• 🇬🇧󠁿 🇸🇪 🇿🇦 🇮🇪 🇬🇭 🇩🇪 🇪🇺
    European & African
    Drug Discussion

    Welcome Guest!
    Posting Rules Bluelight Rules
  • EADD Moderators: axe battler | Pissed_and_messed

Harm Reduction ⚠️Taliban poppy ban puts Europe on fentanyl alert⚠️

TheUltimateFixx said:
I keep saying this!!

Nobody uses any substance merely because it's available, people use whatever they use because they have an interest in / desire for that particular drug. I keep getting offered stimulants and psychedelics, I don't take them just because they're THERE. I can purchase cigarettes legally everywhere but I've never been a smoker.

Anti-legalization zealots, in as far as they're even willing to admit this is the only way to cut both drug-related crime and drug-related deaths, will say that to legalize would be insanity because then untold numbers would get hooked and it would be 'a social experiment with uncertain outcome we can't risk'.
I've been in public debates about this and my answer is we're already run the 'experiment'. It was pre-prohibition times. Any respectable person could walk into a pharmacy and buy laudanum, paregoric, morphine, coca in various preparations, hashish paste. Everybody wasn't doing all the drugs and society didn't collapse.

Those who want to use drugs are already doing them, those who have no such affinity won't suddenly run out and smoke crack just because it's no longer punishable. There remains a small cohort of curious but law-abiding individuals, and as far as those are concerned it stands to reason that someone whose want of drugs isn't strong enough to risk the legal consequences in the first place is highly unlikely to become a problem user, even if they become a regular user.

When cannabis was legalized in the Netherlands the hyped-up scenario of a nation of pot-heads failed to materialize. What happened instead was a slight initial increase in customers, most of which, curiosity satisfied, left off again, and the numbers of regular consumers essentially settled back down to what it was.

The proportion of drug users of any given population has historically been quite stable. We have however seen a steady INCREASE of people with addiction problems right in line with prohibition, and the more strictly enforced generally the more problematic use, the more drug overdoses, the more crime. Prohibition not only is a disastrous failure in terms of what it's claiming to want to accomplish but is directly counter-productive.
Click to expand...
fantastic post
 
After giving this a bit more consideration I’m not any-more that sure Europe wont end in fents (or other super potent opiod) jaws. Reason for that is while most drug markets are driven by chase of a high, heroin market is in a very big part driven by run from WDs. And that very fact would in a blink of an eye transfer many, if not most heroin users to cheaper and more potent stuff. When someone with a huge heroin habit encounters powder that not only drives away WDs but also produces risks of OD if not done carefully, sadly many will go for that not minding negative sides that come with super potent short acting opiods. And sooner or latter deacantly balanced super potent opiod will hit the streets and so leave heroin for a very picky poly-drug (ab)users with good connections and quite big funds for that, kind of like it already is with uber pure heroin in many places.
 

Well last year cultivation increased by 22% and given that the average age of H to hit European streets is FOUR YEARS I don't think much will change in the near future.

The Islamic Emirate didn't stop H production - why should it's restoration achieve such a goal? It's the ONLY cash crop and now nobody is providing funds they need the money.

I might add that I would love to introduce the Norman Strain which is legal in that nation. Since it's opium has no morphine or codeine in it, nobody would be tempted to rip it off. What if DOES contain is orpiavine and thebaine so one can readily produce oxycodone and oxymorphone....

And anyone who has tried it knows oxymorphone blows H into the dust.

Study history - what an Afghan government says and what it DOES bares little relation. Oh, and of course IS is fighting the Taliban and insecurity is where H finds a home.
 
I don’t think Afghans will stop production (more likely increase to remain in race) but only that cheaper/more potent chemicals could overtake market. Not in near future ofc. Given just a few labs set up in Europe could produce enough of heroin replacement and so circumvent probably biggest problem and biggest cost when it comes to heroin, smuggling from nation with everlasting arm conflicts.
 
Have you SEEN how the oxymorphone synthesis has been telescoped? As it is, H is produced IN Afghanistan and since oripavine can be extracted in an identical manner, they won't have a problem providing it.

It's 2 steps. A peroxy acid to oxidize and then a reduction. The former is in the realms of Afghan chemists so 14-hydroxymorphone would be exported so it's just 1 step to the product and since it involves VERY common technology, I see no issue with 'European Labs'. I mean, if a Kg is worth £150000 then you don't need a huge setup. Not kitchen chemistry but with no smells and no huge amount of waste solvent, it's not complex.
 
Well last year cultivation increased by 22% and given that the average age of H to hit European streets is FOUR YEARS I don't think much will change in the near future.

I have seen photos taken in caves in Afghanistan with 100s of 1000s wrapped raw opium parcels prolly 10kg each being g stored let alone any powder that's been produced.
 
Hexenstahl said:
You mean IV oxymorphone?
Click to expand...

By ANY ROA. I was in Opiophile and people who could get 40mg Opana (the white octagonal tablets) were whacking them up which is like 200mg of 100% H but it's rush is stronger and duration longer.

I am NOT saying I like the idea but if I can work it out, I'm sure those bent on becoming uber-rich will not think too hard if they can get farmers to grow what is essentially not going to be a problem within Afghanistan but would reduce the volume of material to be exported by a factor of 10 or, I suppose, each hectare of land producing ten times more doses.

I've never heard of ANYONE disappointed by oxymorphone and if someone made Opana pills with 40mg in each, they would easily get $40 each for them in bulk. Afghanistan cannot produce fentanyl, but it can produce something an order of magnitude more potent than the current product.
 
AlsoTapered said:
By ANY ROA. I was in Opiophile and people who could get 40mg Opana (the white octagonal tablets) were whacking them up which is like 200mg of 100% H but it's rush is stronger and duration longer.

I am NOT saying I like the idea but if I can work it out, I'm sure those bent on becoming uber-rich will not think too hard if they can get farmers to grow what is essentially not going to be a problem within Afghanistan but would reduce the volume of material to be exported by a factor of 10 or, I suppose, each hectare of land producing ten times more doses.

I've never heard of ANYONE disappointed by oxymorphone and if someone made Opana pills with 40mg in each, they would easily get $40 each for them in bulk. Afghanistan cannot produce fentanyl, but it can produce something an order of magnitude more potent than the current product.
Click to expand...
I haven't even seen an Opana in years. I remember getting them back in the good ol' days when doctors prescribed anything. They were on par with only the best grade 4 dope, and like you said, the rush was better.

I would definitely chose to buy pure (enough) oxymorphone before dope.
 
I think the ONLY better option is Levo-Dromoran (levorphanol) which is amazingly euphoric but only turned up in 2mg pills because oral bioavailability is so high, it's as potent as a 20mg Opana.

I don't WANT this to happen but it seems logical.

I mean, methadone and buprenorphine are not much good treating fentanyl dependence. Now Bugodan (bezitramide) IS effective at treating fentanyl dependence, is off-patent and was used in The Netherlands so has a stack of data PROVING it works but for whatever reason, drug companies do not want to treat opioid dependenace.
 
AlsoTapered said:
By ANY ROA. I was in Opiophile and people who could get 40mg Opana (the white octagonal tablets) were whacking them up which is like 200mg of 100% H but it's rush is stronger and duration longer.

I am NOT saying I like the idea but if I can work it out, I'm sure those bent on becoming uber-rich will not think too hard if they can get farmers to grow what is essentially not going to be a problem within Afghanistan but would reduce the volume of material to be exported by a factor of 10 or, I suppose, each hectare of land producing ten times more doses.

I've never heard of ANYONE disappointed by oxymorphone and if someone made Opana pills with 40mg in each, they would easily get $40 each for them in bulk. Afghanistan cannot produce fentanyl, but it can produce something an order of magnitude more potent than the current product.
Click to expand...
If I was filthy rich I'd buy a majority stake in a pharmaceutical company and force them to manufacture me a lifetime supply of oxymorphone IV solution. Ahh, the privileges that the rich enjoy are to be envied...
 
Delmonte421 said:
if you were super rich why not just buy a bunch of the best H you can get along with every kind of oxy product with tons of everything and a doctor by your side 24/7 and just live as the safest drug addict that ever lived lol
Click to expand...
My own personal Max Jacobson. Yes please.
 
Calm dowm folks, for god sake, NO FENTANYL wil take over heroin market in europe. because this already has attempted back in 2015 and it FAILED miserably because most heroin users rejected fentanyl. Now, why talbain ban opium poppy cultivation this year was because there are FAR too much opiums in stock and thsy all have to be releasesd for export, i think the talbain are.tryin to make acomeback heroin, and price increase every month is an attractive for them, but what is ODDS about crystal meth is its production and export hav alll been stopped. Im not sure why. Crystal is not very popluar in uk and western eu. Only poland and slovakia and some in holland and germany a very small numbers of meth users exist there. Maybe talbain wanted to raise price for meth so they can export extremely high quality for sale to eu?
 
No - because they imported Carfentanil after even the few sales resulted in a huge number of ODs so they imported it to the UK (since it's potency means 1 gram will make 5Kg of fake H (which it was sold as) and voila, a stack of overdoses - I knew someone who it killed.

The DEA got the records of the Chinese lab that produced it. The first kg was exported to Canada and wasn't intercepted The second Kg was intercepted but the buyers weren't caught and the 3rd time the importers used proxys (who were arrested). It turned up on the dark web and so anyone could order a gram... it would fit in an envelope.

What gets me is that the ONE analogue that nobody seems to produce is alpha methyl fentanyl. It's 1.5x fentanyl in potency and KEY is that it lasts for about 4 hours so it's perfect to cut into H...

But the Mexicans have sussed out that fentanyl is the crack of opioids. I've heard of $5 deals so they can extract ALL of the money from addicts.

BTW methadone and buprenorphine cannot fully replace fentanyl because the latter binds to an extra amino-acid residue. The Dutch used bezitramide (which DID fully substitute for fentanyl) but political reasons saw it's use discontinued. But I PRESUME the DEA looks here so their experts can see how norbezitramide (the active) overlays fentanyl PERFECTLY. It's cheap to make (2 steps) and since it's been used in another nation, a lot of testing can be bypassed.
 
Remember in 2015? Somebidy have tried to introduced fentanyl and car fentanyl into uk and eu supply at that time, and it was massive.failure, there was alots of h users in uk and eu HATING fentanyl, they pass word around among users and tellin them who to avoid and so on. Some addicts even reported the sellers to the polices because they ar killing their customers without care in the whole world, same things happening in ireland, and some parts of europe, the heroin frim afghan in 2015 was so poor quality. Not aworth wank to buy really BUT this time, itz massive different, because there is plenty of good quality of heroin and then there wil be heroin drought coming soon, makin it way to uk next year at earliest. Its FUCKED BIG TIME. why are talbain doing this to us?? Im fuckim SICK of talbain of.doing this!" I hav read an article somewhere it say russian are seriously PRESSURING talbain into doimg this and they wil give finacal aids support toward afghan people. Lol
 
AlsoTapered said:
What gets me is that the ONE analogue that nobody seems to produce is alpha methyl fentanyl. It's 1.5x fentanyl in potency and KEY is that it lasts for about 4 hours so it's perfect to cut into H...
Click to expand...
As far as I know it's the opioid of choice in Estonia, or at least it used to be.

The opioid market can be drastically different from one country/region to another. It depends on a bunch of different factors.
 
Another Trump's legacy, thanks Don as Joe for that too... Ow... And you remember the iranian general Trump bombed just like that? GODF got the patience of a spider, but is not UGLY as it to do even worse... Believe in Peace, Love & Harm Reduction
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top