Opioids Lethality potential of Fentanyl?

[JohnBoy2000]

This seems like the horror drug in that apparently responsible for so many deaths.

With seemingly micrograms sufficient to cause death.

Actually in morbid wondering, my actual question is, is there any reason given its potential for CNS depression - why it hasn't become the drug of choice to be used for capital punishment lethal injection, versus pentobarbital as has been the case?

Especially given the cost difference between the two - one being thousands, the other literally being pennies.

Additionally - do any users actually use fentanyl directly for recreational/non-medical purposes?

Given that such a small dosing error could be lethal, kind of seems risky, not to mention other drugs being laced with it and it being unknowingly consumed, but to use it directly, intentionally?

 

[nznity]

This seems like the horror drug in that apparently responsible for so many deaths.

With seemingly micrograms sufficient to cause death.

Actually in morbid wondering, my actual question is, is there any reason given its potential for CNS depression - why it hasn't become the drug of choice to be used for capital punishment lethal injection, versus pentobarbital as has been the case.

Especially given the cost difference between the two - one being thousands, the other literally being pennies.

Additionally - do any users actually use fentanyl directly for recreational/non-medical purposes?

Given that such a small dosing error could be lethal, kind of seems risky, not to mention other drugs being laced with it and it being unknowingly consumed, but to use it directly, intentionally?

medicinal fent is used a lot during Surgery, The pharma fent is very diluted though so they can measure out the doses accurately. I've been giving fent at the hospital and have used pharma fent outside the hospital and the doses are like 0.5mg/ML so u don't end up oding.

 

[I_Hate_This_Place]

This seems like the horror drug in that apparently responsible for so many deaths.

With seemingly micrograms sufficient to cause death.

Actually in morbid wondering, my actual question is, is there any reason given its potential for CNS depression - why it hasn't become the drug of choice to be used for capital punishment lethal injection, versus pentobarbital as has been the case?

Especially given the cost difference between the two - one being thousands, the other literally being pennies.

Additionally - do any users actually use fentanyl directly for recreational/non-medical purposes?

Given that such a small dosing error could be lethal, kind of seems risky, not to mention other drugs being laced with it and it being unknowingly consumed, but to use it directly, intentionally?

As nznity mentioned Fentanyl is used in the hospital setting quite often. As he mentioned surgery is one area were the use of Fentanyl is quite common. In terms of people directly consuming it on purpose it's not uncommon by any means. When they were more commonly available on the street Fentanyl Transdermal Systems were at least in my area quite highly sought after. Users would break down the patch & IV the Fentanyl. People also would use the patch via bucall administration or in some cases just wear it. I have experience with all three methods. Though not all that much personal experience as I always found Fentanyl to be one of the least recreational opioids.

I've worn the patches for pain relief &/or maintenance at times as well. That would be my preferred method of usage. Bucall was a decent method of admin when my tolerance was low enough. However; I had friends who found Fentanyl to be the best thing since sliced bread & would seek out said patches. As usual the appropriate disclaimer is required. I do not in anyway recommend the usage of Fentanyl Transdermal Systems in the manner I have described. Messing with F patches is a good way to die. I won't go into the number of times I've had to deal with people oding on Fent. Suffice to say that way before Fentanyl analogues became a thing in 'Dope' I'd had to institute a no shooting Fentanyl at my spots rule for multiple people. One friend in particular would fall out every fucking time. Bring his ass back, repeat. Sadly enough that friend is no longer with us. RIP.

Back on topic yes it is used intentionally for many reasons. As I mentioned I personally am not a big fan of using it outside of it's intended purposes. One of the other concerns with the patches is the range of Fentanyl contained. For example the 100mcg/hr patches varied IIRC by as much as 4+mg. I can't recall the exact numbers but IIRC the generics could range as low as 10mg per patch were as the "best" brand had 16.2mg per patch. I could be wrong on the numbers as it's been quite a long time but regardless there were large differences in total Fentanyl content. Considering the users I knew would extract the patches & IV the large variations in Fentanyl content made an already dangerous practice all the more dangerous. I'm starting to digress & ramble though I think.

I'm not that familiar with lethal injection practices but to the best of my knowledge Fentanyl is used in some states lethal injections. IIRC it was first used in lethal injections in 2018 in the state of Nebraska. IIRC the states of Ohio & Nevada were also looking into using it. As I mentioned I'm not that familiar with the topic but to the best of my knowledge it is used in some states. As far as I know lethal injection protocols are public information & if you wish to find more information regarding the drugs used it should be available. Regardless; hopefully my answer has helped to elucidate & you have a little more insight into your question.

medicinal fent is used a lot during Surgery, The pharma fent is very diluted though so they can measure out the doses accurately. I've been giving fent at the hospital and have used pharma fent outside the hospital and the doses are like 0.5mg/ML so u don't end up oding.

Just noticed that I think you may have missed a 0 when typing out the concentration. The usual concentration for vials is .005mg/mL. 50mcg/mL is the most common concentration for the vials to the best of my knowledge. In the USA anyway. My apologies if the concentration is different in Peru.

 

[JohnBoy2000]

As nznity mentioned Fentanyl is used in the hospital setting quite often. As he mentioned surgery is one area were the use of Fentanyl is quite common. In terms of people directly consuming it on purpose it's not uncommon by any means. When they were more commonly available on the street Fentanyl Transdermal Systems were at least in my area quite highly sought after. Users would break down the patch & IV the Fentanyl. People also would use the patch via bucall administration or in some cases just wear it. I have experience with all three methods. Though not all that much personal experience as I always found Fentanyl to be one of the least recreational opioids.

I've worn the patches for pain relief &/or maintenance at times as well. That would be my preferred method of usage. Bucall was a decent method of admin when my tolerance was low enough. However; I had friends who found Fentanyl to be the best thing since sliced bread & would seek out said patches. As usual the appropriate disclaimer is required. I do not in anyway recommend the usage of Fentanyl Transdermal Systems in the manner I have described. Messing with F patches is a good way to die. I won't go into the number of times I've had to deal with people oding on Fent. Suffice to say that way before Fentanyl analogues became a thing in 'Dope' I'd had to institute a no shooting Fentanyl at my spots rule for multiple people. One friend in particular would fall out every fucking time. Bring his ass back, repeat. Sadly enough that friend is no longer with us. RIP.

Back on topic yes it is used intentionally for many reasons. As I mentioned I personally am not a big fan of using it outside of it's intended purposes. One of the other concerns with the patches is the range of Fentanyl contained. For example the 100mcg/hr patches varied IIRC by as much as 4+mg. I can't recall the exact numbers but IIRC the generics could range as low as 10mg per patch were as the "best" brand had 16.2mg per patch. I could be wrong on the numbers as it's been quite a long time but regardless there were large differences in total Fentanyl content. Considering the users I knew would extract the patches & IV the large variations in Fentanyl content made an already dangerous practice all the more dangerous. I'm starting to digress & ramble though I think.

I'm not that familiar with lethal injection practices but to the best of my knowledge Fentanyl is used in some states lethal injections. IIRC it was first used in lethal injections in 2018 in the state of Nebraska. IIRC the states of Ohio & Nevada were also looking into using it. As I mentioned I'm not that familiar with the topic but to the best of my knowledge it is used in some states. As far as I know lethal injection protocols are public information & if you wish to find more information regarding the drugs used it should be available. Regardless; hopefully my answer has helped to elucidate & you have a little more insight into your question.



Just noticed that I think you may have missed a 0 when typing out the concentration. The usual concentration for vials is .005mg/mL. 50mcg/mL is the most common concentration for the vials to the best of my knowledge. In the USA anyway. My apologies if the concentration is different in Peru.

Don't worry about rambling, I'm trying to soak up as much info as possible so, feel free to ramble.

One point being, users would extract fentanyl from a patch...

10 mg per patch?
They really come with that much loaded?

Fentanyl: What Is a Lethal Dosage? | Oxford

Lethal doses will vary depending on who is taking the drug. Learn more about Fentanyl misuse and how to get treatment for Fentanyl addiction.

www.oxfordtreatment.com

Lethal dose reportedly around 2 mg, up to 3 for sure.

Fentanyl Addiction: Effects, Signs of Addiction & Treatment | DrugAbuse

Fentanyl is extremely potent and highly addictive. Learn the signs and symptoms, as well as options for fentanyl treatment and recovery.

drugabuse.com

Lethal injection, adminned with benzos and some anaesthetic for relaxation but the death comes from fentanyl.
I couldn't find listed the exact dose of fent intended for lethal injection however.

 

[I_Hate_This_Place]

Don't worry about rambling, I'm trying to soak up as much info as possible so, feel free to ramble.

One point being, users would extract fentanyl from a patch...

10 mg per patch?
They really come with that much loaded?

Fentanyl: What Is a Lethal Dosage? | Oxford

Lethal doses will vary depending on who is taking the drug. Learn more about Fentanyl misuse and how to get treatment for Fentanyl addiction.

www.oxfordtreatment.com

Lethal dose reportedly around 2 mg, up to 3 for sure.

Fentanyl Addiction: Effects, Signs of Addiction & Treatment | DrugAbuse

Fentanyl is extremely potent and highly addictive. Learn the signs and symptoms, as well as options for fentanyl treatment and recovery.

drugabuse.com

Lethal injection, adminned with benzos and some anaesthetic for relaxation but the death comes from fentanyl.
I couldn't find listed the exact dose of fent intended for lethal injection however.

Yes they do in fact come in those doses. The 100mcg/hr patches are what I'm referring to at those doses. Those are the strongest & what I have the most experience with. As I mentioned I wasn't into IV'ing them but did use them for maintenance / pain relief. At one point I was wearing two at a time changed every two days instead of three. I would also add IV opioids on top. There really is virtually no limit to opioid tolerance. Here's a few images of various Fentanyl Patches from different brands. Duragesic is the brand name IIRC. As you can see the first two contain 10mg & 10.2mg respectively. Which is as I mentioned on the low side for total content of this strength patch. Next to it is a patch containing 16.5mg! That's a 6.5mg difference for the same strength patch! A huge difference considering the LD50!

So as to confirm the answer to your question yes they really do come loaded with that much. In fact as I mentioned many brands contain considerably more! The fact that some 100mcg/hr patches contain as much as 50% plus more fentanyl than other 100mcg/hr patches is extremely dangerous to those who are unaware. In my area when the patches were commonly available users would cut the patch into pieces, extract & IV. Considering how large a difference there is between brands at the same dosage strength the same size piece of patch from different brands could contain very different amounts of fentanyl. That's assuming that the fentanyl is evenly distributed throughout the patch. That may be the case with "stickies" but it was not the case with "gellies". I'm not sure if the "gel" are still manufactured or not though? I think they may have been discontinued. The "gel" patches were even more dangerous as there was no way to know how evenly the fentanyl was distributed. The following images illustrate the difference between the two. The first one is a matrix patch where as the other is the "gel" patch I'm referring to.

You can probably tell from the images but in case it's not visible the patches on the left are matrix patches. The patches on the right are "gel" patches which contain a gel as opposed to being just a flat plastic "sticker". I'm not sure if the "gel" style patches are still manufactured or if only the matrix style are available now. It may vary based upon the country of residence. As a side note based on the 2-3mg numbers you mentioned as the LD50 (I didn't double check it) other than the 12.5mcg/hr patch all the other fentanyl patches (12.5-100mcg/hr) contain a total amount of fentanyl that would be lethal to a non tolerant user. Other than the 12.5mcg/hr patches all the other patches (25-100mcg/hr) contain at least 2.5mg of fentanyl which based on the LD50 numbers you provided could prove lethal. Fentanyl patches are not prescribed to & should not be used by non-tolerant individuals however.

I'm out of time for the moment but hopefully I've been able to convey some information regarding your question as it pertains to fentanyl in general & Fentanyl Transdermal Systems in particular. I'm not as familiar with the lethal injection aspects & don't have time ATM to look into that particular aspect further though the topic is one that interests me. Given the time I may see about pursuing further information in regards to it. Regardless if you have any further questions I'll do my best to answer them.

 

[JohnBoy2000]

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onlinelibrary.wiley.com

Fentanyl extraction, that's insane formerly all necessary was simply cut the patch and extract via the reservoir it seems.
Matrix patches, presumably designed to prevent this, well - that case report shows a modified extraction method.

Although to acquire illicitly it doesn't seem to be either difficult or expensive anyhow.

Death periods of 15 to 20 minutes have been reported via lethal injection and despite being an opioid, some physicians seem to have questioned whether it's a painful 20 minutes of respiratory depression - likened to a prolonged drowning.

 

[Henrygraft]

Come si iniettano i cerotti di Fentanyl?