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Lysergamides The Big & Dandy LSZ Thread

It's possible to get a little over-confident too! Careful about exposing yourself to unpredictable situations on this & Al-Lad, both these compounds are quite capable of producing very awkward experiences regrardless of how benign they may appear after one go. I've had 5 on Al-Lad & 3 on LSz & I've had afew difficult moments on each.

Keep the repsonse curve & "setting" in mind when pushing the dosage of these remarkable compounds!
 
Hard to say, both these are supposed to be stronger than LSD, weight-for-weight (through in vitro affinity testing, I think), but this is not being borne out in reality as far as I can see. Perhaps they are actually stronger than an equivelent LSD dose but becuase the effects are less in your face they may "feel" less strong...
 
I have four gummy bears injected with LSZ. I am excited to test these out. Unfortunately I am unaware of the dose, but I believe that it is quite small as a friend of mine took 2 and said he could handle a bit more. What are the average doses? Is there a danger zone one should watch for? Any advice is swell.
 
The average dose blotters have been laid with is 150ug.

I wouldn't say there's a danger zone as far as the drug being physically unsafe, at least in reasonable ranges given it's similarity to LSD both structurally (although I'm not chemistry competent so if this assumption is incorrect someone with more knowledge than me should please correct that, and everyone else take this with a grain of salt) and in its effects.

300ug for me was fantastic but not strong enough. I've got more coming on the way along with some AL-LAD and I'll be testing the waters more and updating the threads periodically.
 
Si Ingwe said:
Hard to say, both these are supposed to be stronger than LSD, weight-for-weight (through in vitro affinity testing, I think), but this is not being borne out in reality as far as I can see. Perhaps they are actually stronger than an equivelent LSD dose but becuase the effects are less in your face they may "feel" less strong...
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The trip report that I posted didn't contain a potency comparison to LSD but perhaps it should. Conclusion: Assuming that the blotter was accurately loaded with 150ug and hadn't degraded much, LSZ is significantly less potent than LSD. 150ug of LSD would be an easy +++ whereas the same dose of LSZ was just touching ++.
 
I finally took 300 ug of LSZ this weekend, and I must say, it was nothing like LSD.
 
bloodshed344 said:
That's rather disappointing. Has there been much mention of visuals throughout this thread?
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Psychedelia is definitely there, but µg for µg there are certainly less visuals than for AL-LAD (if at all?). I never took a full 150 µg blotter of this one though.
 
I didn't get much visuals either. It's 5-HT2a affinity is only 8, which is about 40 % that of LSD, while its 5-HT2c affinity is almost the same as LSD. 5-HT1a affinity is is about 2.5 times that of LSD. So it's basically LSD with the 5-HT2a and 5-HT1a affinities reversed and 5-HT2c staying the same. 5-HT2a is the one responsible for the psychedelic effects. 5-HT1a has antidepressant effects but not psychedelic effects. So judging just from the affinities you would expect LSZ to be considerably less psychedelic than LSD. On the good side, it also has much less tremor producing effects.

I've read that D-Lysergic acid pyrrolidide, which is almost the same as LSZ but with a 5 member ring on the amide instead of the 4 member ring, only has about 1/10th the potency of LSD, same with the morpholide which is also very similar, so it's actually surprising that LSZ would be close in potency to LSD. To me it feels like an LSD trip that never really lifts off, but the most I've taken is only two blotters and I did throw up that time so some may have been lost. 3 or 4 blotters might do it but I'm worried about too severe body load. It's possible that a high dose would actually have less body load though, since 5-HT1a is supposed to have antinausea effects. Maybe 1 or 2 blotters isn't enough for that effect to overpower the nausea.
 
jason7 said:
I didn't get much visuals either. It's 5-HT2a affinity is only 8, which is about 40 % that of LSD, while its 5-HT2c affinity is almost the same as LSD. 5-HT1a affinity is is about 2.5 times that of LSD. So it's basically LSD with the 5-HT2a and 5-HT1a affinities reversed and 5-HT2c staying the same. 5-HT2a is the one responsible for the psychedelic effects. 5-HT1a has antidepressant effects but not psychedelic effects. So judging just from the affinities you would expect LSZ to be considerably less psychedelic than LSD. On the good side, it also has much less tremor producing effects.

I've read that D-Lysergic acid pyrrolidide, which is almost the same as LSZ but with a 5 member ring on the amide instead of the 4 member ring, only has about 1/10th the potency of LSD, same with the morpholide which is also very similar, so it's actually surprising that LSZ would be close in potency to LSD. To me it feels like an LSD trip that never really lifts off, but the most I've taken is only two blotters and I did throw up that time so some may have been lost. 3 or 4 blotters might do it but I'm worried about too severe body load. It's possible that a high dose would actually have less body load though, since 5-HT1a is supposed to have antinausea effects. Maybe 1 or 2 blotters isn't enough for that effect to overpower the nausea.
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Use the classic tips for avoiding nausea such as ginger and cannabis, also a good diet for a few days leading up to the trip. Something like diphenhydramine would probably kill the trip or else I would recommend it. Phenergan would too. Is there anything similar that isn't a 5-ht2a antagonist?
 
Maybe I've just been unlucky with this one? I've made multiple attempts at 150 mcg, a couple at 300 mcg, and one at 450 mcg. I guess I could keep chasing whatever it is I'm chasing up the dosage ladder. But, this one is telling me, "it's just not working out between us." I'm going to listen and raise the white flag, I think.

Nothing warrants a trip report -- good or bad. In short, at lower doses, nothing much happens for me. Physically, it's pretty innocuous (and no visuals). Mentally, it's a little and quite pleasantly introspective. At higher doses, it can get pretty rocky (and barely any visuals). Physically, it's awful -- or maybe the feeling of being choked for six hours just doesn't appeal to me the way it once did. Mentally, it's a tedious and relentless boredom trap ... like "c'mon, I don't need psychedelics to work out this mundane crap ... give me something interesting to turn over in my mind -- or just let me go." 8)

When I hear "fucking amazing substance"; "fucking winner"; "best psychedelic drug I've ever taken" ... I really have to wonder whether we're taking the same psychedelic drug?!?!? I mean, seriously, 450 mcg of a legit LSD analog working at its peak should not inspire me to check my e-mail, make coffee, and start working out how to conduct an upcoming estate auction. 8o

That ... and the feeling like my throat was closing up??? I'll be honest: there were moments of pretty intense anxiety in that 450 mcg experience related to the choking feeling and difficulty swallowing. I always have at least a couple of milligrams (OK, a couple of bottles) of a Benzo around, but in 25 years, I have never aborted a trip -- no matter how difficult things became. That said, I almost shot this one down. I was tempted. As it was, I did take 0.25 mg of Klonopin several hours in just to get things back on an even keel. (I should be as clear as I can be. There was no panic, but there was *plenty* of anxiety ... along the lines of "am I suffocating?" and "if I am, would I know in time?" and "if I knew in time, what would I do?" Not to be self-congratulatory at all, but in someone else, this may well have spiraled into full panic. And from a physical side-effect! Man, I thought if I were going to get taken down, my own mind would do it!)

Listen, I'm FAR from overly-tolerant to psychedelics. Experiences with 150 mcg of AL-LAD, for example, have been some of the most intensely pleasurable in my life. I do not feel the need to chase anything with that chemical. And jeez ... just show me a picture of a San Pedro cutting and I'm instantly at a Victorian garden party on Venus with Alice and the white rabbit being served tea by a bound and naked Indian girl who flew in on her mountain banshee for the occasion. No trouble getting there (if I want to) at all. So, why LSZ is *such* a nothing experience (with awful physicals at higher doses) is totally beyond me. :? And yet, I'm as confident in this source (with all that entails -- genuineness, accuracy of dosage, handling and storage) as I can be. If I questioned the source, I would certainly say so.

Oh well ... S'OK ... there are plenty of other fish in the sea. And for those of you who really get on with this stuff, all the best to you!
 
Just A Guy said:
All things equal, GG - from your posts it would seem that you haven't been giving yourself much time between uses...or have you?
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Totally fair question. Right now, I try to space trips out by a week. Sometimes by more, never by less. That 450 mcg LSZ experience occurred after a nine-day hiatus. In general, that amount of time may not be enough ... especially when it turns into week after week after week. Point noted. Thanks!
 
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