• N&PD Moderators: Skorpio | thegreenhand

buggering around with chlormethiazole....sort of...

Limpet_Chicken

Bluelighter
Joined
Oct 13, 2005
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Well then, well then.

This is proving interesting. I just tried some of the deschloro-intermediate thiazolethanol that forms as the cleavage product of thiamine w/bisulfite or metabisulfite, the latter in this case, because I have some GI issues and puked my last dose of rx'd heminevrin (I take it twice a day for seizure prophylaxis, and its just about the best antiseizure drug I can think of, personally for me. VERY little tolerance or habituation physically taking 192mg cap twice a day. For at least a few years now. Wouldn't get away with THAT if it were a benzo or barb.The bromo-analog seems alright, not all that far different really. Never
tasted the iodo, iodine is too good of a leaving group, on a terminal aliphatic haloalkyl moiety. Way too close to an alkylating agent potentially for my liking. mono-fluoroethyl is not happening, not now, not ever. Might try nitrating the intermediate with HNO3 or mixed acid, maybe a nitrate/conc sulfuric in-situ and hope for nothing like a nitrobenzene version, the alcohol would react quicker than the ring, would it not? just saying that because I once did end up with what at the time, I thought was trinitrophenol, or possibly TNT in solution as a yellow oil that absolutely stank to high heaven of benzaldehyde or cyanide after attempting a TNT synth as a youngster, and which I now believe to have been crude, impure nitrobenzene or a methylated version of it, because it didn't seem to form an aldoxime when submitted to a couple of basic tests. Wasn't familiar with nitrobenzene at the time in a personal sense (anyone know just how strong the smell is? the in-situ treatment of toluene or benzene in the cold with sulfuric and ammonium nitrate absolutely FILLED the room with that intense, overwhelming smell of marzipan/benz. Smelled pretty damn good actually, despite the toxicity of nitrobenzene and its relatives (this isn
't asking for synth help, more piecing together the clues to what that yellow oil was likely to be, the formation of it has already taken place, years ago, I just want to know WHAT was happening really there)


Just tried a dose of a few hundred mg of the intermediate alcohol (this is the insoluble fraction which precipitates whilst the pyrimidine crap from the thiamine cleavage stays in solution and is filtered and washed off.

Not far carrying, not terribly strong, but truly satanic stink to it. Not surprising really, chalcogen chemistry is all about stinks and stenches, when sulfur is nasty, selenium is worse and tellurium, well just get someone else to do that synthesis whatever it may be, you and everybody who ever comes within the same room as you will be very thankful for it, as will any spouse or partner.

Prior to ingesting the thiazoleethanol cleavage product (hadn't either any carbon tet or thionyl chloride/bromide to run the halogenation step with to hand right now and it was needed right then right there, time wise, felt like utter garbage, anxiety/panic and tachycardic, some myoclonus. Those dissappeared within about five minutes post plugging the intermediate.
It does APPEAR to be active, although I only took a relatively low dose (treating it as if it were chlormethiazole itself) and whaddya know...I actually almost feel somewhat relaxed. Might even be able to sleep tonight, because there is a cereal bowl full of the intermediate there available, still got a load of metabisulfite in it, but that just washes out with water.

wouldn't recommend oral admin of this stuff though jesus H, the taste is truly awful. Sulfurous and foul, tasted a tiny speck to test for residual metabisulfite, the stink isn't like H2S, but more like the faint odor of thiamine, magnified manyfold, and it lingers, like sucking on an anus sphincter lollypop. Only not that pleasant. But definitely do feel a lot better for taking it, not anxious and sweaty, able to sit back and listen to some obscure sphinx, and I feel, very faintly like the beginnings of some ptosis taking hold, eyelids do feel a bit heavy *yawns and stretches*
 
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very interesting. please keep us posted. are you conssidering iving the finished product? it would be wiser not to. i heard if you dont use glass you have to be really quick as the shit melts plastic!!
 
You must be fucking dropping a monster turd on on my breakfast if you think I'd Iv the stuff, ever handled chlormethiazole? if you haven't, its an oil, with a very distinct smell, like rotting apples, ether and metal put together. Itds very aggressive to plastics, even the heminevrin commervial gelcaps need to be dispensed to me in a glass bottle every time I get a script for my meds, I already take the stuff but I've been having some really severe GI issues, bad en0ugh that my docs caved in to my request for ondansetron, after the first three or so admissions to the ER. This, mind you put me in hospital, vomiting torrents of bile, streaked with blood, and it just wouldn't stop. Already on about 8 different medications for my stomach, getting ultrasound done. So im most certainly not faking it to get drugs out of the doc, but its difficult to get emergency replacements even when I need them, as my med regime includes 3 different opioid preparations, and strong ones at that (I can tolerate up to about a gram of morphine sulfate via IV. Don't ask how I got it all in there or about the histamine release after,you really don't want to know!

I'm simply taking matters into my own hands, that way I need not hope nor plead for the beneficence of another.


The commercial caps, I've left out on a computer keyboard for a while, and later found two dents neatly burnt into the plastic in the shape of the caps. And not all of it is going to end up as chlormethiazole, some will be getting brominated if my suppliier carries thionyl bromide (possibly unlikely since its uncommon although shes rather good at getting what shes asked for) or failing that, carbon tetrabromide, so I cam use the Appel rxn to do the halogenation, using triphenylphosphine, as I've got tons of the stuff left. Not the usual way to do things, but theres no reason it won't work, it will work for chlorinating so afaik brominating with the Appel rxn should go just as well.

Other ideas are nitrating it, trifluoromethylation maybe, or rhodanide perhaps. Seems like it wants a strongly electronegative group there if possible, but anyone know if alkoxy works and if so the size of the alkyl chain to effect ratio?

All in all though the alcohol was easier to prepare even than GHB, chlorbutol or diethyl ether. ONE step and a water wash did it! from vitamin pills! damn. Got another bottle of thiamine too for more experimenting. No pharma companu is likely to reexamine this suff, actually it surprises me a bit that chlormethiazole is still in use, since it mimics the barbiturates very closely aside from lacking the binding to AMPA type GLuRs that barbs do. And its just as damn dangerous if fucked with carelessly. OD on a benzo your going to come round groggy and mashed up later, chlormethiazole OD your just not going to wake up again, period. And its a real bastard to try and form solid salts of, only stable one is the ethaendisulfonic acid salt. I don't even bother and just plug the base shaken up to emulsify it in some water.

IVing it ?: *shudder* the stuff has the consistency of naphtha, a mobile, thinnsh, mobile oil. Chlormethiazole as a soluble salt if I had a glass rig id consider it. Sterilizing would be a bugger, couldnt use a micron filter, it'd melt. Would have to introduce it to a burst of xrays or gamma to ccook any bugs in there. Better yet m just going to let chloro/bromo/trifluoromethiazole stay as oral and rectally administered agents.

Got to admit though I fucking love the original stuff, bes sedative-hypnotic i've ever had, the only ones that compare are barbital, valerian extract and maybe propofol, but propofol isn't one i'll ever experiment with more, its too dangerous, and the short duration I could see making it nightmarishly addictive potentially. Sod that I like living,. Well sort of. Sometimes. To a degree. And no I am not joking about the valerian, I like it specially because of its effect on dreaming, it causes me lucid and incredibly intense dreaming, so intense its actually like the shitstorm from an oncoming psychedelic, its more likebeing battered and tossed around in a maelstrom of dreaming, one after the other after another without cease while its active, if taken just before bed.

Valerians an oddball though, targeting the loreclezole binding site. Shit, I've wanted to try loreclezole for years. And I cant find it available anywhere. Kind of getting to the point of working out how to make some, i'd love the chance to test valerian against it as a benchmark, as i've never tasted another loreclezole binding site ligand.

Another reason not to IV it is I need the few veins I've got left for if ever emergency medical care needs to get a line in. Theyve had to go with IM alfentanil/midaz and inhaled sevo before as they couldn't find a vein after about an hour of stabbing me in the neck etc. And I've NEVER even USED those veins. They are all just hard to access, used and abused or not.

Oh and of note, it does start to stink of SOX after a while once water is added due likely to hydrolysis of the (meta/)bisulfite, and the satanic sulfurous stink of the thiazole compound still really lingers if you let it touch skin. my hands still smell like old scratch's armpit:p Made the mistake of squeezing the coffee filter I used to wash the xtyls by hand, hope it fades by the time I have to picky rx up lol. That'd be the second bout they had to endure of sulfur chem run amok. The fiirst was worse by far though, mercaptans involved, go figure=D
 
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i remember reading a thread on opiophile about some guy "finally" getting the chance to IV the liquid out of the caps.

seemed to be sought after, and IV was considered by a few, but there were a lot of steel feelers on opiophile! Careful of the synth talk its unfortunate we cant go into more detail but itd be sad to see the thread closed.

my veins are bad too. dunno how you manage to shoot 1000mg morphine in one go. even for 3ml barells ive been considering getting a butterfly kit. my script for cyclizine is unlikely to be reissued. The water soluble citrate salt i had been adding to my H shots has run out. I am saving my veins, doing some weights and my next "reward" shot will be 0.4g heroin, 50-100mg diphenhydramine, 60-90mg flurazepam and either a small bit of coke or cleaned up street amphet, just for dopamine. would like to use a 2.5ml barrell for it.
I will save the rest of the coke for a regular speedball. I think more than just a taste of coke would be wasted in a combo like the former. i eventually came to that conclusion after shooting midazolam with my speedballs for a while.

Wanted to try the 3fpm/heroin goofball. did so in small doses as in 150mg. dont have the veins anymore. burnt the shit out of me. for 300+mg id definately need a bigger rig especially with gear in it.
 
With a syringe intended for rectal feeding of people who cannot swallow, with a needle hacked on to the end. Its like a 60ml barrel or something. Most I've ever done is about a gram and a half of morphine sulfate, with some oxy thrown in for good measure, as its water soluble decently enough. I don't really advise doing it though like that, its a LOT of fluid to be putting in, and I actually bled myself a bit first to make some room for it.
And 3-fluorophenmetrazine and opioid speedballs....oh my fucking GOD yes! 'goofball' is that what people are calling it?

Did about 250 of the 3fpm and an unweighed precisely, but a solid fucking belt of dipropionylmorphine (my personal favourite opioid, excluding only really a de-codeine-ized full spectrum opium poppy isolate, that after the codeine is gone to make the result IVable, the entire mixed alkaloid lot acylated with the propionyl moiety serving as the acyl groups of choice (I presume that merely going so far as 'being made to bear a specific functional group' doesn't count as synth talk merely naming what the product is, not HOW it was made' once after picking up some new rigs from an exchange in the city center, sat on a burger king bog in the stall, and coming out absolutely fizzing and sparking at the edges.

Lol somebody else had obviously been getting high on something in the other stall because I heard a snort, another snort, followed by gulp, gulp, gulp, clattering spirit bottle falls under the edge, a barf, a string of curse words, and then guy exiting the other stall at about the time I did. And he actually said something to the effects of 'what are you on, it looks like some good fucking shit mate' although he didn't seem to understand the answer. I have that problem sometimes, of needing a translator in my speech, when speaking english to english speakers that is. But things often come out too tech-oriented and I find it difficult to 'dumb things down' if that makes sense.

But everybody in the bog waiting for the stalls could tell that I was absolutely spannered.


Tryptamite, PM inbox cleared out now? I tried to send you one a while ago about cyclizine but your inbox was full. Because my own script for cyclizine, that is not going to be stopped without my doctor being told to do so by myself, and I am not strongly attached to/conserving of the cyclizine, ESPECIALLY now that I managed to persuade, finally, one of my GPs to add ondansetron to my list of meds for the stomach troubles I've been having. She was a little reluctant, but unlike the other GP, my main one, who despite refusing me the ondansetron, he is an excellent GP and a good, compassionate, decent man, and I won't speak ill of him for refusing the ondansetron, I owe the man my quality of life, and he has given much of it me back which I otherwise couldn't have had, other than by dint of going to my lab and working me fucking nackers off.

And damned if I would find a total synthesis o f morphine anything but immensely challenging and difficult. Although I do intend, SOME day, some day in the future, to do it, when I am not limited to a workspace too small for my liking, had to relocate the lab to another part of the house so my MS and some sort of frontal lobe/fronto-temporal dementia/pick's disease type dementia-lobotomized more or less animal of a mother now, could have a downstairs bedroom, had to give up my former lab space so the building could be converted for her. Hopefully she will die sooner rather than linger more. Its awful to see what she has become, the poor fucking bastard. Shit I don't even begrudge her my having to move my lab to somewhere so damn cramped as it is now; i just hate seeing her stuck like that, incapable of doing much more than eat a few mouthfuls of any meal, and/or point towards the kitchen, speaking more or less the last two words she has remaining to her, to be taken into the kitchen and one of her smokes doled out to her because she can't be trusted to have a lighter and fags, because she'd just light them up in the lounge and smoke the place up, set smoke alarms off or worse actually set the house or herself on fire. I'd be glad if she suddenly dies, but dies of something instant and painless in her sleep like a massive stroke, or aortic/carotid aneurysm bursting, or a literal bolt of lightening direct hit, not something ugly like her turning herself into a human torch :(

Pains me every damn day to have to see what she goes through, its just awful. And makes me worried I'll go the same way. Because the MS and fronto-temporal dementia has robbed her of almost every vestige of herself, and every last shred of human dignity until I cannot even recognize her as the woman she used to be when I was growing up.



Where you get the butterflies? Not mind you because I am even entertaining the mere thought of slamming heminevrin. I have some of the fully chlorinated variety right here, and whilst I've plugged it often enough NO WAY IN *ALL HADES*
will I ever inject something that melts plastic, and neither am I willing to IV an oil. Because the liquid in the caps is chlormethizole base. I've got rigs and as it happens I JUST necked a couple of heminevrin caps whilst composing the start of this very post xD

Fucking LOVE the stuff. As well as finding it the finest of all the anticonvulsant agents, for it controls my seizures near enough 100%, even whilst taking otherwise potentially proconvulsive drugs, its almost totally free of side effects, for me at least. When I first started it I would get a peculiar stinging kind of sensation due to its histamine releasing properties, localized right behind the back of the bridge of my nose (I mean by the back, at the top of the nose, and then inwards towards the direction of the skull and brain although that faded after a while. But while it lasted it served as an alarm clock to tell me when it had kicked in. Now I rely on not drinking any fluid or eating ANYTHING, or even swallowing saliva, until the caoso burst open in my dry throat, leaving a lovely hot, burning sensation in the throat and oesophagus. Lol, call me an odd duck if you must, but I actually do find it pleasant, and likewise the chlormethiazole-flavoured belches that come back up on you like diethyl or diisopropyl ether do if they are drank rather than inhaled.

Lol you know something funny? well no, you don't, but your about to find it out.

A doctor I used to have as a GP, now retired sadly, for he was an excellent doctor as well a as a very good man, not a person who would unreasonably let a patient suffer, he really did CARE about the people he treated, and made sure he did his job to the absolute best of his abilities. I cannot prove it and would not try, for it would drop him in it very deep if I told authorities what and who and how and where etc.

But 'doctor ABC XYZ', at the time, knew I was a major downer freak for sedative-hypnotics. But he also knew that I knew my shit, so to speak, I.e am well aware of the properties of such things and how they interact, what can be got away with and what certainly cannot.But at the time I was just MASSIVELY overdoing it, and I was well down the road to ending up in a bodybag if I'm honest. Doing a fuckton of all sorts, but mostly barbital. Wasn't IVing the barbital, couldn't have IV'ed the free acid anyway, it isn't soluble in water and you really don't want ever to IV any of the barbiturates for the sodium salts are extremely caustic, and alkaline. They cause HIDEOUSLY extensive, deep and ugly burns if you miss any although never suffered one, because as I say I only took it orally or plugged as the shit in the free acid form is insoluble in H2O. Usual way to take it was just to toss-and-wash.

As for the fluoropreludin/dipropionylated refined crystalline poppy pod isolate thats had the ol' acylation treatment ala H, but one carbon longer than boring old acetyl based balls, I can think of no finer combination of upper and opioid.
Although that mix can be made even nicer with some MXP thrown in there too (its a lefetamine analog tuned for dissociative and next largest main effect being opioid although mildish to medium..never tried lefetamine yet although I really do want to)

Bet it'd be just wonderful with a dash of 3-hydroxy-PCP too, or some MXP in the shot. But thats just me, I've always been a raving dissociative fiend, even before I ever tried one. It was there waiting, like a beast straining at its leash,
smelling the scent of PCP analogs on the wind, and knowing that sooner or later, that leash is going to snap and the beast will have its freedom to go on the rampage. It had and it did.
 
would love to try the diffferent morphine type drugs. The one you described sounds nice. next time i come across df118s i will keep them until i have a lab again and get some proper glassware back. then make dihydromorphine -> dihydroheroin. ill probably just get a few mls AA. but will definately try a kompt style pod extract "3,6-__-morphine" in the future.

perhaps i should stay on low dose methadone for another year. i still want to fuck around with opioids a little. i find it hard when im clean because one day of use means 3 days of unease. i tell myself i could save up my lyrica script and taken properly it would completely negate the minor WDs i feel from once off uses of anything but codeine and subutex. however i realise now that anything other than subutex will more than likely lead back to physical dependency eventually.

i have fucked up my mu receptors as well as my benzo site/gaba a and should probably leave them alone in future.

goofball. lol. i just made it up. sounds like a good thing to call it tthe way you described it to me :). i am set on trying this.. however i think i wouuld not go as high as 500mg like some. 250mg + h + cyclizine citrate/dph in a 10ml barrell conected to a butterfly line and needle. diluted so it doesn't sting the fuck out of my veins.
you can get them online fairly handy. never tried them but they seem like a good idea for anything over a 3ml. heck they might even make a 2ml easier on certain veins.
people use them in autralia/nz to iv their methadone take homes which are normally very diluted.

methadone is nice iv but i would not inject the oral preparation. I had capsules once from france. a simple alcohol extraction prevented jelling and the film left after evaporation mixed with h20 for a concentration of about 50mg/ml. no "flash" but a slow rush and packs a punch harder than orally dosing. would like to combine it with cyclizine to see if that kind of opioid has some special relationship with cyclizine.
there are methadone preparations here 1mg/ml that i believe are watery enough to extract the methadone base from it with proper filter paper, buchner and vacumm filter source, although i cannot test this theory as i dont have the equipment. perhaps when my course finishes i will make some diy essentials until i have enough dollhairs to buy glass. i have to invest in photogrpahy equipment as well and get together rent and deposit for new gaff too, so the hobbies like this kind of project are down on my list at the moment.

not a fan of dissociatives. ived mxe once. would be intersting to try a small dose of k or similar with cocaine but i wouldnt put it in my speed or goof balls :)

definately want to make more soluble cyclizine salt soon and store it safely. best rush of all antihistamines. even has a mild rush alone if one was desperate and had already consumed opiates.

i believe people are starting to shoot pregabalin into large veins with large needles (groin). a friend died from this in a shot with h and dalmane. just empty into barrell and shake well. same as crushed cyclizine or zopiclone. increadibly unhealthy.

would be interesting to form a salt of pregabalin and iv 300/400mg to see if it has anything special when done this way.

(please note that i am benzo tolerant and also used to lyrica. 400mg is not a lot to me at all. however they are available from doses of 25mg to 300mg. i have seen people gee-eyed on 50mg while other people need the maximum recommended dose of 600mg to feel anything. do not attempt to iv pregabalin capsules at any dose)

sorry to hear about the situation with your mam. will shoot you a pm soon
 
Shoot me a PM about cyclizine, and if you want to...know about...acylating agents too. I can...tell you what acylating agents are used for....and...instruct as to correct lab technique for their use, etc. Just PM me. Although I use acyl halides more often than I do anhydrides generally speaking. But...just PM me..

I'd LOVE to try dihydroheroin, or better yet dihydrodipropionylmorphine. Never actually synthed any. Although I've wondered if reduction of the thiolate, via a really, really really nonvolatile mercaptan, because of the vile, toe-curling stink of the lower mol.weight mercaptans. If you've never worked with mercaptan/thiols.




Methadone? damn lucky bastard, I WISH I could get methadone. I've had it before, but only 3-4 times. Probably something if I'd ever had the opportunity to explore it more that would have easily made ir to thetop of my list of preferred opioids
I WISH i could get hold of it I really do, but I don't know how methadone clinics in the UK work, I don't know WHERE they are local to me, and I'd have difficulty getting to them at all if they are far off, and even more so if I had to attend daily before getting take-homes.

Is it possible, for patients on 'done who's personal circumstances regarding transport ever to go rapidly or straight to take-homes? and is it possible ever to get permanent physical incapacitation, of a kind which will cannot be healed and which has left the wouldbe attendee at a methadone clinic crippled for the duration of their life since first receiving the disabling injury? Because my personal circumstances are not conducive to being CAPABLE of attending a 'done clinic every fucking morning. I just cannot manage it. I certainly cannot get a lift from family, either, because my old man doesn't need to know, but thats a secondary consideration, because he could not give transport in his car anyway, because my mother has dementia and cannot be trusted on her own, although MS has left her confined to her wheelchair unable to move, so she can do little damage now that she has had her cigarettes and lighter taken away from her, to be doled out when she wants taking into the kitchen for a fag. Otherwise she could burn the house down or something.

So she certainly cannot be left on her own for more than a few minutes)

Fuck no I'd not try IVing pregabalin or gabapentin at all. I've tried oral pregabalin though, and I get loads of gabapentin on script, although I don't really use anything like as much as I actually am prescribed. Just when I run low on opioids or need some help with the neuropathic pain in my leg flaring up.

I think of it as a kind of pauper's benzo really.

And try the acylated kompot if you are going to be doing some kind of opiate anyhow, not suggesting you start using if your not now, but if your GOING to use an opiate, then propionylated 'kompot' (thanks for reminding me of the name) sure as shit isn't a bad one for one's choice of specific drug.. I do highly recommend however, the use of propionyl group rather than acetyl if your making some, and thats the only way anybody is likely ever to get any because people growing can generally just grow enough that they want to keep it all for themselves=D Would love some myself right now, but all I've got at home opiate wise is morphine, and not enough of that for my liking.

Do you mean filtering methadone liquid as is supplied to maint. users ? (britain)

Pretty tolerant to gabapentin myself it'd seem, because I can use strips of the stuff orally, to not all that dramatic effect; seem to be fairly 'hard-headed' (or thick-skulled possibly:p) with respect to that drug. IVing it or lyrica though
god damn thats nasty! was the lyrica the COD? the excipients? if you do not mind me asking the question.

. Asymmetrical ones are next on the list to try, propionylbenzoylmorphine is the next one in line, maybe propionylacetyl and benzoylacetyl.

IIRC if neither anhydride or halide be used, but instead, at least in the case of GAA, 6-monosubstituted acyl derivatives are the result, like 6-MAM. 6-propionylmorphine is one I'd really like to give a go. the 3-monosubstituted morphine derivatives are somewhat unpleasant compounds, toxicity wise I believe.
 
How would you 3 benzoylate your 6-propionylmorphine? That sounds interesting, far more interesting than other pregabalin ROAs.

I was thinking of a CWE on some Paramol followed by a cleanup of the dihydrocodeine and start from there.

On a side note apparently DHC will replace codeine in a "BHNT" very well, haven't sat down to try to go through it but have looked at the codeine/HI reaction and its a messy messy one, but still don't understand why a little more care is not taken by elektoshirka users in russia and along the borders.

I am going to try store some delicious poppy seeds on a few patches around the place. i sure hope they are still there when i come back to collect them in septemer, they better not have grown into flowers or anything! :)
Have you every tried playing around with your morphine supply? in your head? I know you need them but at least with AA there is littlle chance of fucking up and actually losing some if anything ive read about NZ homebake is to be believed. They basically just crush the tablet and heat with acetylating agent. They only bother to try seed out the morphine if the batch is over a gram in size.

And yes i do mean filtering the actual maintenence liquid. I know it can be done and at least here in ireland you can ask for different brands and some are like water (with excipients). Some would not work as they are so thick.
Methadone probably would be a good painkiller and its long lasting but I would be wary if i was you of going down the path of "addiction" treatment to get it. Likely your other opioates would be stopped eventually. As far as i know at least here there are no special circumstances for anybody in the clinics, but if your lucky you might get a sound doctor and only have to see him once a fortnight, he decides if you have to just go to collect your whole bottle once a week or every day. you might still be urine tested though. Can your own doctor not give you methadone? Usually you have to be reffered to a methadone doctor or know him and live "officially" in his catchment area. You can basically refer yourself almost to some of the clinics.

I will be back on a clinic in a few weeks and i normally build up a stockpile once i get to the stage of take aways.
 
Benzoyl chloride and TETA. The TETA is incidental, its only there to suck HCl.

NZ homebake isn't done that way as I understand it. Its a pyridine demethylation of codeine. Works alright, but yields aren't going to exceed 30something percent if your not sloppy. Far better is using a mercaptan to form a mercaptide and dealkylation with that, I'll dig the ref up if you want tryptamite, the yields are staggering, read of upwards of 90%

In the case of starting with morphine itself though...chance of fucking up using the anhydride route? christ fucking wept bile-saturated faeces from his EARS!, I would just DIE of embarrassment! I could never, ever, ever let that get past the lab door, and if I had a lab partner, I'd have to kill them if they saw it happen or got wind of the slightest, merest, most ghostly, spectral and insubstantial wisp of my so doing!. Hell I'd probably have to shoot myself for good measure (albeit with morphine rather than the gauss, mind you:p) Uneducated indian peasantry can be taught to brew up skag, albeit of piss poor quality (in my estimation), I've even heard of a very primitive method of doing it practiced by a few addicts in some article or other once, where the smackheads were simply dropping morphine, no idea if it was even extracted from pill matrices, into a spoon, dropping in some AA, and setting it on fire with a lighter! Apparently it resulted in some actual product. Good fucking god almighty, stripped naked, tied to a tree and pissed all over by dogs, with a banger up his bottom. Thats right up there with the ballsack birch almost, in terms of being both shocking and revolting. I'd never resort to such as that, I really would be ashamed of myself if I ever sank so far as to be so sloppy and to boot, so wasteful of acetic anhydride, although its not very expensive from suppliers that are willing to, lol...err..well..supply it. I don't actually HAVE any, but thats only because I haven't needed any recently, since my last liter got used up (none of it, even hypothetically, actually went into acetylating morphine or any other opiate/opioids, didn't have any point to do it. And if I DID, practically or hypothetically, wish to acylate morphine I wouldn't bother making H, because quite frankly, it is an utterly inferior drug, I like prope dope (to coin a new term for the 3,6-propionyl diester, 'prope dope' it is, and prope dope it will be forevermore, rolls off the tongue nicely, no?...although it rolls into one's circulatory system via venous access a lot more nicely ;) Easier for most people anyway, who seem a lot of the time, for some reason, to need some kind of slang term. I've met H users that didn't KNOW what '3,6-diacetylmorphine' or 'acylation'/acyl moiety' meant for fucks sake, 'prope dope' sounds good, makes sense, and should satisfy people's hunger for the vernacular, and allow such users to speak of it without pointing to wikipedia=D) And of course, its ''prope-r' top notch shit
At least, as long as its prope-rly made. But if your going to try a morphine-family opioid, and its not an acylated papavaretum, prope dope is the one IMO. Don't fancy butyrylmorphine due to the nastyass odour of butyric acid. Never smelled, or even owned any butyric anhydride or butyryl halides, never used any of anyone else's either, absolutely no contact with it whatsoever. But the various isomeric amyl anhydrides/halides, I wouldn't mind trying the resultant 6-mono and 3,6-diesters of the different pentanoyl isomers. And I've never tried 3,6-diisopropionylmorphine though.

I also wish to try, as far as benzoylated esters go, 6-benzoylmorphine, 6-benzoyl-3-propionyl and 6-propionyl-3-benzoyl and dibenzoylmorphines. Plus, I figure a mixture of randomized positionally isomeric benzoylated and propionylated, and benzoylpropionylated morphine acyl esters that would result from simultaneous acylation of both hydroxyls with mixed acyl halides in an equimolar ratio, cleaned up as per the typical methods applied to that end, to see how the mixture compares to isolated products or combinations of two or more products.

As for AA acylation of M, then whilst anhydrides are easier, prefer to envision acyl halides. Its faster. Yes, you must separate the base, whatever one chooses. Wouldn't mind thinking about it with NH3 in dimethyl ether (MeOMe has a very very low boiling point, -24 'C, being able to just turn off a cryostat, or remove a flask from a freezing mixture like ether/acetone/salted ice, or dry ice, and allow the entirety of the solvent (after addition of a little low boiling solvent other than an ether, like dichlor, or perhaps carbon disulfide, because one shouldn't allow ethers to boil to dryness in the pot, because it concentrates peroxides/hydroperoxides if present or if formed during the reaction [would probably blanket it in argon to avoid it, although an acyl halide rxn is very quick proceeding to completion and MeOMe wouldn't hang about long in any case, so perhaps, if treated for peroxides immediately before use, under inert atmosphere and distilled directly into the argon filled rxn vessel. Only thing is I don't know how bad it is for peroxidation compared to diethyl ether, THF and DIPE (ethers of secondary alcohols with the secondary carbon on the carbon attached to the oxygen, like DIPE are particularly bad, its recommended to test diisopropyl ether for peroxidation every 3 months compared to yearly for EtOEt) And THF peroxidizes quickly too although I'm not sure of the number crunching for that one, typically I only buy what THF I'm going to use within a couple of reactions, and if I'm using DIPE, only enough to perform *A* reaction, or/and some left for a few 'manhattan projects' as I've named my custom 'care+' brand codeine linctus/vodka/cheap tesco own brand cheapass lime fizzy pop [specifically that one, deliberately, not because of pricing] with a floated shot of diethyl ether/DIPE or both like a jagerbomb, but I really don't like keeping diisopropyl ether in the house, for obvious reasons. Never had a problem with any kind of ether becoming peroxidized though, indeed I'm probably overzealous and cautious in that respect. I don't need it to happen to me, for that. All I needed was to read the account of someone, and see some pics of other incidents, the account, being a fridge containing some ether or other, EtOEt or THF, I think, most likely THF but I'm going from memory. Fridge. Peroxide. No fridge. Fridge-shaped hole in what was left of the ceiling, what used to be a fridge, scattered around the remains of ground zero. If I remember right, the windows were blown out too. Place looked like a bomb had gone off in the lab. Which it pretty much had, a bomb in the shape of a crusty old bottle of ether in that fridge.

Not a pretty sight in the slightest, the place was in fucking ruins. Which is bad enough in a commercial lab, but personally, I would be absolutely devastated, that would be way beyond heartbreaking, gutwrenching agony. I don't even have the words to describe how much that would rip me up inside, I really don't. And I speak two languages, with a decent latin vocabulary as a side dish, so to speak, although not very good with the tenses. And picked up parts of 5-6 others, to a lesser or a greater extent. I still don't have the words to describe what damage like that would do. I don't have the sign language words to speak of it either, other than simply cursing and blaspheming the air not just blue, but vitriolic enough to protonate the paint right off the fucking walls down to the bare, bricks, probably left, if surviving intact, with a sizzling coating of brick-glass.

But reverse schadenfreude aside, really, and sarcastic wording aside, it really would be beyond devastating. I already lost my lab once, due to fucking filth raiding the place. And not just a few test tubes, flasks, and maybe a buchner and water aspirator either. Had to replace everything, including ALL my kit, and every last reagent I had. The plat cat and Pd/C alone nearly broke me when I had to replace it, considering the financial aspect and nothing BUT that aspect, to say nothing of having to prepare fresh catalysts, not to mention the other precious metal compounds, metal powders/wire/electrodes of all manner of flavors. I can't afford to replace thousands of pounds worth of chemicals and several times that in just equipment ONCE, let alone twice due to blasting the entire lot to hades and Hades. I STILL haven't recovered to my former glory. And there isn't one, not even one day gone by in nearly a decade, that its not stung and burnt like a face full of NaOH (I'd know, unfortunately, and its every bit as unpleasant as you'd expect, more so when one needs to clean the GBL/GHB/NaOH off the walls, ceiling, and every other kitchen fitting on your release from school break for a weekend to come back home and see your family, and vent the smell of THF from the kitchen after using the kitchen tap to irrigate your eye and clean your face of caustic, lactone, G and solvents, all nice and toasty boiling hot, AND then extract the half done job from a load of sloppy bog and kitchen roll mush, stick it all back where it came from and get it done, all in a few hours, racing against the clock before your mother and father wake up, find out and boil you alive in molten tar before covering your still-twitching, skinless, almost-carcass in feathers and dropping it off the most expedient long fucking drop onto sharp rocks:p)

Although there have been setbacks, none like that though, thankfully at least, I've got back until I can stand on my own two feet, metaphorically speaking. But I've been left with PTSD. Self-guided psychedelic therapy (using them as a catalyst, AMT in particular, with a small amount of MXE with it, at first, until I no longer needed the help to be able to set myself cognitively aside from the events and help come to terms with things. Its not been perfect and theres work to be done. But it HAS helped, christ, has it ever, let me adjust. I don't wake up screaming anymore at night, and the nightmares and flashbacks are less than they were, especially the nightmares. Used to get the most awful nightmares of the lab being trashed, only slowly, piece, by piece, by piece by piece, saw things like being tied to the lab door whilst hammers, bats, metal bars etc were being taken to my stuff, all piled up in front of me slowly, and pieces being taken out, lined up in front of me, and being made to stamp on my own equipment, whilst solvents were torched, thrown out of windows, poured down the drain, catalysts taken and thrown , all the things I'd put the greatest efforts into creating and sometimes designing often as not, in those cunt cursed crowbegotten bastard fucking dreams, saved until last.

Even now, I still sometimes wake up with a start, shaking all over. And its neither because of a drug taken, or because of a drug that should have been and was not, taken. Fucking glad that I get chlormethiazole on rx to save me the trouble of always, always having some to hand by means of having to make it. Not difficult to do, but if I had to make sure of a constant supply of thiamine, and constantly spend on thionyl chloride or bromide, or on C-tet (not that easy to find even for me, not sure if my favourite supplier carries it, probably, so its likely less problematic now, as its been a fair while since I've ever needed CCl4, and I've never used CBr4, so I've no idea if I can find that or not. But it really is viewed as the devil incarnate, WORSE, seemingly, than mercury and its compounds. And being much less of general use, for the most part replaceable with dichlor or chloroform that was enough to sound the death knell in general. Isn't it the case that even in 'professional' [I.e with some sort of affiliation to a uni, or actual business lab] labs, its hated on so intensely that its outright banned for any use but those which cannot by any means substitute it, reserved for use

The stench problem (with the mercaptide/thiolate route that is), is best countered by the use of a thiol that is so big and bulky that its rendered nonvolatile, dodecanethiol was the one in the paper IIRC, and its just too heavy to be volatile. Wouldn't fancy snorting a line though=D Do NOT try it with say, propanethiol, butanethiol, pentanethiols etc. because they really, really really do reek something hideous. NOT something I ever, EVER wish to work with again. Really, don't, the lower ones just are not suitable for use outside a glovebox if you want to try, but be warned, a single drop of any of the liquid lower weight aliphatic alkanethiols would render your home uninhabitable for as long as it takes to dissipate the eau de Styx. Get it on you, and it will follow you harder than a lawyer with a writ. Think skunk spray, refined down to a weapons-grade product.

The methadone clinics would go on medical records..scratch that then. Damn. No way to get the stuff then. My own doc, no. And not so desperate as to try and get him to switch me onto it as a sole pain med. Although it is attractive for certain reasons, if I could have gone on methadone from day one, when switching from codeine/DHC (Not as a maint. med, actually as the primary analgesic, because I can't actually get off the painkillers at all, because the underlying cause of the pain, isn't going to be going away. Not short of removing the leg, which would doubtless be a lot more unpleasant and is in no way whatsoever justifiable or desired.) Primarily I like it also due to its dual MOR agonism/NMDA antagonism, because I've got nerve damage courtesy of knee surgery. And I've always felt a lot more psychologically/mentally stable whilst on an NMDA antagonist. I really don't feel right unless I have some sort of NMDA antagonist, at a low dose. I'm actually capable of USING my intellect well then, rather than being stuck with the disabling cognitive fog I get otherwise. I'd love memantine on rx, but have been totally stonewalled. Have tried it and it was brilliant, but otherwise I've been stuck with the likes of MXE, PCP analogs or diphenidine at low doses. Diphenidine being the best of them by far. Getting desperate enough now, to consider a total synthesis of memantine, or even going to the effort of running a grignard and making some PCP. As otherwise I barely feel like I'm hanging on to sanity, its getting that fucking bad.

I was more thinking, in terms of methadone clinics, dropping the use myself once 'on' it, and working out the whole piss test thing myself.
With regards to developing an 'addiction', too late for that mate, too fucking late for that! Was first on codeine for years and years, then switched first to DHC, then tried time-released DHC because the short duration of action caused too many peaks and troughs in plasma levels, whilst the peaks are just fine with me ;) the troughs were not, and DHC withdrawal if your taking a substantial dose is actually rougher than you might expect going solely from the potency as a function of drug weight per dose times by total dose and modified for bodyweight (I don't weigh much at all, 9 stone 9 to 10st, which has been static and very little susceptible to attempts to alter it one way or the other, by any means. Although that does at least mean I get to consume as many cream cakes, steaks, as much candy as well as (and this is critically, vitally important, at least to me, if I couldn't, or had to watch my intake, I'd hate life, or at least, not like it very much in many respects) as many big basketfuls of juicy, delicious wild mushrooms, fried in lovely salty, fat-laden, greasy butter as I like. (such as my absolute favorites, giant puffball fritters, deep-fried in batter, using butter rather than oil for flavor, slices of juicy sulfur polypore, dipped in eggy bread slush and fried in batter, covered in whipped salted buttery egg, then fried in batter again. Fried morels stuffed with minced beef or lamb , spiced with a blend of black pepper, schzechuan [cant spell it...pronounced 'sesh-wan' pepper, dried sumac berries [pink 'pepper'], fly agaric, and shredded up peppery boletus [Chalciporus piperatus]. A mixture not dissimilar to that which I like on my steaks, although for stuffed meaty morels I use a much coarser grind/some ingredients shredded rather than whacking everything in my spice grinder and reducing it to a dust that can be sprinkled over the top for steak, and after mixing with the cooked minced meat, stuff the lot up the arse end of the morels, straight up the hollow in the stalk, and push it deeply into the pits which contain the asci too, the honeycomb-looking part that is; and in season I love fried boletes, and blusher (Amanita rubescens, although these are poisonous raw, haemolytic toxin called rubescenslysin is the guilty substance, although it also contains a phallotoxin, similar to A.phalloides, the deathcap, which is thermostable, but this is not problematic, for unlike the similar amatoxins and (I THINK), alike to the virotoxins found in the A.virosa/destroying angel clade within the phalloidea subsection of Amanita, whilst lethal enough [more toxic than cyanides] if it gets into the bloodstream, phallotoxins aren't absorbed via the oral route, so after a boil, a water change, another boil, another water change and a parboiling they can then be cooked and added to a meal, and retain quite a good degree of firmness rather than just getting all flabby and water saturated and repulsive. So despite their having a poison shared in common with the fungi most commonly cited, although quite erroneously, as the worlds deadliest, and needing to be treated to destabilize a poison that would otherwise start popping your erythrocytes like a clay pigeon shoot and cause haemolytic anaemia and possibly kidney failure from the breakdown products, they are actually pretty popular, especially as blushers like to appear early, and fruit for a good time before a lot of other tasty mushrooms fruit.

And of course, the likes of chanterelles, hedgehog fungi, various boletes [larch Suillus and slippery jack, S.luteus, fried in garlic butter, then sprinkled with just a hint of salt, and hosed down with a nice squirt of lime juice are absolutely wonderful, at least in my opinion, once the slime on the cap is peeled off, I actually rate the slippery jack even higher than I do cep [Boletus edulis, aka porcini if your getting ripped off in a restaurant at a stupid price for a few wee slices, also called the penny bun, and rated as one of THE finest of all mushrooms, anywhere, anyhow]. The slippery jack and larch Suillus, both quite similar although the former is a lot larger and chunkier in stature, the latter has a far more gracile, slender build, but is, in my estimation at least, very very tasty, if not equal to slippery jack]

Surprising my weight stays completely unchanged, because I don't have much money, most of it goes towards more lab glass and reagents, but what I do have for food, well a lot of it is cheap, and as such not exactly the healthiest in the world. But I can REALLY pack away the wild mushrooms, I've been known for ex. to munch a pound of Russula cyanoxantha, fried then covered in mozzarella, sprinkled with pepper, worcestershire sauce and then toasted under the grill until the cheese goes all gooey, all munched down as one big plateful. Luuurvely=D


As far as my pain meds have gone, it started with codeine, then DHC IR, followed by switch to XR after a year or two due to the infernal way DHC had of inflicting repeated withdrawal every day, several times a day, even taking the drug as prescribed, and it kept waking me up, I could never, ever get a proper full 15 hours sleep because after just a few hours the fucking withdrawal would start while I was asleep, and I'd wake, sweating bullets, tachycardic and generally feeling miserable. None of those proved sufficient in terms of being able to provide enough analgesia to remove my pain. Tramadol was offered, but I declined and had my doc put me on OC80s because I don't like the NRI effects of tramadol, I'd probably use it if its the only option to prevent acute opioid withdrawal but otherwise I can't stand the shit. And its serotonergic effects as well, had to explain to the doc that it would preclude my using MAOIs, for if I want to combine betacarboline alkaloids with DMT and some other tryptamines when I take yage'. Although I did have to explain what yage' actually IS, and the mechanism behind the DMT/5-MeO-DMT and beta-carboline RIMAs, as initially, and unsurprisingly the reaction from doctors to non-rx use of an MAOI is 'eeeyyyy what the fuck now?' and a doubletake haha. As I understand it, even the RIMAs are somewhat if not last resort, they are the next thing to last resort antidepressants, with the irreversible older ones being the last resort, short only of ECT [*shudders at the very thought of something so barbarous and primitive*]


Your poppies......the remark 'they better not have grown into flowers'....surely you mean 'better HAVE grown........' ? Because what produces most of the goods is the pods, these develop from the flower structure, the petals fall off when the pods begin to first form, with a little wee baby pod in the center of the flower often being visible. They then of course grow to size.
I like to go out seeding random wasteground, you want a bit of space, some say a foot, but I've still had success with less, 6-7 inches, but you do need some room between the plants for them to stretch their legs so to speak, put out leaves and get an adequate nutrient supply [fertilizer is a good idea, and when the pods start to form, cut their water allowance back to a minimum, it results in more alkaloid yield, or possibly, just concentrates it by dehydration, I have never actually looked into HOW it improves yield, I merely know that its an accepted practice which does indeed make for stronger shit coming out at the end.

As for possible losses to poaching (fucking bastards. If I caught somebody scrumping, chances are I'd take a gauss pistol to their family jewels, bell end first, then nacker by nacker, before popping another round in the spine, going through the front for a gut-shot, and drag the poaching wanker off to make sure that their now paraplegic arse isn't within reach of pain relief, and just leave them there after making sure to pull any rounds out of the body, other than the fragmenting ones, or an incendiary round of course [nothing terribly sophisticated, just a mixture of white phos and whatever fine metal powder is available, stuffed in a hole drilled in the back of the round, which are otherwise simple as hell solid slug caseless ammunition, a sharpened pointy magnetic metal slug with the back drilled out to leave a suitable hole for stuffing the incendiary charge and a thin film of plastic deposited in solvent solution to protect the WP. [thermite rounds would be a lovely improvement, but I've not figured out any potential way of making one that would stand a chance, given how insensitive the stuff is, and the way you need some magnesium ribbon, strip of thin lithium, or fuel/oxidant mixture capable of burning for a while and hot enough to let thermite off, as it is, the basic idea is similar to the 'raufoss' type multipurpose combination HE/AP/incendiary high velocity round, although handheld gauss weapons of pistol size sure as shit can't match the power of a Barett .50 cal rifle, which is the kind of thing used to fire those raufoss rounds [they are, iirc, an armor-piercing tungsten slug inside a hollow round, with an explosive charge that goes off on impact, and a bunch of zirconium dust to act as a high-temperature incendiary agent, can't remember if they include an oxidizer with it ], so same principle, only far lower velocity than a massive fuckoff great big cannon shell of a round like the .50 BMG. Not, mind you that I ever expected pistol rounds to match that sort of thing, even for an unconventional weapon like that. If you COULD get even close with a gauss pistol then the cap bank would be so damned heavy it would be difficult to lift with two hands, one on the handle and one to support the marx generator itself so the caps didn't try tearing themselves free of the brazing connecting the bus bars due to the sheer weight you'd have to use. (yet another fucking prized possession fucking ruined and needing re-building, that I right now, can't afford at all, I can't afford the caps. When I can, buying a few at a time, saving up for ones with a sufficient capacitance and voltage rating, and low as findable ESR, might go for something a bit different. Been contemplating trying to build a PIKL, with a fuel cell power system, that is, if fuel cells can be compact enough and importantly, provide power fast enough to recharge one sufficiently for at least semi-auto fire rather than single shots and hefty recharge time, perhaps a multi-cell power pack to charge several separate marx generators and have the trigger circuit cycle between them in order to allow each individual one to recharge before firing the next beam pair and pulse, a rifle or carbine frame rather than pistol size would be the order of the day methinks. (don't blame me...this topic got way off topic way before I got my hands (back) on it. :p And I start thinking WAY too much when it gets late and I come awake. Y'know, how when you first wake up, and you cease to be in the post/pre-sleep hypnogogic state, the mind starts to rev up and starts fizzing and sparking? well I start letting my mind wandering and it gets ideas, ideas like that. Thats not a new one, but oh boy, its pretty typical of the sorts of things the 'leetle grey cells' start cranking on. DIY pulse rifle? Thats one of the tamer ones, by FAR=D

Soon as I can afford the cap banks, first priority being the work on restoring my beloved pride and joy to its rightful state, I am not the best at electronics by any estimation, but I like a challenge. And the mechanics of a PIKL don't seem incredibly complex, other than the timing and charging, and high voltage switching [got that worked out, at least I think so. Laser-triggered primary sparkgap for each marx generator, in an inert gas like sulfur hexafluoride, or if I can't find or make it, argon or some other noble gas to prevent the electrodes getting 'nice' and toasty.] Can't afford just to replace the lab kit that I have not already bought back, but several pieces at a time is fine enough. Lol, I'm not QUITE at the stage where I'm huddled away in a subterranean grotto, stroking my Kipp gas generator and muttering things ending in 'mmmyyyyyy----precioussssssssssssssss' and a hideous sound in my throat halfway between a glottal stop and gargling with house decorator's paint, with melodious hints of chewing on broken glass...but possibly not all that far off. Still got all my hair, my head is normal sized, and I cannot even bear the thought of sushi, let alone grab a raw, wriggling juiicccy fishhyy...erri meanew. No, seriously. EW. I won't even eat rare meat. And I've not yet murdered my brother for labware. I don't even have, and have never had a sibling, so thats unlikely, even if I had turned into gollum 2.0=D



Tryptamite-what is elektoshirka? is it another term for krokodil? I haven't come across the term before. And the term 'BHNT', abbreviations in russian slang are beyond me, I could ask a polish person I know of, but would far sooner not do, for she is my go-to girl, so to speak, for reagents, when I want something difficult to produce myself, and even harder to buy, and which just don't turn up on ebay/or would get snapped up instantly by like minded science-fiends (and anybody wanting to cook drugs too probably, if they are capable of more sophistication than cooking GHB from y-butyrolactone, methcathinone, heroin from morphine using an anhydride rather than an acyl halide, synthing chlormethiazole using thionyl chloride rather than an Appel-a-day-to-keep-the-doctor-away=D Not that I've ever heard of anyone else using the triphenylphosphine way mind you; or an eph/pfed LWR or birch-benkeser [I'm not aiming that as a barb thrown at meth cooks as a demographic, no insult intended, I try to avoid being guilty of hypocrisy too for that matter. But SOME such cooks really truly are the lowest of the low, and capable of no more sophistication in organic chemistry than having a piss in a river and preparing a solution of urea and uric acid. And some of the DEAnusfelcher busts in microgram of some of the most egregious, aberrant abominations don't even do justice to cookbook gutter-chemistry, like the fuckin' prize pillock that got caught with a birch-b in mid reaction, whilst driving down a motorway. And get this. He hid his would-be meth cook. Where did he hide it? down his christforsaken kecks, every now and then taking his hands off the wheel to 'burp' the bottle full of lithium, pseudo and anhydrous ammonia, I.e taking off the cap of the plastic pop bottle he had it all in, to vent the pressure buildup as his annie boiled off and turned from liquid to gas. Presumably to prevent both losing the pfed, and stopping the plastic pop bottle full of annie from exploding between his legs and turning gonads into stop-nads, in the form of a bubbling, smoking, liquefied blob of scrotum slush puppy.

Now those 'cooks' I do indeed look down on, and IMO not unfairly, they deserve contempt for actions like that, even if it wasn't org.chem being attempted, anyone who is willing to stash a fragile, thin-walled plastic bottle, and probably PET plastic (being an ester, susceptible to bases, which can hydrolyze the ester bond and weaken the plastic or destroy it.) One weak spot in a pressure vessel means thats the place its almost certain to blow out from if it does undergo structural failure. Full of cryogenic liquid gas, of a nature which is both choking and a bit toxic to boot (not that ammonia is really highly toxic as such, just choking, dangerous via physical destruction of tissue, and in the form of liquid NH3, is corrosive as hell to flesh, Annie is a girl you don't want a hand-job from, and even less an traumatic testicular temper tantrum of an explosive nature.

The bottle fragments wouldn't be very nice either. In my younger days, before I got into double digits of years lived, I buggered about a bit with....improvements..on the old chestnut of putting mentoes in a bottle of pop, did it out in an open field with nobody and nothing about to hurt or damage, bar of course myself if I'd had an accident. What I did, was similar in effect, but different gas and corrosive source, and slower too. Caustic potash solution, or if I had none then I improvised a few times with NaOH, small coke bottle, as they have thicker walls and seemed to give a louder bang and bigger mess at ground zero, with a solid chunk of aluminium dropped in, followed by capping, a quick and hurried shake as the bottles were then thrown, sort of a preteen kiddie version of the WW II era german 'potato masher' style hand grenade, the kind with a long handle that contained the part, that had to be taken out, fuse attached, screwed on, activated and thrown. That was the idea anyway when I was out playing, I wanted something to mimic german grenades as well as the conventional rounded style, for which conventional pyrotechnics were the order of the day (I hold my hands up, I really did have, while not a MIS-spent youth, certainly a pretty madcap and to any adults had they known, absolutely hair-raising one. Although hurting people or animals was NEVER my aim, and effort was always taken to be as safe as a kid running around with corrosive and explosive grenades, rocket launchers, mortars, phossy shells, shaped charges and thermite, along with a variety of tear 'gases' and smokes to provide non-lethal simulants for playing at chemical warfare (like green smoke and some chloroacetone or acrolein to be my 'chlorine',which mind you I could produce and used often enough in the lab, but of course, was not going to start hammering the 'enemy' trenches with something that would actually in reality, rather than in children's play-make, do lasting hurt of any kind to the 'germans' or 'allied powers' after we'd decided to call a ceasefire and suspend hostilities so we could all go home and eat, clean ourselves down of dirt, muck, smoke remains and presumably any hints of teargas or OC [charges of phlegmatized chlorate/sucrose, sometimes dampened slightly with a fine mist from a pump spray bottle etc. to slow it further, and then mixed with hot dried chilli pepper, and packed in a toilet roll core, filled round the edges with more chilli, wrapped in tape, given a fuse, and if practical at the time due to financial constraints, not having much of an income (I guess, if I'd been quite so cynical at the age we were engaging in such playful wargaming then I'd have made a sarcastic remark about the war and its economic impact upon supply lines:p) covering them in polystyrene dissolved in acetone, if I could spare the tone, which I more often than not, couldn't, which meant no water-proofing for either side's riot grenades.


Yep...I was one manically nutty kid alright=D

Favourite memory of that time I think has to be either fucking about with white phosphorus for the first few times (this was reserved strictly for smoke around other participants, and strictly as a dominatrix crown court judge with a nail-studded cat'o'nine tails, never ever to be deployed anywhere where it could even possibly burn someone, only for smoke coverage, and even to the extent of no launchers, unless confirmation received that nobody at all was in the deployment area to BE hit-able, given how nasty the stuff is when it burns (been there got one, once, much older, and christ wept it did some damage, only tiny, burn hurt like a bugger its true, but it was small. The unpleasantness was from its toxicity and only showed up days later, in the form of near paralysis of the whole arm up to the elbow at least (forearm burnt, near the wrist), accompanied by SEVERE tremor and muscular weakness, I couldn't write, indeed I could barely pick up a pen, and if I managed could just about hold it in a fist if I used the other hand to wrap my fingers round it and push it closed, without dropping it most of the time.

So, for the most part, hand-thrown grenades only were allowable under what I guess was the pre-teen equivalent of the geneva convention, no launching willy pete from grenade launchers, no rocket explosive/IN loadouts and no raining it down in airbursts anywhere from mortars, other than to destroy uninhabited grass cover, because the 'enemy' of course, were always, in fact, friends. 'frenemies', so to speak ahahah=D and even at that age, irrespective of taking pains to cause no pain other than that which was transient, and never to injure any worse than bruising and strained whatevers in the course of legging it around, throwing stones and such hi-jinx I knew full well that if the parents of the other kids played with ever, ever got wind of the kind of play we were engaging in sometimes, if not all of us, I'd certainly have gotten strung up by the balls and fed to ravenous hogs, IF the parents were feeling merciful enough to put mother theresa and christ himself to shame, and of course, probably grounded for life, and for sure, never allowed to play like that. And I liked my sparks, flames, billowing smoke plumes, clouds of lachrymators and things going ' WHUMP!!!' [the louder and more innard-shaking the report, the more satisfied I was] way too much to let that happen.

Or, my other favourite, coming a close second to the delightful P4, was a handheld, breach-loading grenade pistol. Single shot, but I used to, come 'conker' season, go blasting up at the horse chestnut trees, blasting conkers out of trees. It was a fair bit, but not super-dramatically, as I'd expected it might have been, more effective than a direct hit with a thrown heavy stick, sent winging up into the branches to try and knock the nuts down, but it would send down rains of them if you got in a good shot. I was unfortunately, limited to the size of the charges, and had little in the way at that age of WFNA, and couldn't get RFNA at all, so HEs were difficult, and I mainly relied on pyrotechnics and primaries, as one can, if one gets creatively inventive, work round a deficit of conc. nitric. But efforts to do so and for ex. make TNT, via in-situ nitration with fuming H2SO4 and a nitrate salt ended up with something at the time I couldn't identify, but what must, looking back on things, have been either oxidized to benzaldehyde, or possibly nitrobenzene or a methylated nitrobenzene from the tolly, or both, because the result, doing it in the cold, or at room temperature, was a yellow oil, that had such a strong smell of marzipan that it must have reached the nasal mucosa of the heavenly hosts themselves! Smelled quite delightful actually, but damn did it ever stink the room up, even on a small scale. Although I never knew what it was for sure, did some basic tests and I don't think it was benzaldehyde, at least, not all of it formed a solid oxime derivative. But I wasn't experienced enough a chemist at that age to do much better than that, other than ascertaining things like smell (not possible to avoid having done so though!) and that it was very flammable.
At the time, I knew enough about nitrobenzene only to know it is flammable, toxic, a nitrated derivative of..surprise surprise there..C6H6, and once read of somebody doing some kind of salt electrolysis in nitrobenzene; aiming for alkali metals or alkaline earth metals. Other than that, all I knew, was its name, and its formula.

The yellow color of the oily product makes me think it was a very impure nitrobenzene, or maybe either 2- or 4-mononitrotoluene, both those smell like almonds, quite probably a mixture of several of the suspected products, the cup full of tolly that I'd tried and failed to tri-nitrate was partly liquid and oily, and contained some crystalline product, which could have been the 4-nitro IMO.


Have I ever...imagined....playing around with my morphine? how do you think I got to envision dipropionylmorphine as a single drug, as well as a mixture in the form of refined 'kompot', tryptamite? you think I woke up one night and found the skag fairy had been and hidden a bag of prope-dope under my pillow in exchange for a used needle that had loosened and fallen off its rig?

Or maybe santa left a bottle of propionic anhydride under the xmas tree? maybe I got the land deeds to poppy farm in india left all wrapped up for my last birthday perhaps?

(no, I'm not having a sarky pop at you man, your sound in my estimation, inasmuch as I have the capability to know :))

But no, they did not. And my birthday gift was a new vacuum pump, of the rotary vane type and a quart of 'robinair' high-vac 'premium' pump oil, plus my uncle gave me a pair of new trainers and a warm new hoodie, got a long, thick fluffy warm robe too, which I'm wearing right now as it happens. Comfy as fuck, and ties around the middle to keep the heat in when desired.

I confess though, I was far far more delighted with my dad's gift than that from my uncle though. Somehow he realized that I desperately desired a new pump, and promptly went and got me one when my birthday came around, plus the oil. My uncle doesn't actually live with us, still within visiting distance easily enough in a car, and I get on with him well, but he isn't actually, physically around save for the occasional visit, so he's not around enough to realize whats on my lab wishlist, or to hear either subtle (ish) hints being dropped, or to be given a request for a specific item, I don't think he knows anything about the general mechanics of org chem equipment, at least, he hasn't the opportunity to actually see what I have, and thus work out what I need from whats there already.


Using the procedure you speak of when you meant 'homebake', its a NZ speciality as I said, and it starts with codeine, not morphine. You can't simply heat a bunch of codeine with AA and get H, the 6-position methyl group has to come off first, or the procedure would simply acetylate codeine. And whilst 6-acetylcodeine is indeed active, and seemingly of a similar opioidergic potency as is codeine itself, it appears not to be very healthy stuff, and of at least moderate acute toxicity. Its a convulsant in and of itself, and whats more, it also lowers the seizure threshold, and does so still more when combined with morphine, H, both, etc.

Onion link to sci-hub, direct to the PDF (I can't get the paper myself, though, my browser for some reason has stopped working for PDF displays, and I can't read the captchas, could you be so good as to snatch the PDF and dump it on some free webhost for me maybe?


Convulsant effects....I wonder, if its a delta OR agonist. Some, but not all DOR agonists produce seizures at excessive doses, and are stimulant at lower ones below the threshold for causing convulsions, presumably subtype dependent (DOR1 vs DOR2. Or splice variants if there are any)



http://31.184.194.81/10.1016/S0376-8716(01)00145-4
 
8(

Graphic.

As for that mobile meth chef, instead of burping all it should take is playing Smooth Criminal real loud on the RV stereo..

Copious kudos for the taste in choice fungi, do you hunt or do you let the dogs fetch them for you? I really do love me some boletes, and I also found a treasure trove of Trompes de Mort once, in France so not really such an environmental crime..
Frying in butter??! Obviously there is no other =D And the pepper too, though I hadn't even thought of such creative ways of "peppering" the lot up. I imagine you made the right choice, but that there are also a lot of bad choices as I wouldn't really attempt tabasco or watercress (although the latter who tf knows)

I personally never had the interest in actually messing with explosives (balls not as big as common sense, tho no offense), however I did during some time live so close to a guy without real proper education and an unhealthy interest in explosives for recreational use, that the most responsible / wise choice seemed to me a similar one to when a severely OCD/autistic person who suffered extremely from life and wanted to end it approached me anonymously - in both cases prevention was not a real option: so instead next best thing, basically the HR philosophy. I never enabled those guys or provided them with knowledge or tools that might do harm, but I did step in to prevent something from happening that absolutely nobody would want, as for the mentally broken guy who believed his brain was infected with nematodes or whatever the fuck, there are certainly fates worse than both his misery then and death i.e. botched attempts. He dropped off the radar and it sounds like it was probably the best for him, as any treatment that you might come up and suggest he had already tried and even worse they ended up in total nightmares. It appears he succeeded like he predicted but I do not know how he'd done it.. rip

Botching explosives is also not really appreciated in most neighborhoods, so I kept an eye on the projects... all went alright and I didn't really spend many sleepless nights, and to be fair there were one or two NYE's with a sort of dorm/campus complex going nuts, the physics department arriving with a very theatrical smokey McGuffin-style-lighted case, taking out liquid nitrogen and filling coke bottles that were closed and thrown in the pond for some depth charges. Righteously terrorized the grebe like birds that used to drive me crazy. Also a fire extinguisher filled with gunpowder was definitely one of the most interesting things I saw heard and felt. Ah to be a student. Ah to have survived insanities.

By the way I have a morbid interest to one day smell fluorine for some reason as the element generally fascinates me... but even if I could ever arrange a meeting I believe finding a safe modicum to administer to the nose would be a challenge. I have no idea if a 'safe / therapeutic index or window' even exists although if there is an acute toxic limit I guess one could technically always be under it. Might be more interesting to see someone do than most game shows you see on television. But never mind eh just shooting the shit here I would not try that.

Yeah Ive heard before that 6-AcO codeine is nasty... avoid it.. about your fantasies about various morph esters, do the 3-position moieties really matter if you vary them? Cause I thought that while it might change kinetics and absorption, it's the mono-6 acylated stuff that really does all the magic? In other words it sounds like a waste of time to not just make 'symmetrical' diesters?

To pretend that any of this is still on-topic: instead of (wait for it: magic word) clomethiazole which iirc acts on the barb site, doesn't say phenobarb work effectively to prevent your fits? Yeah it's probably the shittiest barb, but it does act long and maybe it's for the better that it is not recreational, also it is the only one I ever personally came across and added to my collection (although i worship the org chem preceding the products, its the products that i actually collected like a lunatic for years ... but mostly retired now).

As for low dose NMDA antagonists removing 'thought disorders' as the mind becomes like a placid like... I definitely hear you and been there, but just keep in mind that taking them for a stretch comes at a cognitive price.

Then again it sounds like you have a lot of valid reasons to complain but you don't sound dumbed down :)
 
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Its not so much the quieting of noise. I get a ton of sensory bombardment anyhow, being on the spectrum. I use clonidine to suppress that. And the other meds I can't avoid like opioids to keep me walking and able to lie down or sit without constant pain. Comes at a shit price. A really really shit price. But at least I get a whole load of free gear courtesy of the NHS.

A fellow mycophage, I see, solipsis. I have NEVER seen a horn of plenty, not growing. Hell I've looked in supermarket speciality sections for dried ones even and not had any luck. Those fuckers have been on my to-try list for years. That, Sparassis (cauliflower fungi), and Ramaria botrytis. Been looking for those without success more or less since I could fucking WALK. No luck so far. From what I've read of them, the thought of someone wandering into a big cauliflower fungus makes me drool with envy.

As for other ways to add a bite to food. Frying shiitake in tabasco/habanero pepper sauce then enveloping them in a blob of molten mozarella cheese, let it cool until nice and chewy, and you get a lovely meaty mushroom center with a helluva nippy character to say the least. Although it should be said, I'll quite happily drink it by the spoonful as well as use it on food. So YMMV there.


Why would I want to take a nasty ass fuck like pheno, with its persistent ligand-trapping AMPA receptor antagonism. Nasty looking desensitization kinetics for barbs at AMPARs. Barbital is the one I have experience with it, and actually I prefer chlormethiazole. No glutamatergic antagonism to make you a dumb motherfucker, moderate duration of action, very, very very clean, mentally and physically. I know of absolutely no other GABAergic I could have got away with such prolonged use and almost no physical dependency. It DOES control the fits. If not broken no need to fix it. And as for barbital itself, that just isn't prescribable, it doesn't exist anymore here at least as a rx medication. I have absolutely fuck all reason to switch and no intention of doing so. I do explore downers, but out of recreational and scientific interest. But, fucked if I'm gonna even ask my doc for, or bother to synth pheno. KBr is easier if I were to go the ghetto route. Not bothering with chloral, it repeats on me something awful, and its no good at suppressing epileptiform neural discharge activity. And avoid paraldehyde like the plague. Christ wept, that shit is some nasty ass crap.

Its specifically memantine or another voltage-gated antagonist I want, I used the others because it was not the best option, just the only option. But it changes my cognitive issues MASSIVELY, so do the conventional NMDAR antagonists. Its the difference between sometimes catatonic and utterly useless at things, to able to say, work on the lathe in the shed, and make guitar parts, do the brazing, put together from steel bars and rods, and bits of brass, all cut to size, shaped and welded into a finished guitar truss rod for example, or being able to remember that I have to eat. Its getting to the stage where I either want it over, or want out. Fucking swelling of the feet and ankles, tissue erosion from surface to bare muscle
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I haven't read through the tomes but an analogue with an O replacing the S has been patented - it's identical in action.
 
So is 4-methyl-5-thiazoloethanol active in the same way as chlormethiazole? The former is commercially quite available and doesn't seem to be regulated here.
 
This would be the precursor for 4-Me-chlormethiazole?

If so don't know at least right now. Not the best moment. Piss wet through in ether. Not through spillage mind you. About 2 liters of ether/DIPE in me now. And buggered if I don't have to catch public transport to score some H. Ugh. Lets just hope that nobody decides to light a match within about a hundred feet of one of my belches for the next hour or three whilst it clears out=D GODS I'm hammered!

Haven't tried 4-Me-chlormethiazole. Synth would be easy though from that precursor.
Intriguing. Could be just the thing to explore, after working through the nitro analog.
 
Chlormethiazole already has a methyl group in the 4th position, so the substance I'm referring to is the one I assume you talk about in your first post here, the one where the chlorine is replaced by a hydroxyl.
 
This compound apparently has enhanced binding / GABAa potentiation over clomethiazole:

5-(2-hydroxy-1-phenylethyl)-4-methyl-1%2C3-thiazole.png


5-(2-hydroxy-1-phenylethyl)-4-methyl-1,3-thiazole (GM-28)

although that was not really the aim of this research:
http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/bph.12454/pdf

Lower glutamate levels, less excitotoxicity though?
 
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Just wanted to chime in and say that, because the sulphur is aromatic, I don't think it can participate much facilitating alkylation, hence the chloro (and iodo) analogues are probably not as dangerous as you think.

Mustard gases are so toxic because the aliphatic sulphur can intramolecularly displace the leaving group, creating a reactive 3 membered ring which is susceptible to nucleophilic attack.
 
^ honestly there are huge walls of text in the thread, so I didn't read all of it, but was it suggested somewhere that chlormethiazole or its analogues could be alkylating agents? The sulfur's electron pair is a part of the aromatic system, and thus it definitely won't participate in nucleophilic substitution. The nitrogen's one isn't, but it still seems unlikely that it would have the potential to significantly alkylate. Definitely not with a -chloro derivative.
 
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^ honestly there are huge walls of text in the thread, so I didn't read all of it, but was it suggested somewhere that chlormethiazole or its analogues could be alkylating agents? The sulfur's electron pair is a part of the aromatic system, and thus it definitely won't participate in nucleophilic substitution. The nitrogen's one isn't, but it still seems unlikely that it would have the potential significantly alkylate. Definitely not with a -chloro derivative.

Well the only reason why sulphur is so good at facilitating alkyl halide nucleophilic substitution is because it is a soft nucleophile, and can displace the halide very efficiently in an Sn2 fashion.
 
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