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The Discuss Your Views on Sex Work or Prostitution Thread

Mr. Krinkle

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Ok. How's that gonna work practically?

Sure. You're right you could fully regulate the prostitution sector so that virtually everyone in it are aware mentally healthy adults.

Buuut then what do you do with the people who aren't in the official sanctioned prostitution? The ones most vulnerable and where consent is most questionable are ones like street prostitutes.

Sooo,what do you do? Do you declare that prostitution illegal? Then how do you stop it? How do you keep the system then becoming their abuser too?

And if it's legal you're back to the same problem again.

My suggestion is what I've suggested before. Have all prostitution be legal but with outreach programs to help those not giving exactly free and enthusiastic consent to get out.


Maybe decriminalize it first and go from there?

regardless of what you're doing with that money, it's still a job - isn't it? i don't ask anybody what they're doing with their paycheck - why should prostitution be any different?

ive had a lousy BJ before so there's definitely an art to the profession....and i don't want the cracked out hooker either - i'd like to see the menu plz =D
 

Atelier3

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It's less visible, but I'd hardly say it's non existent.

I suspect you're thinking of women visibly trying to solicit customers. Which I never was. The side I experience was homeless and/or visibly desperate women being solicited. And I can assure you they still exist. It's just not nearly as visible as more obvious forms of street sex work.

But if a customer and a sex worker* come into contact on the street, regardless of who initiates it, and sex or sexual favors are exchanged for payment. That's street sex work.

* And I submit if they're not a sex worker before, it they start doing it and establish a continued transactional relationship, then they become a sex worker then.

It doesn't require obvious and visible prostitutes. And it doesn't require that the sex worker is the one finding the customers or if the customers are finding her. So long as sex work is happening on the street it's street sex work no?

Yes. But maybe it varies between different localities. I don’t know of anywhere in Sydney there is active street-walking type prostitution. However, women and especially vulnerable women can be solicited for sex anywhere. It might be the sick homeless junkie who was begging but got propositioned instead. It could be a woman with debts being offered a way to settle the ledger by her landlord. Or the woman in danger of being laid off from her job being offered a lifeline by the HR creep. I’m sure there are a thousand examples of where that kind of sex work that exploits vulnerability and power imbalances takes place.
 

JessFR

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Yes. But maybe it varies between different localities. I don’t know of anywhere in Sydney there is active street-walking type prostitution. However, women and especially vulnerable women can be solicited for sex anywhere. It might be the sick homeless junkie who was begging but got propositioned instead. It could be a woman with debts being offered a way to settle the ledger by her landlord. Or the woman in danger of being laid off from her job being offered a lifeline by the HR creep. I’m sure there are a thousand examples of where that kind of sex work that exploits vulnerability and power imbalances takes place.

Some of those examples are more quid pro quo sexual harassment than sex work. Bordering on rape on some jurisdictions.

To me it's sex work if it involves being paid on something of material value. Money, drugs. And the two parties have no prior relationship.

When it's a boss and an employee it'd quid pro quo sexual harassment not sex work.

Some of your examples are also more survival sex, where the transaction is for basic necessities of life like food or shelter, although it and street sex work have some overlap.
 

Outlier

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My views on sex work are a little divided I guess. It depends. There's nothing really wrong with sex work, but for some hypothetical person who's getting into it - are you ready? There's a reason why here in Ontario, at a leading mental health and addictions hospital in Guelph called Homewood, if you tell them you've been involved in any sex work they will automatically enroll you in sexual trauma counseling. I don't believe truly that every single person doing this is being traumatized by what happens making the decision to get into sex work - but I see why Homewood would do that. Because the vast, vast majority of people who are into it -they aren't doing it because it's something that they truly want or love to do. If you're attractive or fit a niche, somewhere there's a market it's quick and easy money. It's not easy on the mind though. It's really personal. It's really hard to have sex with someone if your heart is not in it even without money involved. Add that money element into the mix, it gets degrading.

I would advocate for sex work to be fully legal any day. In Canada, in 2010 a lot of the laws regarding prostitution were deemed unconstitutional and it was effectively rendered legal. This was brought up to court again by the Conservatives in 2011, and by 2014 or '15 it was rendered illegal to look for a prostitute, illegal to make your living, main income off the proceeds of prostitution, but it's legal to sell sex as a service... what the fuck is that shit? All the brothels which had opened were shut down because they were then illegal, again. These brothels running when it was legal, were actually really, really good things for the worker and for the customer. Everything was monitored so it wasn't nearly as likely something bad happened, all the clients info was taken down at entry, and the health of the worker was actually cared for. If you went to work at one of these places and you had a drug problem, they would help you get help for that. Or for anything.

One of my friends used to work in one of these brothels around that time so I got some pretty good insight into that through him. As I get more and more into the subjects of harm reduction and policy I've been getting up to speed here on some stuff. Like, a lot of harm reduction agencies are dually HIV/AIDS groups, and a lot of groups which advocate for sex workers are also big on harm reduction. It makes perfect sense. I can't think of a demographic which needs harm reduction policies and safe spaces to do this more than sex workers do. In drugs and in the dangers around their trade combined.

I'll advocate for sex workers any day, but on the subject of sex work itself... I felt like I sold my soul when I did it. I made a choice and I regretted it badly each time,
 

JessFR

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My views on sex work are a little divided I guess. It depends. There's nothing really wrong with sex work, but for some hypothetical person who's getting into it - are you ready? There's a reason why here in Ontario, at a leading mental health and addictions hospital in Guelph called Homewood, if you tell them you've been involved in any sex work they will automatically enroll you in sexual trauma counseling. I don't believe truly that every single person doing this is being traumatized by what happens making the decision to get into sex work - but I see why Homewood would do that. Because the vast, vast majority of people who are into it -they aren't doing it because it's something that they truly want or love to do. If you're attractive or fit a niche, somewhere there's a market it's quick and easy money. It's not easy on the mind though. It's really personal. It's really hard to have sex with someone if your heart is not in it even without money involved. Add that money element into the mix, it gets degrading.

I would advocate for sex work to be fully legal any day. In Canada, in 2010 a lot of the laws regarding prostitution were deemed unconstitutional and it was effectively rendered legal. This was brought up to court again by the Conservatives in 2011, and by 2014 or '15 it was rendered illegal to look for a prostitute, illegal to make your living, main income off the proceeds of prostitution, but it's legal to sell sex as a service... what the fuck is that shit? All the brothels which had opened were shut down because they were then illegal, again. These brothels running when it was legal, were actually really, really good things for the worker and for the customer. Everything was monitored so it wasn't nearly as likely something bad happened, all the clients info was taken down at entry, and the health of the worker was actually cared for. If you went to work at one of these places and you had a drug problem, they would help you get help for that. Or for anything.

One of my friends used to work in one of these brothels around that time so I got some pretty good insight into that through him. As I get more and more into the subjects of harm reduction and policy I've been getting up to speed here on some stuff. Like, a lot of harm reduction agencies are dually HIV/AIDS groups, and a lot of groups which advocate for sex workers are also big on harm reduction. It makes perfect sense. I can't think of a demographic which needs harm reduction policies and safe spaces to do this more than sex workers do. In drugs and in the dangers around their trade combined.

I'll advocate for sex workers any day, but on the subject of sex work itself... I felt like I sold my soul when I did it. I made a choice and I regretted it badly each time,

I agree with everything you said.
 

Coffeeshroom

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i can honestly admit that i myself was an escort for a while. By that i mean i was the young good looking guy on the shoulder of a wealthy rich old woman that needed a young sexy man to hang on her arm and to brag about. I went to a lot of fancy company functions or dinners or sometimes pvt dinners and such but without sex. When sex was wanted it was a personal choice between you and the client, so your choice actually. And at some point i was not a pimp per say but a bodyguard for the escorts that went out with other men. So i was always there, around the corner in case the date for the night went south and my help was needed.

But overall i see nothing wrong with it, some people need a specific service and if you willing to provide that service, it's your own choice.

But i don't agree with young woman being forced into prostitution just to pay of there debt or keep there addiction flowing. So for me it's a dbl edge sword. There is the good and the bad side to this industry.
 

JessFR

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i can honestly admit that i myself was an escort for a while. By that i mean i was the young good looking guy on the shoulder of a wealthy rich old woman that needed a young sexy man to hang on her arm and to brag about. I went to a lot of fancy company functions or dinners or sometimes pvt dinners and such but without sex. When sex was wanted it was a personal choice between you and the client, so your choice actually. And at some point i was not a pimp per say but a bodyguard for the escorts that went out with other men. So i was always there, around the corner in case the date for the night went south and my help was needed.

But overall i see nothing wrong with it, some people need a specific service and if you willing to provide that service, it's your own choice.

But i don't agree with young woman being forced into prostitution just to pay of there debt or keep there addiction flowing. So for me it's a dbl edge sword. There is the good and the bad side to this industry.

I would argue that nobody "needs" this service. I don't think sex should be considered a need and I think framing it that way has been used to justify a lot of harmful things.

I get you probably weren't trying to say that, but it's how I feel.
 

Zephyn

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I would argue that nobody "needs" this service. I don't think sex should be considered a need and I think framing it that way has been used to justify a lot of harmful things.

I get you probably weren't trying to say that, but it's how I feel.
I think sex is a need, or more so affection, but obviously this is not provided by sex workers in any sort of meaningful way
 

JessFR

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I think sex is a need, or more so affection, but obviously this is not provided by sex workers in any sort of meaningful way

I guess it probably depends a lot on how you define a need.

To me a need is either something you have to have to live, or if you maybe want a looser definition, something you have to have to function in life.

Obviously sex doesn't meet the first criteria, I don't know that I reaaally believe it fits the second either.
 

Coffeeshroom

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I would argue that nobody "needs" this service. I don't think sex should be considered a need and I think framing it that way has been used to justify a lot of harmful things.

I get you probably weren't trying to say that, but it's how I feel.
I can respect that and you

Edit: so lets make the word a "want" and not a "need"
 

JessFR

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I can respect that and you

Edit: so lets make the word a "want" and not a "need"

Well people certainly want sex yes, a lot.

And it's also probably more than fair to say if there's a significant want in the world, there will be people to provide it.

I just worry for many of the people who provide it. I've been in a small part of that world and I know the affect it had on me.
 

Coffeeshroom

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Well people certainly want sex yes, a lot.

And it's also probably more than fair to say if there's a significant want in the world, there will be people to provide it.

I just worry for many of the people who provide it. I've been in a small part of that world and I know the affect it had on me.
So was i.. And i saw a lot of that world, more then you think. Reason im showing respect
 

deficiT

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I think sex workers perform an important service and should be treated with respect like any other worker. A lot of the problems in the industry would be alleviated by decriminalization of sex work and applying basic harm reduction ideals. Sex might not be a necessity in the same sense as food or water, but it is for many people a deep animal desire that goes beyond being simply a 'want'. Sex can be incredibly cathartic and mentally cleansing, and it serves a very important function in human psychology, beyond just procreation.

There are absolutely John's that are scumbags. And I think those that abuse sex workers should be prosecuted to the full extent of the law. But this can't happen with the climate of prohibition, so a lot of the pitfalls and negative things about sex work are allowed to grow and get worse.

Personally, I'm at a point in my life where I can't imagine having any real affection or love for anyone. And believe me, I've tried. But you can't force yourself to love or care about someone. At the same time, I still have my needs for some form of intimacy and sex. It certainly shouldn't be a crime when I pay someone to help me fulfill those needs... given there is full consent and the person isn't being pressured by someone else to perform those services.
 

Zephyn

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I think sex workers perform an important service and should be treated with respect like any other worker. A lot of the problems in the industry would be alleviated by decriminalization of sex work and applying basic harm reduction ideals. Sex might not be a necessity in the same sense as food or water, but it is for many people a deep animal desire that goes beyond being simply a 'want'. Sex can be incredibly cathartic and mentally cleansing, and it serves a very important function in human psychology, beyond just procreation.

There are absolutely John's that are scumbags. And I think those that abuse sex workers should be prosecuted to the full extent of the law. But this can't happen with the climate of prohibition, so a lot of the pitfalls and negative things about sex work are allowed to grow and get worse.

Personally, I'm at a point in my life where I can't imagine having any real affection or love for anyone. And believe me, I've tried. But you can't force yourself to love or care about someone. At the same time, I still have my needs for some form of intimacy and sex. It certainly shouldn't be a crime when I pay someone to help me fulfill those needs... given there is full consent and the person isn't being pressured by someone else to perform those services.
Exactly, though I'd discourage people from doing it even for personal reasons, maybe its just not for me but mixing sex and money is weird and awkward, and personally the sex I enjoy is more playful and not something you can pay for as it requires an emotional bond.

That said, even in countries where its legal but not regulated, in the few times I've ever done this, I've met women who when asked did say they felt uncomfortable with it, had to do it to survive, or one woman who told my estranged wife and I that her husband would take her kid away if she stopped, we wound up trying to call the cops, but apparently there was nothing illegal about the situation there, and also according to my partner she had been threatened by the cops, but I think she went into a psychosis because shortly after that she was freaking out about taxi driver, hospital workers, etc all being "in the cartel" and screaming in the street, she calmed down shortly after taking antipsychotic injection, and we had been doing a shitton of cocaine.

Thus, whenever I've done this I've been careful to more check in on their situation, and more than a couple times never even had sex with them. (But obviously still paid them for their time, and many were happy for the chance to get paid just to talk)

I don't think you can really have "enthusiastic" consent from a sex worker and im disgusted and ashamed in myself for even participating in such a thing in the careful way that I did, where I was sure everyone was consenting.. moreso because I feel sex is sacred and I swapped with a lot of weird energy, I can almost feel it in my body (hopefully thats psychosomatic and not hiv onset), and its led me to avoiding sexuality at all or even porn.

The only times I've ever been so sexualized to even consider something like that has been when twacked out of my mind on stimulants. Even in a long dry spell, I can go without sex for extended periods of time without much of an issue.

Anyway, I'm sure in say, some places in Europe its legal AND well regulated, so that would be a lot safer.

Also 60% of *my* sex drive is the pleasure of the other person and that also doesn't fit into the paradigm of sex work.

Its all a result of capitalism, which is why it sickens me so much.
 

Mr. Krinkle

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Apr 2, 2005
Messages
281
I think sex workers perform an important service and should be treated with respect like any other worker. A lot of the problems in the industry would be alleviated by decriminalization of sex work and applying basic harm reduction ideals. Sex might not be a necessity in the same sense as food or water, but it is for many people a deep animal desire that goes beyond being simply a 'want'. Sex can be incredibly cathartic and mentally cleansing, and it serves a very important function in human psychology, beyond just procreation.

There are absolutely John's that are scumbags. And I think those that abuse sex workers should be prosecuted to the full extent of the law. But this can't happen with the climate of prohibition, so a lot of the pitfalls and negative things about sex work are allowed to grow and get worse.

Personally, I'm at a point in my life where I can't imagine having any real affection or love for anyone. And believe me, I've tried. But you can't force yourself to love or care about someone. At the same time, I still have my needs for some form of intimacy and sex. It certainly shouldn't be a crime when I pay someone to help me fulfill those needs... given there is full consent and the person isn't being pressured by someone else to perform those services.

Absolutely

Same here - im done falling in love, but i can use some ass for sure tho but i can't really do it "Ooo Ooo" like an ape, i gotta have a little affection and intimacy going on there, and if a hooker can do that, then she's really good at her job, and i'd pay extra for that....

ive had a few good hookers that have kept me as a regular, and when that happens, it does get better...i had a few that were really fuckin cool from years ago that i still hear from today....
 

Mr. Krinkle

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Messages
281
Just don't give your girl crabs, then she might know whats up =D


I had a regular id visit in NYC and her name was Peaches - smokin hot black chick - nicest girl in the world - back in the days where you'd drive down by the meat packing district in manhatten and 3 or 4 blocks loaded with hookers - it was great

and then i had a regular in Portland Or. her name was "Watermelon" she did eventually tell me what her real name is but watermelon stuck better for some reason - white chick - cool as hell
 
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