in the open and not shocking your family and also your family be able tell the truth about what happened without any stigma.. Again just my opinion.

I hope that made sense. I feel like I know what I mean but I can’t make it make sense.

I am sorry about your dad.

Thank you. And yes, I agree for sure, euthanasia in the cases of terminal patients who are suffering is the humane and sensible thing to do. But in our society which claims to be obsessed with the sanctity of life but which actually isn't, it's somehow considered morally repugnant.

 

[wirkdy]

Nobody asks us anything before dumping us suddenly on earth, being free to decide (or have others to in case the conditions make decision impossible for the person) when to leave should be a right of everybody and a fundamental aspect of a good society.

Unfortunately when society (especially western) still allows clown-men in skirts (catholic church clan members) to have too much of a say on these issues the results are horrific.

 

[assclass]

Nobody asks us anything before dumping us suddenly on earth, being free to decide (or have others to in case the conditions make decision impossible for the person) when to leave should be a right of everybody and a fundamental aspect of a good society.

i rather we stop having kids until kids can consent to being born in such a shit world

 

[wirkdy]

i rather we stop having kids until kids can consent to being born in such a shit world

either that or improve this shit world, since the latter is impossible I'm very much against natality (there is also a movement that supports anti-natality).
It's sad but it is for the good of any baby, if a person before being born had the chance to see the shithole they'd be dumped into and offered a yes/no option this world would be almost completely depopulated.

 

[assclass]

either that or improve this shit world, since the latter is impossible I'm very much against natality (there is also a movement that supports anti-natality).
It's sad but it is for the good of any baby, if a person before being born had the chance to see the shithole they'd be dumped into and offered a yes/no option this world would be almost completely depopulated.

anti-natality activists are perhaps some of the dumber people to ever hold a sign.

Short sighted useful idiots for a marxist agenda.

 

[Jabberwocky]

How is a child going to consent to being born? More importantly, how did the conversation stray from the right to euthanasia to 'the world is a shithole and people should stop having babies'? I'm not seeing the connection.

 

[assclass]

How is a child going to consent to being born?

Not my problem to figure out, but I didn't consent to this life.

 

[Jabberwocky]

Not my problem to figure out, but I didn't consent to this life.

Sounds like you have a misplaced sense of entitlement.

 

[jasperkent]

Nobody asks us anything before dumping us suddenly on earth, being free to decide (or have others to in case the conditions make decision impossible for the person) when to leave should be a right of everybody and a fundamental aspect of a good society.

Unfortunately when society (especially western) still allows clown-men in skirts (catholic church clan members) to have too much of a say on these issues the results are horrific.

Also, the medical establishment's code of save the life at all costs (both literally and figuratively).
That's starting to change, but change is slow.

 

[assclass]

Sounds like you have a misplaced sense of entitlement.

if you knew me better, you would understand the entitlement is deserved. I'm Jesus.

 

[Jabberwocky]

Sorry, I didn't know assclass was secret code for Jesus.

 

[Shady's Fox]

If we were to live forever we'd fill up each square of Earth until earth becomes Eden, yes both mean same thing. Now I am happy I die, I saw what's here and shit, that kind of behaviour you need to accept life as an egg shell.