Dissociatives Dodgy ketamine UK (pic added)

[Hodor]

I'm sure it's possible it happened, but, yeah, I don't think it's common. IMO blaming "Chinese RCs" is the modern day equivalent of LSD being tainted with strychnine or rat poison in weed, or whatever other nonsensical urban myths that emerged historically to explain small subjective differences in experiences of a given drug. But compared to the various lysergamides which by all reports are very similar (although I am aware, apparently, that some seasoned lysergamide users can distinguish them - although even then not perfectly) and even benzos, to a lesser extent (again, benzo-naive users would be easily fooled), ketamine-like dissociatives in my experience are distinct enough from each other that they could not be easily substituted.

So much this.

I mean, yeah, I could see someone passing off some of the shorter lasting disso RC's as ketamine, but 3-MeO-PCP? Not so much.

That said... much of today's black-market ketamine does indeed come from dodgy Chinese underground labs. Not RC's sold as ket, mind you, but actual ketamine, just shittily made. Ketamine is *massively* popular in China; I don't think even the British do as much of the stuff as the Chinese.
While the Chinese government's crackdowns on illegal ketamine production can be brutal, given the size of the Chinese countryside (where a few bribes can go a long way) it's still a game of whack-a-mole for the authorities.

It therefore shouldn't surprise anyone that the triads are taking advantage of the economies of scale here, exporting massive amounts of black-market ketamine into foreign markets, where genuine veterinary/pharma ketamine has been becoming harder to source due to concerns about abuse.

 

[Vastness]

The closest "RCs" to actual ketamine IMO would be 2F-DCK and DCK/O-PCM, both of which, probably, I could be fooled into thinking were ketamine if I was told it was ketamine beforehand and was only allowed to use a single dose. The former would just seem like especially weak ketamine, like it was heavily cut with something inert, and the latter obviously would seem like mindblowingly strong ketamine - although I like to think I would realise something unusual was going on once I started to come back to reality. :giggle:

I don't really know anything about the relative financial or technical differences in production and supply of these substances compared to ketamine - although intuitively it seems to me there would not be any value in selling either as ketamine, quite the opposite in fact.

 

[jhjhsdi]

The closest "RCs" to actual ketamine IMO would be 2F-DCK and DCK/O-PCM

Anyone got any photos? Do these come in shard or any type of crystal form?
Also what do they taste like? I've never seen or tried them (to my knowledge lol)

although intuitively it seems to me there would not be any value in selling either as ketamine, quite the opposite in fact.

So I take it they are more expensive mg for mg?




It's not just that this stuff is weird shaped its the RC effects I was talking about. Not long lived like the mxe/mxp cut stuff that was around a few years ago. It's same length of normal k sometimes even shorter, the dissociative effects are basically as they should be and the rush and taste you get from IV is the same, it cooks the same, tastes the same, feels the same in the nose, drip tastes the same, its the behaviour of people in the hole that's the most concerning issue here.

 

[jhjhsdi]

Bump

 

[Ignio]

I don't know where you are from, but placed around the world you can find different places that offer lab grade testing (different Mass Spectrometry techniques) that can be used to identify drugs and adulterants, measure purity and so on. I use a company called Energy Control located in Spain. Using such a service is the closest drug users can come to getting scientific drug information and thus sending a small sample of the drug you have in hand would offer you the most accurate "case closed" you can get

Obviously you will have to pay a fee (at Energy Control around 100 euros), but for me it is a small prize to pay in terms of hard reduction. I always use it when I buy from new places, receive tablets in packaging I haven't seen before or when I buy larger shipments of powder or crystals to know that it actually contains when I think it should contain, the adulterants it contains, the purity and so on.

It could be very interesting indeed to get the "ketamine" you have posted a picture of tested.

 

[Bella Figura]

Mate - send a sample of your Ketamine to WEDINOS (Welsh drug testing service). it's anonymous and it's free. You'll know for sure then. I just got some Ketamine in the UK myself today, was hoping for those large salt rock looking type but got some more crystalline smaller pieces.

 

[Hodor]

It's not just that this stuff is weird shaped its the RC effects I was talking about. Not long lived like the mxe/mxp cut stuff that was around a few years ago. It's same length of normal k sometimes even shorter, the dissociative effects are basically as they should be and the rush and taste you get from IV is the same, it cooks the same, tastes the same, feels the same in the nose, drip tastes the same, its the behaviour of people in the hole that's the most concerning issue here.

I'm not sure if ketamine analogues are even produced in China at this point. From what I've read, deschloroketamine ("DCK", "O-PCM") got banned in China in late 2018, and I believe they may also have stopped producing 2-fluoro-deschloroketamine ("2F-DCK", probably the closest thing to actual ketamine), possibly because the excuse "it's just an analogue, bro!" might not fly if the authorities think you're producing it for the Chinese domestic market instead of exporting it to the gwai lo. Thus, it would make sense to either switch to making something else entirely, or try to go full illegal and make actual ket for the Triads.

So I would still argue that what you are having is likely actual ketamine produced in a clandestine lab. While the dissociative experience is not quite as mutable as that of classical psychedelics, the experience a person has on ketamine is still going to be heavily influenced by set&setting, the placebo/nocebo effect and tolerance. IMO, changes in the "holing" behavior of a user are more likely to be attributable to the effects of long-term ketamine use on that person's mind, rather than changes to the drug itself.

You can also look at test results on WEDINOS and ecstasydata.org, which show that pretty much all samples sent to them as "ketamine" in the recent months did, in fact, turn out to be actual ketamine.
This one I find particularly interesting:

DrugsData.org (was EcstasyData): Test Details : Result #7181 - White Powder, 7181

DrugsData (EcstasyData) lab testing result

www.ecstasydata.org

Sent in by someone from NY in the USA, the sample contained mostly ketamine, as well as minor amounts of something called "1-[(2-Chlorophenyl)-N-(methylimino)methyl]cyclopentanol". So what is this compound? Simple, it's an intermediate in the synthesis of ketamine that should no longer be present in the final product (although I doubt it would be psychoactive to any significant degree). In other words, you can clearly tell that this is actual ketamine, but made in a clandestine lab.

 

[Phobos]

I never tried it but I have read multiple reports that described 4 MeO PCP as similar enough in dosage and effects to Ketamine.

 

[Hodor]

I never tried it but I have read multiple reports that described 4 MeO PCP as similar enough in dosage and effects to Ketamine.

From what I've read, 4-MeO-PCP shares the excessive duration of the other PCP analogues, meaning that while the dosage range may be right, it is probably far too long-lasting to pass off as ketamine.

 

[Bitchniggaz]

4meo is def my favorite of the old pcp analogues.
Its a bit like ket mixed with dxm.
Quite visual at higher doses.

But it also had a very toxic vibe to it, so wouldnt really recomend it.

 

[emkee_reinvented]

gwai lo

Long time I heard that one used. So are these Fah tong's just losing there Ketamin cooking skill's or cheatingh on us Qwai lo's

 

[Vastness]

Off topic but 4-MeO-PCP sounds very interesting, hopefully I'll get the chance to try it, will keep an eye out in case it pops up again somewhere...

 

[jhjhsdi]

Had another small batch of this stuff. Welsh friend of mine reckons its cut with TAURINE. Yes taurine. The shit in energy drinks!
He reckons loads of K in Wales is being cut with it recently. Funnily enough that's where I sourced this batch from. ?

Never heard of taurine in crystal form but a quick Google image search confirms you can buy it in crystal shard form. Madness.

Anyone else heard of taurine being used as a cut?

 

[Hodor]

Where is he getting the idea that it's taurine from? Contrary to common belief, the only psychoactive compound in Red Bull et al is the caffeine.

Personally, I think Dimethylsulfone AKA methylsulfonylmethane ("MSM"), the "popular" meth cut, is the most likely culprit, as it's been detected in several recently analyzed samples of ketamine. Taurine might be too hygroscopic for this purpose, though I'm not ruling it out completely.

Just curious how your friend got the idea that it's taurine, as it and MSM both contain an oxidized sulphur atom in their structure.

 

[jhjhsdi]

Where is he getting the idea that it's taurine from? Contrary to common belief, the only psychoactive compound in Red Bull et al is the caffeine.

Personally, I think Dimethylsulfone AKA methylsulfonylmethane ("MSM"), the "popular" meth cut, is the most likely culprit, as it's been detected in several recently analyzed samples of ketamine. Taurine might be too hygroscopic for this purpose, though I'm not ruling it out completely.

Just curious how your friend got the idea that it's taurine, as it and MSM both contain an oxidized sulphur atom in their structure.

He just said that he's got friends in the k supply chain in Wales who have said its taurine! Or well that taurine has been being used alot recently. I said it can't be as I tasted these suspect shards alone and they tasted like hairspray/solvent with a slight numbing like k should... He said they only taste like that because they've been in the bag knocking around with the k for so long.
I've had k with msm crystalline powder in it in the past, but never seen msm shards.
Msm is too salty/cooling on the tounge to fool me it defo wasn't msm. I really wish I'd saved some to send to WEDINOS. Shame my feindy side took over and I did it all lol. If I get another batch the same I'll 100% be sending a gram off!
I really can't see it being taurine but tbh it wouldn't surprise me fucking k is being cut with everything thesedays as it's gained popularity. Such a shame

Where's all the vials at!

 

[jhjhsdi]

He must be chatting shit!M (which was my original reaction) I can't see it being taurine.

Hopefully I can source some more of this and get it tested. Well, I rephrase that... Hopefully I can source some PURE ket. Especially since me and friends like to inject. BUT - If another batch with said cut comes about I am 100% sending to WEDINOS.

 

[khaosddt]

hey mate, i am recieving a batch of ketamine that looks similar, big ass shards, but with some snowflake ketamine. Did you got your final word on this?

 

[jhjhsdi]

hey mate, i am recieving a batch of ketamine that looks similar, big ass shards, but with some snowflake ketamine. Did you got your final word on this?

I never got round to sending a sample bud!
It's all gone now and I'm not scoring from that guy again.
Have you tried any? It does do the the job but it's not quite right in my opinion.
Any pics? Are the big shards flat instead of cylinder? Sounds like the same stuff if so.
My Welsh friend said there's tons of it up there...
Be very interested to hear your opinion and if you send any to wedinos.

 

[nznity]

pretty often I take for granted how I have access to most pharma drugs Ketamine, Midazolam, Diazepam, Fentanyl, Demerol and my personal favourite MORPHINE Hydrochloride 20mg/ML pure bliss, oh and I get em dirt cheap. you guys would srsly say get the f off you're lying that's too cheap. I'm not joking I'm a lucky peruvian bastard ? ohhh was forgetting about coke. too haha but that's diff, was talking strictly. about pharmaceuticals not some powder made in the jungle by a guy who doesn't even know how to read.... anyway back on topic im a lucky bastard again ?

 

[nznity]

hey mate, i am recieving a batch of ketamine that looks similar, big ass shards, but with some snowflake ketamine. Did you got your final word on this?

srsly man I have access to pure ketamina vials and to be honest it's a drug not really euphoric at all. it's just plain weird. tastes weird, you. become mentally challenged for a while if y take too much, you can't move, like I said weird. Not worth all the hassle to get ahold of that shit but if u wanna take the risk go ahead, there's some ppl that love it
I despise it.