Yeah this is true.
It's odd to think about, but everyday long term, highly dependent heroin users have a less likely chance of OD'ing in a way, because their bodies are so used to the dope, their tolerance is so high and you always know where it is, and they have been doing the same amount for so long.
The people who are really at risk are the "chippers". People who are only doing dope occasionally.. they don't do enough that their body is used to it at all, their tolerance is always really low or they never quite know where it is, they are getting dope from different sources every time etc.
I mean, of course hard core daily users can still OD.. but when you hear about them happening, it's usually somebody who got clean for a bit and went back, or was dabbling and did too much, etc.
I haven't had an overdose in six years.
I agree and disagree kinda. I agree that it's easier for 'chippers' to OD compared to more frequent users, but there are some things that make people with high tolerances more likely to OD.
Here's my main example. So let's say that someone with a big habit does 5 bag shots, and that each bag weighs out to 0.1, so 100mg per bag. Now let's say that the dope he gets is on average 50% pure (so each bag technically only has 50mg of diacetylmorphine in it) making his 5 bag shot out to be 250mg of heroin. Let's also compare this to some 'chipper' that does 1 bag shots usually, and then goes from there.
Now let's say that a more potent batch is in town, and both peoples sources got it now. This stuff is 70% pure, which is 20% better than the last batch, but also nothing crazy for this area, so word isn't really going around about being careful with this stuff. So as usual the heavy user loads up his 5 bag shot, and somewhere across town the 'chipper' is prepping his 1 bag shot since it's a Friday night which is the only time he uses all well.
5 of the new 100mg bags at 70% purity means that the shot has approximately 350mg of heroin in it, which is 100mg more than usual, thus 100mg more than he's been doing per shot. The 'chipper' on the other hand is doing his 1 bag shot of this new batch, so at 70% purity that puts it at 70mg which is only 20mg more than usual, which can still be enough to cause some problems (especially if the person is new to dope and really hasn't had a habit before nor gone above 1 bag shots of 50% dope), but I would be more worried about the frequent user in this instance.
So basically the bigger the habit and the more bags you do per shot, the more you are affected by an increase in purity of the dope. Do you agree that in cases like this the person with the bigger habit is in more danger than the 'chipper' that only does a bag or two to start off?
Eh, you'd pick it up pretty quick man if you were really looking to score. Hah. Dope fiends are super fast at adapting to a new scene in a new city.
Haha, yea man if regional drug slang is that much of a barrier for you to score dope in an area than
maybe you're not cut out for the dope scene and being an addict, which is actually a good thing since you're better off not diving right back into the dope scene when you are new to an area or something.
^BBT, let me apologize for being harsh on you, I get jumped on for expressing my opinion and it doesn't make me happy...Precipitated WDs do exist...but what I go through and Scagnattie goes through, it's not even precipitated withdrawal, it's just inability to adjust to bupe...True PW is different I guess...Most people I know are either fine, or they get sick for a few days making the transition...I've never personally met someone who became deathly sick for only 2 hours and then was fine, which afaik is what true PW would be like...
As far as the grams and bundles thing...This will piss people off, but most of the grams we get in New England these days are pretty stepped, the cut that's being used is usually professional and it doesn't translate to getting gunk in the cooker when you fix, but it's stepped on nonetheless....
You get what you pay for though...a gram of New England dope might go a little further than a NY bundle, but not much...and the price is about the same, give or take...
Grams and halfs as a way of selling dope to the general public is a thing of the last 5-7 years, before that, it was still sold in grams, but the price was about double and the quality was far superior...you couldn't get away with a .6 shot unless you had a serious habit...now, pretty much everyone I know can kill a gram in 2-5 shots...
I think the plastic bags are just easier for the dealers, but really pure heroin is not cheap enough at the wholesale level to sell grams at the prices they are now...that's why, the bags will usually be better dope by weight...
Connecticut is the biggest wild-card dope state on the east coast because it's sold in just about every way there is there...They have bags in bundles at NY prices and sizes, they have the smaller cheaper bundles you see in Mass and RI and they have grams...
Don't be fooled by the fact that your dope comes in a rock, comes back a nice clear brown color in water with no sludge...that doesn't mean anything for the purity...I've had beautiful chunks of 2-3 grams of dope that looked like they were broken off a kilo brick that were mediocre....
My 2 cents on precipitated withdrawals;
I have personally experienced them, and also know someone else IRL who had the dreadful experience. In my case it went like this- I was doing dope at the time, and also had access to percocets which I would use to hold me over until I could get more dope, since the percs were free. One day I couldn't get my hands on anything, so took 30mg of oxycodone. This wasn't enough to keep the withdrawals at bay for long, so when I came across some suboxone I took it just 4-6 hours after the oxy. I took 4mg sublingually, and then went to drop someone off in my car. It was a short ride that started like 15 minutes after I had taken the suboxone, and I started feeling worse about 10 minutes after I took the sub. I dropped the person off in my car, and right after I turned the corner I had to pull over to vomit. Now considering that I only had taken 30mg of oxycodone 4-6 hours earlier, I only had the runs, vomiting, anxiety, and a runny nose for about an hour and 20 minutes before I started to feel better. It probably didn't take that long for the suboxone to knock that little amount of oxy off of my receptors, and then replace it with the bupe.
Now for my friends story. He had a really bad habit (was shooting 10-15 bags a day of
really reallygood dope, in fat bags too) and had actually called me the day before to ask when he would be good to take the suboxone he had recently acquired. I told him that he should really try to hold out 24 hours before taking it, and he told me that he started to get sick about 12 hours after his last shot, and that he was usually only able to make it 18 hours tops between shots.
The next day he called me to tell me about his horrible experience. He was watching the Jets game at his house with his dad, his GF, and some family friends when he decided he couldn't wait any longer [it was 16 hours since his last shot of dope] so he took an 8mg strip sublingually. He said that he could tell pretty much immediately that he hadn't waited long enough, and that things were about to go south for him really fast. He said that snot was literally pouring out of his nose, like actually flowing out to the point of needing to constantly have a tissue under it to catch the snot. He felt horrible all over, with achy everything and horrible anxiety, so he pulled his dad aside and they went outside so he could explain to him what was going on. He told him that he was trying to kick dope and took a suboxone to help with the withdrawals, but that he took it too soon and it caused him to go into horrible withdrawals, and he also told him that he couldn't stay there to keep watching the game with them, so asked his dad for money so he could score dope to end the withdrawals, and also asked for him to make up an excuse for him. So his dad asked him how much money he needed to front him, and he told him $120! So after a quick lecture and agreement that he would tell my friends girl that he had some emergency he needed to tend to, he hopped in his car for the 45 minute trip to the city to cop dope, all the while clinching his butt-cheeks together so he didn't shit himself. He said that when he finally got it, it was basically the best shot he ever took.
![:\](https://bluelight.org/xf/BL_Images/Orig_Emoji/wrygrin.gif "wry grin :\")
I am talking using about 24hrs after my last dose of 12MG. right now I am taking 12MG in the morning and TRYING to keep it like that throughout the day; this morning when I woke up I didnt feel "great" but once I took the 12MG I felt good again. wondering if I ever waited 24hrs to use again if it would still have the some effect and if the dosage would be lower than when I was once using or just be the same.
I've always used dope and sub together but I have yet to be off dope this long before using again.
When you are on suboxone for a while it blocks way more than if you were to just have taken it a few days in between doing dope. So not only is the blockade affect going to diminish the high, the dose you are on will also keep your tolerance high. Obviously don't expect it to be super high and do a lot of dope to offset it since everybody is different and such, so you will still have to stick to starting low and working your way up if you want to play it safe.
As for how it will affect your tolerance, well that depends on your habit. Like there are a lot of people that get on suboxone when their habit was like 160-200mg of oxy or something, so for those people their tolerances will actually go up from being on subs. But with a big habit such as yourself (I could be wrong but I think you said that you were using between 2-3 grams of dope a day) it may be a little lower, but that's also after waiting for the blockade affect to wear off, although shooting that much heroin would certainly 'break through' the suboxone at some point, giving you a high albeit a diminished one. The ceiling affect of bupe probably keeps the suboxone from keeping a tolerance of a few grams / a few bundles a day that high though.
Bupe is a weird drug and affects everybody differently, so in the end you're going to have to find out for yourself. I think that you were the one saying that a few mgs of suboxone would hold you over until you could score dope later in the day, and so you had a lot of times where you would get high at night, take suboxone during the day, get high at night, rinse, repeat. That seemed unusual to me on several fronts, one being that I'm shocked that suboxone would hold you over for even just half the day with a habit like yours, and 2 being that I was also surprised the suboxone worked for you considering that you were going back and forth between the subs and dope that often, which usually renders the suboxone useless for at least a few days for a person.
I would think that if the suboxone is working that well for you, that it will also block very well for you. That's just been my experience with it, having taken it both years ago when my habit was smaller and when it worked very well for me, and then more recently this spring when my habit was way worse and the subs really didn't work well for me. During my first go with it the blockade affect worked very well (or very bad depending on how you want to look at it) but more recently it didn't work nearly as well, although it still worked and maybe it worked better than I though but since my habit was higher more recently and I needed a good 5 bags to get high, it was probably just able to break through since it was a lot of dope being shot at once.
At the time i was maintained on 110 and my sister gave me a piece of a pill she said was oxy, so i railed it and it turned out to be subutex. It was maybe 1mg....i was thrown into the worst wd ive ever had. Never been narcaned but i imagine thats what it would have been like. So yea pw is most def real.
This is more proof that it's the buprenorphine in suboxone that has all the affect, and not the naloxone. Some people think that they are safe to take subutex soon after another opiate/opioid, but not suboxone, but the truth is that the outcome will be the same. Same goes for people that think that you can't IV suboxone due to the naloxone in it, thinking it will cause precipitated withdrawals even if you don't have anything else in your system. Again, not true, and as long as you don't have another opiate/opioid in your system you are good to go.
Gonna be honest when I see the doctor on Tuesday, since maybe they'll up the dosage. I was craving dope really bad after a week on 4 mg a day. After talking to people at an NA meeting, I suspect that amount is not enough. If they start giving me drug screenings more than once a week, I think I'm cool with that. They're just trying to help me, right?
