Etizolam max solubility in PG?

[AlphaOdure]

Don't know if this belongs here or not..

Apologies Sir Sekio if not

Does anyone have the exact-about ratio of solubility of PG to etizolam.. i know 15mL PG is fine for 150mg etz.. but could it be hypothetically possible for 250mg to dissolve adequatley in 15mL PG solution?

If someone could point me to a resource elsewhere w/ this direct information, that'd be great! Thanks as always guys.

 

[sekio]

If you're making a solution, why don't you just start with a known amount of etizolam and keep adding propylene glycol and mixing and warming it gently, and see what the minimum amount needed is? Preferably let us know what that number is.

You can't really calculate solubilities in propylene glycol, you can guess wildly at them though, but it's not going to be accurate. The only reliable way is to measure it and see.

 

[2cAlex]

I don't have any direct source to link you to, but dissolving typical benzos (i've tested alprazolam, diazepam, diclazepam, and clonazepam powders) will dissolve very well into PG at high concentrations.

any reason you need such a high concentration? I'd bet anything you could easily make atleast a 10mg/ml solution

 

[ebola?]

Let me just add a friendly reminder that concentration of 1 drop per dose is not particularly safe.

ebola

 

[AlphaOdure]

Let me just add a friendly reminder that concentration of 1 drop per dose is not particularly safe

if by one drop you mean 1mL, I realize this isn't safe at all for most individuals. But my tolerance could easily handle 50mg in a day. Or 10mg IV, three times a day.. give or take.

any reason you need such a high concentration? I'd bet anything you could easily make atleast a 10mg/ml solution

I already make 0.1mL=1mg dosing (tolerance-wise, this isn't a large dose for me whatsoever)- I just use bottles that limit me to 150mL & would like to preferably dose 0.1mL=2mg (which i have came close to several times in error w/o any solubility issues). I could even handle 0.1mL=3mg; so that i'd have 30mg per 1cc.

 

[AlphaOdure]

If you're making a solution, why don't you just start with a known amount of etizolam and keep adding propylene glycol and mixing and warming it gently, and see what the minimum amount needed is?

Yes, i always make solutions.. as noted above. I may try this method & repeat. If I do, I will certainly report any findings on my end.

Problem is gentle heat is a NECESSITY here; as it will evaporate off some PG. Although this amount could be minimal.. I do know heavy heat w/ etizolam for IV prep will lose 0.1-0.2mL; as etizolam's boiling & melting point is way higher than any heavy heat could inflict--correct me if wrong on that; but i know etizolam's boiling & melting point are both way higher than PG.

 

[sekio]

Propylene glycol isn't very volatile at all. It boils at 188C.

 

[ebola?]

if by one drop you mean 1mL

A "drop" is not particularly well defined (drops of liquid come in many sizes), but they tend to range between 10 to 60 per ml. It takes little ingenuity to figure out how to measure single ml volumes safely.

ebola

 

[AlphaOdure]

Propylene glycol isn't very volatile at all. It boils at 188C

I know it's not volatile, I don't want to crack my glass ware. I boil it before IV etizolam if sedation/anxiolysis is needed in a hypertensive, hyper-anxiogenic crisis.. & w/o ANY water a full 1 cc can be successfully IV'd, IM'd, subcutaneous, etc (IM & sub hurts the most) this way. (if using a 1:1 ratio of PG-to-etizolam). Key is you need to register while its still warm or its not coming out. This was all w/ a 29G btw, too. I prefer 27's.

A "drop" is not particularly well defined (drops of liquid come in many sizes), but they tend to range between 10 to 60 per ml. It takes little ingenuity to figure out how to measure single ml volumes safely.

No this is why i use oral syringes that fit yellow tips to get exact PG, H20, ethanol levels etc. They'll hand them to me for free, 5 at a time once a week at my local pharmacy.

 

[AlphaOdure]

Did 200mg to 150mL solution etizolam that dissolved very quickly.

Wating on 300mg to dissolve in 150mL solution, mostly clear except for air bubbles. And a few small chunks (1-2mg? guesstimation.. unless its an impurity, but have never seen this before. only a few little bits.. maybe they'll be gone by tomorrow.. either way if its clear; this will mean 1mL equates to 2mg.

The 200mg/150mL solution equates to 13.33mg/10mL (unless my equations were off.. sorry my next day after a miprocin trip 5 separate doses, from 45mg to 15mg & managed to IM 10mg! tripping from 4:50 pm till falling asleep sometime after 2pm). Woke up in a panic.. realized it was quite a night, hadn't dosed any etizolam since earlier that morning and was WAAAY over due. So took 4mg buprenorphine, 10mg etizolam to make up for it--and things were straight--able to enjoy tryptamine-mental afterglow.

 

[AlphaOdure]

SIDE NOTE/SLIGHTLY OFF-TOPIC: I have mixed 6.67mg etizolam (in 5mg of PG) w/ 16mg of buprenorphine (Subutex, 2x 8mg; small "8" & arrow imprinted pills) in only 5mg of distilled water (started out w/ much more water- but after enough filtering i got down to 5mg--as w/ 16mg i usually use 10mg H20; & then filtering I usually lose half the mixture/5mg in binders/fillers/etc. So this mixture was tried; etizolam hits quicker.. was nice, very potent; like a more anxiolytic midazolam w/o such anesthesia/ultra-fast-sedation. Buprenorphine usualy takes 5-10 minutes to slowly build but much stronger than before; but its odd, while 8-20mg will last me from 1 full day to 2.5 days IV--something seems to be "missing" relative to the normal insufflation or sublingual route after about 6-10 hours? Still very satisfying. Would do it everyday if it was pure buprenorphine, much more effective. Could use 1-2mg a day & wean much more quickly. But I don't, too much of a hassle for something not too intense. Even at 5x my normal daily dose.

Would like to try for shits and giggles again w/ 10mg etizolam (in 5mg PG) w/ 16-20mg of buprenorphine (4mg/day is my normal dose--which i easily return to.. as i do this w/ bupe probably once or twice every 6 months at most; 1x every few years if not longer during lower periods of activity)

 

[AlphaOdure]

I think I found the max solubility: First off, 300mg dissolved no problem in 10mg; 3:1 ratio was fine: 1mL = 3mg etizolam. But when trying 400mg in 10mg pg; stayed cloudy despite vigorous shaking for 3 days; slowly added 1cc of PG, shaking each time until I got to a rato of 4:1.3; that is 400mg wouldn't dissolve in 100 mL PG, but would dissolve in 130 mL. Giving a per mL milligram dose of 3.077mg.

This was done w/o heat, by the way. I'm sure a 5:1 ratio could be achieved w/ heat. But, i don't have the time to mess w/ it that much; it takes long enough to weigh out the powder & get my dosing down first.. let alone running these "experiments" 8)

 

[AlphaOdure]

by the way, with boiling.. you want a slow simmer--not a flame. Your solution will catch fire if you heat too hot, destroy some etizolam i'm sure in the process.

 

[AlphaOdure]

I don't have any direct source to link you to, but dissolving typical benzos (i've tested alprazolam, diazepam, diclazepam, and clonazepam powders) will dissolve very well into PG at high concentrations.

any reason you need such a high concentration? I'd bet anything you could easily make atleast a 10mg/ml solution

hmm, i don't know about that.. i don't know if this would affect solubility or not, but, none of these are thienodiazepines like etizolam..

i've made up to a 3.7:1 ratio of etizolam to propylene glycol so far & it takes about 24 hours to fully cure. Unless it'd just take longer to cure w/ a 5:1 or 10:1 ratio? I know heat helps solubility.. i'll usually leave the bottles in my pockets overnight & their cured by morning (w/ only minimal shaking after first mixing my batches)

& yes, i need high concentrations for IV use in ER situations.. & i have a tolerance, obviously. 1cc w/ 8mL of etizolam (~29mg of etizolam) & 2mL of water is my usual dose in these circumstances, but, it hardens veins too quick (& i cannot register in the crook of my elbow for some fucking reason! i try both w/ a tourniquet & w/o a tourniquet; both arms--the vein runs side ways on both arms too which doesn't make things easier). I'd love a 10mg/mL strength; so i could add 5-6mL water instead of 2mL of H2O; for better vein health.

 

[AlphaOdure]

Well i was able to make roughly a 5-7:1 ratio.. that is, 5-7mg of etizolam per mL of propylene glycol.

I tried a 10:1 solution as 2cAlex suggested:

I'd bet anything you could easily make atleast a 10mg/ml solution

But etizolam 10mg/ml of PG will absolutely not dissolve. I tried it, after 4 days, even after small heat was applied. Unsuccessful.

The reason I say 5-7mg/mL of PG is because I was on a business trip & forgot my oral syringes to measure out exact amounts of PG. but, i know my bottle cap will hold a little over 5 mL (i have it marked w/ permanent marker, just got to remark it after every batch of 1000mg-2000mg i mix)--so i poured in half, and; b/c of the \volumetrically known amount of the original undissolved solution already in the bottle; this would've made it roughly between 5-7mg per 1 mL of propylene glycol. still turned out pretty potent. Dissolved in 24 hours.

And had to intravenously inject roughly ~50mg in an emergency situation (yes i have a huge tolerance; but i only dose 1-3x a day max; & this is down from 70-80mg per dose; weaning is actually pretty easy for me w/ etizolam; & 3g phenibut works wonders--intramuscular in the leg along w/ roughly 4-5g of phenibut FAA orally--if my new orders of raw powder are late/misrouted by USPS). Can even shoot in hand veins (easist part if i have hand tremor). No tourniquet is necessary with a short tip, 31g ultra fine BD.. i always backload w/ BD 1cc liquid syringes/no needles, too b/c the content is pure; always clean hands w/ soap, the alcohol when handling, mixing, & dosing, especially intravenously)

 

[MagickalKat777]

Wow, after reading this thread I'm less worried about making a solution.

I was under the impression that all of this required heat but I'm looking for an even 1mg/1mL and it sounds like that won't be an issue with etizolam or alprazolam and I bet I could probably get 4mg/mL on flubromazepam too and I should just shake the bottle and let it sit for a day?

Thanks for the thread, it was very enlightening. I think I'll just use straight PG to make my solution, I'll have to see what the consistency is like but I've got 4 ounce glass amber vials coming to store the solutions in and I want to have long term stability, it sounds like diluting the solution might be a bad idea.

 

[higherconciousness]

Nice info, I've been making etizolam solutions for iv for quite some time and all your data seems legit, but i've had no issue in dissolving about 5-10mg in about 20cc of prop. glycol. Gently apply some heat, as your shaking it around, and the solution appears to be clear, resulting with no loss of prop. glycol. After, add some water to dilute it in order to draw it up, as glycol is way too thick. after a missed shot nothing burns more then straight prop glycol, so it can't be to benign on ones veins.

Problem began when I started administering 50-80mg a day via IV for roughly 8 months. I know, I have a bit of a drug issue, but I'll say I'm still traumatized from that benzo detox and it has been 3 years since. I will never be able to operate/function both mentally and physically at my normal level prior to my benzo addiction. At high enough amounts, over enough time benzos can cause immutable changes in the human brain.... according to my physician I work with, so I highly advise not using this ROA unless its an emergency of some sort.

It has served to be quite a vital drug in my tool kit. From seizures/tremors or stimulant/psych overdoses, it's always comforting to have something as such near by.

Thanks for your time in putting this thread together, I found it very informative.

 

[yaesutom]

A friend of mine bought a 30mL bottle with 300mg etizolam in it - its dosed at 0.1mL=1mg, it tastes like alcohol so i'm assuming etizolam dissolves in alcohol fine? Or is there another liquid that tastes similar to alcohol which can get 1mg into 0.1mL?

 

[cjchriscj]

This ^
I have pure clonazepam powder. And the small amount scares me. I want to make 1mg or even .5mg per drop. Pg? Or ethanol? Or would I not be able to get a full mg in a drop of any liquid? Acetone i read seems to be my best bet. I was also thinking of mixing it with a liquid and then lactose powder? But that scares me also. Don't want a hot dose :/
Any suggestions? Sorry to hijack this thread but it's the same thing.

 

[~QuirKyNai~]

I have.both etizolam nd diclazepam.both 1gm q piece. And I need to store eapeciqllu the etizolqm and make q few bottlew to hide on myself. Cuz I've bwwn known to kill 150mh in. Day or two...but i m thinkinh I wantothe solution of both to be 5mg/1mL..I've.bought fromendor rhthatad his 1mg/1mL ratio.but lookinh back it mqy be besto have less concentration of etizolam.I love ot.my problem with it is I seem to forgey I take any and keep taking more till I forget where put it then rummage thru houwe and yellibg nd accusing everybody of takingt.Its not good.
So I think having. 5mg/1mL wud be better. So that each .1ml=.5mg...
And with the diclazepqm id like to do a 10mg/1mL ratio..so that .1=1mg

I juay