Harm Reduction New! - Cold Water Extraction Mega Thread & FAQ

[S.M.F.G]

Tramadol by itsself if ur able to get it.And i like the sounds of the above post sounds like panadene forte in a cap, Would be ideal. Unfortunatly i dont think this exists in AUS... imo anything other than panadene 15's is a worthless endevor, the ricodone mentioned above sounds good but im not chemistry wise enough to do that,and im not sure that it is available here in AUS . BUT it would be ideal, morph hcl. Fuck yer but not a CWE

 

[quest92]

Others have asked this in this thread a while back but wondering if I'll get any other responses. I'm trying to figure out a way to remove the caffeine as I'm using A.C.&C. combo with shit loads of caffeine. Apparently activated charcoal (like a brita filter) does remove the caffeine but I'm wondering how much, if any, of the codeine would be lost as well and if it does effectively remove the caffeine.

The other poster mentioned evaporation. Would the caffeine evaporate with the water if you evaporated your product to a powder? I do not know anything about chemistry so I'm not sure how to find this out.

Another person said something about adding a base, or using acetone or ether to take the caffeine out somehow before you do the CWE. I have not actually done much googling or searching the forums yet on this topic because I'm lazy and thought I would ask here first, does anyone have any links or suggestions?

Thanks!

 

[Azzid]

been snorting vicoden for a little over a year.... boy do i feel stupid.
Thanks for the new method that changed my ways!

 

[Cartesia]

I want to add some points to this thread.. maybe they've already been covered but maybe not..

Please note these points are based on the following:
- I am from AUSTRALIA
- I only use CODEINE + IBUPROFEN pills.

0) Point zero is just a handy hint to you all.. the chemist's home brand pills are the cheapest by far, but they contain the most disgusting taste... they are almost not tolerable even just a few swallowed.. Panafen Plus, another cheap(ish) brand have no added foul taste and dissolve the easiest. Nurofen plus have no foul taste but cost the most and take longer to dissolve than panafen plus.

The reason I'm adding these points is because it's incredibly important that no matter what your circumstances you do everything in your power to take as small an amount of 'other' stuff as you possibly can.. Due to 9 months of not CWEing I nearly died It was a slow process, with no obvious warning signs that anything was going wrong.

1) I now carry a high quality cotton handkerchief with me at all times.. Just make sure when you hold it up to the light you can't really see obvious holes in the fabric.. you want a nice tight weave. Also I keep water bottles in my car so I always have water.

2) Don't use more than say 150ml of water.. more water = more bad stuff staying in the water.. Remember to include the water you use in a secondary 'washout' in the total amount of water. (and yes.. a 2nd wash through with water contains significant amounts of codeine in some cases)

3) If you can't get anything warm/hot to dissolve the pills in... they WILL dissolve in cold water.. it just takes ages. Panafen Plus dissolves easier than Nurofen Plus. Speed it up by shaking them in a bottle or crushing them before dropping them in the water.

4) Again - NOTE THIS IS FOR IBUPROFEN and codeine mixtures - The solubility of ibuprofen flattens off at approximately 10 degrees C.. and even at 20 degrees C you're looking at very low solubility - if you don't have ice/a fridge/etc Try to find the coolest place in the room and let it sit.. even if its 30degrees C youll be alot better off than eating them straight.

(For paracetamol/other mixtures, try and find temperature solubility graphs for the chemical.)

And remember point 2 - The less liquid you use, the less stuff can fit into the solution... 100ml at 15 degrees C is approx the same amount of ibuprofen as 50ml at 20 degrees C. (the curve is roughly exponential as temp rises).. So if you can't get it cold, using less water will help. (and conversely - if you can get it right down to 1 deg C, you can use a bit more water to wash out any trapped solution)


5) If you buy something from McDonalds/Hungry Jacks (Burger King) here in australia, they will most give you a cup of hot water for free if you ask... cold water is also free I believe, but I keep bottled water in my car and don't like asking for 2 freebies.

One maccas store I know of in the whole city I'm from charges for hot water, but their boss is a bitch.
I'm sure they all know me now for my order.. they must think im homeless making cup-a-soup or something.

Large fanta (with extra ice) + Cup of hot water.. I avoid coke because caffeine uses cyp2d6 enzyme.

- Large fanta is the mixer, to bear the taste

- Extra ice - use some of it to get the boiling water down to just hot enough to dissolve the pills (I am afraid excess heat will kill the codeine), then use the rest to chill the dissolved solution and cool the bottled water i have in my car (for a secondary wash through after the first bit is poured through - again, remembering to keep the total volume of water low)


So please guys.. I know its a pain in the arse.. but even a shit dodgy CWE is effective and NOT CWEing over long periods of time can have very, very bad health effects.

(On that note.. to the guy on BL who still thinks you can split nurofen plus pills.. learn to CWE right now, and get a blood test to make sure you're not bleeding internally)

 

[DavidStayzFadedd]

i took seven crushed percocets mixed with water put in freezer than filtered thru coffee filter and let the liquid evaporate over night on a mirror. i scraped the powder up and snorted it but it didnt work, and it burned like tyenol got thru.. well thats the last cwe i ever do. a waste of 7 perks. wat i do worng? does evaporating destroy the oxycodone

 

[dokomo]

i took seven crushed percocets mixed with water put in freezer than filtered thru coffee filter and let the liquid evaporate over night on a mirror. i scraped the powder up and snorted it but it didnt work, and it burned like tyenol got thru.. well thats the last cwe i ever do. a waste of 7 perks. wat i do worng? does evaporating destroy the oxycodone

Even with a CWE, there is still 14mg of acetaminophen per mL of water used. Snorting APAP is less than ideal, and the quantity of powder could interfere with the oxycodone getting to your nasal membranes.

I'd recommend taking the CWE liquid orally, rather than evaporating and snorting

 

[Ksa]

i took seven crushed percocets mixed with water put in freezer than filtered thru coffee filter and let the liquid evaporate over night on a mirror. i scraped the powder up and snorted it but it didnt work, and it burned like tyenol got thru.. well thats the last cwe i ever do. a waste of 7 perks. wat i do worng? does evaporating destroy the oxycodone

No. If you used a cofee filter it means you used way...way...way too much water. The right amount of water would completely absorb itself in the cofee filter and you wouldn't be able to recover it ^.^

Try this:

- Take a glass cylinder shaped vial, 3/4 inch diameter, 4inch high.
- Add the very fine powder.
- Add 10mL (a spoon) of pure water.
- Mix well
- Add boiling water in a glass, let it rest for a few minutes.
- Seal the vial and let it warm up in the glass of hot water (if you fear that pv=nRT will break the glass you can keep it open)
- After 10min shake the vial contents vigorously for 5 min.
- Replace the vial in the glass, let it warm up
- After 10min shake the vial contents vigorously for another 5 min.
- Let the solid particles settle at room temperature! for 15min
If you cannot obtain a good phase separation, cool it down, shake it again and wait until you get a proper phase.

- Place the vial in the fridge, for 30 minutes.
- Using a pipette, remove the clear solution from the vial and place it on a mirror.
- Wait for the water to evaporate.

Even with a CWE, there is still 14mg of acetaminophen per mL of water used. Snorting APAP is less than ideal, and the quantity of powder could interfere with the oxycodone getting to your nasal membranes.

I'd recommend taking the CWE liquid orally, rather than evaporating and snorting

He can't get the high he needs if he takes it orally. It's what I would do to relieve pain but he's definitely looking for a recreational type of high. 14mg/mL is the room temperature figure, if you want the figure in icy water you divide that by 2.

 

[dokomo]

No. If you used a cofee filter it means you used way...way...way too much water. The right amount of water would completely absorb itself in the cofee filter and you wouldn't be able to recover it ^.^

Try this:

- Take a glass cylinder shaped vial, 3/4 inch diameter, 4inch high.
- Add the very fine powder.
- Add 10mL (a spoon) of pure water.
- Mix well
- Add boiling water in a glass, let it rest for a few minutes.
- Seal the vial and let it warm up in the glass of hot water (if you fear that pv=nRT will break the glass you can keep it open)
- After 10min shake the vial contents vigorously for 5 min.
- Replace the vial in the glass, let it warm up
- After 10min shake the vial contents vigorously for another 5 min.
- Let the solid particles settle at room temperature! for 15min
If you cannot obtain a good phase separation, cool it down, shake it again and wait until you get a proper phase.

- Place the vial in the fridge, for 30 minutes.
- Using a pipette, remove the clear solution from the vial and place it on a mirror.
- Wait for the water to evaporate.



He can't get the high he needs if he takes it orally. It's what I would do to relieve pain but he's definitely looking for a recreational type of high. 14mg/mL is the room temperature figure, if you want the figure in icy water you divide that by 2.

Oxycodone is definitely recreational when taken orally, its simply a matter of preference. Opioid preparations with acetaminophen are just not ideal for snorting because even with an efficient extractions, there will still be several times more acetaminophen than opioid (not to mention soluble binders and fillers.) I do agree though that the OPs best shot at using them nasally is to do the most efficient extraction possible and try from there.

Interesting, near freezing water is 7mg/mL? I've never been able to find a solid empirical source for acetaminophen's water solubility at near freezing (~1C) temperatures, any sources on that?

 

[Ksa]

I found the article, see post made at 18:18

 

[dokomo]

That graph actually seems to show the solubility of acetaminophen at 15C to be 10mg/mL, not 1.0 (were you perhaps looking at the nitrobenzene graph?)

And for some odd reason the solubility is slightly trending upward as it approaches the origin. From these data, I don't think we could make the firm argument for a solubility of less than 10mg/mL.

Thanks for posting that graph, it is quite illuminating.

 

[Ksa]

I found the article, see post made at 18:18

 

[dokomo]

ya they got the triangles wrong. It's water instead of nitro-benzene.

No, you just read it wrong. Acetaminophen is the higher figure.

 

[S.M.F.G]

Get yourself Rikodeine instead...easier hits reasonably hard.....but not as good a body feel.

Looked into this today as i happened to see it @ the chemist... they want like <snip>$ for a bottle i can only guess is 100-200 ml
Might have ta give it a go once finances improve

*mod edit* no prices

 

[mymindisgoo]

if i do a cwe and let the water evaporate, is it worth it for the powder that would be left behind? has anyone done this? thanks

 

[Ksa]

I found the article, see post made at 18:18

 

[Ksa]

Ever heard of a biblical figure named Thomas?

here:

Interesting, near freezing water is 7mg/mL? I've never been able to find a solid empirical source for acetaminophen's water solubility at near freezing (~1C) temperatures, any sources on that?

and here:

That graph actually seems to show the solubility of acetaminophen at 15C to be 10mg/mL, not 1.0 (were you perhaps looking at the nitrobenzene graph?) comment: 1.0 is in g/100mL if I put mg/mL my bad. I never use units of mg/mL because it's hard to picture it's magnitude.

And for some odd reason the solubility is slightly trending upward as it approaches the origin. From these data, I don't think we could make the firm argument for a solubility of less than 10mg/mL. comment: ya so people do a CWE because the solubility skyrockets towards freezing point?...lol

Thanks for posting that graph, it is quite illuminating.

Here's the article:

Solubility Of Paracetamol In Pure Solvents
Roger A. Granberg and Åke C. Rasmuson*
Department of Chemical Engineering and Technology, Royal Institute of Technology, SE-10044 Stockholm, Sweden

http://pubs.acs.org/doi/full/10.1021/je990124v

Let's take a peak:

7.21g/Kg
7.21g/L
0.7g/100mL
7.21mg/mL

Now let's see what I have claimed originally:

14mg/mL is the room temperature figure, if you want the figure in icy water you divide that by 2.

Not going to break the law so if dokomo wants to read the article, he'll pay for it. I am happy to put an end to a pointless argument. ^.^

 

[dokomo]

Ever heard of a biblical figure named Thomas?

here:



and here:




Here's the article:

Solubility Of Paracetamol In Pure Solvents
Roger A. Granberg and Åke C. Rasmuson*
Department of Chemical Engineering and Technology, Royal Institute of Technology, SE-10044 Stockholm, Sweden

http://pubs.acs.org/doi/full/10.1021/je990124v

Let's take a peak:

7.21g/Kg
7.21g/L
0.7g/100mL
7.21mg/mL

Now let's see what I have claimed originally:



Not going to break the law so if dokomo wants to read the article, he'll pay for it. I am happy to put an end to a pointless argument. ^.^

I never intended for there to be an argument, simply discussion of the available information about acetaminophen solubility. Your "original claims" have all been edited out by yourself, but your assertion about the previous article was incorrect. This is not any kind of slight or insult, so there's no need for name calling or bizarre biblical references.

Thanks for posting the new article. I have journal access so I'll read it this afternoon when I have a few minutes.

Edit-I've contacted you via PM, please do not further derail this thread.

 

[histaminejunky]

A faster better CWE method for oxycodone

Just thought i would share a quicker CWE method for Percocet or Endocet . Granted you need to have the tools available that I have but nevertheless it worked great. So here it is:

I heated 100ML water to 140F, crushed (4) 10/650 Endocet (using a nice marble mortar and pestle set) into to a fine powder.

I Combined powder and water into a small clear glass ramekin (this is a glass container that you usually would see in a restaurant like what your dipping sauce comes in).

Then I stirred slowly for 3 minutes until dissolved.

Next I placed in a 40F fridge for 15 min, after that I moved to a - 6F super freezer for 12 min.

I removed the ramekin from freezer very very carefully without disturbing mixture (as not to stir it up particles that settled to bottom).

Then i used a 15ML lure lock style syringe and carefully sucked all the clear liquid out of the ramekin by holding it steadily, about 2-3millimeters from bottom, (not touching the particles that settled out) this is much faster and cleaner then using a coffee filter or similar.

I then squirted the syringe out into a new clean glass ramekin. I was very careful not to suck up any of the solids from bottom, or knock any debris that formed around the edge of the ramekin.

The whole process only took 35 minutes.

The key here is to use a clear glass ramekin so you can see what you’re doing; also the two stage cooling process will yield a better product. This is the best way I have come up with for quick and efficient extraction.

You will have a minimal amount of water and gel like substance left over, I suppose you could argue there is maybe a 5-10% loss but honestly I did not feel any difference in final product, good clean high.

If you want total purity for IV use, you can pass your solution through a 2micron wheel filter using the lure lock syringe and then it’s safe to inject (however this will add a good 30 min time and several yellow 2uf wheel filters about 6 of them). Hope this was useful for someone please feel free to add or discredit my work as you see fit.

 

[blackjesus]

i think your post has merit your last paragraph concerns me because it opposes the extra HR involved with micron filtering against the additional time required in filtering. The tone in this sentence may imply to less experienced and therefore less safe users to engage in high risk behavior.

but overall good post, kudos.

edit:
if you want to make this thread a tek style post like something you would add to your diary i would get very technical with your write up and include a contents section for things like materials/tools needed, nice start though welcome to blue light

 

[Cane2theLeft]

^ good points. Also I edited out the 'hydrocodone' from the title because even if you get the APAP out and micron filter, it's not safe for injection due to massive histamine release and potential for dangerous reactions such as pulmonary edema.