Cannabis Advocates: Can you concede that weed is not ALWAYS harmless?

[bit_pattern]

Its very rare but I know people who had to go to detox.

EDIT: I just realised you said go to detox, which is different to what I am talking about below but I'll leave my comment as it stands because it's still relevant I feel.

Detoxing from weed isn't rare - every time I use I have to go through withdrawals of varying degrees of severity, whether it be a few sleepless nights and vivid drams when I've only used a little, or full blown physical withdrawals including cold sweats and reduced appetite if I've been using heavily.

I 100% believe that weed should be legal both recreationally and medicinally but the advocates who say it is 100% harmless or tout it as a miracle cure from everything from cancer to depression really shit me. I can't believe half the stuff they get away with prescribing it for in the States. There's no way any other drug would get away with making some of the claims the muscularly pro-cannabis advocates get away with. It verges on pseudo-science and discredits the legitimate uses for the drug.

 

[DETROIT*edm*JUNKIE]

everything can be harmless when in a certain context, even two seemingly harmless things.. exp. water (drowning, fluoride etc.) or cookies (obesity, hyperglycemic)..

Weed depends on the context in which it is being examined whether it is harmless or not..

i can name plenty of things wrong with weed..

*impaired driving (especially for infrequent smokers)
*paranoia
*anxiety
*impaired cognitive function
*smoking
*mentally addictive properties
*the opportunity cost of not spending your money on something that will bring further benefit to your life than marijuana
*some people experience laziness, extreme chillness, lack of motivation

etc... im sure much more could be added to this list.


however, it should be looked at in in a benefit-cost analysis.. and ultimately it seems that America is coming to the conclusion that the benefits exceed the costs.

 

[thujone]

I don't think that anything poses significant dangers kept in "moderation"--that's essentially what moderation is.

ebola

I would be hesitant to say that about drugs just because many have fairly powerful physiological effects and come with contraindications on the label, to suggest that a moderate dose of drug A + a moderate dose of drug B may equal a harmful cocktail. AFAIK there are no such issues associated with pot use, making it something that can be leisurely enjoyed without any immediate risks.

 

[badfish45]

Never really said it was, Its just not lethal and thats what is important to me. Smoke is bad for your lungs, and heavy use kills your ability to function as efficiently and make good decisions and your ability to store memories. As ebola said, moderation is truly what counts for pot. It can most optimally be enjoyed if used in moderation but drugs arent as easy as that, and its different for everybody. Personally I think being consistently stoned is a bad way to approach life and that it is important to train your mind to function off of natural highs rather than just depending on a chemically induced one. Both are great though

edit: it also potentiates mental illness and can further depression. But so can other drugs

 

[Someone13232]

A lot of people I know are somewhat dependant on it at a mental level. So many times I have been at parties with more than enough drink to go around, but there is no weed and everyone gets agitated and all they do is try and score weed.

I also think weed is fantastic and opens up people's creative sides but at the same time it makes people lazy and unmotivated to the point that people argue over performing simple tasks like buttering toast. People just want to sit down and do fuck all which irritates me.

my friends are like a bunch of crackheads for weed, i think sometimes its more about the weed being your fix than anything else, like a psychological thing, they would be just as bad for any material that would exist in the place of cannibis, just means we have less street drinkers imo.

 

[Beavesmx44]

90% of people who have issues that arise from marijuana would have issues with any and all mind altering substances. Not the substance....... its the person.

 

[Mycophile]

90% of people who have issues that arise from marijuana would have issues with any and all mind altering substances. Not the substance....... its the person.

I'm not sure I agree with the "90%" statement, and no offense but you are just pulling that out of your ass cause there's no way to know that.

All sorts of substances effect people differently in ways that I could never even try to explain but which maybe some of those mods who know a lot more about neurology could explain.

Even with weed there are strains that are more motivating and less anxiety producing which could help someone to be more productive.

I've never tried Kratom but some on here sing it's praises and say that the more stimulating strains can help motivate some people to do more and be less lazy.

I know when I used dexedrine I'd be EXTREMELY motivated to write essays for school, read for hours and clean my apartment but have me smoke some weed and you will NOT see me react the same way, and I'm the same person so the difference in that equation is a different drug.

It is ALSO the person, because I have heard of many people who can be motivated by weed and go do daily tasks on it but I can't.

I think that drugs and personal brain neurology are probably a very delicate math equation and that the right drug at the right time for the right person with the right brain chemistry can be very beneficial.

To make a VERY simple argument, I am extremely social and not at all shy at bars when I drink, but if I smoke I won't talk to anyone.

So in that case, is it the drug or the person??

I'd say it's more the drug there.

Some drugs decrease inhibitions like benzos and alcohol, some can increase them like weed, some can give someone energy to get things done like dexedrine.

It's BOTH the person AND the substance and to say the substance doesn't play a MAJOR role is another way of being pro weed or pro-drug to the annoying extent I see all the time even though I believe in the legality of all drugs.

 

[exists]

first off i myself and a cannabis advocate in that i think it should be 100% legal, has medicinal properties etc.

but i'm put off by people saying it's God's greatest gift to man, harmless, no bad side effects, etc.

can some other people down with herb admit it's not 100% without it's downsides?

and on the flipside, those who think it is ONLY positive and good and from the sky etc. post your position here.

I'm pro-cannabis, but can easily admit that weed has its downsides. The major one being potentially psychotic episodes occurring right after weed has been ingested. I have bipolar II disorder, and at many points in my life cannabis would push me into a mixed state (depressed & manic at the same time). The added paranoia and anxiety would cause me to go off the deep end, events usually precipitated by the way I clash with society (people can be fucking heartless, and my heart just can't take it sometimes). (I should mention the mental problems I have experienced with weed have now almost completely gone away, even though I have continued to toke up.) And weed can alter your thinking to the point that certain tasks become difficult (going out in public when paranoid can become a nightmare; working on a complex project might seem daunting because you feel mentally fatigued; etc.) Also, smoking anything is obviously not good for you.

Even though weed has some downsides, I really believe weed's harmfulness is way overblown. People often compare weed to alcohol, but the two are hardly comparable. Intoxication from both share common effects, but it's the levels of negative effects we should be looking at, not just the similarities. Its effects on coordination & response time are nowhere near as bad as alcohol's. I have done some daring things requiring great concentration and fast reflexes while stoned out of my gourd, feats I would not have been able to achieve had I been drunk. Weed's cognitive impairment is not on-par with alcohol's, not even close. Stoned people might make small blunders, but drunken decisions and actions take the cake. Weed-associated memory loss is more akin to distraction than real memory loss. If a person appears idiotic when stoned, it's likely that that person's mental state has simply shifted. When I get stoned, I'm more likely to think in music and imagery, rather than words. It gets so bad that I might stumble on my own words when speaking to others, thus making me appear "stupid."

So yes, weed has its downsides, but they are far outmatched by that of other drugs.

 

[ebola?]

I would be hesitant to say that about drugs just because many have fairly powerful physiological effects and come with contraindications on the label, to suggest that a moderate dose of drug A + a moderate dose of drug B may equal a harmful cocktail. AFAIK there are no such issues associated with pot use, making it something that can be leisurely enjoyed without any immediate risks.

Well, I wouldn't call harmful cocktails part of practices of moderation in drug taking. I think that cannabis is a bit special in that you can to some degree eschew moderation without facing severe, relatively immediate harms.

ebola

 

[neversickanymore]

without a doubt I conceded that weed is not always harmless... but this is earth people and everything causes harm. So you better learn how to take care of yourself.. if cannabis causes negative things for you, then don't use it.

 

[Beavesmx44]

I'm not sure I agree with the "90%" statement, and no offense but you are just pulling that out of your ass cause there's no way to know that.

All sorts of substances effect people differently in ways that I could never even try to explain but which maybe some of those mods who know a lot more about neurology could explain.

Even with weed there are strains that are more motivating and less anxiety producing which could help someone to be more productive.

I've never tried Kratom but some on here sing it's praises and say that the more stimulating strains can help motivate some people to do more and be less lazy.

I know when I used dexedrine I'd be EXTREMELY motivated to write essays for school, read for hours and clean my apartment but have me smoke some weed and you will NOT see me react the same way, and I'm the same person so the difference in that equation is a different drug.

It is ALSO the person, because I have heard of many people who can be motivated by weed and go do daily tasks on it but I can't.

I think that drugs and personal brain neurology are probably a very delicate math equation and that the right drug at the right time for the right person with the right brain chemistry can be very beneficial.

To make a VERY simple argument, I am extremely social and not at all shy at bars when I drink, but if I smoke I won't talk to anyone.

So in that case, is it the drug or the person??

I'd say it's more the drug there.

Some drugs decrease inhibitions like benzos and alcohol, some can increase them like weed, some can give someone energy to get things done like dexedrine.

It's BOTH the person AND the substance and to say the substance doesn't play a MAJOR role is another way of being pro weed or pro-drug to the annoying extent I see all the time even though I believe in the legality of all drugs.

It's even more annoying when people complain about a substance and it's negative effects on them: yet continue to use. If this doesn't describe you then move on. Drugs aren't for everyone. Weed is not for everyone. Neither are cheeseburgers. Of course different drugs produce different effects. Whats your point?

 

[Mycophile]

It's even more annoying when people complain about a substance and it's negative effects on them: yet continue to use. If this doesn't describe you then move on. Drugs aren't for everyone. Weed is not for everyone. Neither are cheeseburgers. Of course different drugs produce different effects. Whats your point?

I have NOT continued to use weed.

I will smoke too much every several months and then abstain for as long as possible because even though I love it it often cause me issues.

My point was your saying that "90% of people who have issues with weed will have problems with any and all substances" is not necessarily true or proven in any way, and also, your saying "it's not the drug but the person" is not totally true.

Different people with different brain chemistries react differently to different substances and some have more of an allure for them than others.

It's not necessarily all or nothing and that if weed causes you problems you must also have problems with alcohol or cocaine or any other drug you choose to experiment with.

It's true that some people have addictive personalities, and I'm probably one of them, but I have found that certain substances don't cause as many problems for me as others.

I just didn't find your statements to be entirely true, so I voiced my opinion.

No hard feelings meant, it's just my viewpoint.

 

[RDP89]

I am a cannabis advocate and i can admit that it is not always good. For one thing not everyone can handle the high. Also I can't understand how people can sit there and say it is completely non-addicting. Even non-psychoactive substances and also behaviors and such can be psycholgically addicting so how can you say that a psychoactive has absolutley no addictive properties?? That said I do beleive it is much less harmful than most drugs including ethanol and acetaminophen.

 

[Beavesmx44]

I have NOT continued to use weed.

I will smoke too much every several months and then abstain for as long as possible because even though I love it it often cause me issues.

My point was your saying that "90% of people who have issues with weed will have problems with any and all substances" is not necessarily true or proven in any way, and also, your saying "it's not the drug but the person" is not totally true.

Different people with different brain chemistries react differently to different substances and some have more of an allure for them than others.

It's not necessarily all or nothing and that if weed causes you problems you must also have problems with alcohol or cocaine or any other drug you choose to experiment with.

It's true that some people have addictive personalities, and I'm probably one of them, but I have found that certain substances don't cause as many problems for me as others.

I just didn't find your statements to be entirely true, so I voiced my opinion.

No hard feelings meant, it's just my viewpoint.

None taken and same to you. I agree with with everything you said. I am sometimes too quick to jump on the types who blame substances on their personal problems instead of taking hold of their lives and doing something to change it. It's one of my personal pet peeves that annoys me every time I see it.

 

[Mycophile]

None taken and same to you. I agree with with everything you said. I am sometimes too quick to jump on the types who blame substances on their personal problems instead of taking hold of their lives and doing something to change it. It's one of my personal pet peeves that annoys me every time I see it.

That VERY much annoys me too, but it's not what I am doing even if it sounds like it.

 

[Smoothsprayh]

Well nobody has mentioned it yet.....Cannabinoid Hyperemesis Syndrome. I suffer from it. I want to continue getting high in spite of my certain realization that chronic smoking causes CHS for me. But that debate became irrelevant when I realized that during the 2 years I vaporized my herb only, that I did not have CHS. When my vaporizer broke, the CHS progressed to every two week attacks. I got a nice Ascent vaporizer four months ago and now have not had another attack. I believe the debate is not whether to stop smoking to cure CHS, but to switch to vaporization only. Remember that combustion is a chemical process creating many toxic compounds not found with vaporization. I propose that some could be toxic CB1 cannabinoids that have effect on hypothalamus leading to many of the symptoms of CHS. This is a first, I do not think anyone else has put combustion of pot and CHS together. I hope it works for others and no suffering is caused by enjoyment of this wonderful substance given to us by God.

 

[Mycophile]

Well nobody has mentioned it yet.....Cannabinoid Hyperemesis Syndrome. I suffer from it. I want to continue getting high in spite of my certain realization that chronic smoking causes CHS for me. But that debate became irrelevant when I realized that during the 2 years I vaporized my herb only, that I did not have CHS. When my vaporizer broke, the CHS progressed to every two week attacks. I got a nice Ascent vaporizer four months ago and now have not had another attack. I believe the debate is not whether to stop smoking to cure CHS, but to switch to vaporization only. Remember that combustion is a chemical process creating many toxic compounds not found with vaporization. I propose that some could be toxic CB1 cannabinoids that have effect on hypothalamus leading to many of the symptoms of CHS. This is a first, I do not think anyone else has put combustion of pot and CHS together. I hope it works for others and no suffering is caused by enjoyment of this wonderful substance given to us by God.

What is CHS?

I've never heard of it.

 

[badfish45]

A disorder including colic pain and nausea caused by use of cannabis.

 

[yteek]

90% of people who have issues that arise from marijuana would have issues with any and all mind altering substances. Not the substance....... its the person.

Bullshit, out of everything I've tried, even in moderation marijuana has caused me so much psychological distress, the typical anxiety, paranoia, perhaps some would say that pushes into the realm of nearly psychotic.

No other substance has impacted me more negatively to be honest, even alcohol.

Even in moderation, it can have this particularly negative impact on the user.

I fucking hate then on the other hand the argument "well they must of had a underlying mental illness", perhaps, not that really makes much a difference, it is like the chicken or the egg argument, what came first, it don't even really matter. Any other substance brings out the worst in someone, like alcohol for example, they're just drunk, weed brings out the worst in someone, they're obviously suffering from mental illness, bull fucking shit.

Not to say mental illness doesn't play a role in this, but such a petty write-off.

Weed is big, but I think the more it gets into the limelight and gains acceptance, it will eventually highlight the negative, I'm not anticannabis, but there is that side, that is often overlooked, weed may not kill you, but the downsides are quite prevalent for many.

I think it is rather common, obviously it is also common to enjoy and have no issue for some people, but I think many are impacted negatively by it.

 

[tryptamine-tripper]

The drugs I actively use are a variety of psychedelics, methoxetamine, kratom, and marijuana. The only one of these which actually causes serious negative effects on me is marijuana. Laziness and demotivation are effects specific to marijuana - psychedelics & MXE, when used wisely, are very beneficial and make me more motivated to make positive changes outside the trips, on kratom I am more productive and enjoy doing things, psychs/MXE/kratom all actively help me to deal with my anxiety issues as well, but smoking weed absolutely makes me extremely lazy, and while most of the time it helps with anxiety it's also the only drug I ever get really paranoid/anxious on.

Weed's not fucking harmless, I 100% believe that recent study saying heavy marijuana use in ones teens causes permanent changes in ones ability to be motivated- that definitely happened to me, using the other drugs I do actually helps me break out of that cycle of demotivation! I almost actually want to quit smoking marijuana, but really that isn't gonna happen, however for the most part I only smoke in the evening now, which helps me to be far more productive than I was when I used to smoke all day a lot of the time, so I am finding a better balance with it at least.

I have a sneaking suspicion that many of those who say marijuana is "harmless" just aren't at all self aware and can't see the problems it causes - I know I used to be that way (I know there are also some people who can be stoned constantly & still be productive, I know some personally myself, but contrary to popular belief among stoners they are in the minority).