Stimulants 4C-MAR

[deficiT]

Will be trying this substance shortly and am curious if anyone has any educated guesses or anecdotal experience on it at all. Pulled this excerpt from another site but can't find a whole lot of info on it. I've never used 4-MAR, but hear that it has somewhat of a bad rep.

"4-Chlorine-4-methylaminorex (4C-4-MAR) is a stimulant drug of the 2-amino-5-aryloxazoline class that was first synthesized in 1960 by McNeil Laboratories 4C-MAR has effects comparable to methamphetamine but with a longer duration."

Dosage range for 4-MAR, parent compound; pulled from Erowid:

Oral 4-Methylaminorex Dosages
Light5 - 10 mg
Common10 - 25 mg
Strong25 + mg

Onset : 1 - 2 hours (depending on form and stomach contents)
Duration : 10 - 16 hours
Normal After Effects : up to 48 hours


Insufflated 4-Methylaminorex Dosages
Light5 - 10 mg
Common10 - 20 mg
Strong20 + mg

Onset : 20 - 40 minutes
Duration : 5 - 10 hours
Normal After Effects : up to 48 hours


Smoked 4-Methylaminorex Dosages
Light5 - 10 mg
Common10 - 20 mg
Strong20 + mg

Onset : 1 - 3 minutes
Peak Duration : 1 hour
Duration : 6 - 12 hours
Normal After Effects : up to 48 hours

 

[negrogesic]

I don't know, but ive heard that the halogenated methylaminorex analogs weren't so great. And in general, chlorinated stimulants kind of make me uneasy.

Ive had real 4-MAR in the past and it was nice. Very smooth and very long lasting

 

[Buzz Lightbeer]

Good luck researching, interested in hearing your findings!!

 

[deficiT]

Good luck researching, interested in hearing your findings!!

Thanks, I will definitely let you guys know

 

[Xorkoth]

Interesting, it appears there is also 4B-MAR, as well as the 4F-MAR that had already been available. (Actually they would more accurately be called 4'-C-4-MAR, or B or F)

I wonder why they don't make 2F-4MAR? From what I have read, that one is just as easy to make, safer, and has a more desirable effects profile. Instead they've made more halogen substitutions on the 4' position.

 

[Tryptamite]

If anyone has had a branded rc called master mind purported to contain 4-F,4-MAR I have serious doubts that it actually was an aminorex analogue instead of mix of bog standerd cathinones etc.

I didn't think much of it at all. However I think I would really like 4MAR based on previous stimulant use. It is just an educated guess.

My fear with this 4-Cl substitution is it's similarities to amphetamine counterparts. I have no education is SAR so I cannot say if it is safe or neurotoxic. Please be careful and report back.

I am very interested.

 

[Xorkoth]

The same place has 4-B,4MAR, and also the 4C and 4F. I know there have been a small number of reports about 4F-4MAR for a while, but I think the chloro and bromo are very recent additions.

I have heard some concerning speculation about 4F-4MAR. I would think, as heavier atoms, a chloro or bromo would change the nature of the drug more from 4MAR itself, whether that's good or bad. But who knows.

 

[negrogesic]

Not much here, but for those interested:

Characterization of a recently detected halogenated aminorex derivative: para-fluoro-4-methylaminorex (4′F-4-MAR) - Scientific Reports

Despite the fact that 33% of the new psychoactive substances seized in 2015 were synthetic cathinones, the number of these derivatives has been decreasing in the last years, probably as a consequence of the unfavourable effects reported by users. Thus, the list of possible cathinone analogues is...

www.nature.com

 

[Xorkoth]

Some interesting stuff in there, thanks.

 

[negrogesic]

Some interesting stuff in there, thanks.

What's most interesting is that article's supposition that cathinone based stimulants have now been been pretty much exhausted by illicit drug designers (as far as legal cathinone analogs). This is true; these increasingly bulky compounds like a-pcyp have limited potential so its interesting to see RC market drug designers abandon cathinones all together and branch into aminorex analogs. Problem is, these aminorex based releasing agents can be pretty toxic, either through excessive serotonin release or through other mechanisms (like the hepatotoxic properties of pemoline -- which ostensibly extend to its cyclopropyl derivatives such as cyclazodone and n-methylcyclazodone). They are also extremely long lasting. That said they havent yet found one with the recreational potential of 4-MAR (at least as far as I know, and i don't necessarily have my ear to the ground when i comes to this stuff).

Interesting though nonetheless. It will be crazy to think what designer drugs will look like in 20 years. The ligand class may even be more exotic like orexin oriented, sigma receptors, who knows.

Maybe RC deep brain stimulation like devices will become available, which can be tremendously euphoric. Just gotta find an electrical socket.

 

[Xorkoth]

I do wonder at what point we will be able to plug in or otherwise stimulate the brain directly via targeted electric impulses or something, to stimulate the same pathways as drugs stimulate?

Anyway, man I have always wanted to try 4-MAR, it sounds amazing. I'd love it if they came across something that is comparably good.

 

[fugme]

yeah but what about disso + opioid + DRI arylcyclohexylamines? when are we going to get those?

 

[SKL]

Problem is, these aminorex based releasing agents can be pretty toxic, either through excessive serotonin release or through other mechanisms (like the hepatotoxic properties of pemoline -- which ostensibly extend to its cyclopropyl derivatives such as cyclazodone and n-methylcyclazodone). They are also extremely long lasting. That said they havent yet found one with the recreational potential of 4-MAR (at least as far as I know, and i don't necessarily have my ear to the ground when i comes to this stuff).

Concern about the toxic potential of 4-MAR is actually somewhat ambiguous. There were a couple of studies done (on rats IIRC) which went up to rather high doses and concluded that 4-MAR actually might be less neurotoxic than regular old MA. This is to be taken with an entire shaker of salt, of course, as it's neither a well researched drug nor one that has seen as much widespread recreational use as things like MA or MDMA. It's serotonerginicity is a little worrisome, though.

As for it's subjective effects, 4-MAR was quite nice. It was of course rather like MA but it's greater serotonergic affinity was very much felt at the forefront in a sort of "rolly" feel on the edges of the experience. It did not feel overly cranky or paranoid, although I'm sure you could get there at sufficient doses or with enough sleep deprivation. It does last a very long time, which I think among other things somewhat decreased it's compulsiveness related to MA.

It's still something I'd exercise caution with, though. As to the 4-substituted analogues I can't really speak but I'd echo that it's very interesting this chemical space is starting to be explored for RCs. The synthesis is considerably more involved than that for most of the beta-ketone RCs, I'm pretty sure, but probably not so much as to put off the custom-synthesis Chinaman when there's a buck to be made.

Must be an interesting time to be a NPS-taker. I'm kind of glad I got out when I did but there's also a number of things I'm a bit curious about. Not enough to jump back into drug use for, though.

 

[deficiT]

Just an update, I have tried this stuff in allergy test and tiny doses. My experiences have been too colored by my 4f-mph use to be of much help, so I am waiting for a day off where I can start my day with this stuff and I'll report back. It is crystal chunks, that are relatively tasteless when insufflated. My doses have been low like ~10mg, I did feel something but it is tough to discern like I said.

 

[Xorkoth]

I'm looking forward to your further reporting on it. Good idea to get some distance from 4f-MPH to really give it a proper try (and much safer to not combine an unknown stim with the potential for toxicity with another stim).

 

[negrogesic]

Just an update, I have tried this stuff in allergy test and tiny doses. My experiences have been too colored by my 4f-mph use to be of much help, so I am waiting for a day off where I can start my day with this stuff and I'll report back. It is crystal chunks, that are relatively tasteless when insufflated. My doses have been low like ~10mg, I did feel something but it is tough to discern like I said.

How do you find the 4f-mph? I've used it off and on for perhaps 8 months. Can cause pretty significant irritability but seems generally pretty innocuous, and fortunately for me, of much lower abuse potential than methylphenidate proper.

Should not be combined with releasers of the oxazoline class or rather aminorex analogs, ive noted some pretty alarming hypertension when 4f-mph is combined with cyclazodone.

 

[deficiT]

How do you find the 4f-mph? I've used it off and on for perhaps 8 months. Can cause pretty significant irritability but seems generally pretty innocuous, and fortunately for me, of much lower abuse potential than methylphenidate proper.

Should not be combined with releasers of the oxazoline class or rather aminorex analogs, ive noted some pretty alarming hypertension when 4f-mph is combined with cyclazodone.

I find it to be useful for work, with also the potential for fun as well. I have been snorting it a lot, but it is much smoother taken orally. It doesn't leave you as strung out as other stims, and the comedown is much more comfortable. I haven't felt the need to go on any big long crazy benders, and I've got plenty of it. Most I've stayed up was one night, otherwise I can get sleep well as long as I stop taking it a couple hours before I need to sleep.

I haven't used methylphenidate more than maybe once in my life, so I can't really compare to that. For me the only thing I can compare it to is cocaine, though less euphoric, longer lasting, and more focused. After using it for a couple days a lot of the euphoria vanishes and it's mostly just stimulating. It isn't nearly as reliable or powerful as methamphetamine, but I do enjoy a good sized bump of it and just laying back, enjoying the little rush.

It would be interesting to do some tests on street cocaine, because I imagine someone had to have had the bright idea to cut it with this stuff. I imagine I might hold a different opinion of it if I had been doing IV or something, I'm sure the abuse potential is there for that.

I don't know a whole lot about the aminorex drugs, so I'm treading with caution on taking it.

 

[negrogesic]

I find it to be useful for work, with also the potential for fun as well. I have been snorting it a lot, but it is much smoother taken orally. It doesn't leave you as strung out as other stims, and the comedown is much more comfortable. I haven't felt the need to go on any big long crazy benders, and I've got plenty of it. Most I've stayed up was one night, otherwise I can get sleep well as long as I stop taking it a couple hours before I need to sleep.

I haven't used methylphenidate more than maybe once in my life, so I can't really compare to that. For me the only thing I can compare it to is cocaine, though less euphoric, longer lasting, and more focused. After using it for a couple days a lot of the euphoria vanishes and it's mostly just stimulating. It isn't nearly as reliable or powerful as methamphetamine, but I do enjoy a good sized bump of it and just laying back, enjoying the little rush.

It would be interesting to do some tests on street cocaine, because I imagine someone had to have had the bright idea to cut it with this stuff. I imagine I might hold a different opinion of it if I had been doing IV or something, I'm sure the abuse potential is there for that.

I don't know a whole lot about the aminorex drugs, so I'm treading with caution on taking it.

Methylphenidate is far more abusable. I almost exclusively snort the 4f-mph. I don't find it enjoyable really at all, but an ok functional stimulant. Makes me pretty irritable though, but not as bad as isopropylphenidate. The abusability of 4f-mph relative to mph (methylphenidate) is very similar to 2fma and ma (methamphetamine), wherein the halogenated derivative has greatly reduced abuse potential. Pretty decent functional stimulant though. What doses do you use? I generally dont exceed 30mg/day.

 

[deficiT]

Methylphenidate is far more abusable. I almost exclusively snort the 4f-mph. I don't find it enjoyable really at all, but an ok functional stimulant. Makes me pretty irritable though, but not as bad as isopropylphenidate. The abusability of 4f-mph relative to mph (methylphenidate) is very similar to 2fma and ma (methamphetamine), wherein the halogenated derivative has greatly reduced abuse potential. Pretty decent functional stimulant though. What doses do you use? I generally dont exceed 30mg/day.

Yeah, I can see your point with 2fma, I came to a similar conclusion about that one as well. Still an alright stimulant but not as good as meth.

I've been starting with 15mg bumps, and I'll do several in a day. I've gotten to the point where I've gotten lazy about weighing it out. I think today I'm gonna try and just take 30mg orally, and not bring any with me when I go out. I think that will be the best way to use it functionally. Might have a bump when I get home from work, but I can't just be bumping it all day like I have been.

This is the first stims I've had in a while so I've been a little compulsive with it.

 

[negrogesic]

Yeah, I can see your point with 2fma, I came to a similar conclusion about that one as well. Still an alright stimulant but not as good as meth.

I've been starting with 15mg bumps, and I'll do several in a day. I've gotten to the point where I've gotten lazy about weighing it out. I think today I'm gonna try and just take 30mg orally, and not bring any with me when I go out. I think that will be the best way to use it functionally. Might have a bump when I get home from work, but I can't just be bumping it all day like I have been.

This is the first stims I've had in a while so I've been a little compulsive with it.

Yeah i never weigh it out, it's not necessary, im guessing ~ 30mg/day in the form of three doses of 10mg. Makes me far more irritable than 30mg of dextroamphetamine (though causing less appetite depression and anxiety).