Lysergamides The Big & Dandy LSZ Thread

[Bagseed]

if I were to aquire any of these LSD analogs, I would definitely get some Ehrlich reagent to check if it actually is an indole compound.

 

[Transform]

I've nipped out some uninformative posts and some vendor discussion. Please remember our rules when talking in here.

It seems that real LSZ is indeed about to hit the market so please try to stay on topic as this thread is likely to become a useful resource.

 

[Incunabula]

very exciting

I'm wondering, what are the 2 "sticks" sticking out of each side of the azetidine ring?

 

[Solipsis]

They are methyls like normal non-wedge lines, only they show 3 dimensionally which way they are pointing, namely at an angle towards you or away from you. It is not flat, such connections are tetrahedric.

NSFW:

Often they don't show 3-dimensionality because there is a mix available of isomers, but here the azetidine site has two stereocenters that matter a lot considering the structure of the "antlers" at that position (the azetidine ring is like the two ethyls from LSD bound together, or constrained as it is called) decide how well the molecule binds.

There is an optimal way for those methyl "sticks" to point, and that particular isomer is called (S,S)-(+) as mentioned before in this thread. It is what I meant with "the more active enantiomere", and it is the entire purpose of why this compound was designed.

 

[Kerensky]

I really don't want to start a source discussion. But I'll reserve the right to be sceptic about this because something does smell fishy............I thought the LSZ was going to come from the same place as the AL-LAD, not makes me wary. (no, he's not the source of AL-LAD. He's just a reseller. The source was the first to post the HNMR, logically)

We'll see when reports start coming in. Did he post any kind of analysis of what he's offering? GC/MS? HNMR? anything to prove it's not "just" LSD-25, RH-34, a surplus NBOMe mix or that LSDB phen scam?

I'm not familiar with that scam but you're right, people should be cautious, there's nothing much to go on in the way of proof so far, no. So perhaps we should say there is the prospect of this being on the UK RC scene, subject to confirmation.
From an HR perspective one should exercise caution either way. AFAICT there is no in-vivo data for this compound if it is real, not even TIKHAL, and if it's not what it's supposed to be then caution also.

 

[Transform]

Don't forget we don't really allow availability or vendor discussion in PD guys.

I'm going to step in here and say that the LSZ is exactly as legit as the AL-LAD currently circulating but ask that you confine cryptic discussions about vendors to more suitable platforms such as www.safeorscam.com.

No doubt there will be resellers so it's hard to tell who's talking about who here and that could lead dangerous misinformation where someone believes a fraudster to be legitimate.

 

[LucidSDreamr]

More potent than LSD, are you kidding me? :D

But as I understand it 5-HT2 agonism is not a guarantee for psychedelic effects though many substances apparently have it as their absolute basis. Could someone explain to me how that is possible and how probable or certain it is that this dimethylazetidide is centrally active??
Also am I safe to assume that this compound is even more difficult to make than regular LSD aside from the fact that it has a much much shorter history?

don't know if someone else answered this but even with good agonism and binding if the compound affects other proteins such as phospholipases, the response from 5-ht binding cannot result in a psychedelic effect if the downstream event after 5-ht binding suchas phospholipase activity is hindered in some way by the drug or by something else going on when that drug is added

 

[Solipsis]

Thanks, I know - I learned a lot since that post which is from a while back.

Theoretically:

Pharmacological evaluation showed that (S,S)-(+)-2,4-dimethylazetidine gave a lysergamide with the highest LSD-like behavioral activity in the rat two lever drug discrimination model that was slightly more potent than LSD itself. This same diastereomer also had the highest affinity and functional potency at the rat serotonin 5-HT2A receptor, the presumed target for hallucinogenic agents, and a receptor affinity profile in a panel of screens that was most similar to that of LSD itself

http://pubs.acs.org/doi/abs/10.1021/jm020153s

However I was told that in practice (regarding use in humans) this (S,S)-(+)-2,4-dimethylazetidide is slightly less potent than LSD although it causes a more severe or pronounced body load. The inconsistency with results in rats may come from difference in downstream signal transduction effects between humans and rats or because "the body load the rats got" affected their reaction in the tests despite the actual "psychedelic" effects. I have no idea how these things are interpreted and if other psychedelics with pronounced body loads tested in rats also result in such discrepancies.

 

[Incunabula]

Very interesting, Solipsis. This might very well be the same reason that Nichols reports AL-LAD to be 10% more potent than LSD, when it actually turns out the be not as strong as old Lucy.

 

[Si Dread]

I guess this should be American pronounced huh? L S Zee?

If this turns out to have a greater bodyload than LSD I can't see myself using it. If on the other hand it turns out to be weight for weight, stronger than LSD, I can see the hardheads turning to it after Al-Lad fails to impact them hard enough.

 

[Incunabula]

I guess this should be American pronounced huh? L S Zee?

If this turns out to have a greater bodyload than LSD I can't see myself using it. If on the other hand it turns out to be weight for weight, stronger than LSD, I can see the hardheads turning to it after Al-Lad fails to impact them hard enough.

.......Or EL-ES-ZED

I somehow have a feeling that LSD will never be beat in the combination of potency, lack of side effects/bodyload, liniency in dose/response, spiritual power etc.

There's something totally magical about how it came into existence, it really is the first ever synthetic psychedelic (research) chemical, and it still is number one imo.

 

[Si Dread]

Information appears very thin on the ground regarding effects or anything else... which is why I've just return to this thread. Found a brief report on Drugs Forum but I'm not sure of the linking rules, so here's the body of the report. It's easily found through Google...

My friend tried 2/3 of a tab of LSZ last night. (~100-150ug)

Age: 22
Height: 6'1''
Weight: 80KG

Blotter had no taste, defiantly no nbomes here.

He was sat at his desk, listening to music and browsing the web, when he felt a similar feeling to that of an LSD come up but less uncomfortable. As well as feeling drowsy.

He thinks he fell asleep for about an hour this point, and awoke to sparkling lights, and warping walls, nothing too extreme at this dose. CEVS were nice, music was enhanced and caused him to think introspectively about things in his life, and evaluate what was going on. Nothing too extreme, will report back with higher doses soon.

He did note that he was feeling rather warm, but made sure to keep hydrated, never felt like he was overheating and had no heart rate or BP issues.

After about 3 hours he was tired, went to sleep listening to music, slept like a baby and woke up feeling like a king.

He tells me from the initial dose to falling asleep, the experience was about 8 hours.

In restrospect : has potential, no bad feelings at all, all positive. experiments with higher doses needed.

I know a vendor has starting selling this along with AL-LAD, so I hope more reports will come in soon!

 

[foolsgold]

ive got a sample of lsz coming my way soon hopefully for the weekend the people who put me on to the site all say its the real stuff so should be fun

any for you tried candy flipping on these once you got the testing out the way ? or we still to much in the new experience stag ?

 

[Si Dread]

I tried to christian 2c-e & MDMA Happy Flipping, but it turns out this combo is called Sparkle Flipping, a very apt term. So I coin Happy Flipping for the Al-Lad/MDMA combo. I planned to attempt to pioneer this awsome sounding combo but I'm off stims for the forseeable future, & besides, I wouldn't be the first anyway, a short report of this combo, a back-to-back job, appears in TIHKAL.

 

[ZFC]

I tried to christian 2c-e & MDMA Happy Flipping, but it turns out this combo is called Sparkle Flipping, a very apt term. So I coin Happy Flipping for the Al-Lad/MDMA combo. I planned to attempt to pioneer this awsome sounding combo but I'm off stims for the forseeable future, & besides, I wouldn't be the first anyway, a short report of this combo, a back-to-back job, appears in TIHKAL.

Hey, I want to coin an exotic flip too!

Quick:

LSZ + MDMA = Zesty flipping

There.

 

[Si Dread]

Hahahaha good one... How about Zippy Flipping?

I'm in the wrong thread, aren't I, for Al-Lad/MDMA combo conjecture..?

PS I Trip Reported this LSz stuff in errrrmm Trip Reports! It's excellent!

 

[foolsgold]

well im thinking of dropping it after a k-hole maybe with some speed not sure yet im very very use to psychedelics so cant see any problems that way only thing i want to know is interactions good or bad idea in that sense

 

[bloodshed344]

well im thinking of dropping it after a k-hole maybe with some speed not sure yet im very very use to psychedelics so cant see any problems that way only thing i want to know is interactions good or bad idea in that sense

combo with speed will most likely increase bodyload and definitely increase stimulation.

 

[Ismene]

Legitimate AL-LAD is most definitely available at this moment, and the very same lab (well, the only genuine one I know of) is currently at work producing LSZ.

Only one lab making Al-lad? You'll lose count of all the chinese and bangladeshi labs with it for sale.

 

[Psichedelic]

Fellow (suspected) Bluelighter posted up a trip report:

http://www.erowid.org/experiences/exp.php?ID=100740

And LC/MS Data for the LSZ we're all talking about

http://imgur.com/VzUrhka,p4kVMvS,lJ0bqkJ#0

I cannot find any other LC/MS data on LSZ to compare to, I also noticed the dates are from late May.

Hopefully I may partake in this legendary experience. Reviews are checking out well.

These LSD analogues are rather interesting, I've been interested by the lysergamides for a few months now. I truly wasn't expecting to see this beauty come around any time soon. ALD-52 was the last good analogue I've seen, and it has been a little while.